This MUST STOP!

[RND]

Hi,

I agree with you that this is reaching into the final climax of the great controversy. We shouldn't stiffle/shy away from the challenge.

However this forum does not necessarily provide the platform for fruitful discussions. I can see and have seen the damage outweigh the gains.

Our best defense is the transforming holy spirit. If our characters are transformed into the solid gold, our testimony will be the most powerful weapon against the enemies attacks.

You are so right!

We can only convert those we wish to convert by displaying the same character and love to them that Christ does. They will know God much better by the love we show those that disagree with us.

 

[woobadooba]

RND,

Even though we don't necessarily agree that this kind of thing should be tossed out of here, it is still good to see a new face in here.

Hopefully you won't end up despising me too, like most of them in here do.

Happy Sabbath to you!

 

[honorthesabbath]

Since we don't know the end of things as God does it is best to leave making sure the truth always wins out to Him. He knows His sheep, they hear His voice.

What we may see physically we have no idea of what the end is with them.

No--we cannot know what those peoples very end will be--but for the here and now--truth for them didn't win.

 

[Mankin]

Oh brother. There is something called freedom of speech you know. We are not trying to convert you to anything. And no I am not trying to attack with this speech.

DL it seems you believe we might be going to hell? Well according to the perfection theology we would all burn in hell anyway.

 

[honorthesabbath]

Oh brother. There is something called freedom of speech you know. We are not trying to convert you to anything. And no I am not trying to attack with this speech.

DL it seems you believe we might be going to hell? Well according to the perfection theology we would all burn in hell anyway.

Yes--but never forget that YOUR freedom ends where MY nose begins!


PS--WHOA_-how did I get that extra sentence in Mankin's post when it is NOT showing up in his section? Weird!!

 

[Mankin]

Yes--but never forget that YOUR freedom ends where MY nose begins!


PS--WHOA_-how did I get that extra sentence in Mankin's post when it is NOT showing up in his section? Weird!!

What is that supposed to mean lol. Hmmm that is weird. maybe there's some type of censure or something.

 

[honorthesabbath]

What is that supposed to mean lol. Hmmm that is weird. maybe there's some type of censure or something.

In other words mankin--your freedom of speech (or any other freedom we have) only goes as far as not trampling on mine.

 

[OntheDL]

Oh brother. There is something called freedom of speech you know. We are not trying to convert you to anything. And no I am not trying to attack with this speech.

DL it seems you believe we might be going to hell? Well according to the perfection theology we would all burn in hell anyway.

I don't know where you will be going. God has the record of works and the book of life. I don't.

And no one will go to heaven (myself included) without a transformed character.

However knowingly or unknowingly, we all either work for God and His purpose or for the devil and his purpose.

 

[happywiththelord]

Amen to that!

 

[Xenon]

I for one am glad that there is discussion on alternate viewpoints. I've learned far more from watching traditional beliefs challenged than I believe I would have learned if this whole forum was sanitized. Others have forced me to search out answers to hard questions (like the IJ, which I now believe has biblical legs to stand on) which have brought me closer to a traditional SDA viewpoint than I have ever been.

I can think of at least 3 times that God has "culled the herd": the 300(?) soldiers who marched around the city and took it, Jesus' crucifixion, and the Great Disappointment. If God wanted us to believe without any refining, the church would have experienced none of these, not to mention the persecutions that Jesus promised.

Of course, I do not speak for everyone who may come here.

 

[woobadooba]

I for one am glad that there is discussion on alternate viewpoints. I've learned far more from watching traditional beliefs challenged than I believe I would have learned if this whole forum was sanitized. Others have forced me to search out answers to hard questions (like the IJ, which I now believe has biblical legs to stand on) which have brought me closer to a traditional SDA viewpoint than I have ever been.

I can think of at least 3 times that God has "culled the herd": the 300(?) soldiers who marched around the city and took it, Jesus' crucifixion, and the Great Disappointment. If God wanted us to believe without any refining, the church would have experienced none of these, not to mention the persecutions that Jesus promised.

Of course, I do not speak for everyone who may come here.

It is pleasing to me to know that you haven't been swayed by the assaults on our doctrines.

It is unfortunate however, that this isn't the case with everyone.

 

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

Acts 5:38-39
38 - And now I say to you, Do nothing to these men, but let them be: for if this teaching or this work is of men, it will come to nothing:
39 - But if it is of God, you will not be able to overcome them, and you are in danger of fighting against God.

 

[woobadooba]

Acts 5:38-39
38 - And now I say to you, Do nothing to these men, but let them be: for if this teaching or this work is of men, it will come to nothing:
39 - But if it is of God, you will not be able to overcome them, and you are in danger of fighting against God.

But this was a response to the enemies of the faith, not a response to those who upheld it

The question then, is does Jesus Christ want us to associate ourselves with people that have departed from the faith and are inculcating ideas that are contrary to it, or are we to avoid entering into discussions with such people on doctrinal matters after they have shown that they refuse to accept the truth?

In other words, does God want us to debate with those who are eager to try to refute what we believe, or to spend that time edifying each other in the faith?

Which one is most needed to meet Christ's objective for His church?

