(Unchurched)

[watchman7]

Hello Unchurched Brothers and Sisters,
I read in some of your letters that you are interested in why some Christians do not attend church. I think that we are usually referring to the what is called the mainstream church in America. There are obviously many thousands of Christians who do not attend these churches.
There are many reasons: dissatisfaction, health, disagreement,etc. I don't like to call us unchurched, but that seems to be the term that people understand. Most associate church with a building.
I do not believe the church requires real estate ownership in order to be scriptural.
I believe the church (whether they meet in church owned real estate, home, online, etc.) is scriptural as long as Christ is recognized as Lord and Savior and the Bible is accepted unconditionally as God's Word.
Any church (assembly of Believers) must abide by the principles set forth in the Bible.
Therefore, Christians should not forsake the gathering because the gathering can take place just about anywhere, even here on this forum. There are always those of course those who just cannot gather, but this should be the exception.
I believe if you desire to attend a local assembly in what is accepted as as church, this is good.
If you cannot or decide not to attend the local church building, I believe it is still scriptural if you assemble as I mentioned above.
So, fellow (unchurched) members, let's choose to assemble at home, work, school, on the river bank or even here in this forum.
Christ is the Head of the Church. The Church is the body of Christ. Don't let anyone look on the (unchurched) as being out of God's will.
IHS

 

[Andry]

There are obviously many thousands of Christians who do not attend these churches.

There are many reasons: dissatisfaction, health, disagreement,etc.
IHS

What about a rebellious spirit?

 

[StevenL]

What about rebellious "churches" ?

 

[Albion]

The drift of threads like this usually is towards the idea that the institutional church has failed Christians or has lost its way. I am not arguing against that now, but I would like to ask a related, more theological, question.

Granted, the NT speaks of gathering together and not avoiding this. We can assemble in many different ways. What of the argument that the institutional church is really Jesus' intent?

More precisely, what in the NT clearly establishes that what he instructed the Apostles and other disciples hearing his voice to do--and with the authority he gave them--could be transferred to anyone coming later?

Unless we can show that all that today's ministers and churches do in his name is with his permission or instruction, nothing of it matters except 1) the moral codes he taught to all men and 2) the connection we are invited to have with him, through Faith, as individuals.

Thoughts?

 

[watchman7]

I believe groups of Christians have been and still can be rebellious. Protestantism was born in this manner. Who is to say what is next in God's perfect plan.

The Church is the Body of Christ. It is more than an institution. Practically speaking, there must be communion between members the Head. In New Testament times, this occurred in Synagogues, homes, prisons, and outdoors. I believe in many ways we have surrendered to the program rather than to the Word.

I do believe the local church assembly is scriptural. As I have mentioned before, this is not always possible. We have to admit, obviously, that unchurched exists whether because of personal sin or God's will. Whatever the case, He still loves us and will make a way for us because He has a plan for each of us.

Christ gave us the Great Commission - to share His Good News. This hasn't changed.

We or nobody else can prove that all ministers or all churches provide instruction according to God's will. This however does not mean that nothing matters.God has given us (Christians) His Spirit of discernment that continues to reveal His will ,today as in the past, according to His Word. God has spoken. We have proof of that.

When we accept Christ by faith, our presuppositions take a radical change (repentance). We should actually believe what the Bible teaches, even if takes reading it every day for as long as we live.

Thanks for the input in this discussion concerning the (unchurched) (I really don't like that word).
May God Bless You.

 

[Sally Wren]

Hi you all. I"m using my husband's work computer at this job because my car broke down and he had to come and pick me up. So lucky me I get to use the computer again.

Well, how are you all doing? Good, I hope.

Wow cool, I just found this part of the website (I'm just new to this website) and I didn't know they had a section for Home Church and Unchurched. I perfer to think of myself as Unchurched since I have tried many Home Churches and quite frankly! How do you find one that is on track? They either don't believe in the manifestation of the Holy Spirit (the gifts) or they are really off on some harmful doctrine. This world is a zoo right now.

Praise God for His promises to us and especially the one the says the gates of hell will not prevail against the Church.

It is so sad what is happening to Terri Schiavo right now. It is a real case of someone (her husband) that thinks what he is doing is right. The bible says that what everyone does they think it is right but God weighs the spirits. This man has commited adultery. He has gone to the courts before the sinners to resolve his conflict. I have no doubt that he truly doesn't mean his wife harm but he seems to have a very confused mind. I have to ask myself how many judges in our country have decreed unrighteous decrees and the bible says "Woe, to those who decree unrighteous decrees". People think they are getting away with things, and the truth is that they are not. But it seems they have succeeded in taking Terri's life this time. Beyond a miracle!

