Us vs Them

[shinbits]

We seem to have an "Us vs Them" attitude, on both sides whenever a debate or doctrine is being discussed.

We are all Christians here, and I'm so sick of how some people here can call another brother/sister in Christ names, and purposely aim to drag them down.

You all now the now infamous "'Virgin' Mary" thread.

I was shocked at just how nasty this thread got.

Now first, let me start with me:

I saw what seemed to be discrepencies. So I posted them. A particular individual later tried to rip my character in his response, because he was Catholic.

I reacted in the flesh, and fired back at him.

After about three posts, I had to stop. And I quit posting for a while. And think.

This came to me:


1 Corinthians 3:3 (Whole Chapter)
You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere men?



Thinking back, I know I fired hard. And someone who believes in Mary would only act in an offended way. In trying to shed light, I may have offended some people.

For that, I am very sorry. Please forgive me.


We are all the body of Christ, Catholics, Baptists....anyone who believes in Christ as Savior.

The Bible says we are to sharpen each other in the Faith, as "Iron sharpens iron."

---Why can't we lift each other up with an encouraging word, as well as lead each other to the the truth of what the Bible teaches?

---Why can't we all use love to to try and show each other what's right with the Bible?

---Why can't we be humble, and accept with humility (after thoroughly anylizing doctrine) a good point that was made?

We need to drop the "Us vs Them" attitude, and start thinking "We".​

We should all be trying to lift each other up in the Faith, not beating each other up. And if someone, using sound doctine, shows that what we believe may be wrong, we should heed that brother or sister, since God may be trying to use them.

If that brother or sister is wrong when making that point, in love we ought to correct them, and in love and humility, that person should recieve that correction.

We are all by-passing basic, Sunday-school teaching of love, and loving even if someone else wrongs you in a post.

Well? Are we Christians who know who are mature and love each other, or are we just like the world?

 

[ChristianCenturion]

We seem to have an "Us vs Them" attitude, on both sides whenever a debate or doctrine is being discussed.

We are all Christians here, and I'm so sick of how some people here can call another brother/sister in Christ names, and purposely aim to drag them down.

You all now the now infamous "'Virgin' Mary" thread.

I was shocked at just how nasty this thread got.

Now first, let me start with me:

I saw what seemed to be discrepencies. So I posted them. A particular individual later tried to rip my character in his response, because he was Catholic.

I reacted in the flesh, and fired back at him.

After about three posts, I had to stop. And I quit posting for a while. And think.

This came to me:


1 Corinthians 3:3 (Whole Chapter)
You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere men?



Thinking back, I know I fired hard. And someone who believes in Mary would only act in an offended way. In trying to shed light, I may have offended some people.

For that, I am very sorry. Please forgive me.


We are all the body of Christ, Catholics, Baptists....anyone who believes in Christ as Savior.

The Bible says we are to sharpen each other in the Faith, as "Iron sharpens iron."

---Why can't we lift each other up with an encouraging word, as well as lead each other to the the truth of what the Bible teaches?

---Why can't we all use love to to try and show each other what's right with the Bible?

---Why can't we be humble, and accept with humility (after thoroughly anylizing doctrine) a good point that was made?

We need to drop the "Us vs Them" attitude, and start thinking "We".​

We should all be trying to lift each other up in the Faith, not beating each other up. And if someone, using sound doctine, shows that what we believe may be wrong, we should heed that brother or sister, since God may be trying to use them.

If that brother or sister is wrong when making that point, in love we ought to correct them, and in love and humility, that person should recieve that correction.

We are all by-passing basic, Sunday-school teaching of love, and loving even if someone else wrongs you in a post.

Well? Are we Christians who know who are mature and love each other, or are we just like the world?

May I suggest that this thread would be better posted in the forum where it applies... i.e. where the Mary thread to which you referred resides and where the audience is actually all Christians.

As for the OP, unity in Christ is a praiseworthy focus as long as it doesn't entail prostituting myself into accepting a different gospel.

