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Go look up what disbelief means.According to the online Oxford dictionary-
definition of atheism from Oxford Dictionaries Online
Atheism - disbelief in the existence of God or gods (italics added for emphasis)
Nice.So which version of the Oxford Dictionary were you using Brian? The one you made up?
Unless you know something for certain, you must rely on faith.
Do you know for certain there is no God? Or are you relying on faith?
A position of faith requires belief.
Yet another evasion. But then we all know why you have to evade my requests for you to show us that your belief in your God is based on sound evidence and sound reasoning.
I never claimed to have a "lack of belief" in fairies or Santa. My belief is that they don't exist.Oh? Do you consider your lack of faith or belief in fairies to be ignorance? How about your lack of belief in Santa Claus? Is that also ignorance? What about your lack of belief in Ra, Odin, Zeus, Vishnu and a thousand other imaginary gods? Is it that you are abysmally ignorant or do you perhaps just lack belief?
My. A lack of belief requires ignorance. A lack of belief = ignorance.So if I believe everything, literally EVERYTHING, I am the least ignorant person in the world...
Ok you beat me to it.That Red Herring is starting to smell like your definition of atheism.
I never claimed to have a "lack of belief" in fairies or Santa. My belief is that they don't exist.
How can I have a "lack of belief" in a belief I'm not ignorant of? Once I understand that belief, I must make a choice. To either believe in it or not believe in it. I'm no longer ignorant to it (lack of belief).
There is no similarity at all. My definition of atheism is a lack of belief in gods. Your continual evasions are an indication of your belief in your God without sound evidence or sound reasoning.That Red Herring is starting to smell like your definition of atheism.
Actually, you did. You said [post=56099263]here[/post], I have a belief that stops me from believing in fairies. If something stops you believing in fairies then you clearly have a lack of belief in fairies. Tell us, is there anything at all that you lack belief in or do you hold beliefs about everything? On what do you base these beliefs when there is no sound evidence?I never claimed to have a "lack of belief" in fairies or Santa. My belief is that they don't exist.
Go look up what disbelief means.
Nice.
No, the Oxford dictionary disagrees with you and agrees with the OP.
Atheism is belief that there are no gods.
A quick side question to all involved.
If
1. atheism involves a belief, if only a belief in the falsehood of certain propositions and
2. belief is defined as not knowing with certainty
then
what do we call people who know for certain that there is no God?
My position is different than yours. It does not require me to claim virtual omniscience.
Example:
Let say you claim that there are no dogs in existence. It would be impossible for you to search the entire earth (not to mention the universe) to know this.
Let's say I claim that dogs do exist. All I have to do is find one dog to prove my claim. I might not even have to leave my neighborhood.
It's probably not a position many people would take. Good question though, perhaps a gnostic anti-theist?
There are lots of beliefs in this forum. Personal beliefs are based upon judgement. A lot of these discussions pose as science debates but they are really judgement debates.
Off the top of my head, these are elements I have come across that typically drive peoples' judgements:
1. Availability of proof
2. Availability of robust evidence
3. Conjecture
4. Wishful thinking (conjecture biased by hope)
5. Ignorance
6. Denial
7. Delusion
Scientific knowledge is based on 1 and 2. Scientists make conjectures but this is not the same as scientific knowledge.
I consider faith to always consist of 4 and often 5 and 6.
Traditional atheism consists of 4.
YEC consists of 4 and lots of 6.
Belief in the Christian God and the Resurrection consists of 4 and 5 and 6.
Philosophy is mostly 3.
I don't think there are many delusional people around. As I understand it this is a psychiatric dysfunction - a sort of complete inability to make rational judgements. So I am loathe to attribute religious faith to delusion.
So my position, what I perceive my position to be, is to believe in things that are supported by proof or robust evidence but to be sceptical about everything else. This is a hard task because my thinking, like everyone else's, is prone to emotional bias and ignorance. However, I do not agree that it is a virtue to believe in the unevidenced or unproven.
Perhaps "atheist".It's probably not a position many people would take. Good question though, perhaps a gnostic anti-theist?
You have demonstrated you don't know what atheism is Brian. However, I agree with the last paragraph emphatically.
Perhaps "atheist".
Good grief.
Disbelief is refusal to believe. This is the same bias as faith (refusal to deny). This is not the position you claim to have. Your position is quite different: that you do not believe in things for which you do not have compelling evidence.
It is up to you what you choose to label yourself but I am just pointing out, as is the OP, that the normal/traditional definition of atheism is belief that there are no gods. It is a prejudiced position.
Dawkins weasels his way around this by calling himself an atheist but defining himself as an 86% atheist. I think he chose to use the term atheism because it is a common term and sounds as if it could mean anti-theism. But science is not atheistic - it is sceptical and empirical.
Let "God" be the collective consciousness/self-awareness of the universe.
I see no evidence to support this premise.
And even if the universe did have some collective consciousness or the universe was self aware, I still see no reason why that consciousness/awareness should be called God.
I believe my belief is rational, just as you believe you belief is rational. However, I fully understand my belief relies on faith. This is because I cannot "absolutely" know for certain if God exists.
Ezekiel 12:2 "Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people.
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