Transhumanism

[TLK Valentine]

He was always larger than life. That is His portrayal in the Bible.

Such portrayals always are.

And, angels were tending to Him in the desert, remember? Do you know of any other biblical or not person to be given such an 'honor'?

God protected Moses and the Israelites in the desert for "40" years, remember? Even fed them with manna from heaven.

So yes, I do know of such people.

First thing to remember about Jesus' stories -- they are indeed larger than life, but very few are in any way original.

Yet, it doesn't mean that ''40'' doesn't mean ''40'' ... logically, '40 days' seem more probable than 'a million days'.

Nor does "a million." Learn to recognize figures of speech.

As for Japan, a portion of its population believes that everything has a soul (I believe the Shintoists believe so). Ever been to down-town Tokio? Thinking of becoming a Shintoist?

My point exactly -- technology and spirituality; the whole package, as it were.

 

[just a believing guy]

Such portrayals always are.



God protected Moses and the Israelites in the desert for "40" years, remember? Even fed them with manna from heaven.

So yes, I do know of such people.


First thing to remember about Jesus' stories -- they are indeed larger than life, but very few are in any way original.



Nor does "a million." Learn to recognize figures of speech.



My point exactly -- technology and spirituality; the whole package, as it were.

First you use Bible to describe Christ as existant, than you use the Bible to describe Him as non-existant.

As for Moses and his people, '40 years' seems logical, as it describes a generation.

Give me an example of Jesus' stories that aren't in any way original.

So, you do approve of the Japanese overuse of technology?

 

[TLK Valentine]

So, he was indeed larger than life? He was not as vulnerable as we are, then?

If he wasn't vulnerable, then he wasn't human -- you can think of him as a god in a human suit, as it were, but that denies the Incarnation. That's on you, not me.

My point is that Jesus was hardly the only person in the Bible who supposedly received divine protection... certainly not while wandering the desert for an extended period of time.

We are speaking of a single person here, compared to king David. As original as it gets.

King David was not a single person? Moses wasn't a single person? Not sure what you're trying to say here.

Who are we to judge the originality of the Bible's content.

We are human. We question things; it's what we do.

Remember, it was written by people who had left Babylon, the cradle of the civilization.

Remember, some of it pre-dates that time.

Not your point, I'm afraid. 99% of the down-town Tokio Japanese are crazed about technology. How on Earth can that be right?

Why on Earth isn't it? What is technology if not a tool?

I'm no technofetishist, myself, but I see no harm in being excited over something new and innovative... and these days, "new and innovated" comes from Japan more than anywhere else.

What's the problem?

 

[just a believing guy]

If he wasn't vulnerable, then he wasn't human -- you can think of him as a god in a human suit, as it were, but that denies the Incarnation. That's on you, not me.

My point is that Jesus was hardly the only person in the Bible who supposedly received divine protection... certainly not while wandering the desert for an extended period of time.



King David was not a single person? Moses wasn't a single person? Not sure what you're trying to say here.



We are human. We question things; it's what we do.



Remember, some of it pre-dates that time.



Why on Earth isn't it? What is technology if not a tool?

I'm no technofetishist, myself, but I see no harm in being excited over something new and innovative... and these days, "new and innovated" comes from Japan more than anywhere else.

What's the problem?

That doesn't deny the Incarnation ... remember, while on the Cross, thirsty and all, He told John: ''behold your mother''... so, even before the Ascention, He said that He was preexistant God...

We question things, but when it comes to impecability regarding the use of technology, we aren't entitled to questioning, or are we?

Of course it predates that time...

That new and innovative has sprung out of a belief, a faith. Religiously, we (by ''we'' I mean ''the non-Japanese'') are not naturally prone to accept technology in such a way, you see.

 

[TLK Valentine]

That doesn't deny the Incarnation ... remember, while on the Cross, thirsty and all, He told John: ''behold your mother''... so, even before the Ascention, He said that He was preexistant God...

Remember, in 1928, when George Appel was about to be executed, he said, "Well folks, you're about to see a baked appel..." so, even before his death, he had his sense of humor.

What's your point?

We question things, but when it comes to impecability regarding the use of technology, we aren't entitled to questioning, or are we?

Of course we are -- who told you otherwise?

