"True repentence"

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Firstly, this passage is not biblical justification for divorce. This was something the children of Israel did because they had broken a commandment that the Lord told them, which was in Deuteronomy 7:1-3, which says, "When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Caananites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; and when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son."

So you see here that the people were never even supposed to marry foreign women anyway as commanded by the Lord; so, in order to return to the Lord's will, Ezra commanded the people to put them away from them. That is the only reason why the people divorced their wives: because they were commanded not to be married in the first place. . . . .
.

You just said divorce is OK if the marriage should never have happened.

Now consider the marriage of Hosea. Explain why that SHOULD have happened.

 

[razzelflabben]

Every time I read a post in this thread I am reminded of this passage James 1:5...maybe it is a promise for the OPer for this time in life...maybe it is a reminder to all of us participating that God's wisdom is greater than ours and we should trust Him and His wisdom over our own ideas and imaginations no matter how wise they might sound. No matter it is the one who asks for wisdom that receives it without judgment from God...seems to me that wisdom was asked for and sought after by the OPer. Maybe we all need to learn to trust God and His wisdom over our own.

 

[thesunisout]

Your ASSUMPTIONS are out the SHAZANG ! !

You do not KNOW me, nor have YOU been in my home for the last 19 years.

I could have written a novel ...BUT.... Ain't Nobody Got Time For That!
My respect, submission, care, concern, adjustments, tweaking this then that, PRAYERS upon PRAYERS Only GOD knows this clear reality in my life. Not to mention, the abuse my daughters (who i didn't include for their safety!!). Unreal how so many of you ASSUME on this post!
Stop throwing stones and pointing fingers .
How bout this for pointing out ...
You forgot to add the next line:
7 You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered.
here ya go, you'll hate this one too:
" Husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them." Col 3:19

I misread what you were asking, sorry. What does your Pastor say?

I don't doubt that you and your family have endured a lot. I sympathize for you; I had an abusive alcoholic father who destroyed my family. I know what a dysfunctional family environment can be like. I am sure you are tired and weary of all of this, but the scripture tells us not to become weary in well doing:

Galatians 6:9

And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not

You will reap a harvest if you don't give up. We also see this:

1 Peter 3:9

Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing

We are called to repay evil with blessing, and because of that you will inherit a blessing

 

[razzelflabben]

I don't assume anything about you or your life. You said you're here to get someone to give you a reason to divorce your husband, but no such reason exists. So therefore, if you're not to divorce your husband, then your only choice is to figure out how to live with him. That means following the scriptures which tell you how to be a godly wife. If you're unwilling to do that then that is something between you and the Lord, not between you and your husband.

I don't doubt that you and your family have endured a lot. I sympathize for you; I had an abusive alcoholic father who destroyed my family. I know what a dysfunctional family environment can be like. I am sure you are tired and weary of all of this, but the scripture tells us not to become weary in well doing:

Galatians 6:9

And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not

You will reap a harvest if you don't give up. We also see this:

1 Peter 3:9

Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing

We are called to repay evil with blessing, and because of that you will inherit a blessing

The world would say divorce, but Gods heart is reconciliation. That is a cross to bear, but it is not greater than the cross Jesus endured for us

not to butt in or anything but the OP asked for advice on how to talk to her friends about her decisions based on scripture not on whether or not to divorce and I should have to remind you of this but it is against forum rules to advice someone to divorce or not so in both cases you are wrong.

 

[thesunisout]

not to butt in or anything but the OP asked for advice on how to talk to her friends about her decisions based on scripture not on whether or not to divorce and I should have to remind you of this but it is against forum rules to advice someone to divorce or not so in both cases you are wrong.

Oh, thanks..I should have reread the OP before commenting. I guess I just misunderstood what she was asking

 

[RaymondG]

Every time I read a post in this thread I am reminded of this passage James 1:5...maybe it is a promise for the OPer for this time in life...maybe it is a reminder to all of us participating that God's wisdom is greater than ours and we should trust Him and His wisdom over our own ideas and imaginations no matter how wise they might sound. No matter it is the one who asks for wisdom that receives it without judgment from God...seems to me that wisdom was asked for and sought after by the OPer. Maybe we all need to learn to trust God and His wisdom over our own.

Interesting. Would you suggest getting rid of the Christian advice section? Maybe to be replaced by a Christian encouragement only section?

I do agree that all posts should have only one reply...: James 1:5. But what fun would that be? you wouldn't continue to come here if you were only allowed to post the truth of James 1:5, would you?

