Except that you literally are. You are asking me to believe the "supernatural" without having any verifiable reason to do so.
How did Israelite slaves escape Egypt? Without some sort of spectacular assistance. From. Feet fortune and Divine Providence.
That is literally deciding on the answer before asking the question or doing the investigation.
I don't know why everyone automatically believes everything you say, but you are actually the one who has your mind made up? You are the one who's mind is not open to the possibility of super terrestrial intervention into human history on Earth. You have. Your answer before and without doing any investigation.
A hypothesis is testable / verifiable.
You aren't proposing anything either.
You are just assuming and declaring it true.
Again, you're describing yourself. If there have never been any super terrestrial interventions into human history on Earth. Then why do miraculous things happen like Israelite slaves is scaping? Egypt.
If such so called miracles never happen? Why does anybody report them?
You yourself have never won a lottery jackpot. Nor have your eyes ever directly seen a winning lottery ticket. Yet you hear about people winning the lottery and you trust their reports and claims.
Then other people claim they won the lottery in the sense of being contacted by super intelligent beings from the heavens. Which fact if true would violate no laws of physics? So why do you automatically deny the claims?
Not accepting the claim "the supernatural exists"
is not the same as making the claim "the supernatural does not exist". I'm not making that claim. Just like I'm not claiming that there are no extra-dimensional unicorns that control gravity. What would be the point of such a claim?
Well, you say one thing but mean another? You obviously disbelieve in the existence of gravity, controlling unicorns as preposterous.
Yes, terrestrial horse like creatures. And primitive mammals cannot possibly control wield or manipulate gravity.
God in heaven. Is not depicted as a terrestrial horse-like Primitive mammal.
I don't know how you can compare an advanced Super Intelligence in heaven to a terrestrial horse without anyone noticing but they apparently don't.
No earthlings don't know how to manipulate gravity. The claim is. Is that there is an intelligence in heaven? Which does?
Especially when it comes to claims of existance, it's the positive claim that needs to be demonstrated. If you wish to claim the supernatural is real, upto you to support said claim.
Judge a tree by its fruit. Something spectacular. Was required to liberate the Israelite slaves from Egypt? Something spectacular was required to convince millions and billions of people. Very poor Carpenter from Galilee. Was the messiah
you denying all reports of supernatural and paranormal phenomena? Is you saying "you can't trust people. You can't trust everything people say. You can't trust what they tell you. Sometimes they are lying or otherwise just plain wrong" But then you neatly exempt yourself. For your own sweeping statement.
I'm sorry if you can't comprehend that saying "I don't believe X" is not the same saying "I believe 'not' X is true".
I don't know why I'm the only one who notices your extreme sarcasm. Comparing Super Intelligence in heaven to a terrestrial horse like creature.
But you obviously do not believe in the existence of gravity, controlling unicorns. And since you think. You can equate terrestrial apples with super terrestrial oranges. You obviously actively dis believe in the existence of his super terrestrial round.
You can repeat it till the cows come home, but the fact of the matter is that this is obviously false, as any mainstream archeology and history of religions study will tell you.
Except for the Biblical Archaeology Society.
That's rich............................................
Sun standing still above Jericho, anyone?
Resurection (sic), anyone?
Dead walking around, anyone?
Physically impossible floods, anyone?
Physically impossible, and non-existing, genetic bottlenecks anyone?
See Joshua verse, you're referring to. Has been mis interpreted?
The Crucifixion Resurrection appears to have been a vision.
The resurrection itself like the resurrection of Lazarus. Was witnessed? Why hundreds and hundreds? Of seemingly credible seemingly straight talking eye witnesses.
The flood correlates. With the extreme climatic shift at the end of the Holocene Climatic Optimum 5000 years ago. There was a major redistribution of monsoon weather patterns. Which retreated eastward and now only? Continue to occur. In South and Southeast Asia.
Those regions continue to experience severe flooding rather frequently. Perhaps there was some kind of Wild Climatic Fluxuation, which dumped an enormous amount of monsoon rains on the Middle East. Flooding all of the major River valleys as is not unknown in India, or Southeast Asia.
Call them what you will. Such events can't happen without violating or suspending the laws of physics. Or "manipulating" them if you prefer. In any event, such things are what we call "magic" and "physically impossible".
The flood. Can be described? As a monsoon.
Yeah, sentient of Enoch and Elijah can be described by tornadoes.
The exodus can be described by storms earthquakes and volcanoes.
None of the miracles described in the Bible violate known laws of physics.
The claim is that there is a Super Intelligence in Heaven, who can manipulate the laws of physics. Causing storms on Earth, causing earthquakes on Earth. Inducing volcanic eruptions on Earth, manipulating storms and weather patterns.
And I'm sure climate, lava pressures, plate tectonics etc have nothing do with it, ha?
Of course, they do. The claim is is just not the whole story.
Dude, it seems you missed the main point.
There is mainstream consensus among historians that this story is a LEGEND.
Much like Hercules and his 12 works.
Except for the Biblical Archaeology Society.
And one of the theories, is that in the 1st century BCE, the existing legend story was taken and altered (like the protagonist changing his name to "moses"), to then be used as anti-jewish propaganda.
Greenberg carefully scrutinizes dejection records of the exodus. Extracts. Their basic elements and shows how they are completely compatible with the biblical memory.
In my estimation, Greenberg did an excellent analysis and scholarship.
Whatever the case with that, the main point here is that there is no reason to believe this story is accurate and every reason to believe it is just a legendary tale........
Jews and Egyptians say otherwise.
