The Ten commandments!!!

marcie · Apr 11, 2004

at creation when God rested from His work (Genesis 2:1-3) and later set in the heart of the 10 Commandments as #4, Remember the Sabbath (Exodus 20:8-11) and called by the Lord "My holy day" (Isaiah 58:13) and later claimed by Jesus in the New Testament as the day He is Lord of (Matthew 12:8, Mark 2:28, Luke 6:5), making the Sabbath "The Lord's Day"

NO I DONT WORSHIP IDOLS, YOUMUST UNDERSTAND THE DEFINITION AND TERMINOLOGY OF WHAT IDOL WORSHIP MEANS ITS MEANS TO WORSHIP FALSE GODS.

ITS DOES NOT MEAN PICTURES OF JESUS AND CRUCIFIXTIONS, OR PICTURES OF OUR FAMILY WOULD THEN MEAN WE WORSHIP IDOLS.

The Thadman · Apr 11, 2004

marcie said:
at creation when God rested from His work (Genesis 2:1-3) and later set in the heart of the 10 Commandments as #4, Remember the Sabbath (Exodus 20:8-11) and called by the Lord "My holy day" (Isaiah 58:13) and later claimed by Jesus in the New Testament as the day He is Lord of (Matthew 12:8, Mark 2:28, Luke 6:5), making the Sabbath "The Lord's Day"

So, do you or do you not celebrate the Sabbath on Saturday?

The Sabbath was referred to as "The Lord's Day" many years before Jesus.

NO I DONT WORSHIP IDOLS, YOUMUST UNDERSTAND THE DEFINITION AND TERMINOLOGY OF WHAT IDOL WORSHIP MEANS ITS MEANS TO WORSHIP FALSE GODS.

ITS DOES NOT MEAN PICTURES OF JESUS AND CRUCIFIXTIONS, OR PICTURES OF OUR FAMILY WOULD THEN MEAN WE WORSHIP IDOLS.

But do you, like many other Orthodox, have "icons" of Jesus and various other saints and bow down before them and kiss them?

I am familiar with the traditions of several Orthodox churches locally, all propagate the practice of bowing to, praying to, and kissing statues and other "icons" of Jesus. Some even bring them flowers and other things and even dress the statues.

Does your Church do some or all of the above?

Shlomo,
(Peace!)
-Steve-o

marcie · Apr 12, 2004

I practice Sabbath on SUnday along with billions of other christians.

Do I bow down to Christ, you better believe I do..... Do I kiss the curcifix, yes I do. Christ is my God. I honor and idolize him. Father , Son and Holy Spirit.

God gave moses the 10 commendments as the Law, Jesus taught us why we Keep them and what it means to be a Christian.

marcie · Apr 12, 2004

Past-Present & Future sins already forgiven!

Is this too good to be true? Not according to the men standing behind pulpits today! Their reasoning: Since Christ died once for all, the perfect sacrifice for sin, God no longer sees your sin, but only His Son through whom you have forgiveness by faith through grace!

Sounds good and has some basics in scripture, but it disregards the warnings of God and the free will of man. Yes, Grace saves you through faith, not of works, but that DOESNT mean you have permission to continue in your sin! (Rom6:1) And if you do, you WILL NOT inherit the Kingdom of heaven. (Gal5:19-21, Eph5:5-7) Grace was NEVER meant to be a cloak for evil behavior. (1Pet2:16) Nor is it an accommodation to make up for lack of obedience to the faith. (Rom1:5) Willful sin against a FULL & COMPLETE Knowledge of the truth was not tolerated under the law nor is it permitted under Grace. (Num.15:22-31, Heb10:26-28)

marcie · Apr 12, 2004

Paul said they had fallen from grace. This implies they must have been IN grace (i.e. saved) in order to FALL FROM IT.

REAL 100% Christians having LOST their salvation. (How many examples are needed to convince osas FOLLOWER that its possible for a person to have really been saved, and then to have REALLY LOST HIS SALVATION???)

Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men...but *whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit NEVER HAS FORGIVENESS, but is guilty of an ETERNAL SIN. Mark 3:28,29

I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If ANYONE adds to them, God shall add to him the plagues which are written in this book; AND IF ANYONE (! Does the word Anyone also include osas FOLLOWERS) takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, GOD SHALL TAKE AWAY HIS PART FROM THE TREE OF LIFE AND FROM THE HOLY CITY, which are written in this book. Revelation 22: 18&19

Well, gee, this sure sounds to me like a clear refutation of the once saved, always saved

The Thadman · Apr 12, 2004

marcie said:
I practice Sabbath on Sunday along with billions of other christians.

Exodus 20:

8 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 You shall labor six days, and do all your work,
10 but THE seventh day is a Sabbath to Yahweh your God. You shall not do any work in it, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, your man-servant, nor your maid-servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates;
11 for in six days Yahweh made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested THE seventh day; therefore Yahweh blessed the Sabbath day, and made it holy.