 

[Mal'ak]

In regards to Matthew 19, Jesus is not making commandments. He is given wisdom of a higher standard, if you read both Matthew 5 and Matthew 19 which many on here have quoted, it is not a commandment. The Bill of Divorce was a commandment, which Jesus tells us in Matthew shall not be changed or taught to ignore until his return at the end of this world. There are two things to take away from the Matthew 5 and 19, it is a "saying". The proper way is to not have divorce, but if it is not working out then you can divorce.

Deuteronomy 24:1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

The wisdom to understand is after the saying, the disciples say it was not worth getting married if you end up being with someone you do not like and can not even divorce her. Jesus then replied, that his saying was not for everyone and only for those meant to receive it. Just meaning there are those Christians that are able and can live at a higher standard of living holy, but others that can not bare it. Better you divorce, then to let the misery from the marriage cause you to sin. As Jesus said in Matthew 19 also, if your hand offends you cut it off and caste it away so your entire body does not go to hell.

Matthew 19:10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.
11 But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.

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On repentance, which is part of this also. What has been said is half truths also, as there is a difference between repenting and saying "I am sorry". Anyone wanting to ease someone's wrath, or not get in trouble will give a quick lie "I am sorry". Empty words mean nothing to God, so it should not mean anything to you. Of course, you should still forgive people if they apologize or not, but it does not mean you have to believe they are really remorseful. Repent in the Greek meaning when Jesus used it in the bible was to "change" and "amend". It does not mean to say an empty "I am sorry" then keep doing it, there is no repentance then. The answer is simple:

"I forgive you for your sin against me, but I do not believe you are sorry or will ever change, so the best thing I can do for myself to prevent the misery of this Marriage to cause me to falter and sin is to end it".

Repent in Greek means:
to change one's mind, i.e. to repent
to change one's mind for better, heartily to amend with abhorrence of one's past sins

 

[Galilee63]

1. I will try and make this concise and short Lovie - gather up your marriage with your heart and Soul and immerse your Heart and Soul along with your husbands Heart and Soul in complete Trust in our Lord Jesus Christ and in Most Holy Mother Mary handing over your marriage to Jesus in entirety. Trust in Jesus completely. Always. Picture our Lord Jesus Christ standing there watching during all abuses and make The Sign of The Cross over your husband heartfully and mentally as he abuses. "3" times. Then walk away out of the room and pray for yourself and him. To Jesus in complete trust. Including Most Holy Mother Mary Whom intercedes with Jesus.

Offer up your heart Soul and Sufferings - our Lord Jesus Christ Loves Sufferings - for all of His Loving Holy Divine Intentions and for Most Holy Mother Marys Loving Holy Divine Intentions and there are trillions innumerable Holy Causes of our Lord Jesus Christs in which Jesus takes these of those whom offer with a joyful heart to Him and immerses their hearts Souls and sufferings in His Holy Sacred Wounds and in His Precious Holy Blood then wait...for what our Blessed Holy Trinity gives back to you in your Life!! I have done this for 7 years with my whole life changed and others around me changed for the good/best in our Lord Jesus Christ and in Most Holy Mother Mary Whom lead me to "receive" Jesus in to my heart in God The Most High and in Holy Spirit as I suffered dreadfully in a similar circumstance to you. Ask for our Lords Holy Callings to be bestowed upon you at the same time and see what happens next!!

Make The Sign of The Cross in front of Jesus on The Cross reverently and trusting.

"Jesus I trust in You. Jesus Mary I Love you save Souls"
For your husband
"O Blood and Water which gushed forth from The Heart of Jesus as a Fount of Mercy for us, I Trust in You". x 3 times as our Lord Jesus Christ asked of mankind through His Holy Saint Faustina (Nun/Sister) when delivering His Holy Divine Mercy Chaplet and Novena. Then Jesus works through that heart/Soul deeply powerfully converting them leading them to repentance, to Healing, to Salvation after Conversion Jesus said.

Store up your treasures on your Soul through your sufferings and offer up the past sufferings most greatly in addition to the current sufferings as Gods Holy Saints Nuns did to our Lord Jesus Christ and you wont ever look back upon this current state of life.

