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Virginia school board votes to restore Confederate names to two schools

Tuur

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It is absolutely clear that the motivation to name schools after such traitors is to use memory of the confederacy to emphasize the ideology of white supremacy.
Ah, no. The only clear example of that that I know of is that a private school founded as a response to segregation. If you wish to argue that it was for white supremacy, then look for institutions named after Brown vs Board of Education. Prior to that is the concept of hero and reconciliation. The latter goes as far back as Grant's troops honoring Lee's after the surrender at Appomattox. Lee, who has been reviled, asked for reconciliation rather than continued guerilla action. And guess who said the following:

"We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment. Use your best judgement in selecting men for office and vote as you think right."

That was N.B. Forrest. Yes, that Forrest, at a gathering of a black organization in Memphis after the Civil War. Revile him for Fort Pillow and leadership in the KKK. Remember that before he died he supported reconciliation and sought to disband the KKK. And remember than when it first looked like Spain and the US would come to blows, Forrest tendered his services to none other than your avatar. Your avatar sent a rather nice letter declining his services due to reduced tensions. Having read a letter he sent to a man in Augusta, Georgia, who asked why their city was spared during the March to the Sea, that was unusual.

When it did come to war with Spain, the US government had no problem accepting the services of former Confederate officers. Keep in mind that this was in the same army that had fought these same men not ten years earlier. They had no qualms at accepting their service.

What then: If men who had tried to kill each other not one decade before could find reconciliation, who are we, generations removed, to say different? And if we revile these men for being Confederates, do we also revile their call for reconciliation?

To really get a sense of what was going on, you need to go from Tennessee into Georgia. Near I-75 there's a Union memorial that no one seemed to have minded because it was in the memory of someone's father or brother or husband or son, and that's the way the North viewed Southern memorials, at least then. And while I doubt you'd find a Robert the Bruce school in London, wouldn't be shocked to find one in Scotland.

I don't expect any of this to change anyone's opinion one whit, but it's something that must be said, even though it will fall on deaf ears.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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Ah, no. The only clear example of that that I know of is that a private school founded as a response to segregation. If you wish to argue that it was for white supremacy, then look for institutions named after Brown vs Board of Education.
That is, in fact, when most schools that are named after Confederates were named as such. Including the one in the OP.
As I stated in a previous comment, forgiveness and reconciliation does not require naming schools after people or building monuments to them.
While there have been some attempts by overzealous activists to remove memorials to Confederate soldiers, cooler heads have generally prevailed in those cases. I live about an hour away from Gettysburg, and there are hundreds of memorials to Confederate units there, with firm statements from the Park Service that they will remain. The monuments being removed are generally statues of prominent Confederate figures in places of honor and/or significance unrelated to the men in question.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Ah, no. The only clear example of that that I know of is that a private school founded as a response to segregation.
It does not surprise me at all that a segregation academy was so named.
The memorialization of confederates for current political purposes goes back to the era of the second klan (1920s) at least.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I don’t think the names should’ve ever been changed in the first place, they are both historical American figures. Both of these men earned their legacy in the Mexican American war before the Civil war. I mean how many presidents did we have before Lincoln who didn’t stop slavery and have schools named after them. Just because these schools were named after brave men who fought for their country doesn’t mean that the school promotes racism and just because the Union Generals fought to free the slaves doesn’t mean that they weren’t racists. Racism was still predominant in the entire US all the way into the 1970s.
 
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Desk trauma

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don’t think the names should’ve ever been changed in the first place, they are both historical American figures. Both of these men earned their legacy in the Mexican American war before the Civil war.
They threw that legacy away when they took up arms against the United States.
 
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GreatLakes4Ever

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I don’t think the names should’ve ever been changed in the first place, they are both historical American figures. Both of these men earned their legacy in the Mexican American war before the Civil war.

Under this logic, we should have schools and monuments to Benedict Arnold for his efforts in leading the United States to a victory over the British in the Battle of Saratoga.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Under this logic, we should have schools and monuments to Benedict Arnold for his efforts in leading the United States to a victory over the British in the Battle of Saratoga.
We did name something after Benedict Arnold in the US -- betrayal. His name is a byword for betrayal.
 
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Hans Blaster

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That's a broad spectrum, from Union soldiers who cried at fighting boys and old men at Griswoldville to those who trashed Christ Church, St Simons.
Visited Columbia, had a nice time

Yours,

__sherm
 
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GoldenBoy89

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History is hidden if we don’t name schools after those involved? Best name some schools in Oklahoma City after McVeigh otherwise that’s being hidden.
Can’t wait to see all the schools in Israel named after Hamas leaders/generals. Otherwise it’s like this conflict they’re in today isn’t even happening.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Just sounds like good old fashioned warfare to me.

War, propaganda and the mass manipulation of a people by their feelings and fears have always gone perfectly together.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Do you consider that the American revolution of 1776 was carried out by traitors?
Yes, they were traitors to the crown. That was the whole point of the war.
And for you too, is the USA a Hotel Cali. that
you can join voluntarily but you get shot for
trying to leave?
Anyone can leave. They just can’t take the states with them. That belongs to the United States.

It’s right there in the name.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Just as I thought, justifying a racist statement. Hypocrites.
Nobody has justified that. Biden was just an idiot trying to be funny on a black podcast show and get a quick laugh out of the host. It didn’t land and we also didn’t honor the tagline by naming a school after it or building a statue to Biden with the phrase on a plaque.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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No It's not about disagreeing with me. The whole conversation is about our racist ancestors and the outrage because of it. When a person in the 21st century makes a racist comment there is no outrage. That is being a hypocrite.
Plenty of people were upset with Biden for saying it at the time but I think in the context of all the protests going on that summer over that exact issue of racial justice, plus a deadly, spreading pandemic, a stupid tone deaf joke on a morning podcast by a candidate that didn’t land was hardly a blip on any radar.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Remind me of the war Lenin waged against the United States in an effort to preserve a racist institution within the United States.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Neither did it stop Che Guevara from being idolized by certain political faction in America. In fact you can easily find Che Guevara merchandise sold openly in America.
Che Guevara also never fought any war against the U.S. nor tried to maintain or defend the institution of slavery within the country. You get that this isn’t about outlawing t-shirts and random private statues of generally bad people from history, right? It’s about specific people who took part in specific events related to American history, society and culture that we have to continue to live with today.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Respectfully, as an outsider, we don’t have to convince you of anything.
 
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