Weeks start on Sunday.

The Torah says to keep the Sabbath on the 7th day. That would be Saturday

Do I bow down to Christ, you better believe I do..... Do I kiss the curcifix, yes I do. Christ is my God. I honor and idolize him. Father , Son and Holy Spirit.

I, personally, believe that this goes against the commandment not to bown down and serve idols. One needs to bow to Christ, not a physical representation Why kiss a cross? It's a lump of metal or two sticks of wood.

The Golden Calf was a representation of YHWH to the Israelites (you'll notice that Aaron was declaring it to be a feast to YHWH). God threw a fit. The snake on the pole was a representation of YHWH, it was fine until the people started reverencing it, in worship to YHWH, bowing to and kissing the idol. God threw another fit.

God gave moses the 10 commendments as the Law, Jesus taught us why we Keep them and what it means to be a Christian.

The 10 Commandments are not the only Law. Even the 10 Commandments bid those who follow them to keep the rest of the Torah of Moses

4 You shall not make for yourselves an idol, nor any image of anything that is in the heavens above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
5 you shall not bow yourself down to them, nor serve them, for I, Yahweh your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and on the fourth generation of those who hate me,
6 and showing loving kindness to thousands of those who love me and keep my Commandments. (NOTE)

The "10 Commandments" is a man-made title that was imposed upon these 10 (which are actually 11 or 12 depending on how you break them up), "Commandments" refers to the whole of the Torah.

Shlomo,
-Steve-o

marcie · Apr 13, 2004

Jews observe saturdays, christians sunday for thousand of years, The commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 states that the seventh day of the week, Saturday, is the day which the Lord selected as the day of rest and worship. However, in the New Testament the Christian church began to worship and rest on the first day of the week, Sunday. the command to set Saturday apart as a day of rest and worship is the only commandment not repeated. There are very good reasons for this.

By His resurrection on the first day of the week (Matt. 28:1), His continued appearances on succeeding Sundays (John 20:26), and the descent of the Holy Spirit on Sunday (Acts 2:1), the early church was given the pattern of Sunday worship. This they did regularly (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2). Sunday worship was further hallowed by our Lord who appeared to John in that last great vision on "the Lord's day" (Rev. 1:10). It is for these reasons that Christians worship on Sunday, rather than on the Jewish Sabbath

The important issue is WE HONOR IT.

Symes · Apr 13, 2004

The commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 states that the seventh day of the week, Saturday, is the day which the Lord selected as the day of rest and worship. However, in the New Testament the Christian church began to worship and rest on the first day of the week, Sunday. the command to set Saturday apart as a day of rest and worship is the only commandment not repeated.

Click to expand...

You say it is not repeated but it is the only commandment that God said to "Remember...."

Tawhano · Apr 13, 2004

The Thadman said:
The "10 Commandments" is a man-made title that was imposed upon these 10 (which are actually 11 or 12 depending on how you break them up), "Commandments" refers to the whole of the Torah.

The Ten Commandments was the covenant God made with Israel. The were called such because there were ten of them on the stones.

Exodus 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

Deuteronomy 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, [even] ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

Deuteronomy 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.

Tawhano · Apr 13, 2004

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

The question is what commandments is being referenced here?

1 John 3:22-24
And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

We are under a new covenant. We have new commandments that God has given to us through Christ.

John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

In that Christ said new it then meant that the old was done away with and something better took its place. The same is true of the old covenant and its commandments and laws.

Hebrews 8:13 In that he saith, A new [covenant], he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old [is] ready to vanish away.

beetlequeendiva · Apr 13, 2004

sethsmommy said:
I know some people belive that if you follow the ten commandments you'll go to heaven..

but everyone lies and one of the commandments is thou shalt not lie am I right...

Just because everyone lies doesn't make it right, we are taught that we are to repent from our sins. So when you do something wrong you repent, you ask for God's forgiveness - that is what the Bible teaches.

The Thadman · Apr 13, 2004

marcie said:
Jews observe saturdays, christians sunday for thousand of years, The commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 states that the seventh day of the week, Saturday, is the day which the Lord selected as the day of rest and worship. However, in the New Testament the Christian church began to worship and rest on the first day of the week, Sunday. the command to set Saturday apart as a day of rest and worship is the only commandment not repeated. There are very good reasons for this.

Mark 7:7 But in vain do they worship me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For you set aside the commandment of God, and hold tightly to the tradition of men ...
9 He said to them, Full well do you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition.

By His resurrection on the first day of the week (Matt. 28:1), His continued appearances on succeeding Sundays (John 20:26), and the descent of the Holy Spirit on Sunday (Acts 2:1), the early church was given the pattern of Sunday worship. This they did regularly (Acts 20:7; 1 Cor. 16:2). Sunday worship was further hallowed by our Lord who appeared to John in that last great vision on "the Lord's day" (Rev. 1:10). It is for these reasons that Christians worship on Sunday, rather than on the Jewish Sabbath

Matthew 28:1 And?

