Thoughts?

[RND]

It's not that your questions aren't worth our time--it is the fact that these questions have already been answered over and over and over again. it gets quite frustrating after awhile when someone "researches" by visting some anti-SDA/EGW website and then comes here with the same old questions. To them this is new, but to us it is quite stale.

Try this site:

"Did Ellen White Contradict the Bible Over 50 Times" @ http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/contradictions.html

It turns out that most, if not all, of these alleged contradictions were created by people with such an axe to grind that they see what they want to see vs. seeing what the texts actually say.* And, of course, one cannot think any better or clearer than one can read.

*The Bible critics have the same problem.

On another forum a guy claimed that EGW had contradicted Scripture 75 times. When I pointed out to him that the number was 53 he claimed that it was my research that was outdated. But, despite repeated requests to produce the extra 22 he never did and ultimately turned tail and ran.

Thanks DJ. No way I could have said it as well as you did.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

All Experts is "research?"



Can't



Ask for wisdom.



Not worth addressing.



That's a rather blanket statement in that it assumes one could not have received thoughts inspired by the scriptures or the Holy Spirit.

I believed in the sabbath and state of the dead long before I heard of EGW.

Kinda harsh don't you think RND. It sounds like you are offended. Don't get upset with L.R. Its good that he came here to ask these questions.

 

[RND]

Kinda harsh don't you think RND. It sounds like you are offended. Don't get upset with L.R. Its good that he came here to ask these questions.

Yeah, I guess you're right PK. It's just the original tenor of his OP didn't seem to suggest a willingness to disguss as to post formed opinions.

When I see 'research' and 'All experts' in the same post it kinda makes me wonder what type of research has been engaged in.

I'll try to do better PK.

 

[LogosRhema]

Yeah, I guess you're right PK. It's just the original tenor of his OP didn't seem to suggest a willingness to disguss as to post formed opinions.

When I see 'research' and 'All experts' in the same post it kinda makes me wonder what type of research has been engaged in.

I'll try to do better PK.

I'm not looking for a fight. I read a little bit, was concerned with what was said, and posted it here. The website just has "expert" in it. Doesn't mean to me that they are. Most proclaimed "experts" that pad themselves on the back are idiots, but I don't know enough to really say anything about what was remarked at the website.

I'll have more to post later, I must get started on a vague report for class... I don't understand some Prof's... lol

 

[Jon0388g]

I'll read that other site here in a day or so, got some homework to do :S.

I'm not baiting harassment, but believe what you will.

PS: Sorry my questions aren't worth your time RND. Perhaps someone else will find the questions worthy of answering.

I'm here to understand the doctrine, not create harassment. I have no opinion. I've said no opinion. I have only questions. If you don't have answers you are more than welcome to read along, but please don't start this into something it isn't. Thanks.

Hi,


Read the link that Goodnighteternal sent you, it should give you an alternative take.


I think RND was a bit harsh on you, but he is battle-scarred, so forgive him


If you've got anymore questions feel free to ask!!



Jon

 

[RND]

I don't understand some Prof's... lol

Who does?

 

[djconklin]

As an indicator how "bad" the AllExperts site is they claim that Moses Hull was a Christian after he quit the SDA church in 1863! He was a spiritualist within weeks! And promoted free love! Another one that drank the Kool-Aid of error.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

I'm not looking for a fight. I read a little bit, was concerned with what was said, and posted it here. The website just has "expert" in it. Doesn't mean to me that they are. Most proclaimed "experts" that pad themselves on the back are idiots, but I don't know enough to really say anything about what was remarked at the website.

I'll have more to post later, I must get started on a vague report for class... I don't understand some Prof's... lol

You should really check out the sight recommended by djconklin. It is really good and will answer all of your questions.

 

[thecountrydoc]

Hi LogosRhema,

Thanks for your list of questions. As you can tell the name Ellen White seems elicite some strong responses. At the moment I don't have the time necessary to address your questions one by one so let me just say this.

For starters I echo the seniments of T&O. Not that I've never read any of Ellen White's writings but that I don't need a single word she wrote to defend my faith. I do need the Bible however. The Bible, combined with authoritative history books, will back up the personal conclusions I have reached. While there are many who accuse SDAs of forming their beliefs based on the writtings of Ellen White, and that is the reason that they areSDAs, in my case I choose to be a SDA because , as a church, SDAs belive what I believe. Not the other way around.

I'm out of time for now but please come back and visit some more. I'll be looking forward to your visit.

Your brother in Christ,
Doc

 

[djconklin]

The problem with the list is that it is too simplistic and sort of based upon the proof text method of interpretation which is frankly illogical.

Quite true--such is how such lists are made. Take a gander at the one's that the anti-Bible crowd make.

For Instance:

Quote:
EGW says: Not everything outside the ark died (SG, vol. 1, p.77).
The BIBLE says: “…everything on earth shall die” (Genesis 6:17).
Did Noah take whales and multitudes of fish on the ark? If we use the Bible verse section from the above we would have to assume that the ark was filled with aquariums to continue the aquatic species.

Well, if we wish to be technical: the Bible says "everything ON the earth" while the aquatic animals are IN the water.

 

[djconklin]

in my case I choose to be a SDA because , as a church, SDAs belive what I believe. Not the other way around.

In my case, I chose to be an SDA because the SDA church as a body believes in following what the Bible says.

 

[ricker]

In my case, I chose to be an SDA because the SDA church as a body believes in following what the Bible says.

Funny, members of my church say the same thing about being a Lutheran.......

 

[ricker]

In my case, I chose to be an SDA because the SDA church as a body believes in following what the Bible says.