 

[shinbits]

As for the OP, unity in Christ is a praiseworthy focus as long as it doesn't entail prostituting myself into accepting a different gospel.

agreed. just be willing and humble to accept loving guidence as to what the correct gospel is, then decipher and read the Word for yourself to see if it's true or not.

Should you find that it's not true, don't attack, but guide, with love, to the truth.

 

[*Starlight*]

You're right, but that that doesn't only apply to Christians... we should respect other people and their opinions even if they believe something else. Unfortunately, a lot of Christians have the "us vs them" mentality when they talk about non-Christians...

 

[The Gregorian]

1: it doesn't necissariliy have to mean 'we' as 'christians' but as 'all of the people trying to figure out what god wants, or if there is one, and either way, what is morally/ethically right?'

2: I agree, (see signiture) Galations even calls divisions and sects a sin... Eventually, we need to stop breaking off and forming new groups of christianity to suit our personal believes and just go by what the bible says.

 

[Garnet2727]

I think for those of us living in the United States, the "us vs them" attitude is imbedded in our current culture. Look at the polarization between the political parties here, as one example. A common attitude is, "It's my way or the highway." It's difficult, I think, to shed that attitude and discuss issues with reason and respect.

 

[shinbits]

You're right, but that that doesn't only apply to Christians... we should respect other people and their opinions even if they believe something else. Unfortunately, a lot of Christians have the "us vs them" mentality when they talk about non-Christians...

Let's also extend that to non-Christians who don't think God exists, people of other religions---

and this is a big one---

evolutionists and creationists.

For all the people mentioned, let's drop the "us vs them" attitude.

For example, with the evolution/creation debates, one side may make a valid point, but the other side, instead of saying "hey, you're right. Let me consider that.", they get defensive, and just don't want to lose no matter what.

With this issue, I've noticed that often, a side will have it's mind made up and not really caring about facts or truth, but are only bent on proving the other side wrong.

Let's change this around. Instead of saying things like, "you obviously are ill educated and stupid," thank the other person for providing good points that are valuable to the discussion.

I hope we can get along.

 

[Electric Sceptic]

evolutionists and creationists.

For all the people mentioned, let's drop the "us vs them" attitude.

For example, with the evolution/creation debates, one side may make a valid point, but the other side, instead of saying "hey, you're right. Let me consider that.", they get defensive, and just don't want to lose no matter what.

With this issue, I've noticed that often, a side will have it's mind made up and not really caring about facts or truth, but are only bent on proving the other side wrong.

Let's change this around. Instead of saying things like, "you obviously are ill educated and stupid," thank the other person for providing good points that are valuable to the discussion.

I hope we can get along.

I'll be happy to do this just as soon as I see a creationist make a valid point.

 

[shinbits]

I'll be happy to do this just as soon as I see a creationist make a valid point.

This is what I'm talking about. This attitude. There's this drive to pull the other side down, and take jabs at them.

If anyone is going to have this kind of attitude, then there's no use in participating in debates. Because your mind is made up, and there's no use talking to you.

If you can't be civil, no matter which side you're on, then just don't post.

Can we just be peaceful?

 

[Catherineanne]

As for the OP, unity in Christ is a praiseworthy focus as long as it doesn't entail prostituting myself into accepting a different gospel.

I fail to see the need for the word 'prostituting' in this sentence. Firstly because changing belief does not generally entail being paid for doing so, and secondly, because there is no connection whatever between any gospel message, of whatever denomination, and harlotry.

Can I put in my twopenn'orth for moderation and temperance of language, therefore?

 

[Electric Sceptic]

This is what I'm talking about. This attitude. There's this drive to pull the other side down, and take jabs at them.

If anyone is going to have this kind of attitude, then there's no use in participating in debates. Because your mind is made up, and there's no use talking to you.

I don't enter debates about creationism to have my mind changed. Creationism has been long proven to be false; the jury is in. People who believe in it need to be told facts, and it needs to be pointed out that what they support is rubbish.