John 20:26: NO WORSHIP. It says after 8 days. If his first appearance was on a Sunday, his next would be on a Monday if the period of time was 8 days. This does not help your case

Acts 2:1: This is Pentecost.

Acts 20:7: NO WORSHIP. Gathering together to "break bread" is not a worship service. It was sharing a communal meal. Don't confuse the modern connotations of "breaking bread" with 1st Century Jewish practice.

1 Cor. 16:2 NO WORSHIP. This was the collection of funds to be distributed. They could not exchange money on a Sabbath.

Rev 1:10: "The Lord's Day" is a rabbinic term for the Sabbath!

Did you not read all of Acts to see that they learned and worshiped on Saturdays? (15:7,etc.)

The important issue is WE HONOR IT.

God never commanded any other day by the 7th. I'm not willing to mess over this any further, but I MUST implore you to see this as in indication of a greater problem.

Shlomo,
-Steve-o

marcie · Apr 14, 2004

OF COURSE THERE IS A PROBLEM, I AM CHRISTIAN AND YOU ARE A JEW, WE LOVE JEWS YET THE CHRISTIANS AND JEWS HAVE DIFFERENCES.

JESUS THE SON OF GOD IS THE DIFFERENCE.

I HAVE MY HANDS FULL WITH THE LUKEWARM CHRISTIANS. I REALLY DONT HAVE TIME TO GET INTO JUDEO/CHRISTIAN THEOLOGIES .

Most orthodox Christians profess and teach the New Testament has not replaced the Old Testament, it has completed it. Christians believe in plenary inspiration, which means that every word of the entire Bible is God-breathed (2 Peter 1:21).

The Thadman · Apr 14, 2004

marcie said:
OF COURSE THERE IS A PROBLEM, I AM CHRISTIAN AND YOU ARE A JEW, WE LOVE JEWS YET THE CHRISTIANS AND JEWS HAVE DIFFERENCES.

JESUS THE SON OF GOD IS THE DIFFERENCE.

I HAVE MY HANDS FULL WITH THE LUKEWARM CHRISTIANS. I REALLY DONT HAVE TIME TO GET INTO JUDEO/CHRISTIAN THEOLOGIES .

"In order to be a good Christian, one must be a good Jew first." -Pastor George (a.k.a. Nehemiah_Center on ChristianForums.com)

Most orthodox Christians profess and teach the New Testament has not replaced the Old Testament, it has completed it. Christians believe in plenary inspiration, which means that every word of the entire Bible is God-breathed (2 Peter 1:21).

But there was no New Testament at the time of Peter's writing, so he would be talking about the OT.

For example, do you actually think that Paul actually thought that his letters to his friends about specific problems that they wrote to him about would one day be counted as scripture? We know that parts of Paul's writings aren't even "God-breathed" because he, himself, said that they come from him and not God?

Shlomo,
-Steve-o

Wreck n Sow · Apr 14, 2004

Hi Marcie
you wrote
Christians believe in plenary inspiration, which means that every word of the entire Bible is God-breathed (2 Peter 1:21).

1JOHN 5 [2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.[3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

I agee with ya there Marcie.

Symes · Apr 14, 2004

1JOHN 5 [2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.[3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

They have not been done away with. They are all there, everyone of them including the 4th commandment.

ischus · Apr 14, 2004

Ok:

Everyone take a time-out and read the bible for a second...

If you read the following passages and still have something to talk about, then please do... but I think that these need to be considered :

Rom.14:4-10 Jn.1:15-16

And don't just read them...try studying them too (context, situation, occasion, audience, original language etc.)

Wreck n Sow · Apr 15, 2004

Hi Ischus,
Just took a look at Romans. But lets at least look past verse 14 to see whats actually being judged. Is it the meat and drink offerings of the holy days (set feasts)thats being talked about? The vain oblations? The laws contained in the ordinances, which Jesus nailed to the cross?All 3 are 1 in the same. Meat and drink - bread and wine? Just somethin to think about.

ischus · Apr 15, 2004

WS,

didn't quite get your point there, but what I am suggesting is that God has no problem with people doing something that honors him in their actions and in their heart. This includes choosing a special day to honor him (weekly, anually, etc.). In other words, Those who honor and keep the sabbath are justified in doing so, as well as those who hold Sunday as a special day dedicated to the Lord.

Tawhano · Apr 15, 2004

I have never understood why people continue to discuss which day the Sabbath fell on. If you keep the Sabbath you must keep it on Saturday and you will be under the law. Christians are not under the law. The Ten Commandments in which the Sabbath command is part of was the covenant made to Israel. As I have shown in my previous post (which was totally ignored) that covenant was replaced by the new covenant herald in by Christ who fulfilled all the law and set us free from it.

Romans 7:1-6 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to [her] husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of [her] husband. So then if, while [her] husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, [even] to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not [in] the oldness of the letter.

The Ten commandments!!!

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