I just thought you might be interested in a couple recent quotes from the Lutheran side of things when asked why they are Lutherans. Good answers, in my opinion!

was raised Lutheran but tried to leave in search of something else when I got older. It was God who called me back to the faith after discussions and my trying to continually pull away thinking, It can't be that simple that I'm forgiven by Jesus' death...there must be SOMETHING I CAN DO...

But there isn't anything I have to do, pray, work, feel, etc...

God saves us 100% and I don't contribute in any way to it. Thankfully I don't have to because I'd totally mess it up if it was relied upon me to do anything!

I came back to realizing that the Lutheran beliefs are biblically correct after reading the Bible within 6 weeks...always that book in my hand while cleaning, cooking, etc...and the house didn't fall down and everything still got done around here (I'm a stay at home mom). It was so clear how things are intertwined in scripture and how God uses means to achieve His purposes!

Lutherans are cross focused whereas too many other denominations are ME focused. Lutherans look to Christ and the cross and bear fruit because of it, whereas other denoms look to themselves and see how they're doing...it just doesn't fit in scripturally the way they view it.

I'm Lutheran also because Lutherans properly distinguish between Law and Gospel. We know that baptism and Holy Communion weren't new Laws given to us by Jesus Christ (for He said He didn't come to bring new Laws), but they are Gospel, a means that God uses to give us the benefits of the cross.

Because of Lutheranism, I am assured that objectively I have been justified, that outside of myself, Jesus died on the cross in my substitute and I am forgiven. That truth is something that is muddied in other denoms because they say that before anything like that is true you first need to do this, or this or this...you know, words like pray this prayer, surrender yourself or accept Him in you heart. But, Jesus died on the cross before any of us were born. Our sins WERE forgiven there. We didn't need to do anything to earn that...no prayers, nothing like that.

This is why I'm Lutheran. The Lutheran beliefs are the closest biblically than any other denomination that I can see...here I stand

I've been a Lutheran my whole life, but in my teens I did look into other denoms, simply for my own edification. I didn't want to be Lutheran simply because my folks were, I wanted to be Lutheran because it was right. What I found is that Lutheranism is the closest to the scriptures. It has biblical backing for every single doctrine. I couldn't find that in any other churches, even the one religion that claims to be the "mother" of all churches.

Simply put, because it is the only denom I have looked into that its completely scriptural. Everything we have and do has backing in scripture, not in something someone thought they had the power to put in place, not by someones flawed reasoning of scripture.

About the only thing that could make it better would be going back a few hundred years to a purer form that hasn't been influenced by so many other reformed denominations. Then, it would be truly as close to perfect as it could be.

God bless! Ricker

 

[djconklin]

Originally Posted by djconklin
In my case, I chose to be an SDA because the SDA church as a body believes in following what the Bible says.

Funny, members of my church say the same thing about being a Lutheran.......

After our family converted (from the Methodist church) my dad gave Bible studies to his sister's family and they became SDA's. My cousin Bruce then gave Bible studies to his friend John who was studying to a be a pastor in the Lutheran church. And he converted and became an SDA pastor.

One doctrine that sets us apart for Lutherans and Methodists, but closer to the Baptists, is that of baptism by immersion. Did you know that the floor of the Leaning Tower of Pisa covers a baptismal tank? A Catholic speaker at Notre Dame showed us a slide of the covering.

 

[ricker]

After our family converted (from the Methodist church) my dad gave Bible studies to his sister's family and they became SDA's. My cousin Bruce then gave Bible studies to his friend John who was studying to a be a pastor in the Lutheran church. And he converted and became an SDA pastor.

One doctrine that sets us apart for Lutherans and Methodists, but closer to the Baptists, is that of baptism by immersion. Did you know that the floor of the Leaning Tower of Pisa covers a baptismal tank? A Catholic speaker at Notre Dame showed us a slide of the covering.

Thanks, that is interesting. Baptism is one theological sidenote I haven't seen discussed very much in this forum. I will say one thing that kinda upsets me is the practice of "rebaptism", but I'm not sure I want to spend time and energy dialoguing with you all about it.
God bless! Ricker

 

[Lebesgue]

I just thought you might be interested in a couple recent quotes from the Lutheran side of things when asked why they are Lutherans. Good answers, in my opinion!






God bless! Ricker

That the Lutherans do follow the Bible pretty closely!

G-d Bless.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

I'm Lutheran also because Lutherans properly distinguish between Law and Gospel. We know that baptism and Holy Communion weren't new Laws given to us by Jesus Christ (for He said He didn't come to bring new Laws), but they are Gospel, a means that God uses to give us the benefits of the cross.

Isn't it interesting how we use our definition of Laws rather then the definition of Biblical times. The word means teaching or instruction, can we honestly say that we get no new teaching or instruction from God incarnate?

We so often forget that "laws" are not what God expects us to keep but to follow His instructions to let those instructions be seen in the things we do. Jesus gave us the instruction to believe in Him something you can't do as a "law" something you can only do as an internalized acceptance of His teachings. A law you can't keep you can only accept or reject, you believe in Christ or you don't.

 

[honorthesabbath]

When I was baptized into the Lutheran church--I was sprinkled. This is why, after studying how it is biblically done--I was re-baptized (or baptized for the first time is how I looked at it) in the SDA church.

 

[ricker]

When I was baptized into the Lutheran church--I was sprinkled. This is why, after studying how it is biblically done--I was re-baptized (or baptized for the first time is how I looked at it) in the SDA church.

If you came to believe the first time was not done in a Biblical manner, I have no problem with your decision to be rebaptised. (not that my opinion should or does matter to you. ) Rebaptism because of "falling away", or changing denominations, however, is a different matter to me.
God bless! Ricker

 

[djconklin]

Those who feel the need to be rebaptized haven't been clearly taught the meaning of the ordinance of foot-washing.