Tithing Question

[Jesus_is_Saint]

When a church is big and rich, does it mean it is "spiritually big and rich" too ?

 

[LSOJ]

When a church is big and rich, does it mean it is "spiritually big and rich" too ?

Revelation 3:14-19
14) To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Originator of God’s creation.
15) I know your deeds; you are neither cold nor hot. How I wish you were one or the other.
16) So because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of My mouth!
17) You say, ‘I am rich; I have grown wealthy and need nothing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind, and naked.
18) I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, white garments so that you may be clothed and your shameful nakedness not exposed, and salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see.
19) Those I love, I rebuke and discipline. Therefore be earnest and repent.

Financial success is often inversely proportionate to spirituality. You cannot love both God and money.

1 timothy 6:5-11
5) and constant friction between men of depraved mind and deprived of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain.
6) But godliness actually is a means of great gain when accompanied by contentment.
7) For we have brought nothing into the world, so we cannot take anything out of it either.
8) If we have food and covering, with these we shall be content.
9) But those who want to get rich fall into temptation and a snare and many foolish and harmful desires which plunge men into ruin and destruction.
10) For the love of money is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing for it have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.
11) But flee from these things, you man of God, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, perseverance and gentleness.

Are you asking obvious questions for the sake of it, or do you read scripture?
Do you even lift?

 

[Jesus_is_Saint]

Yes, you are very right,
Spirituality is not measured by materials.
God wants us to be faithful to him all the time, even during persecution.

 

[LSOJ]

Yes, you are very right,
Spirituality is not measured by materials.
God wants us to be faithful to him all the time, even during persecution.

Ok, why are you asking questions to which you know the answer?

 

[Hank77]

God always keeps his promises. If you don't see it, it's because of something at our end, not God's end. He is completely trustworthy.

Indeed God is trust worthy.
I think if you would read the whole discourse which begins in Malachi 1 you would see that it wasn't that the people were not paying their tithes. It was the priests who were to receive 1/10 of the 10th that were stealing the Levites 9/10 portion of the grain that was stored at the temple for their use when they serviced their courses at the temple.
There is a flip side to blessings in the Law and that is a curse. So those who teach that OT tithing the giver will receive a 100 fold blessing should also be teaching that if one doesn't they will be cursed.

 

[Hank77]

Right, but tithing is still important to keep the ministries that give glory to our Lord doing great things.

Before the Law it was by freewill offerings, after the Law it is by freewill offerings.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Indeed God is trust worthy.
I think if you would read the whole discourse which begins in Malachi 1 you would see that it wasn't that the people were not paying their tithes. It was the priests who were to receive 1/10 of the 10th that were stealing the Levites 9/10 portion of the grain that was stored at the temple for their use when they serviced their courses at the temple.
There is a flip side to blessings in the Law and that is a curse. So those who teach that OT tithing the giver will receive a 100 fold blessing should also be teaching that if one doesn't they will be cursed.

Well, first of all the Old Covenant is gone, so if someone is preaching about the Levitical priesthood then they are under the wrong convenient, because the Old Covenant became obsolete in Christ. The Old Covenant people were promised Christ and told that God would make a new Covenant with them.

You really should know that you are under grace not the Law. We are the priesthood, each one of us and Jesus is the only High Priest.

Hebrews
14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

Hebrews 7:11
Now if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the people received the Law), what further need was there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be designated according to the order of Aaron?

Hebrews 7:27
who does not need daily, like those high priests, to offer up sacrifices, first for His own sins and then for the sins of the people, because this He did once for all when He offered up Himself.

Hebrews 9:12
and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.

Hebrews 8:6
But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

Hebrews would be good for you to read. Hebrews was written to the Old Covenant Hebrews to explain the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant.

 

[Hank77]

Hebrews would be good for you to read. Hebrews was written to the Old Covenant Hebrews to explain the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant.

Because I am discussing the OC Law does not mean that I don't understand that we are under the NC. What would lead you to believe that I don't?

 

[ToBeLoved]

Because I am discussing the OC Law does not mean that I don't understand that we are under the NC. What would lead you to believe that I don't?

I'm sorry, I think I misread your post. I read it again and you did not say what I thought you said.

 

[Hank77]

I'm sorry, I think I misread your post. I read it again and you did not say what I thought you said.

No worries, I have done the same thing myself.

 

[Mayflower1]

I havent tithed in forever so I may not shouldnt even say anything but my thought reading would be to question your motive behind tithing. God can reward you but if that is your main reason for tithing to test God in this...then just remember that the tithe isnt just about the money and what God can do for you but it is about your walk with God and your desire to give back to Him. Because believe me, He doesnt need our money. His reward may come in the form of helping grow your church or grow you in your spiritual walk. We can ask God for things but He knows what we need and what would make us thr most happy.

I havent tithed in a very long time. I first went to putting it into the kids ministry instead of the offering plate and then I just stopped completely. I think God has slowly been nudging me to start again.

 

[Truth Never Dies]

Tithing as the church portrays it (for the sake of greed and filling the coffers) isnt biblical, originally the tithe was used radiclaly differant, a feast to show God is good to you, to help the poor and to every few years give to leviates so they may also feed poor, todays tithing is all about wealth for the apostate church.

God is still Good, The Poor still need our help, maybe more so than ever, and the Levites are gone and no longer needed.