1. Immerse your husband's Heart and Soul in our Lord Jesus Christ's Holy Sacred Wounds and in His Precious Holy Blood daily for 7 days, praying like this, as our Blessed Holy Trinity told Holy Saint Marie Chambon in the early 1900s delivering His Holy Wound Chaplet of which Jesus said,

"My Wounds are like Gold in The Crucible"
"Anything that is asked in My Sacred Wounds and through My Precious Blood is heard and answered"
"Through My Sacred Wounds and Precious Blood hearts are healed and strengthened".
"Pray on the Strength of My Bitter Passion, ask My Father to look upon My Sacred Wounds, Precious Blood and upon and through My Divine Countenance, The Most Holy Face of Jesus and to look through My Divine Love United with My Mother's Divine Love for God The Most High praying for the world, praying for the conversions and salvation of souls and hearts, offering up your sufferings and immersing them with your hearts and souls in My Sacred Wounds and Precious Blood for My Healing".

Our Blessed Holy Trinitys Holy Wound Chaplet after making The Sign of The Cross in reverence in front of our Lord Jesus on The Cross

O Jesus Divine Redeemer be Merciful to us and to the whole world Amen.
Strong God Holy God Holy Mighty God have mercy on us and on the whole world Amen
Grace and Mercy O My Jesus during present dangers cover us with Your Precious Blood Amen
O Eternal Father grant us mercy through The Blood of Jesus Christ Thy only Son, grant us mercy we Beseech Thee Amen Amen Amen

x1 O Eternal Father I offer Thee The Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ to Heal the Wounds of our Souls Amen.

x10

My Jesus Pardon and Mercy through The Merits of Thy Holy Wounds

Pray this 5 times - 5 Holy Decades then make The Sign of The Cross afterwards in reverence. Every one of our Lords Holy Wound Chaplets and Holy Divine Mercy Chaplets and The Most Holy Rosary are heard and answered by our Blessed Holy Trinity and by Most Holy Mother Mary every time over 7 years for everything

+++

THE EIGHT BEATITUDES OF JESUS

"Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Blessed are they who mourn,
for they shall be comforted.

Blessed are the meek,
for they shall inherit the earth.

Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they shall be satisfied.

Blessed are the merciful,
for they shall obtain mercy.

Blessed are the pure of heart,
for they shall see God.

Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they shall be called children of God.

Blessed are they who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."

Gospel of St. Matthew 5:3-10

 

[Galilee63]

Jesus the Bread of Life

22The next day, the crowd that had remained on the other side of the sea realized that only one boat had been there, and that Jesus had not boarded it with His disciples, but they had gone away alone. 23However, some boats from Tiberias arrived near the place they had eaten the bread after the Lord had given thanks. 24So when the crowd saw that neither Jesus nor His disciples were there, they got into the boats and went to Capernaum to look for Him. 25When they found Him on the other side of the sea, they asked Him, “Rabbi, when did You get here?”

26Jesus replied, “Truly, truly, I tell you, it is not because you saw these signs that you are looking for Me, but because you ate the loaves and had your fill. 27Do not work for food that perishes, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. For on Him God the Father has placed His seal of approval.”

28Then they inquired, “What must we do to perform the works of God?”

29Jesus replied, “The work of God is this: to believe in the One He has sent.”

30So they asked Him, “What sign then will You perform, so that we may see it and believe You? What will You do? 31Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, as it is written: ‘He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’c”

32Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I tell you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread from heaven. 33For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

34“Sir,” they said, “give us this bread at all times.”

35Jesus answered, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to Me will never hunger, and whoever believes in Me will never thirst. 36But as I told you, you have seen Me and still you do not believe.

37Everyone the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will never drive away. 38For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but to do the will of Him who sent Me.

39And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall lose none of those He has given Me, but raise them up at the last day. 40For it is My Father’s will that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.”

41At this, the Jews began to grumble about Jesus because He had said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42They were asking, “Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How then can He say, ‘I have come down from heaven?’”

43“Stop grumbling among yourselves,” Jesus replied. 44“No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. 45It is written in the Prophets: ‘And they will all be taught by God.’d Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from Him comes to Me— 46not that anyone has seen the Father except the One who is from God; only He has seen the Father.

47Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life. 48I am the bread of life. 49Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died. 50This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that anyone may eat of it and not die. 51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And this bread, which I will give for the life of the world, is My flesh.”

52At this, the Jews began to argue among themselves, “How can this man give us His flesh to eat?”

53So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I tell you, unless you eat the flesh and drink the blood of the Son of Man, you have no life in you. 54Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55For My flesh is real food, and My blood is real drink.

56Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood remains in Me, and I in him. 57Just as the living Father sent Me and I live because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on Me will live because of Me. 58This is the bread that came down from heaven. Unlike your fathers, who ate the manna and died, the one who eats this bread will live forever.”

