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Truth, Epistemology, and Purpose

Chany

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A humanist is an atheist. Humanism does not recognize any God. The god in humanism is human.

A secular humanist is an atheist/agnostic/skeptic, but not all atheists/agnostic/skeptics are secular humanists.

I'm done discussing this. I want to focus on my epistemological questions and discussions.
 
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leftrightleftrightleft

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Chany,

I like what you said but I have some questions and/or disagreements:

Alright, after going through the responses, I would like to point out a few things.

The major point that everyone (seemingly) agrees on is the answer to question 3. The main reason we actually care about truth and how to find it is because it affects our lives. Finding truth is more than just a hobby or intellectual exercise. The answers will affect our lives.

What about that astronomy masters student studying some particular star 400 light years away which we can never reach and has no impact on our planet? What is the purpose of the knowledge or truth gleaned from this exercise?

Based upon these answers, I will state this: We care about truth because what is true affects our decisions. For whatever reason, we care about the outcomes of our decisions. The only way to accurately make the right choice for the desired outcome is by having the necessary information. The more knowledge one has, the more likely one can make better decisions and achieve desired outcomes and goals. For example, consider the health of a person. If we want to be healthy, we must understand as much as we can about the aspects of health, such as nutrition, anatomy, etc. We want to understand the truth of these subjects so we can make decisions regarding how to be healthy.

I'm not sure I agree. Can truth not be sought just for truth's sake? I am reminded of the astronomy student studying that star 400 light years away. Many aspects of truth-seeking are not "practical" or "useful". Why are we spending billions of dollars on the LHC to find some particles that interact so weakly with matter that they will likely have no usefulness to us? Why search for echoes from the Big Bang when that past history has little to no impact for our life on Earth? Why search for signatures of life on other planets hundreds of light years away?

I think one of the highest ideals of science is to search for truth for truth's sake, not for our own practical uses. Curiosity is the only requirement.

This is a maxim of sorts. Anything dealing with truth will ultimately come down to this. Anyway we define truth, how to obtain it, or what propositions are true that does not aid in this maxim is frivolous and pointless; if it does not help in making the right decisions with regards to desired outcomes, it is worthless.

Truth does not have to affect decision-making. When they found the Higgs-Boson, the way I make decisions did not change. And the vast majority of humanity, even the scientists working on the project, did not change their decision-making processes based on the discovery of the Higgs particle. Was all the work in the LHC worthless?


The next point I would like to illustrate is, probably, the annoying one that throws a wrench into things: the problem with the correspondence theory of truth. The correspondence theory of truth claims that truth is that which conforms to reality. For example, the statement that "the earth is round" is true if the earth is, in correspondence with reality, round.

Here's the problem: we have no way of knowing, with 100 percent absolute certainty, that a claim corresponds with reality for all practical purposes. Sure, I can be one hundred percent certain that saying, "I am not omniscient," and, "I (whatever 'I' am) feels sad," corresponds with reality. I am also one hundred percent certain that there is a set, objective reality out there somewhere. Beyond a few other similar examples, however, everything is called into question. This is because there are barriers in between the whole of external reality and my internal self.

First, there is the barrier of comprehension between myself and reality. I may not even be able to grasp actual reality and simply miss major parts of it. I, in the most literal sense, can't handle the truth. It is beyond my mind's capability to process. A way to look at this is to compare the comprehension and understanding of reality an amoeba possesses to that of a human, and the gap of comprehension becomes easy to understand.

Next is the gap of perception. The only thing I am really aware of is my qualia, or subjective personal experience. I don't know what prompts my qualia and how that exactly relates to reality. The classic example regarding this is the brain in a vat: I could, in fact, be a floating nervous system that is prompted to believe exactly what I am seeing, even though what I perceive is not correspondent with reality at all.

There is also the barrier of linguistics. This simply refers to the a problem of communication breaking down when our language tools cannot adequately describe something we perceive or create discrepancies between different people. For example, let's say you see a new color. You have never seen it before and cannot relate it to any other color you have experienced. Let's say you want to describe it to a friend. If they cannot ever see the color, how could explain the color?

In short, this definition of truth fails our maxim. If we are to follow it to its logical end, it leads us incapable of finding out correct information, and, therefore, preventing us from making the right decisions to get the absolute desired outcomes. As I said, there is a objective reality out there, but we are forever cut off from it. We must either modify or change the definition of truth and look at it in a different way. I am sure most of you already have answers or objections.

I will post more tomorrow.

Great thoughts. Thanks :)
 
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juvenissun

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A secular humanist is an atheist/agnostic/skeptic, but not all atheists/agnostic/skeptics are secular humanists.

I'm done discussing this. I want to focus on my epistemological questions and discussions.

Agree.
 
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GrowingSmaller

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OP. Ok if you know of no purpose, then why not hand to me your life savings? If you know of no difference it would make, having no access to reality via comprehension of truth.... then why not?

If you are a complete nihilist you may do that, but I feel you know it would have adverse affects. Hence you can know of effects, and implicitally that you have preferabilities disclosed to you.

Of course we cannot be 100% sure about everything, but that does not entail we know nothing. Thats extremism, black and white thinking. You are unwilling to go to extremes sor the sake of philosophy I imagine, which implies you have art least a "hunch" or sub conscious understanding that I may be onto something. QED, or bank details....?

BTW I would much prefer not to exploit someone for a percieved "philosophical weakness", but help them come to the "truth" if possible. ANd what goes round comes round, make sense to me.
 
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