Twisted Scripture (False Doctrines)

[JacobCook715]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

 

[Hammster]

Just believe differently and you'll never fall away.

 

[extraordinary]

Jacob ... Jesus Loves You!

And He is ready, willing, and able to wipe out your sins, if you have the correct heart attitude.
So, just simply STAND on this passage ...

1 John 1:7-10
"But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another,
and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess (and repent of) our sins, He is faithful and just
to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."

Note: to repent means to agree that your sin is wrong, and to run from it.

 

[OzSpen]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God....

I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

Welcome to Christian Forums, Jacob. I'm pleased you have joined us. How did you hear about us?

I have a couple questions for which I'd like your clarification.

1. You say that you've been a Christian for little over a year. What did you believe that led you to salvation and to become a Christian?
2. How can you continue to experience eternal life? What do you need to do NOW in your life?

In Christ,
Oz

 

[sdowney717]

The Lord's promise to those that keep His words is clearly spelled out if you can believe this, keeping His word in your heart, then all will be well with you. One way of keeping His words is spending time studying His words and then following what He says to do in His words. Repent of your unbelief and sins against God and believe in the gospel of His dear Son. His arm is not shortened that it can not save you.

John 14

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

Indwelling of the Father and the Son

19 “A little while longer and the world will see Me no more, but you will see Me. Because I live, you will live also. 20 At that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you.

21 He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him.”

You have a precious promise of God's Christ right there in v21.

 

[Skala]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

I would say you did reach an extreme in thinking that holy living is not necessary for the Christian life.

But I'm afraid equally dangerous is to go full swing to the other side of the pendulum, the other extreme: thinking that good works is what saves you or keeps you saved.

Salvation is not by works, you don't do anything to earn salvation, thus how can you do anything to "keep" it or "Un-earn" it? If salvation is by works, it is no longer by grace, and the grace of God is cheapened, and man can boast/take credit in his salvation, all of which is forbid by the scriptures.

 

[Willie T]

Right believing produces right living. You have just chosen to believe whatever it is you have chosen to believe.

Don't blame the words of others. You were given a brain for a reason.

 

[catholichomeschooler]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

Christianity didn't REALLY make sense to me before I became Catholic. Jesus only started one Church, and it makes sense!

 

[bling]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

Bottom line is: “Do not believe anyone just because they said it.”

People can take verses out of context, use the wrong meaning for words and cause scripture to say almost anything they want.

You have to be responsible for yourself, the indwelling Holy Spirit can help you, but you have to allow the Spirit to lead you (God has allowed you this awesome responsibility).

 

[Skala]

Christianity didn't REALLY make sense to me before I became Catholic. Jesus only started one Church, and it makes sense!

Yeah, except he started the church, not the Roman Catholic Church.

 

[OzSpen]

Bottom line is: “Do not believe anyone just because they said it.”

People can take verses out of context, use the wrong meaning for words and cause scripture to say almost anything they want.

You have to be responsible for yourself, the indwelling Holy Spirit can help you, but you have to allow the Spirit to lead you (God has allowed you this awesome responsibility).

I have two questions:

1. Doesn't your 'bottom line' also apply to those who say things on this forum?
2. As for allowing the Spirit to lead you, how can I objectively know it is the Holy Spirit who is speaking and not human thoughts?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

Your opening statement is that you became a Christian a year ago. God promises eternal life to those who have believed in His Son for it. So you have it if you did believe in Jesus Christ for eternal life.

What did you believe that qualifies you to claim that you "became a Christian"? That's the key. If what you believed isn't saving faith, you were never saved in the first place, which may explain your current state. You may not have believed what you need to believe in order to be saved.

 

[OzSpen]

Your opening statement is that you became a Christian a year ago. God promises eternal life to those who have believed in His Son for it. So you have it if you did believe in Jesus Christ for eternal life.

What did you believe that qualifies you to claim that you "became a Christian"? That's the key. If what you believed isn't saving faith, you were never saved in the first place, which may explain your current state. You may not have believed what you need to believe in order to be saved.

Two things are needed for saving faith:

1. Acts 4:10-12, ' Let me clearly state to all of you and to all the people of Israel that he was healed by the powerful name of Jesus Christ the Nazarene,[a] the man you crucified but whom God raised from the dead. 11 For Jesus is the one referred to in the Scriptures, where it says,‘The stone that you builders rejected
   has now become the cornerstone.’
   12 There is salvation in no one else! God has given no other name under heaven by which we must be saved.” (NLT)
2. Matt 24:13, 'But the one who endures to the end will be saved' (NLT).

