Visiting a statue is visiting?

[Iollain]

In Father Auriemma's little book, Affetti Scambievoli [Affetti Scam. p. 2. c. 3], we read of innumerable favors granted by the Mother of God to those who practised this most profitable devotion of often visiting her in her churches or before some image. We read of the graces which she granted in these visits to Saint Albert the Great, to the Abbot Rupert, to Father Suarez, especially when she obtained for them the gift of understanding, by which they afterwards became so renowned throughout the Church for their great learning: the graces which she granted to Saint John Berchmans of the Society of Jesus, who was in the daily habit of visiting Mary in a chapel of the Roman college; he declared that he renounced all earthly love, to love no other after God than the Most Blessed Virgin, and had written at the foot of the image of his beloved Lady: "I will never rest until I shall have obtained a tender love for my Mother."; the graces which she granted to St. Bernardine of Siena, who in his youth also went every day to visit her in a chapel near the city-gate

http://www.catholictradition.org/Eucharist/blessed-sacrament.htm

 

[IamAdopted]

In Father Auriemma's little book, Affetti Scambievoli [Affetti Scam. p. 2. c. 3], we read of innumerable favors granted by the Mother of God to those who practised this most profitable devotion of often visiting her in her churches or before some image. We read of the graces which she granted in these visits to Saint Albert the Great, to the Abbot Rupert, to Father Suarez, especially when she obtained for them the gift of understanding, by which they afterwards became so renowned throughout the Church for their great learning: the graces which she granted to Saint John Berchmans of the Society of Jesus, who was in the daily habit of visiting Mary in a chapel of the Roman college; he declared that he renounced all earthly love, to love no other after God than the Most Blessed Virgin, and had written at the foot of the image of his beloved Lady: "I will never rest until I shall have obtained a tender love for my Mother."; the graces which she granted to St. Bernardine of Siena, who in his youth also went every day to visit her in a chapel near the city-gate

http://www.catholictradition.org/Eucharist/blessed-sacrament.htm

well we all know that Mary is not in that statue just as budda is not in his statue so it really just gives me the eeries..

 

[PaladinValer]

We also know Jesus isn't upon the cross anymore, yet it still inspires us, even to the point of revelation and sacramentalism.

 

[IamAdopted]

We also know Jesus isn't upon the cross anymore, yet it still inspires us, even to the point of revelation and sacramentalism.

Jesus sits on the right hand side of God. My Lord has risen.

 

[PaladinValer]

Straw Man, as that doesn't address the point I made.

 

[IamAdopted]

Straw Man, as that doesn't address the point I made.

Oh boy you and strawman what are we doing building a scarecrow? LOL.. Jesus is not on the cross you are right. I look at the cross in a whole new meaning now. For now I am to pick up my cross and follow Jesus.

 

[PaladinValer]

And thus my point: when you look at a cross, it inspires you and builds your Christian faith and devotion, does it not?

When I see our Mother, I cannot help but be in awe of her faith, and wish I had that level of grace and strong belief myself. It doesn't matter if it is while saying a rosary or viewing a statue or icon of her; all it does is increase my devotion to Christ.

 

[IamAdopted]

And thus my point: when you look at a cross, it inspires you and builds your Christian faith and devotion, does it not?

When I see our Mother, I cannot help but be in awe of her faith, and wish I had that level of grace and strong belief myself. It doesn't matter if it is while saying a rosary or viewing a statue or icon of her; all it does is increase my devotion to Christ.

When I see the cross I know that I am to put to death the deeds of the flesh and walk according to the spririt. That because Christ died and rose from the dead that I have the power to become the child of God that He desires of me. My relationship is with God and not dead saints. For God alone is worthy of all praise Glory and Honor forever and ever..

 

[PaladinValer]

The Saints are not dead unless God has abandoned them. Does God abandon those who accepted Him? Surely not!

In addition, you are confusing reverence with glory and worship. I do not glorify or worship the Saints, only God. I revere them for in them I see Christ's Grace in them, which makes me want to glorify and worship God even more.

 

[IamAdopted]

The Saints are not dead unless God has abandoned them. Does God abandon those who accepted Him? Surely not!

In addition, you are confusing reverence with glory and worship. I do not glorify or worship the Saints, only God. I revere them for in them I see Christ's Grace in them, which makes me want to glorify and worship God even more.

They are dead to me. For they no longer live here on earth to where we can speak and talk. There is only one God and it is not the saints nor Mary for they were mere Human beings being led by the Spirit and power of God. Therefore I do not need to speak to them for anything. I have my Father who is creator of all Heaven and all earth and His grace is sufficient for me.

 

[Oblio]

They are dead to me.

So the truth of what something or someone is depends on how you feel about it ?

 

[PaladinValer]

It doesn't matter if they are dead to you. It matters if they are dead to Christ.

And while we cannot speak to them in corporeal form, we do have another language we can use, for the Holy Spirit did not leave them upon their earthly deaths, just as the Holy Spirit still resides in us. Thus, through the Holy Spirit, there is still Communion between all Christians.

