This is the place to discuss "The official thread" without worry of violating the strict rules imposed in that thread in regard to the order of the discussion of topics.
You may refer to any step in "The official thread" and copy it here for preliminary discussion.
This is a more relaxed thread, and a good place to ask questions of the staff, and of each other.
Okay, please permit me to do the copy thing, and make a comment here and there as I process thoughts...
There's a lot to discuss regarding the placement of the SDA forums in the faith groups, the split that evidently paved the way for that move, what sort of options we have, how this will be handled, and the course of events that should be observed.
We're going to handle this issue one step at a time. Please do not try to side-step around any of the parts of this proposed process.
It seemed to me that a lot of thought that made no one happy gave us the result we have now. That was to resolve the protectionist intent of the congregational forum that allowed no discussion (with meat, anyway), which made no one happy.
You aren't going to make every one happy, and if that's the goal, it is destined to failure - that's simply the historical lesson.
So, I don't think embarking on changes should be done without a clear idea of the end goal. We already know that where there is no vision, the people perish, and that holds true with discussion forums as well.
Ultimately, your staff wants peace, and if that means that your forums are to remained split and left in the faith category for now, that's what is going to happen.
You either want "peace", or you're going to use the sword of the Word and upset people for a while. No one likes exercise, but that doesn't mean that exercise has no benefit.
This is a tentative list that may lead to the reconciliation of the issues:
What are the "issues"? Shouldn't that be defined first?
1) Peace must be maintained at all times and all parties will remain civil, or risk derailing the process and possible other steps that may need to be taken to maintain the peace. This is not negotiable.
Death is very peaceful, and life has lots of activity that rubs some the wrong way. That gets us no closer to a goal, unless the moderation staff decides to simply nuke us from orbit and call it peaceful
2) Issues regarding staff and their decisions are not to be made public in this process, but instead be taken to the staff members through PM, and failing that, to their Admins. I'd suggest that Athene, Ravenscape, Tishri1, and Sophia7 be the go-to Admins in case of any discontent with your mods that cannot be resolved through PMs.
I only hope they have a vision of the goal...
3) We need to learn to debate properly and with respect.
Every single one of my posts have complied with the rules of CF, and yet I still have at least two other members crying their heads off and I'm still subjected to deletions and "administrative edits". As long as you cater to the most easily offended, there can be no objective discussion of the Scriptures.
4) We need to come up with a workable plan. Your input will be valued, but I am hopeful that you will strongly consider input from your staff, as they are more up-to-date with the specific requirements of upper staff that need to be addressed. IOW, trust your staff to help you through this, but do not be afraid to to make valid points in a civil manner.
What's the goal, guys?
5) A meeting of the two SDA groups will be held in an appropriate area. Issues will be highlighted that could possibly impede the peace process. Neither group will be given any more weight than the other. The discussion of who is and who is not a proper SDA will be off limits, and violators may find themselves removed from the discussion at the staff's discretion.
The goal can be seen through the fog - you intend to ban me.
6) A new framework and design for a new forum will be presented by staff, and will be based on the best possible compromises and take into account all the issues presented by both sides. We've got some pretty good organizers on staff who are unbiased in this matter. We need to trust them.
7) Both sides will discuss the new framework, and either agree or disagree with it. Changes may be considered at this point, but this process will not drag out forever if both sides cannot be placated. The process will be scrapped at this point if there is undue bickering from either side.
8) We will submit this framework to the upper CF staff and allow them time to discuss it. We may at this time ask for the new forum to be considered for placement in the denominational category.
My recommendation is to scrap this proposed "process", based on a pragmatic realization:
9) The forums will be combined and switched into "denominations."
The pragmatic realization is that Adventism isn't a Christian denomination in the strict sense of the term; there are enough changes of a salvic nature within this sect that it merits placement as a heterodox sect
at best.
The ones making this proposed decision process need to be aware of the theological implications as well as their desire to create a cozy home to tuck the cults into. Ooops - did I say cults? Yes, I did, and the staff should realize that consistency begs for them to create an equal opportunity cubbyhole for the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses, if they want to list Adventism an orthodox Christian denomination.
After all, did you think the tempers that are ignited within the "traditional" camp are inspired by a theological vacuum?
Leave Adventism in the "faith" category; that's where it belongs.
10) Staff will guide the new forum through counseling posts for the first few weeks. Your staff is to be respected at all times. When we think you've got the hang of getting along, the staff will back off into its normal stance of moderation.
And you will discover yourself back where you started a couple of months ago, with a load of reported posts to wade through and lots of unhappy people.
After reading the above rules, we are currently on step #3.
Learning to debate properly, and with courtesy.
You have a small problem that is a permanent barrier against the "members-only friendship" vs. "apologetics Bible-only" dichotomy:
People.
Fallen people will tear this forum apart as long as these two incompatible goals listed above are catered to.
These are the pragmatic words from the carnal ramblings of Victor.
