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Using science to spread the gospel?

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mumluvsherboys

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So far I see this from TE's. Christians who believe in Creation as it is written are incompetant, witness using hellfire and scare tactics and are intolerant to other religions.

Hmmm, I thought as Christians we were supposed to build eachother up and not bad talk eachother. I can think of several verses that pertain to that. Paul, for instance, spoke about this many times.

I believe in creation as it is written and I can witness that I have never shared the gospel in the ways that are suggested, nor am I outwardly intolerant to other religions. I use love to share the gospel. Love and prayer toward my enemies and loved ones. My knowledge of science or lack there of has no consequence in sharing the gospel.

God bless.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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Well, in the Plaza at my campus, we get these recurring Hellfire Preachers with Big Signs (TM). They generally enjoy condemning everything from Catholicism to Evolution. As a result, I've gotten to meet and talk to many people who came up to argue about "stupid Christians who lack knowledge of anything scientific but feel they can condemn everyone."

here, note the statement about "stupid Christians"
 
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mumluvsherboys

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We mostly just had interesting discussions about various things related to religion. I don't cram the Gospel down people's throat...they get plenty of that from the preachers. :p

...and here. Pretty negative talk. I believe the "stupid Christians who cram the Gospel down people's throats" would argue about who really looks bad. What do you think God feels about Christians talking about other Christians in such a manner? And behind their backs, too.

Anyway, just a heads up. God bless.
 
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Melethiel

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It is not me who calls them stupid. As for the "cramming the Gospel down people's throats," that is not being demeaning. It is a statement of fact. If you ever heard them, I think you would agree.

Why are you taking so much offense at my personal experiences with a very specific subgroup of YEC Christians who happen to be prominent around here?
 
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Xaero

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We all have different gifts, so some sow and some reap (John 4:37,38)
"I sent you to harvest where you didn't plant; others had already done the work, and you will gather the harvest."

How will God use you ( or how do you hope God will use you?)
God will use me to wipe out creationism :cool:

For a lesser "militant" testimony:
I am a witness for the Lord, so other seekers can see that you can use your godgiven brain to defend the body of christ and stop being simple:

http://blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/words.pl?word=simple

"How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?"

And to the YEC leaders i say:
"For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple."(Rom 16:18)
 
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mumluvsherboys

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It is not me who calls them stupid. As for the "cramming the Gospel down people's throats," that is not being demeaning. It is a statement of fact. If you ever heard them, I think you would agree.

Why are you taking so much offense at my personal experiences with a very specific subgroup of YEC Christians who happen to be prominent around here?

It is not a personal offence, it is an accountability. I do not believe this has anything to do with how I believe we came to be. Here is a verse that may help you understand what I mean.

"Do not let unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who will listen....Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving eachother, just as in Christ forgave you." Ephesians 4:29-32

This forum is for both TE's and YEC's, not just TE's. There is also a sub-section for TE's. I am aware of the sub-section for YEC's.
Thank you and God bless.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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We all have different gifts, so some sow and some reap (John 4:37,38)
"I sent you to harvest where you didn't plant; others had already done the work, and you will gather the harvest."


God will use me to wipe out creationism :cool:

For a lesser "militant" testimony:
I am a witness for the Lord, so other seekers can see that you can use your godgiven brain to defend the body of christ and stop being simple:

http://blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/words.pl?word=simple

"How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?"

And to the YEC leaders i say:
"For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple."(Rom 16:18)

What purpose does wiping out creationism serve? I am curious.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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This thread asked for everybody's experiences. I gave mine.

Yes, I know, I believe personally a point can be made without harsh words about or to your fellow Christians. I was helping you see something about yourself. My words have come from scripture and my love. That is all. God bless.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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"For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:" (Eph 4:12)

I'd like to see how that is done using science. IF it can be done. So far I personally have seen very little convincing arguments. However, I will say this. Am I right in saying that the scripture that we read is the same... and so the understanding is slightly different... BUT the overall end result is in fact, the same. So I do not see what difference it makes in understanding whether we were created from sand and one of Adam's ribs or if we came from apes. I prefer one ideology more than the other, but it makes no difference to me. As long as all God's people are using love to spread the Word of God then there is no reason to argue one way or the other. My problem is I have not seen a lot of love in the argument about evolution vs. creation. And so I believe it to be pointless and fruitless.

Perhaps you can prove me wrong?

God bless.
 
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Xaero

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I'd like to see how that is done using science.
If you mean convincing yecs to TEs using science then you are right - it seems only possible in few cases since yecs don't listen to the TE's knowledge. But it strengthen the body of christ because the unbeliever is aware that christians ain't simple minded.