But there you go again. No reason to believe people. No reason to believe people. No reason to believe people. No reason to believe people no reason to believe people.
Believe me.
There is no evidence at all to suggest it did.
The Israelites did not spend 4 years in the Sinai Peninsula, which was at the time a province of Egypt. They did not spend 40 years. Within the pharaohs reach.
Saint Catherines Monastery aside. They spent their years wandering. In Western Arabia. As it happens in median near Mecca and Medina. I hope someday. Saudi Arabia finds archaeologists they can trust that allows them to excavate. The regions of Western Arabia, where in. The Israelites wandered.
There is no evidence of the Israelites spending. Any amount of time wandering on the moon, there's no evidence of them on Mars. There's no evidence of them on Mercury. There's no evidence of them in the Sinai Peninsula. Because they were wondering in western Arabia as Paul states in his letter to the Galatians.
Since Zero Archeology has been permitted in Saudi Arabia to date, we have zero archaeological evidence. Of that phase of Israelite history.
But as you somehow have successfully got everyone else to ignore we have evidence of Semitic speaking slaves in Egypt. Before. The exodus in the late Bronze Age. We have archaeological evidence of Israelites in Canaan. In the earliest iron age. There is a gap of a couple of decades in between. The gaps in biblical archaeology are narrow and few and far between. By comparison to the numerous and vast gaps in the fossil record. And yet you and everyone else still except evolution. Even when evidentiary support for hits. Story. Is scant by comparison to the biblical archaeological record?
So if we can trust evolution based on sparse evidentiary support based on supporting evidence few and far between, so much more can, we except the Biblical. Historical claims. In broad brush strokes.
But not the israelites in the desert off course.
No, they had "sacred mana" falling from the sky to eat.
They've lived off the land. They survived because they were good survivalists. I think you'd be surprised how much. Food is available from the environment if you know where to look. And supposedly God in heaven help them find it all.
Anyway, Egypt collapsed in 670 BC, when the Assyrians invaded and Egypt was already a bit crippled by a civil war (that didn't start in 1200 BC).
Yes, Egypt never recovered from the late Bronze Age collapse, which coincides with the exodus account of God's wrath and a judgement against Egypt. Whatever explains God's wrath and judgment. Those spectacular events caused the late Bronze Age collapse, which wiped out the Hittites for Matani and everyone else around and Egypt. Even Egypt. Never fully recovered.
DNA is traceable, because it is past on to off spring.
It's how we can tell your biological siblings from your adopted siblings.
DNA in living organisms? Is not archaeological? Paleontological. Hard physical tangible FOSSIL evidence. Of all of the transitional forms. Allegedly alive in ANCIENT TIMES. Implied by the phylogenetic tree. Derived by the analysis of DNA in modern current living Organism.
DNA suggests how eleutian occurred. But it is not hard physical tangible archaeological dog out of the ground fossilized rocks in hand evidence. Of that evolution.
This boils down to the present is not the PAST.
It implies something about the past. It doesn't prove anything.
Ok. So.........................
1. israelites = canaanites
In part is everyone has been saying for thousands of years
2. no evidence of massive israelite enslavement in egypt
Except for the literal tons, thousands of kilograms of evidence of, look up HYKSOS
3. hard to tell late canaanites from early israelites
Except for their distinctive home architectures Their distinctive pottery. The introduction of iron. And their strict kosher dietary regiment.
4. most likely conclusion: israelites ARE canaanites who practiced revisionist history (a rather common practice in human kind).
Just like you seem to be doing.
You want me to cite all papers published in mainstream archeology and other historical sciences?
How about just one or 2
25 million people could agree on B happening.
If the objective evidence says otherwise, then those 25 million people are wrong.
So millions of other people can and must be wrong, but you are in must be right.
How do you know so much more than everyone else? Are you divinely guided? Do you receive instructions from a super intelligence in the heavens that guides you to the truth much more so than tens of millions of other people.
No. No matter how many times you repeat it...
Stories in ancient texts do not trump the actual objective evidence of reality.
Biblical archaeology confirms the Biblical account more than the fossil record confirms evolution. If evolution is still true so much more is the Bible.
Whenever there's a gap in the fossil record. You say give paleontologists time they'll find the fossils eventually.
However, much time you request from everyone reading this thread. I request HALF as much time for biblical archeologists to be allowed to keep digging for the few missing gaps in the archaeological record.
For starters, believing Julius Ceasar existed and conquered gual, does not require me to believe that the laws of nature were suspended / violated / manipulated.
So right of the bat, bare claims about Ceasar are extremely more believable then claims that require the violation of natural laws
.
Julius Caesar claimed. That, he was the son of Venus and that he was God Incarnate. He had coins minted with the words "Divius filus", meaning divine son son of the gods.
So you find his? Accounts plausible.
By comparison, the Gospels depict Jesus as a poor farmer. Like millions of other poor farmers around the region. Much more mundane. Except for the miracles.
As for those something spectacular must've happened. For Jesus to have risen above the rest. Had been hailed as the Messiah. When he came from such a humble background.
In every other rags to riches story people invariably hail some exceptional virtues. In the person explaining why they were able to rise above their beginnings.
Likewise, there was something extremely exceptional. In and about. Jesus of Nazareth. Something spectacular is required to explain the observed result. The people devoted their lives to him as the promised Messiah.
Incidentally. Of all of the Jewish. Messianic claimants. Of the first and second centuries. Jesus was the only one to have any measurable impact on the Roman Empire.
Something spectacular is required to explain that story... That HISTORY.