So there is salvation through Christ alone, but continuing faith is needed to be saved.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Two things are needed for saving faith:

1. Acts 4:10-12, ' Let me clearly state to all of you and to all the people of Israel that he was healed by the powerful name of Jesus Christ the Nazarene,[a] the man you crucified but whom God raised from the dead. 11 For Jesus is the one referred to in the Scriptures, where it says,‘The stone that you builders rejected
   has now become the cornerstone.’
   12 There is salvation in no one else! God has given no other name under heaven by which we must be saved.” (NLT)
2. Matt 24:13, 'But the one who endures to the end will be saved' (NLT).

So there is salvation through Christ alone, but continuing faith is needed to be saved.

I disagree. There is nothing in Scripture to conclude that one's faith must continue in order for one to be saved.

Paul's answer to the jailer was to believe, aorist tense. Nothing about continuing faith.

In the parable of the soils, in Luke 8:12 regarding the first soil, Jesus said "unless they believe and be saved". Believe is in the aorist tense. Yet, in the next verse, He noted that the second soil "believed for a while, then fell away", and He used the present tense. This demonstrates that the present tense doesn't necessarily mean continuing action.

If one must maintain faith in order to be saved, that means they are being saved by their faith. Jesus said that those who have believed HAVE eternal life, WILL NOT come into condemnation, and have PASSED from death to life.

If loss of faith results in loss of salvation, Jesus' words aren't true.

 

[OzSpen]

John 3:15-16 disagrees with the perspective you are promoting:

15 that whoever believes [present tense - continues to believe] in him may have [present tense - may continue to have] eternal life.
16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes [present tense - continues to believe] in him should not perish but have [present tense - continue to have] eternal life.
​

So to continue to have eternal life, any person must continue to believe. That's Bible. This is what perseverance of the saints means. Those who are truly saints are not those who once believed and then forgot about Jesus. They are those who continue to believe to the end of life or Jesus' second coming.

Oz

I disagree. There is nothing in Scripture to conclude that one's faith must continue in order for one to be saved.

Paul's answer to the jailer was to believe, aorist tense. Nothing about continuing faith.

In the parable of the soils, in Luke 8:12 regarding the first soil, Jesus said "unless they believe and be saved". Believe is in the aorist tense. Yet, in the next verse, He noted that the second soil "believed for a while, then fell away", and He used the present tense. This demonstrates that the present tense doesn't necessarily mean continuing action.

If one must maintain faith in order to be saved, that means they are being saved by their faith. Jesus said that those who have believed HAVE eternal life, WILL NOT come into condemnation, and have PASSED from death to life.

If loss of faith results in loss of salvation, Jesus' words aren't true.

 

[FreeGrace2]

John 3:15-16 disagrees with the perspective you are promoting:

15 that whoever believes [present tense - continues to believe] in him may have [present tense - may continue to have] eternal life.
16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes [present tense - continues to believe] in him should not perish but have [present tense - continue to have] eternal life.
​

So to continue to have eternal life, any person must continue to believe. That's Bible. This is what perseverance of the saints means. Those who are truly saints are not those who once believed and then forgot about Jesus. They are those who continue to believe to the end of life or Jesus' second coming.

Oz

If every occurrence of believe was in the present tense, you would have a point, but it also occurs in the aorist tense. Paul's answer to the jailer was in the aorist tense and the result was in the future tense (will be saved).

Interestingly, Jesus used the aorist tense in Luke 8:12 regarding the first soil: "lest they believe and be saved". Nothing about continuing to believe to be sav ed. Then, in the next verse, He says of the second soil: "they believed (present tense) for a while". Huh? How is that possible? Present tense believing for a while?

I think it is a mistake to make more of the present tense than is warranted. Did Luke misquote Jesus, or was Jesus not aware of Greek syntax? Of course not.

It is clear from Scripture that at the moment one believes (aorist tense), one is saved and HAS eternal life. And there is nothing to suggest that eternal life isn't eternal, or can be lost.

If one must continue in faith in order to continue to be saved, then one is saved by their own continuing faith. That is not God's plan. His plan is to save those who believe (aorist - Acts 16:31).

Regeneration occurs at the moment of faith, not some time later. The one who believes in a point in time becomes a new creation (2 Cor 5:17). That doesn't change. If one does not "live by faith" they come under God's hand of discipline, which can be extremely severe, including loss of eternal reward.

But there is no hint of loss of salvation in Scripture.

 

[A New Dawn]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

And that part that I highlighted, above, is where you problems lie. There is no one who is a serious believer who would espouse or teach that you can do whatever you want (including sinning) after you are saved. Not even people who believe in OSAS. That is called antinomianism, and is a heretical position.

Antinomianism:
- The belief that once a believer is saved, they are not bound to follow moral laws.
- The belief that a saved believer can freely sin because he is forgiven of past and future transgressions.