Can I assemble here with some people? I just have this incredible drive to, for some unknown reason, to have a driving need to do God's Word and it says we are to assemble even as we see the day approaching.

But you know after living years outside the "church" (23 years now) I have thought and thought and thought and thought about things. I have come to the conclusion that we are not rightly dividing the Word of God. The bible also says that we are not to let any man deceive us by any means TOO.

Oh, by the way did you all hear that you can see Jesus on a piece of tile now. Yeah, He must be on that bathroom tile! Be sure and go see him, LOL. When they say He is here and He is there, do not go. That is what the bible says.

Well, glad to have been back. I'm going to be getting a computer of my own in a couple of weeks so I can be on more often again. I look forward to doing that.

Love Brothers and Sisters in Jesus Christ our Lord,

Kim

 

[2+2=5]

What about rebellious "churches" ?

!..Not possible

 

[Wisdom's Child]

!..Not possible

Really???

Matthew 24:48-51
But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

The Servant of the Lord, is a reference to the follower of Christ, and the Ecclesia (Church).

One of the signs of the "Evil Servant" (Rebellious Christian/Church) is that they tend to "smite their fellow servants", ie, verbally abuse other Christians...

Which of course never happens, especially at Christian Forums

 

[DEPO]

I am new to this site and have already encountered people who have come against what I know is true through the Holy Spirit..... I saw this post and wanted to let people know that Home Church is the new testament church, and in some countries it is the only church.

Here is why I love my Church,
We are a cell church which is a New Testament model. The Disciples of Christ spoke publically and house to house, this is what we do. We have the Saturday and Sunday meetings and during the week we have cell groups that meet, during cell we pray, worship and get into the word of God. This is not a bible study, a bible study is for personal growth, the cell is evangelical in the sense we invite friends, family and co-workers, we have all the basic church elements that the large service has. Prayer, worship, offering and ministry all takes place in the home.
At this time our Public services are growing due to the cell ministry, we have over 100 cells in our church and it is still growing strong.

 

[mrs.wilde]

I have been a Christian for six years and have searched, attended and found out that they don't have any use for me. I never felt right with organized churches. I quit attending church and started concentrated on evangelizing. I also serve V.O.M. I finally feel useful for the Lord. I have peace with Him too. Thank you for this forum.

 

[Albion]

I am new to this site and have already encountered people who have come against what I know is true through the Holy Spirit..... I saw this post and wanted to let people know that Home Church is the new testament church, and in some countries it is the only church.

I'd have to question what I think is being described there as "Home Church." There are a few organizations that claim to have made home churches into some formal organization, ordaining their own people and, in effect, becoming a defacto denomination. Home Churches are nothing more than churches in homes, unaffiliated with any denomination, but also just as likely to be Baptistic or Pentecostal or just about any kind of Christian in orientation as any other.

 

[mrs.wilde]

I'd have to question what I think is being described there as "Home Church." There are a few organizations that claim to have made home churches into some formal organization, ordaining their own people and, in effect, becoming a defacto denomination. Home Churches are nothing more than churches in homes, unaffiliated with any denomination, but also just as likely to be Baptistic or Pentecostal or just about any kind of Christian in orientation as any other.

That's very true. We just have to be complestely commited to Him. Thats the only way to discern. I believe if you are truful to Him He will help you to discern.

 

[9-iron]

Granted, the NT speaks of gathering together and not avoiding this. We can assemble in many different ways. What of the argument that the institutional church is really Jesus' intent?

I think both sides of the issue are out of balance. I will agree with the model and mode of operation more so with the 'institutional' church over home church. However, this beast if you will has been subject to false teaching, deception and abuse of authority. It has in a way become self destructive. In response it has become more and more self-propagating in order to save itself. Evermore creating it's own downfall.

On the other hand, I have found the home church movement to be out of balance as well. It to has been subject to false doctrine, abuse and lack of structure.

The main issue is that the church as whole lacks true, Godly, servant, humble and honest overseers in my opinion. The leaders we are either abusive or have been given into the false doctrines pasted down over the decades.

Walking in unity and love is addressed by Paul over and over. We must find some common ground and unity. We can do this and we do it without each one comprimising their core believes. It will take a little giving on both sides on issues that are irrelavant to the great commission.

 

[New_Wineskin]

On the other hand, I have found the home church movement to be out of balance as well. It to has been subject to false doctrine, abuse and lack of structure.