Of course it predates that time...

Then what was your point?

That new and innovative has sprung out of a belief, a faith. Religiously, we (by ''we'' I mean ''the non-Japanese'') are not naturally prone to accept technology in such a way, you see.

You say "religiously," I say "culturally."

 

[just a believing guy]

Remember, in 1928, when George Appel was about to be executed, he said, "Well folks, you're about to see a baked appel..." so, even before his death, he had his sense of humor.

What's your point?



Of course we are -- who told you otherwise?



Then what was your point?



You say "religiously," I say "culturally."

Relativizing isn't helpful here, and you relativize.

I don't get the impression that 'agnostics' question technology on religious forums that much, or do they?

I can't imagine anybody's denying that culture has sprung out of religion.

 

[JoeP222w]

It is based in the original lie.


Genesis 3:4-5 ESV But the serpent said to the woman, "You will not surely die. (5) For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

 

[just a believing guy]

It is based in the original lie.


Genesis 3:4-5 ESV But the serpent said to the woman, "You will not surely die. (5) For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

The part ''you will be like God'' is of key importance here.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Relativizing isn't helpful here, and you relativize.

I analogize.

I don't get the impression that 'agnostics' question technology on religious forums that much, or do they?

Technology isn't a topic that comes up often on religious forums, so I can't speak as to the truth of your impressions.

I can't imagine anybody's denying that culture has sprung out of religion.

That would be an issue with your imagination, then, not reality.

 

[PsychoSarah]

First you use Bible to describe Christ as existant, than you use the Bible to describe Him as non-existant.

Many legends and stories of the past are based on real people that did exist, but the events surrounding them are extremely exaggerated.

As for Moses and his people, '40 years' seems logical, as it describes a generation.

-_- a human generation is usually marked as being between 20-30 years, and more towards the lower end when concerning biblical times.

40 is a number often mentioned in Hebrew sayings that amount to "a long time", not literal amounts of time. It's an idiom, taking it literally is like taking "it's raining cats and dogs" literally. Basically, any time in the bible that is measured as 40 days or 40 years is an idiom, not literal.

Give me an example of Jesus' stories that aren't in any way original.

Him restoring the sight of a blind man. It's a super common story element.

 

[just a believing guy]

I analogize.



Technology isn't a topic that comes up often on religious forums, so I can't speak as to the truth of your impressions.



That would be an issue with your imagination, then, not reality.

No, the person whom you mentioned wasn't Christ (the Savior, etc.), so you do relativize matters. (Libertarianism is in an ideological crisis these days, so you guys are stuck with relativizations, you don't have anything to cling on...so you come up with bionics, and technology gods etc.)

You cannot deny that culture sprang out of religion, can you? You agreed that some parts of the Bible were written much earlier than the Babylon era, didn't you?

 

[just a believing guy]

Many legends and stories of the past are based on real people that did exist, but the events surrounding them are extremely exaggerated.


-_- a human generation is usually marked as being between 20-30 years, and more towards the lower end when concerning biblical times.

40 is a number often mentioned in Hebrew sayings that amount to "a long time", not literal amounts of time. It's an idiom, taking it literally is like taking "it's raining cats and dogs" literally. Basically, any time in the bible that is measured as 40 days or 40 years is an idiom, not literal.


Him restoring the sight of a blind man. It's a super common story element.

I don't know how old you are, but 40 years do sound like a sound element as to describe a Hebrew generation of the time. Rabbis were not allowed to preach before their 30th birthday. So they would have reached their teaching-preaching peak not before their 40ish birthday.

Restoring the sight of a blind man? Where else is this 'common motif', as you call it, present?

 

[just a believing guy]

Many legends and stories of the past are based on real people that did exist, but the events surrounding them are extremely exaggerated.


-_- a human generation is usually marked as being between 20-30 years, and more towards the lower end when concerning biblical times.

40 is a number often mentioned in Hebrew sayings that amount to "a long time", not literal amounts of time. It's an idiom, taking it literally is like taking "it's raining cats and dogs" literally. Basically, any time in the bible that is measured as 40 days or 40 years is an idiom, not literal.


Him restoring the sight of a blind man. It's a super common story element.