The Bible is clear that if one is saved, they are saved unto good works in Jesus Christ (Ephesians). And that faith without works is dead (James).

So, if someone taught you that you could do anything you wanted because you were previously forgiven, they were wrong. That doesn't make OSAS wrong, nor does it mean that we are not saved by grace alone. If you are indeed saved, Christ will help you to put off those sins and help you make your life a sacrifice to Him.

 

[extraordinary]

There is nothing in Scripture to conclude that one's faith must continue in order for one to be saved.

I post this list for the benefit of those who have eyes to see, ears to hear, etc.

[FONT=&quot]Col 1:22-23 • He has reconciled in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and blameless, and above reproach in His sight —[/FONT][FONT=&quot]if indeed you continue in the faith[/FONT][FONT=&quot], [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Cor 15:1-2 • Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]which also you received and in which you stand, by which also [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you — unless you believed in vain.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 2:1-4 • Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]lest we drift away[/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT][FONT=&quot] For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation …?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 10:36-39 • For you have need of endurance, so that after you have done the will of God, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]you may receive the promise: “For yet a little while, and He who is coming will come [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and will not tarry. Now the just shall live by faith; but if anyone draws back, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]My soul has no pleasure in him.” But we are not of those who draw back to perdition[/FONT][FONT=&quot], [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]but of those who believe to the saving of the soul. … Oh, really? Paul always encourages.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Tim 4:16 • Take heed to yourself and to the doctrine. Continue in them, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Jude 1:20-21 • But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]praying in the Holy Spirit, keep yourselves in the love of God, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Phil 2:12-16 • … work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… that you may (not will) become blameless and harmless, children of God without fault[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… holding fast the word of life, so that I may (not will) rejoice in the day of Christ [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]that I have not run in vain or labored in vain[/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Pet 1:5-9 • … the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]perishes, though it is tested by fire, may (not will) be found to praise, honor, and glory at [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]the revelation of Jesus Christ … receiving the end of your faith — the salvation of your souls.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Tim 6:9-14 • But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]many foolish and harmful lusts which drown men in destruction and perdition (i.e. hell). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. But you, O man of [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, to which you were also called …[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus … that you[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]keep this commandment [/FONT][FONT=&quot]without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ’s appearing[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Rev 2:10 • Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]that[/FONT][FONT=&quot] you may (will) be tested[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and you will have tribulation ten days. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of (eternal) life.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]James 1:12 • Blessed is the man who endures temptation; for when he has been approved, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]he will receive the crown of life[/FONT][FONT=&quot] which the Lord has promised to those who love Him.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 3:6,14 • Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… For we have become partakers of Christ, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2 Tim 2:12 • If we endure, we shall also reign with Him. If we deny Him, He also will deny us.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Because of all of the above verses …[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1) Christians see the following passage as having a double-meaning:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matt 10:22 • But he who endures to the end (of his life) will be saved. (also Mark 13:13, Matt 24:13)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2) Eternal life is actually granted (or denied) some time after one dies![/FONT]
.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I post this list for the benefit of those who have eyes to see, ears to hear, etc.

[FONT=&quot]Col 1:22-23 • He has reconciled in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and blameless, and above reproach in His sight —[/FONT][FONT=&quot]if indeed you continue in the faith[/FONT][FONT=&quot], [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Cor 15:1-2 • Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]which also you received and in which you stand, by which also [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you — unless you believed in vain.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 2:1-4 • Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]lest we drift away[/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT][FONT=&quot] For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation …?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 10:36-39 • For you have need of endurance, so that after you have done the will of God, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]you may receive the promise: “For yet a little while, and He who is coming will come [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and will not tarry. Now the just shall live by faith; but if anyone draws back, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]My soul has no pleasure in him.” But we are not of those who draw back to perdition[/FONT][FONT=&quot], [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]but of those who believe to the saving of the soul. … Oh, really? Paul always encourages.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Tim 4:16 • Take heed to yourself and to the doctrine. Continue in them, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Jude 1:20-21 • But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]praying in the Holy Spirit, keep yourselves in the love of God, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Phil 2:12-16 • … work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… that you may (not will) become blameless and harmless, children of God without fault[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… holding fast the word of life, so that I may (not will) rejoice in the day of Christ [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]that I have not run in vain or labored in vain[/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Pet 1:5-9 • … the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]perishes, though it is tested by fire, may (not will) be found to praise, honor, and glory at [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]the revelation of Jesus Christ … receiving the end of your faith — the salvation of your souls.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]1 Tim 6:9-14 • But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]many foolish and harmful lusts which drown men in destruction and perdition (i.e. hell). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. But you, O man of [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, to which you were also called …[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus … that you[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]keep this commandment [/FONT][FONT=&quot]without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ’s appearing[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Rev 2:10 • Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]that[/FONT][FONT=&quot] you may (will) be tested[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and you will have tribulation ten days. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of (eternal) life.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]James 1:12 • Blessed is the man who endures temptation; for when he has been approved, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]he will receive the crown of life[/FONT][FONT=&quot] which the Lord has promised to those who love Him.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Heb 3:6,14 • Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]… For we have become partakers of Christ, [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2 Tim 2:12 • If we endure, we shall also reign with Him. If we deny Him, He also will deny us.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Because of all of the above verses …[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1) Christians see the following passage as having a double-meaning:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matt 10:22 • But he who endures to the end (of his life) will be saved. (also Mark 13:13, Matt 24:13)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2) Eternal life is actually granted (or denied) some time after one dies![/FONT]
.