Lastly, while you may not wish to speak to them (though I'm sure they pray for you), I do pray for them and through the Spirit petition them to pray for me.

Oh, and I guess this is truly my last comment: you've broken off from the topic of discussion.

 

[IamAdopted]

So the truth of what something or someone is depends on how you feel about it ?

LOL.. They are dead. To the living here on earth they are dead. They are at rest with the King. But for me they are gone on. They have finished the race. They are at the finish line. Me I am still down here running the race with Christ as my coach. Gods grace is sufficient for me. For I have the Spirit of the Living God in me.

 

[IamAdopted]

It doesn't matter if they are dead to you. It matters if they are dead to Christ.

And while we cannot speak to them in corporeal form, we do have another language we can use, for the Holy Spirit did not leave them upon their earthly deaths, just as the Holy Spirit still resides in us. Thus, through the Holy Spirit, there is still Communion between all Christians.

Lastly, while you may not wish to speak to them (though I'm sure they pray for you), I do pray for them and through the Spirit petition them to pray for me.

Oh, and I guess this is truly my last comment: you've broken off from the topic of discussion.

I uphold the truth of Gods word. I do not pray to dead saints for we do not see this in scripture. In fact God has forbidden to pray to the dead. We see this with Samuel. My God has not changed. He is the same today yesterday and forever. I don't need anyone in Heaven to pray for me because My Lord lives to intercede for Me. I have the whole Godhead on my side. The Holy Spirit prays for me. Jesus prays for me and my Father hears and answers my prayer. Now if God be for me who can be against me?

 

[PaladinValer]

They may be dead in a corporeal sense, but the soul cannot die nor sleep.

In addition, they cannot be with the King unless they've been Judged worthy to. Since the Judgment has not occurred yet, they are not experiencing heaven quite yet...a foretaste probably, but not the whole enchelada.

And do they not have the Spirit anymore?

 

[Oblio]

I don't need anyone in Heaven to pray for me because My Lord lives to intercede for Me.

Then why do you need those not in Heaven to pray for you ?

 

[Kepha]

Jesus sits on the right hand side of God. My Lord has risen.

When I look upon the Cross, my heart goes straight to His Sacrifice for us. That should never be forgotten.

 

[Kepha]

They are dead to me. For they no longer live here on earth to where we can speak and talk. There is only one God and it is not the saints nor Mary for they were mere Human beings being led by the Spirit and power of God. Therefore I do not need to speak to them for anything. I have my Father who is creator of all Heaven and all earth and His grace is sufficient for me.

Living with God is more alive than you can ever be here on earth. Nobody said Saints or Mary are God. You keep saying this and it gets annoying. You ask people on earth to pray for you. Asking those in Heaven who I most certainly are a part of the Body of Christ is likewise profitable.

If only God would do, then Jesus never would allow you or your friend to ask another to Pray for them would He.

 

[Kepha]

I uphold the truth of Gods word.

You uphold what you interprete to be the truth of Gods' Word so your statement does not hold merit.

I do not pray to dead saints for we do not see this in scripture. In fact God has forbidden to pray to the dead. We see this with Samuel.

Again, incorrect interpretation can mislead the flock. That is precisely what your doing now.

My God has not changed. He is the same today yesterday and forever. I don't need anyone in Heaven to pray for me because My Lord lives to intercede for Me. I have the whole Godhead on my side. The Holy Spirit prays for me. Jesus prays for me and my Father hears and answers my prayer. Now if God be for me who can be against me?

Your friends pray for you too. What you say makes no sense in how your trying to defend yourself. Show us one place where Christ never asked anyone to pray for the other. If you can do that, then you have a point. You cant so going on about how you only need this and that and is an excuse to say it is wrong is balony.

 

[IamAdopted]

You uphold what you interprete to be the truth of Gods' Word so your statement does not hold merit.


Again, incorrect interpretation can mislead the flock. That is precisely what your doing now.


Your friends pray for you too. What you say makes no sense in how your trying to defend yourself. Show us one place where Christ never asked anyone to pray for the other. If you can do that, then you have a point. You cant so going on about how you only need this and that and is an excuse to say it is wrong is balony.

Baloney is right. Tee hee. I sure don't need anyone in Heaven to pray for me for I have my Lord intercessing for me and this is the only one that scripture tells us is ever living to do this. We see no where in scripture that there is anyone else doing this. No where do we see in scripture that saints intercede on our behalf that have passed out of this life to eternity. This is assumption at best. These that have passed on are just mortal human beings that could not have changed one spot on a leopards back. The only reason they are with the Lord is because of Gods grace. Nothing they have done could have saved them. THey lived by Gods grace just as I do. The only one that can change anything is God for it is written that He can even change the hearts of a king. As far as people gathering down here to pray is because were two or three are gathered in His name there He is in the midst of them. Also Jesus taught us that if two of us agree to touching anything here on earth it shall be done by the Father. Notice that Jesus said here on earth.