Can we just be peaceful?

Peace, between knowledge and ignorance? No.

 

[Skydancing]

Christians should never feel morally superior to those of other faiths or none, in my opinion Christians have nothing to be superior about!

 

[Jacob4Jesus]

Although it's a nice idea, it's very idealistic. I can't tell you for how many years I have tried my best to get people to get along. I can't say how many times I have stifled saying things in a rude way because I want to get along with everyone. The sad thing is, it doesn't get you any further.

When I have tried to be nicer and have a unifying opinion, I get accused of not being able to choose a side and stick with it. When I choose a side, there are always those who will oppose it and not budge on their opposition. When I try to compromise and stay in the middle, people on both sides generally get angry with me and it becomes pointless to post anything when no one on either side supports you.

It's the adage of why can't we all get along (my least favorite cliche, thank you very much Rodney King) which isn't going to happen. It's noble that you would like it to, but just in the case that this very thread you started to convey this point has already betrayed that point, it shows that it's unlikely to happen any time soon.

And honestly, if everyone got along on a message board, do we honestly believe as many people would be posting?

 

[shinbits]

I don't enter debates about creationism to have my mind changed. Creationism has been long proven to be false; the jury is in. People who believe in it need to be told facts, and it needs to be pointed out that what they support is rubbish.


Peace, between knowledge and ignorance? No.

you completely miss the point.

Who's right and who's wrong is not what this thread is about. It's about basic respect and decency.

I guess some non-Christian people aren't capable of understanding that.

I shouldn't have posted this in a forum where godless people could respond.

This is my last post in this thread.

The rest of my brothers, I also posted this in the Christian ethics section. You can catch me over there.

 

[Electric Sceptic]

you completely miss the point.

Who's right and who's wrong is not what this thread is about. It's about basic respect and decency.

I guess some non-Christian people aren't capable of understanding that.

I shouldn't have posted this in a forum where godless people could respond.

The irony here is rather nice. Talking about respect and decency...which you lousy godless non-christians can't even undersatnd. Just shows how sincere the OP was in his post.

 

[shinbits]

Last post No Matter What.

The irony here is rather nice. Talking about respect and decency...which you lousy godless non-christians can't even undersatnd. Just shows how sincere the OP was in his post.

Electric Sceptic sent me a PM. Here it is with my response:

The hypocrisy of your last post in the "Us vs Them" thread is very telling...it shows how much you really want us to all get along (ie., not very much at all).

you purposely made two derogatory statements after an olive branch was handed out. That makes you a horrible person.

And I said some people, which includes you. Not all non-Christians.

 

[xAtheistx]

We are all Christians here

Nonsense.

Christians should never feel morally superior to those of other faiths or none, in my opinion Christians have nothing to be superior about!

Not even your eternal salvation?

 

[Electric Sceptic]

you purposely made two derogatory statements after an olive branch was handed out. That makes you a horrible person.

Yes, I can feel the respect and getting along - calling me a horrible person based on a post on a forum really shows how sincere you are in your desire for mutual respect.

And I said some people, which includes you. Not all non-Christians.

You said godless non-christians...geuess we know exactly how much respect you have for them.

 

[justanobserver]

The title of this thread did make me think it was about christians vs us godless non christians. And I was almost right. the difference between "some" christians and "some" of us godless non christians is very very little. I choose not to call myself one as I dont beleive at this point I am truly saved and dont live the life IAW the Word although I do pray daily to God for forgiveness and guidance for me. I am just not going to lay claim to a title when I am not living the Life.

So, perhaps I am a godless non christian but when the Word sais you shall know them by their fruit, I would rather be an honest sinner than a lying hypocrite that claims to be a christian. just a comment in general - not specifying anyone particular person that may or may not post in this forum board (ie: neighbors, co-workers, a preacher, a asst. preacher, the list can go on and on and on and...).

 

[Skydancing]

I am of the opinion that as long as your beliefs don't hurt others, and you are happy believing what you do, go for it!