Mark 1:15 New International Version (NIV)

15 “The time has come, He said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news

 

[Galilee63]

The Greatest in the Kingdom
(Mark 9:33-37; Luke 9:46-50)

1At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who then is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”

2Jesus called a little child to stand among them. 3“Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5And whoever welcomes a little child like this in My name welcomes Me.

6But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

 

[Galilee63]

A Brother who Sins
(Deuteronomy 19:15-21)

15If your brother sins against you,b go and confront him privately. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over. 16But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’c 17If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, regard him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.

18Truly I tell you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

19Again, I tell you truly that if two of you on the earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by My Father in heaven. 20For where two or three gather together in My name, there am I with them.”

 

[razzelflabben]

Interesting. Would you suggest getting rid of the Christian advice section? Maybe to be replaced by a Christian encouragement only section?

I do agree that all posts should have only one reply...: James 1:5. But what fun would that be? you wouldn't continue to come here if you were only allowed to post the truth of James 1:5, would you?

I think advice is important and helpful in that there are often many passages that apply to a situation that we don't think about in the midst of a struggle and that is where the body is very helpful. In addition, I think that both the giver and receiver of any advice should ask God for wisdom...I mean it should be one of the first things we do no matter which end of the situation we are on....but when someone says they have already asked God for wisdom (directly using the word or indirectly) and searched scripture about what to do then simply asked for advice on how to explain to others it seems to me that we should simply trust the wisdom God already promised in the situation and help with ways to carry out that wisdom...in prayer for wisdom as to that part too.

 

[Cheylynn]

Hello! Doing a thorough search, with biblical reasons for separating from a relationship, with a willful sinner, who has continually apologized for his violations against me and continues to go back to the same behavior he apologized for. I need to add here: This isn't repentance which I know is, a 180 turn in the other direction.
Anyhow, I found numerous scriptures that stated what I needed to do:
Matt 18:14-18 ~ Go- take witnesses-go to the church ---Did that
1 Cor 5: 11-13 ~ Have nothing to do with them Did that
1 Cor 6 ~ take the serious violation to the church instead of the court (family --of God/not a building)
2 Tim 3:1-5 Have nothing to do with them.
Lastly about 40 verses in Proverbs, regarding how to handle a fool; basically, someone who returns to their vomit.
NOW my questions...
After explaining all of my biblical reasons to his Christian friends (yes he calls himself a Christian and will argue profusely that he is!), for not associating with this unrepented sinner. They said, I was being unloving, unkind, impatient and so forth. Also that "Jesus would never forsake anyone " his mother said. THey completely disregarded the scriptures. SHEESH!
Why are so many soft on sin?
What am I to do when they themselves are believers, and don't live with this man and don't see his violations/issues/repeated sin on a daily basis? I don't want a divorce I simply want him to get a wake-up call. THis has helped trememndously....but he hasn't fully repented (my hope still stands for his restoration)
How do I explain it better to those who we know, other than how the verses explain it?

From what you have explained already, I think that there is nothing more needing to be said. Its tough going through such a thing as it is - and to have to be accountable to people with your life, I don't think that it is biblical. You've done what is to be done, as you have listed. Now, its your life, and you are accountable to God - in how you walk this difficult road.
My advice to you is that you do not give play by play information to your friends, relatives etc any longer. I give it based out of my own experience. Take all that you are going through to God. And if you need to, but honestly, I really saw that I did not need to tell anyone, find one good, integral friend - you can trust, to share certain things.
I wrote something out of my experience in my blog if you care to read:
In A Marriage That Is Dying?
May God bless you

 

[Blade]

"What am I to do" A your not their God are you? They dont answer to you do they? Can you save anyone even your self? Can you know read understand the heart of anyone? If God can not lie then HE is the only one that knows the heart and man onlyl sees flesh.

Just because someone hangs arround anyone saved or lost...ok so what? No matter the AGE people are nor how long they have been saved.. they can still be a babe in Christ. So try to remember some are weak in the faith. And what you do can be more hurtful then good. If christ does not judge this person nor condemn then and He knows that heart..what are you doing? Is this really about THEM or you?

The word makes it very clear GOD does not need our help. He cna do ALL this with out one man to help. He chooses to use us. So.. see with love.. dont show them YOUR truth and how YOU should be living. They dont answer to you. Does not the sweet sweet Holy Spirit convict the world of sin? We dont. So love the preson right where they are. They only sin against GOD not man