Hebrwe rabbies were allowed to teach after their 30th birthday, so they would have reached their teaching ripeness at about 40 years of age. I really hope you get my meaning.

How is it a super common story element? Where else do you find such a motif? And what does your ''- _ -'' stand for?

 

[Ophiolite]

No, that technology was created to create fear, at least.

You have confused me. I want to remove that confusion.

You appeared to object to the further development and use of technology to solve human problems. Do I have that right?

Despite this objection to technological solutions you have no issues at all with using computers and the internet. Do I have that right? If so, how do you reconcile the two positions?

Further, you declare that the reason you don't have a problem with using technology developed during hot and cold wars, is that such technology was developed to create fear. Do I have that right? If so that suggests you would not have been happy using the technology if it had been developed to make kittens even more adorable, rather than create fear!

I just don't follow your logic.

 

[just a believing guy]

You have confused me. I want to remove that confusion.

You appeared to object to the further development and use of technology to solve human problems. Do I have that right?

Despite this objection to technological solutions you have no issues at all with using computers and the internet. Do I have that right? If so, how do you reconcile the two positions?

Further, you declare that the reason you don't have a problem with using technology developed during hot and cold wars, is that such technology was developed to create fear. Do I have that right? If so that suggests you would not have been happy using the technology if it had been developed to make kittens even more adorable, rather than create fear!

I just don't follow your logic.

Technology is going too fast, humans cannot possibly follow that pace. So, solutions (robotics) are being considered to bridge that gap between the technology and humans. I don't believe that these solutions will bear good fruit at all...

As a believer, I take my PC and the internet for granted; they are a gift of the Providence, as it were.

But bionics... please, no thanks.

 

[just a believing guy]

A question to whom it may concern:

Was the computer invented for warfare purposes?

 

[Ophiolite]

A question to whom it may concern:

Was the computer invented for warfare purposes?

Yes and no.

Computers originally referred to humans who conducted complex, or tedious arithmetic and mathematical calculations. Some of these related to pure science investigations, such as planetary orbits, but others had significant military applications, including determining lat/long, cartography and artillery targeting.

The first mechanical computers were designed by Charles Babbage in the 1800s with much the same objectives.

The first electronic computer was Colossus, used by the British to break the German Enigma code.

 

[just a believing guy]

Yes and no.

Computers originally referred to humans who conducted complex, or tedious arithmetic and mathematical calculations. Some of these related to pure science investigations, such as planetary orbits, but others had significant military applications, including determining lat/long, cartography and artillery targeting.

The first mechanical computers were designed by Charles Babbage in the 1800s with much the same objectives.

The first electronic computer was Colossus, used by the British to break the German Enigma code.

So, you see that the Enigma code was broken and we now live in democratic societies
Oh, yes... I was interested in electronic computers, not the mechanical ones...

 

[TLK Valentine]

Give me an example of Jesus' stories that aren't in any way original.

Oy vey.... where to begin?

How about his father? (His Earthly father, that is -- Joseph)

There's no mention of him chronologically in the stories until we get to Matthew, and when he is mentioned, we learn that he is the son of Jacob, he receives warnings from God only through his dreams, and he rescues his family by taking them into Egypt.

Sound familiar? Genesis 37, perhaps?

Also, it was one of Joseph's brothers -- Judah -- who literally sells out Joseph for twenty pieces of silver. Not to be outdone, in the New Testament, Jesus gets sold out by Judas (the Romanized spelling of Judah) for thirty pieces.

Jesus raised people from the dead and made food appear to feed his people. Elisha did the same in 1 Kings 16-17.

 

[Larniavc]

Transhumanism is defined as "the belief or theory that the human race can evolve beyond its current physical and mental limitations, especially by means of science and technology".

What are your guys' thoughts on this? Personally I think that if done right and so it's widespread for everyone (without just a few people having control over it and the like), I feel like improving ourselves with technology and such would be great. I'd want a bionic eye anyway providing no damage would be done to my other one. XD

I know that some say "it's man trying to become God", but I wouldn't say we'd become like God unless we could create things in the blink of an eye or the like, which we can't do because physics. Improving ourselves through our endeavors shouldn't be a problem if it's done so it's available to everyone and people can't abuse it.

I'm all for. Roll on the singularity!