 

[IntoTheCrimsonSky]

But this was a response to the enemies of the faith, not a response to those who upheld it

The question then, is does Jesus Christ want us to associate ourselves with people that have departed from the faith and are inculcating ideas that are contrary to it, or are we to avoid entering into discussions with such people on doctrinal matters after they have shown that they refuse to accept the truth?

In other words, does God want us to debate with those who are eager to try to refute what we believe, or to spend that time edifying each other in the faith?

Which one is most needed to meet Christ's objective for His church?

Ah, but the verses from Acts there are addressing the followers of the Way, are they not? And the Pharassies that were being told it were seeing those followers as against God. So, it does technically apply.

The pharassies saw The Way as a threat to their beliefs, and they wanted to get rid of it..or seperate it from themselves. Granted, The Way turned out to be in the right..but the principal still works even here. Who are we to judge truth? We are only to judge the truth that we know, not what others do.

Yes, methods..whether it is done in agression or in love matters, but I have seen agresssion on both sides of this, Bro.

People on both sides do not wish to conform to the other, so naturally there will be debate which will end in nothing but negativity. So yes, I believe that God would rather us focus our energy in other areas which will provide productivity, but that goes for both sides. Singling one out as in the wrong helps no one in this case, as we are all reacting this way in our attempts to follow God.

Apparently people just have different ways that they feel is right, as did the believers of the past.

The Progressives have their own section, as do we. We have a debate section for both to butt heads. We all need to respect that, and not attack anyone as that's not Christ's way.

If someone doesn't want to debate with the others, then dont go into that section. Go to your own.

It works for me. If I want Trad input, I go here. If I want Prog input, I go there. If I want a mix-mash I go to Debate. As far as I know, no one has problems with me.

 

[moicherie]

Ah, but the verses from Acts there are addressing the followers of the Way, are they not? And the Pharassies that were being told it were seeing those followers as against God. So, it does technically apply.

The pharassies saw The Way as a threat to their beliefs, and they wanted to get rid of it..or seperate it from themselves. Granted, The Way turned out to be in the right..but the principal still works even here. Who are we to judge truth? We are only to judge the truth that we know, not what others do.

Yes, methods..whether it is done in agression or in love matters, but I have seen agresssion on both sides of this, Bro.

People on both sides do not wish to conform to the other, so naturally there will be debate which will end in nothing but negativity. So yes, I believe that God would rather us focus our energy in other areas which will provide productivity, but that goes for both sides. Singling one out as in the wrong helps no one in this case, as we are all reacting this way in our attempts to follow God.

Apparently people just have different ways that they feel is right, as did the believers of the past.

The Progressives have their own section, as do we. We have a debate section for both to butt heads. We all need to respect that, and not attack anyone as that's not Christ's way.

If someone doesn't want to debate with the others, then dont go into that section. Go to your own.

It works for me. If I want Trad input, I go here. If I want Prog input, I go there. If I want a mix-mash I go to Debate. As far as I know, no one has problems with me.

A very wise and mature response.

 

[TrustAndObey]

Does anyone here think for one minute that Christ had a "live and let live" attitude? I'm just curious.

I gotta say that what seemed slightly subtle when I was posting here a lot, is very very apparent now that I've been gone a while.

Woob is right. You can almost track the progression of what is going to happen with some people right down to them denouncing the Sabbath....even when they SWEAR they will never believe the Sabbath isn't binding for Christians.

You can also see people speak out FOR the Sabbath that won't say a word when one of their "friends" says its no longer binding.

I'm fine with staying in this little corner of the forum when I do have time to come here, but why should I feel like I have to when this subforum is named after a church I attend? Seriously, why should I? To be tolerant?

I've read the bible and I know how Christ feels about tolerance toward hypocrisy and satan. Enough said on that.

What I witness every time I pop in here isn't one bit surprising and I'd be lying if I said it was. I EXPECT this every time someone announces their disbelief in one of our doctrines. It's a steady progression that has gotten almost too predictable.

What is it about our church in particular I wonder that makes formers think they can't just leave? Why do they always seem to feel that they have to take others with them?

 

[TrustAndObey]

PS...something else to watch for.....

When someone denounces some of our beliefs, and they decide to change churches, you can tell within just a few posts from that WHICH church they chose, even if they don't announce it.

If they want to attend a church that has an ANYTHING GOES attitude then the Sabbath commandment won't be allowed anywhere in that church. So as I said....it's a natural progression and it's predictable.

 

[mva1985]

Trust,

There is a natural progression of not believing in certain doctrines. I think EGW even mentions it in her writings - but I would need to look that up.

Nice to see you check in during your busy schedule.

 

[woobadooba]

Trust,

There is a natural progression of not believing in certain doctrines. I think EGW even mentions it in her writings - but I would need to look that up.

Nice to see you check in during your busy schedule.

If I get a chance to, I will share some thoughts on this.

Right now however, I need to figure out why my word processor is placing a limitation on how much content I am allowed to copy and paste in it

 

[TrustAndObey]

Aren't computers aggravating? I got some malicious spyware that really messed up my computer for a while. It was new so my anti-virus program didn't know how to get rid of it. I finally figured out a way to keep it from being accessed until it can be deleted. Grrrr!

I look forward to seeing the comments about this, because it seriously is something that is VERY apparent after you've been gone a little while.

Miss you guys!!

~Lainie

PS...my finals are all around the 11th, and then I'm done with this semester!!