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I don't know why being in prison should bother a person who has a clear conscience.
Except for the church teaching God desires our happiness (which is not the same as "blessed" since Jesus said "blessed" are those have qualities that match those of God such as suffering, not generally a mark of happiness) most of this is true but if this is what a person embraces as the sole motive of God, they are not going to remain following Jesus for long. His goal is not that we feel personal happiness in our life and well-being. His goal is that we learn to love Him and love others as we love ourselves. The above message appeals right to the selfishness we can embrace and feeds it. It would be like telling a new groom that his wife is there to meet his needs and help him through life leaving out the bit that he will called upon to do the same for her, laying aside his selfish desires at time.First of all He wouldn't be much of a God if He didn't want that for us-and eternity with Him in heaven might be a bit of a grind. The Church has always taught this, related at least to 1 Cor 2:9. Also, look up the word beatitude and its etymology; the church has also taught that God wishes to share in His own beatitude/happiness. He's a good God, His glory is a reflection not of an aloof superiority but flows from the goodness and love that He is-and inherently wants to share. What we have to understand is that God is infinitely, ineffably good and loves man lavishly and wants the very best for him-always has; God's on our side while enmity came from us, not Him, even as He allows us the freedom to wallow in our selfish, prideful foolishness, eternally if we wish. Anyway, Jesus came as a suffering servant, remember, and when we see Him we see God.
I have lost two children and am no strange to the above. The above is true but rather surfacey.Yep, but not only that. Try losing a child or suffering some awful illness or being a victim of another's sin or wrong-headed pursuit of happiness IOW-and you may well have. And these things can be used as well-to break stony hearts, to help us reject this world's ways and in any case help see our need for and dependency on God.
Well, the church never preached personal happiness is God's life goal for us. That is actually deeply selfish. But yes, many make choices based on obtaining personal happiness at the expense of the happiness of others. IT is true but the chruch does not teach it as a valid goal in life.Because, if we're honest, we'd agree with the church that we all desire happiness-it's behind much of what we do, many of the choices we make-it's simply innate to want it, and it would certainly be bizarre to pursue its opposite-unhappiness.
Don't you see that the above is completely selfish? Wanting what is good and right for ourselves (no matter what it costs others) is completely selfish.Happiness is our "homeostasis" so to speak, where we want to be internally and no more selfish in itself than simply wanting what's good and right for ourselves, even if we can be selfish in pursuing it.
I know of this catchy phrase and it is not how God works. One needs to add what we let go of, our selfish pursuit for our own happiness, and let God tell work on us to love the happiness of others as much as our own.And the more we let go and let God, the more peace and happiness we experience, relatively speaking to the extent that this world allows it.
Why do you think selfish pursuit of personal happiness at the expense of the happiness is the teaching of the church and yet say at the end the opposite? (Some of us do know it as well as God desires us to, btw.)Loving God isn't vague; Jesus didn't teach the Greatest Commandments for no reason; love is the very New Covenant reason for obedience, the right motivation for that obedience as opposed to blind insincere drudgery or sense of obligation based solely on fear or legalism. Love should be every Christian's goal; most vagueness about it would be due to the fact that we don't yet know it as well as God desires us to-and will help us to.
He who turns away from evil for fear of punishment is better than he who does evil fearing no punishment at all. If a man has ever been truly discipled or punished by God, he would know the foolishness of the above statement. It sounds lofty and noble but the human heart is such that punishment is a motivation that teaches a man to do good. Eventually he will do good for other reasons but at least he is still doing good along the way. Waiting for the right motive to do good will embed doing evil all along the way quite nicely.Anyway, here's Basil of Cesarea from the 3rd or 4th century speaking:
"If we turn away from evil out of fear of punishment, we are in the position of slaves. If we pursue the enticement of wages, . . . we resemble mercenaries. Finally if we obey for the sake of the good itself and out of love for him who commands . . . we are in the position of children."
Sometimes a little common sense suffices. If you obey the Lord's commandments, you get life.Clarify yes, who throughout Scripture is granted eternal life ? Who is not ?
IN the New Testament, who suffers ? Why ? Is there ANYONE in the New Testament who does NOT suffer ? Why ?
Way too simple? Where did the Lord tell us life was complicated?This is way too simple. We suffer because of the sins of others as well of which we are completely innocent of as regarding sin. The goal of following Jesus to be like him. Happiness is one feeling among others in life. All sunshine and no rain only makes a desert. God's goal is that we be like Jesus, not that we personally experience happiness.
It might vex me till the Lord calmed me down, but the real trouble begins when we start experiencing the consequences of our sin.So if the police came and arrested you on trumpted up charges and threw you in the worse jail in the country, that would not bother you?
The Lord is a great God, quite capable of teaching us how to be happy.Jesus promised eternal life, not eternal happiness. There is a problem that developes in the man who makes being happy, eternal or otherwise, the goal. It is completely self centered.
I've heard some were anxious to be martyred.I am pretty sure that when Christians are murdered, especially under torture, even for their Saviour, they did not think it was no big deal. You are forgetting that pain is considered trouble and a lot more than trouble.
Once you repent of your sin, you are forgiven and have a clear conscience.True.
Can you name 3 people you know are blameless in Yahweh's Judgment (Sight) , who have a clear conscience in His Presence TODAY on earth ? (not even one tiny thing known against them)
Once you repent of your sin, you are forgiven and have a clear conscience.
I bet there are lots of people who have repented of their sin, who therefore have been forgiven, who therefore have clear consciences.Almost no one I know, including on the forum, has a clear conscience. (upon questioning)
Wonder why ?
I bet there are lots of people who have repented of their sin, who therefore have been forgiven, who therefore have clear consciences.
Out here in Reno, where gambling is big business, I learned my lesson about gambling early. The odds aren't in our favor.oh oh oh.......
now? feel guilty conscience for betting ? ! and then for losing the bet too !!!
He didn’t need to do so. Everyone knows it’s complicated without being told. He didn’t tell us to eat or breathe or sleep either. Doesn’t mean we fail to do these things. God doesn’t tell us the obvious. He teaches that which is not so obvious unless you have the mind of Christ (think like He does.)Way too simple? Where did the Lord tell us life was complicated?
This is true. But no longer is.I've heard some were anxious to be martyred.
Except he has no desire to do that which we selfishly pursue without any help. His stated goal is to teach us to want the happiness of others as much as we naturally want our own.The Lord is a great God, quite capable of teaching us how to be happy.
Sometimes you get death though, in this life I mean.Sometimes a little common sense suffices. If you obey the Lord's commandments, you get life.
This is true. But no longer is.
It is written Yahweh created all things SIMPLE. MAN came up with many devices (sinful and complicated)Way too simple? Where did the Lord tell us life was complicated?
He didn’t need to do so. Everyone knows it’s complicated without being told.
The Lord wants us to obey a few commandments. I don't consider that complicated, though.He didn’t need to do so. Everyone knows it’s complicated without being told. He didn’t tell us to eat or breathe or sleep either. Doesn’t mean we fail to do these things. God doesn’t tell us the obvious. He teaches that which is not so obvious unless you have the mind of Christ (think like He does.)
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