Am I right in saying that the scripture that we read is the same
Not at all since yec's only know the verses which seem to fit their theology, while avoiding all the others.
the overall end result is in fact, the same.
We are all brethrens in christ, and when you stay in him, you won't get lost - so the important thing is the same between us. Evolution/Creation is not the gospel.

My problem is I have not seen a lot of love in the argument about evolution vs. creation.
Love doesn't mean that you have to be nice all the time. Sometimes truth hurts - but i am trying to be as gentle as possible.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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If you mean convincing yecs to TEs using science then you are right - it seems only possible in few cases since yecs don't listen to the TE's knowledge. But it strengthen the body of christ because the unbeliever is aware that christians ain't simple minded.

Not at all since yec's only know the verses which seem to fit their theology, while avoiding all the others.
We are all brethrens in christ, and when you stay in him, you won't get lost - so the important thing is the same between us. Evolution/Creation is not the gospel.


Love doesn't mean that you have to be nice all the time. Sometimes truth hurts - but i am trying to be as gentle as possible.

Thank you for your reply, God bless. :thumbsup:
 
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artybloke

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I'd never use science to convince people of the truth about Christ, for the simple reason that you don't have to know anything about science to be a follower of Christ.

That, and I've seen people try to use it. They can convince people who's knowledge of science is zero; but anyone with any knowledge of the subject in question probably knows more than the person trying to convince others.

And if the "science" they use to convince folk into the kingdom is bad science, then it's a bad start to begin with. Whereof one cannot speak, thereof be silent.

Let your life speak, not your supposedly superior knowledge.
 
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mumluvsherboys

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I'd never use science to convince people of the truth about Christ, for the simple reason that you don't have to know anything about science to be a follower of Christ.

That, and I've seen people try to use it. They can convince people who's knowledge of science is zero; but anyone with any knowledge of the subject in question probably knows more than the person trying to convince others.

And if the "science" they use to convince folk into the kingdom is bad science, then it's a bad start to begin with. Whereof one cannot speak, thereof be silent.

Let your life speak, not your supposedly superior knowledge.

Excellent wisdom and a nice surprise. God bless!
 
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jds1977

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Thank you all for your posts. I am hoping to see more examples of actual witness encounters and by reviewing, there has been very little. This could mean one of two things: either the participants are too consumed w/ proving their position, or more worse, they just don't witness. Some have said they don't witness using science...I respect that. Of course science or knowledge doesn't save anyone but could be a means of introducing the gospel. We know that salvation comes from repentance and faith in Jesus Christ, and giving intellectual assent to Jesus or creation or guided evolution does not pardon our sins.
In these forums, I have observed many who say something to the effect of "I don't bible-beat them or shove the gospel down their throat", and "the best witness is to build a relationship w/ them and just talk and discuss etc..." I understand their point of view. My only problem is, what happens if they die tomorrow? Did you effectively share the gospel, or skirt the issues so as not offend? If I had a terminal disease and would die in a week unless treated, I would want a doctor who would tell me of my disease, it's symptoms, and its cure. Not one who would just pat me on the back and be lovey-dovey because he didn't want to upset me. Yet, so many times we as Christians do this. I am not referring to bible-beating someone. But, I am talking about speaking the truth in sincerity and love. Love is never offensive, but appreciated.
Some friends and I go to college campuses and all different kinds of hangout places to preach the gospel. I have the opportunity to witness to a lot of athiests at the secular colleges. When i ask them about God, they usually start by saying, "I don't believe in God, I believe evolution." As a yec, I quickly throw out some lines about the surrounding buildings. Did they just pop up and form over the years or were they designed and built? I use simple illustrations and sometimes delve into more scientific arguments depending on who I'm speaking to. My main objective is to get them thinking agnosticly instead of athiestic and then go directly for their conscience using the 10 commandments. All this done w/ a loving, caring spirit while making them laugh at times, and sometimes sheading tears makes a tremendous impact on their lives and the gospel seed is planted.
I started this thread as a change of atmosphere for the Christian brothers and sisters here, and to see how a TE might use science to witness. It's somewhat easier for me to witness to an athiest (or it would seem) because I believe in a literal interpretation of Gen. I am curious to know how a TE would witness using science. This is not for debate but to satisfy my curiosity. I would encourage those who said they wouldn't use science, to maybe come up w/ a gameplan in case the opportunity arose. We may have different origins theology but we're both preaching Christ and Him crucified. Looking forward to seeing more response...thanks
 
