The use of grape juice in churches

[BlackSaab52]

I've been going to a PCA church for a few months now, and I've been glad to have been going there, but I'm starting to have a problem with something. I really feel that wine should be used in Communion instead of grape juice, but the church uses grape juice. I'm not actually a member of the church, but I'm not sure what I should do. The reason that it is being used is because some of the people who are members there used to have alcohol problems.

 

[BygTex]

I wonder why no one has brought this up before? I have asked myself the same questions before...I always assumed it was for liability reasons.

Grape Juice, however, is just unfermented wine....if that helps your conscience any.

 

[rmwilliamsll]

there is an extraordinary resources at:
http://www.peterwallace.org/dissertation/wine.htm

with an excellent analysis of the relationship of Presbyterian theology to the temperance movement.

the whole thesis is one of those must read items on the net, i hope he publishes it for a wider audience. in any case this is an excellent place to start a study on the issue as it is well documented.

 

[heymikey80]

I wonder why no one has brought this up before? I have asked myself the same questions before...I always assumed it was for liability reasons.

Grape Juice, however, is just unfermented wine....if that helps your conscience any.

Well, it's brought up often in my circles.

Me, I don't have a problem with it. In the past some of my churches have offered an "inner ring" of wine in the communion tray. OTOH other churches have problems with that because it further divides "the common cup". Still, it's worth a petition. Why not ask your elders if they would consent to such a thing?

 

[rmwilliamsll]

some of my churches have offered an "inner ring" of wine in the communion tray.:=split tray

Grape Juice, however, is just unfermented wine see the two wines theory arising out of temperance, to justify the passages that speak about wine as not referring to alcoholic wine but to grape juice.

 

[BygTex]

Our church no longer has an Elder board. Thank You GOD!

 

[heymikey80]

some of my churches have offered an "inner ring" of wine in the communion tray.:=split tray

Grape Juice, however, is just unfermented wine see the two wines theory arising out of temperance, to justify the passages that speak about wine as not referring to alcoholic wine but to grape juice.

Mmm. Well, the wine used probably wasn't nearly as alcoholic as the wine sold today. Modern wine alcohol levels are kinda high versus ancient wine.

 

[Cajun Huguenot]

Mmm. Well, the wine used probably wasn't nearly as alcoholic as the wine sold today. Modern wine alcohol levels are kinda high versus ancient wine.

How so? I make my own wine and have a pretty good idea of how it works.

The wine drank at Passover (like much of the wine in most of the cultures of the ancient world) was mixed with water (Many churches still mix the communion wine with water).

With that said, wine was what all the church used in communion (usually mixed with water) until the unbiblical temperance movement (which atually began among the Unitarians).

I would speak with the elders (or who ever is in authority), but I would have all the biblical facts to present to them when y'all meet.

The letter at this link -Alcohol and the Bible - is a good place to start.

I think this is an issue that we can use to get Christians to think more biblically, but it is not one to break fellowship over. We have two PCA churches in a thirty miles radius of our home. One church uses wine only and the other uses a has wine and juice.

In Christ,
Kenith

 

[heymikey80]

How so? I make my own wine and have a pretty good idea of how it works.

The wine drank at Passover (like much of the wine in most of the cultures of the ancient world) was mixed with water (Many churches still mix the communion wine with water).

Cut-wine in ancient times was still wine. It was often cut to dramatically low concentrations of alcohol, and seemed to be used to purify water.

The distinction sometimes appears in Scripture as "strong drink".

For the record I'm not a teetotaller, though outside my family they largely are. I line up there with the OPC's view and while I see alcohol as a problem for our society and for many individuals I don't see it as simply right or wrong.

 

[christianmomof3]

Our church used to use wine, but I noticed that some of the Jr. High girls would pour as much as they could into their little communion cup and get all silly about drinking wine. I mentioned it to a parent and she told me they could not get drunk off of that amount of wine - - I know that, but what bothered me was the attitude, and I can see it being a problem to people who are alcoholics as well. That was many years ago and at the church I go to now they use grape juice in the service that I go to, which is the one that all the young people, high school and jr high go to, but I have seen wine in the kitchen - perhaps it is used in the other groups that don't have young people in them - I am not sure - I never asked. But, I don't see a big difference in using wine versus grape juice anyway. It is all from grapes.

 

[Erinwilcox]

Well (and all of you Presbies look closely cause you probably aren't used to hearing this from a. . .Baptist! ), it seems almost hypocritical, especially in Reformed churches, to use grape juice instead of wine. My church does use grape juice, but. . .If we are all crying out for Sola Scriptura and the Regulative Principle and sticking to what the Bible says no matter how unattractive it may be to man, then why are we using grape juice? It seems like a small matter, but it certainly is an interesting one.

BTW, my Presbyterian friends, I was at a Reformed Baptist wedding this past month and you'll never guess what was on the table for use in the toast! Never thought you'd hear that about Baptists, did you?

 

[lmnop9876]

Well (and all of you Presbies look closely cause you probably aren't used to hearing this from a. . .Baptist! ), it seems almost hypocritical, especially in Reformed churches, to use grape juice instead of wine. My church does use grape juice, but. . .If we are all crying out for Sola Scriptura and the Regulative Principle and sticking to what the Bible says no matter how unattractive it may be to man, then why are we using grape juice? It seems like a small matter, but it certainly is an interesting one.

BTW, my Presbyterian friends, I was at a Reformed Baptist wedding this past month and you'll never guess what was on the table for use in the toast! Never thought you'd hear that about Baptists, did you?

i disagree with the use of grape juice, not only is it not Scriptural, the Church has always used fermented wine. I also disagree with the use of individual cups for the same reason.