 

[Jesus_is_Saint]

Give money to church is to show Love to God and your brethren.

 

[insurchoftruth]

Four types of financial giving in the Bible;

1. Tithe
   

The motivation for the tithe, is obedience to God. It is given to God only and it is given regularly, all the time! The tithe belongs to God only! With the tithe, we worship God and recognize him, as our source of everything, and give him the first place in our life!



The tithe can be from a regular income like wages for example, or from one time income, like when we receive a financial gift once, from somebody!



The tithe is given to God, so we show that we put Him first, in our life.



The tithe which is given out of love for God, is like a recognition, worship, respect and thanks, recognizing that God is the owner and provider of the money, and is blessing us with everything. The tithe belongs to God. Tithe Gross, not Net.



The tithe is a tithe, and it must never be given as a fruit offering, alms-giving, or a seed!

The giving does not work in the life of many chistians, because they give the tithe as an alms-giving, or as a fruit offerings, or as a seed.



The tithe was being given by Abraham to Melchizedek, long before the Law of Moses, was given! Where did Abraham learned from, that he must give tithe? From God, not from the Law!



Jacob also made a vow to God, to give a tithe. Where did Jacob learned about giving a tithe? From God, not from the Law of Moses!



God loves a cheerful giver!



God will rebuke the devourer and will not let him steal or destroy our material blessings, if we give tithe! If we give the tithe as an alms, first fruits or seed, God will not rebuke the devourer for us!



In the Old Testament, the tithe was given to the Levites.





Genesis 14:20, 28:21,22, Leviticus 27:30, 31, 32, Corinthians 9:7, Haggai 2:8, Psalm 50:12, Deuteronomy 8:10,17,18, 12:1-20, 14:28,29, 26:12-15, Leviticus 27:30-33, Malachi 3:8-12, Nehemiah 10:35-39, Proverbs 3:9, 8:17-21, Matthew 6:33, 23:23, Luke 11:42

1. First fruits
   

The first fruits is done only once, and not more, on every new channel of income!



The motivation for the first fruits is generosity!



The first fruits belong to God only!



If there is first fruits, that means, there are second, third, fourth, ect...

The first fruits is about a regular income of money or material goods!



We give first fruits to God, to show that we put him first in our lives, and that we believe that he is the source of everything we have!



With the first fruits, we show, that He is the one who gives us power to get wealth, and that without Him, we would not be able to get or have anything. We worship God with our giving, as the source of all things!



The first fruits, is any new channel of income, and it is not the source of income, because the source is only one always, and that is God. But we can have many different channels of income!



For example, the fist salary of your new job, is the first fruits. Any first income from money or material things, must be given as a first fruits.



Of if anytime you receive an increase of your salary in your job, that whole amount of the first increase of the salary, is the first fruits!



Also, Abel and Cain gave an offering to God, which was before the Law of Moses!

But Abel gave a first fruits offering, but Cain gave only a partial offering, which was not first fruits!



Abraham also sacrificed his first son for God!



Jesus said that we first must seek the kingdom of God.



There are 31 references in the Bible concerning the first fruits.



The first fruits must never be given as a tithe, alms or seed!



The first fruits shows God, that we are not in love with money. It a principle of being willing to sacrifice.



In the Old Testament the first fruits were given to the priests.





Genesis 4:3,4, Proverbs 3:9,10,14,15, Deuteronomy 18:3-5, 26:1-11, Nehemiah 10:35-39, Leviticus 23:9-14, Leviticus 27:26, 27, Numbers 18:12-15, Exodus 22:29,30, 23:16, 34:26, Ezekiel 44:30, Deuteronomy chapter 8, 1Kings 17:12-14, Matthew 6:33

1. Alms-giving
   

Alms-giving must be done privately in secret, in order to keep in secret, the dignity of the person, the poor man, who receive the alms in their crises. Their dignity because of their poverty is decreased, and damaged. They feel hurt because of their poverty – (Matthew 6:1-4).



The motivation for alms-giving is compassion.



The alms-giving is only given to men.



The alms can not be and must not be given as a tithe!



The exact amount of alms-giving you give, will be returned from God to you, the same amount, $1 you give, $1 God will repay back to you!



There is no 30, 60, 100 times increase in the alms-giving.







Psalm 112:5,9,

1. Seed
   

The seed is where the 30, 60, or 100 fold return happens.



The seed must never be given as a tithe, fruit offerings, or alms giving!



The motivation for the seed is faith and reward!



The seed will help you to stop poverty in your life.



The seed must be given into a fertile soil.



If you are not giving tithes, first fruits and alms-giving, but are giving only a seed, even if you get 30, 60, 100 fold return, you will lose it, because God can not rebuke the devourer er for your sake.







Mark 4:8

 

[Jesus_is_Saint]

We give to show Love to God, show obedience,
also to help our Church's brethren.
A good Church will use the money to expand the kingdom of God.

 

[Mel62]

My blessings come in the form of seeing Joy when people know God has provided for them.

 

[ToBeLoved]

When I give to the church I do not call it a tithe, because just the word tithe is only used in the Old Covenant. It is not in the New Testament, nor are the New Covenant church told to tithe.

I call it giving with a happy heart. That's in the New Testament. That's just what I prefer to say since the word tithe can be troublesome for all the reasons above by the posters.