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Mallon

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Some friends and I go to college campuses and all different kinds of hangout places to preach the gospel. I have the opportunity to witness to a lot of athiests at the secular colleges. When i ask them about God, they usually start by saying, "I don't believe in God, I believe evolution." As a yec, I quickly throw out some lines about the surrounding buildings. Did they just pop up and form over the years or were they designed and built? I use simple illustrations and sometimes delve into more scientific arguments depending on who I'm speaking to.
This is exactly why I think it's a bad idea to use science to attest to Christ. If you ever hung around outside my lab door, and one of my lab mates popped out, they'd school you before you ever got the chance to even mention Christ! The argument that creating a building is analogous to creating life is a logical fallacy: argumentum ad ignorantium. Evolutionary theory has some very good explanations as to how biodiversity -- life, even -- might have arisen (yes, I am conflating evolution with abiogenesis here for the sake of argument). Just because you cannot fathom how any of this happened doesn't negate the theory. And besides that, short of just posting a bunch of links, I don't think I have ever seen you actually debate science. (No offense.)
Again, I think resorting to science to attest to Christ is like resorting to a bike repair manual. Science is nothing but a methology for investigating the natural world, and has never "proved" God one way or the other. Christ is supernatural. It's like trying trying to smell a flower with your eyes. You need the right tool for the job, and science is not the right tool as far as witnessing is concerned.
Marvelling at God's creation may open a door to conversation, but if you want to preach the law, preach the law. If your science is faulty, atheists will understandably pass you off and you will have avoidably missed your chance to introduce them to Christ
 
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random_guy

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Thank you all for your posts. I am hoping to see more examples of actual witness encounters and by reviewing, there has been very little. This could mean one of two things: either the participants are too consumed w/ proving their position, or more worse, they just don't witness. Some have said they don't witness using science...I respect that. Of course science or knowledge doesn't save anyone but could be a means of introducing the gospel. We know that salvation comes from repentance and faith in Jesus Christ, and giving intellectual assent to Jesus or creation or guided evolution does not pardon our sins.
In these forums, I have observed many who say something to the effect of "I don't bible-beat them or shove the gospel down their throat", and "the best witness is to build a relationship w/ them and just talk and discuss etc..."

That's basically how I witness to my friends. I show them that not all Christians (as they view them) are Bible Thumpers who only care about fire and brimestone. I show them my love and compassion for others and how God touches my life. Nothing turns off people more than hateful speech. I see this many times at my University. There's always a group that parades around the Free Speech area promoting the idea that Mormons, Catholics, gays, etc... are all going to Hell and are all horrible people. These people hurt Christianity through their hateful message.

I believe a more loving message would do much better. And even if I did not convert them, I would hope to leave an impression upon them so that they too would lead a good life, and would leave them open to conversion.
I understand their point of view. My only problem is, what happens if they die tomorrow?
And what if they die in the few seconds before you even talk to them? Should I scare them using Hell right away? We can play the what if game all we want, but it's pointless because they wouldn't convert if I shoved it straight down their throat.


Some friends and I go to college campuses and all different kinds of hangout places to preach the gospel. I have the opportunity to witness to a lot of athiests at the secular colleges. When i ask them about God, they usually start by saying, "I don't believe in God, I believe evolution."

Here in lies the problem. According to YECists, the Bible says evolution is false. This causes the atheists to falsely believe you either have to accept the Bible or science, but not both. That's why I am against Creationism. It causes educated people (especially in the scientific areas) to reject Christianity.

As a yec, I quickly throw out some lines about the surrounding buildings. Did they just pop up and form over the years or were they designed and built? I use simple illustrations and sometimes delve into more scientific arguments depending on who I'm speaking to.
But the problem is that's not how evolution works. This is exactly why I don't mix science and witnessing, it's too easy to say something that's incorrect. Buildings don't reproduce and accumulate small errors, so using them as an argument against evolution is wrong. Not only that, if you start spreading misinformation about how genetic information can't increase, then a simple paper search would prove your statement was incorrect (see my reply, I found a paper that directly shows an increase of genetic information, according to AiG's definition). Now what do the secular atheist think? Christians are ignorant, and don't understand science? Science and religion is incompatible?

These reasons are why Christians (especially those without scientific backgrounds) shouldn't be using science for the purposes of conversion. Many times, they are just plain wrong. For example, how many Creationists here have used the argument that the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics disproves evolution? Don't be shy, raise your hands. This argument is completely wrong, since it ignores the Sun. How many people have used genetic information against evolution? Carbon dating sea objects? Exponential population growth? All these arguments can be shown to be wrong, yet Creationists still use them.

I wouldn't use evolution to witness just because it, too, may also be wrong. Science changes, and I hate to use an argument that would later be shown to be incorrect because it may shake the faith of the people. A lot of atheists on the forums mentioned that they lost faith due to the stances of YECism and the lies spread by Dr. Hovind and his likes.
 
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