Those with eyes which see will see plainly that none of these verses says that continued faith is required for salvation.

 

[stevenfrancis]

Hello all,

I have been Christian for little over a year now and I have backslidden to a state of prayerlessness, habitual sin, inner bitterness toward God and sheer fear of if I am beyond salvation, but in my heart I want nothing more than to return to God.

When I started out learning scripture I got the wrong idea of salvation, preachers commonly preach on:

- Once Saved Always Saved - LIES
- Works are nothing, faith is everything - LIES
- God forgives ALL sin, no matter how many - LIES

Now many here will agree with some, if not all them statements. But I challenge you, as I feel they are scripture that has been sinisterly twisted over the years.

By believing these doctrines I developed an attitude that no matter what I did, I was saved and all I had to do was believe that God raised Jesus from the dead (which I did). This led me to think I could get away with enjoying the "passing pleasures" of sin. As a result, I have backslidden and tremble at the thought of if I have "fallen away".

The Bible clearly states:

'but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.' - Matthew 24:13

'In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.' - James 2:17

'If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,' - Hebrews 10:26

'It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.' - Hebrews 6:4-6

'And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.' - Luke 12:10


I want to come back to God, to feel that passion that I had some time ago. False doctrine like above has helped cause me to stumble, along with my own foolishness. Please, if you have any advice for me or want to chat about the above doctrines, please leave a comment.

God bless you all.
Jacob

This has all the earmarks of journey that didn't include a serious look at the universal Church established by Jesus Christ, where there exists the fullness of truth, and a magesterial interpretation of scripture, and Christian tradition. These things are problems for those who like the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts of the Apostles, were trying to understand the depth of the scriptures, and the paradoxes they present, without guidance from the Apostles.

Acts 8:26 Meanwhile, Philip was commanded by an angel of the Lord, Rise up, and go south to meet the road which leads from Jerusalem to Gaza, out in the desert.[1] 27 So he rose up and went; and found there an Ethiopian. This man was a eunuch, a courtier of Candace, queen of Ethiopia, and had charge of all her wealth; he had been up to worship at Jerusalem, 28 and was now on his way home, driving along in his chariot and reading the prophet Isaias. 29 The Spirit said to Philip, Go up to that chariot and keep close by it. 30 And Philip, as he ran up, heard him reading the prophet Isaias, and asked, Canst thou understand what thou art reading? 31 How could I, said he, without someone to guide me? And he entreated Philip to come up and sit beside him. 32 The passage of scripture which he was reading was this; He was led away like a sheep to be slaughtered; like a lamb that is dumb before its shearer, he would not open his mouth. 33 He was brought low, and all his rights taken away; who shall tell the story of his age? His life is being cut off from the earth.[2] 34 And the eunuch turned to Philip, and said, Tell me, about whom does the prophet say this? Himself, or some other man? 35 Then Philip began speaking, and preached to him about Jesus, taking this passage as his theme. 36 As they went on their way, they came to a piece of water, and the eunuch said, See, there is water here; why may I not be baptized? 37 Philip said, If thou dost believe with all thy heart, thou mayest. And he answered, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.[3] 38 So he had the chariot stopped, and both of them, Philip and the eunuch, went down into the water, and Philip baptized him there. 39 But when they came up from the water, Philip was carried off by the spirit of the Lord, and the eunuch did not see him any longer; he went on his way rejoicing. 40 As for Philip, he was next heard of at Azotus; and from there he went preaching all round the villages, until he reached Caesarea.

I'm not going to debate these individual issues because of time and space, but I do encourage you heavily to look deeply into these at your leisure. You may find yourself back on your path, with a lot more security in Christ.

I'm Not Catholic | Catholics Come Home
NEW ADVENT BIBLE: Genesis 1
CHURCH FATHERS: Home
The Holy See - Archive