Perhaps , it just isn't for you . The home churches are as varied as the nondenoms . The only difference is the setting . That is all . That of course means there will be abuse since there is abuse o matter what the setting , no matter how many members , no matter how many levels of "authority , and no matter how long the group has been in existance . False doctrine ? The same can be applied . Structure ? Is structure needed ? What type and why ?

The main issue is that the church as whole lacks true, Godly, servant, humble and honest overseers in my opinion. The leaders we are either abusive or have been given into the false doctrines pasted down over the decades.

I see that we agree . Except that I wouldn't say that the church lacks these but groups calling themselves "churches" lack them .

 

[9-iron]

Perhaps , it just isn't for you . The home churches are as varied as the nondenoms . The only difference is the setting .

My personal home church experience has been with two groups. I also work with others who have tried cell church/home church type of fellowships. From what I gather most have a shelf life of 10-12 months on average. For whatever reason they don't seem to hold together. Or least in my limited experience.

The question is posed by the Apostle Paul and the commandment is to walk in love and in unity. How can we do that if we become exclusive of one another? In fact, I see more and more division occuring throughout the Body of Christ with each passing year it seems.

 

[9-iron]

I see that we agree . Except that I wouldn't say that the church lacks these but groups calling themselves "churches" lack them .

I think these people are out there. Unfortunately most are discouraged, caught up in false doctrine, under religious systems that hold them back or just have flat out thrown in the towel.

 

[New_Wineskin]

My personal home church experience has been with two groups. I also work with others who have tried cell church/home church type of fellowships. From what I gather most have a shelf life of 10-12 months on average. For whatever reason they don't seem to hold together. Or least in my limited experience.

Yeah , there are a lot out there that have existed for quite some time . I wonder what the shelf life is of new nondenoms . I can see why many fail . One reason is that they continue to think that they must meet . When you start with the Law , other laws are added .

The question is posed by the Apostle Paul and the commandment is to walk in love and in unity. How can we do that if we become exclusive of one another? In fact, I see more and more division occuring throughout the Body of Christ with each passing year it seems.

Well , I find two contraditory doctrines among many Christians . First , they quote a phrase of one sentence that is out of context with the rest of the book ... "do not fasake" the assmbling together . Then , they insist that one *must* join a singular group and "church hopping" is forbidden . These two doctrines contradict each other as the second is an intentional forsaking of groups other than that one . Even if they allow for people to attend the meetings of other groups , those visits are secondary and not primary .

No matter how many people with whom you associate or "meet" , you cannot meet with all believers . This "unity" thing is not really about the unity of believers . These are organizations . Their doctrinal differences don't indicate a disunity among believers except when believers look to their organization as speaker for the church instead of al believers being the Church . The whole concept ofthe necessity of meetings in buildings on scheduled times with scheduled religious things to do misses the whole point of being with one another . This is a big cause of what people consider "disunity" .

 

[watchman7]

Hello Brothers and Sisters in Christ.
I commend each of for sharing your views in the love of Christ.
I really do not understand the importance of where Christians gather to worship.
The most important element is that we gather in Christ.
I agree that there differences of views and sometimes the duration is short.
We can share more similar views if seriously begin and continue with personal and corporate Bible study. I believe this is a critical factor that is often avoided.
We shouldn't be too concerned of the longevity group meetings. The early churches founded by Paul ceased to exist after a few years. This does not mean that they were wrong or inscriptural. Many of the instutional churches began scripturally but now are little more than museums on the street corners.
God will always have a remnant people. They may even be scattered as Israel experienced in the past. I believe the institutional church and the "unchurched" ( I really don't like this title) both contain some of God's remnant people.
Maybe we should look at Paul's work with the Church. His most important focus was maintaining unity between churches without sacrificing the truth of Scripture.
Let's search and pray for God's will for us today. The unbeliever will question, We should have a defense for the Gospel with love.
The institutional church has invented the word "unchurched" for those of us who do not attend. My connotation for our group is Christian Church.
This is not to imply that there are not Christians in the institutional church because there are, of course, and I know many of them personally.
We should be known for our fruit of the Spirit and our love for one another.
Let'slook forward. Any suggestions?

 

[9-iron]

The whole concept ofthe necessity of meetings in buildings on scheduled times with scheduled religious things to do misses the whole point of being with one another .

I have found a lot of people need structure or they are too lazy and unmotivated to move on their own. Myself included at times.

 

[New_Wineskin]

I have found a lot of people need structure or they are too lazy and unmotivated to move on their own. Myself included at times.

Ok . I don't think of those things as motivators except to focus on religious things instead of the Lord . But , that is for me .