The Receptive Pulpit of Tongues

[rocknanchor]

Speaking of tongues, how would you paint today's Pentecostal pulpit, large or small amount of time dealing with speaking in tongues? Would your response likely include a frequent amount of time Church oversight deals with the subject? Should a Church mirror the frequency the Apostle Paul and others exhibited in the book of Acts?

Currently, I would like to be shown by someone to be in gross error by the good report of congregations who are so pumped by the subject they break out in applause whenever the Pastor sets the subject in motion! My experience to date cannot provide such a report.

What is a good or healthy frequency for a Pentecostal assembly to be thought friendly with the subject of tongues?

 

[rocknanchor]

Oh yes, for all you who are less than friendly with the possibility of your Pastor, Priest, Spiritual mentor's bringing a message of tongues to the pulpit or any gathering in His name due to your 'Oh no no, we can't invite that type of indecent activity, for even the Apostle advised against everyone speaking in tongues at one time in the Church.' But that is for those who are already exercising speaking in tongues, not for those who are about to have hands laid upon them with petitions to God to bless. For if you take the time to look in Acts, whenever they receive the gift as a group, they do so collectively as one, at the same time. This is the exception, Hallelujah!

 

[Richard T]

Speaking of tongues, how would you paint today's Pentecostal pulpit, large or small amount of time dealing with speaking in tongues? Would your response likely include a frequent amount of time Church oversight deals with the subject? Should a Church mirror the frequency the Apostle Paul and others exhibited in the book of Acts?

Currently, I would like to be shown by someone to be in gross error by the good report of congregations who are so pumped by the subject they break out in applause whenever the Pastor sets the subject in motion! My experience to date cannot provide such a report.

What is a good or healthy frequency for a Pentecostal assembly to be thought friendly with the subject of tongues?

I do not think it is taught or preached frequently at all, maybe not even once a year. I think most Pentecostal/Charismatic pastors though will have an altar call for those seeking the baptism of the spirit at least every once in awhile. Some too may teach this on an individual or small group level. I don't remember the exact stats, but the Assembly of God is getting far more converts than they are getting people baptized in the spirit. This likely is why the baptism of the spirit has been reduced I think over the past few decades. More of a dulution in the Congregation in most churches, which of course does not have to occur. This subject should be taught when there are some in the church that are fairly clueless as to how it works. I think that some pastors are weak in this area (They also seem weak in teaching the end times) Rather than address a topic that is is controversial to some, they will pass it over.
Alternatives I have seen include a special class, or at an indivdual or small group level. I do know at leat one church that covers it during a new members class, though it is not as important as many of the other basics of Christianity.
I personally like K.E. Hagin's teaching on tongues. While he is known as a faith teacher, his teaching including books on the gifts and tongues in particular show the subject was important to teach. I don't think all Rhema trained pastors though emphasize it as much.

 

[mourningdove~]

I do not think it is taught or preached frequently at all, maybe not even once a year.

I would agree with this ^.

Where I live now, most of the AOG churches don't appear to preach or teach much on the Baptism of the Holy Spirit or the spiritual gifts.

A few years back, I worked in an AOG church. It was a very interesting experience, in many ways. But what a difference I saw that it made, depending on who was the current lead pastor! I believe it is the lead pastor who sets the pace for the church.

Before the new pastor arrived at our church, we had an Interim Pastor. I worked mainly under his watch. He was an old-timer, very knowledgeable of the true Pentecostal church. When he came to the church, he started teaching Wednesday nite classes on the Baptism and the gifts. It was amazing to watch the transformation that took place as he continued with his weekly lessons! People started going forward at services to receive the Baptism. People started moving in the spiritual gifts, personally and publicly in services. And this Pastor was not afraid of doing deliverances. These he, escorted with another pastor, would do privately as needed. No big ordeal or show, he just knew how to do it. People were being set free! It was all so amazing, to watch how the church came alive under the leadership of this Interim Pastor!

When the new pastor and his family arrived at the church, they took over in many of the church's positions, and the church went back to the way it was before the Interim Pastor: not discussing the Baptism, not teaching on the spiritual gifts, etc.

Not all are in agreement with the Jimmy Swaggart Ministries., but one thing I do like about them is that they still do talk about receiving the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in their Sunday services, which are live-streamed. And persons are regularly given the opportunity to go forward and pray to receive the Baptism. Usually Donnie Swaggart is the one to lead into this, and I'm very glad that he still does. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and the spiritual gifts, have not 'gone away'.

 

[rocknanchor]

I don't remember the exact stats, but the Assembly of God is getting far more converts than they are getting people baptized in the spirit.

I do not think it is taught or preached frequently at all, maybe not even once a year.

Has either your study or experience shown decades-past were times of AOG averages to feast on the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

I personally like K.E. Hagin's teaching on tongues. While he is known as a faith teacher, his teaching including books on the gifts and tongues in particular show the subject was important to teach. I don't think all Rhema trained pastors though emphasize it as much.

Brother Hagin showed us here that there is no question to us of the importance, so much so, sometimes to lay low and let God exalt the ministry. Still, does not touch on those in the ministry who dabble to cast a negative tone an ultimate 'don't turn off the hungry soul'. I tire of describing those who can't bring themselves out of that 'cozy' spiritual condition they emit.

 

[Richard T]

Has either your study or experience shown decades-past were times of AOG averages to feast on the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

Brother Hagin showed us here that there is no question to us of the importance, so much so, sometimes to lay low and let God exalt the ministry. Still, does not touch on those in the ministry who dabble to cast a negative tone an ultimate 'don't turn off the hungry soul'. I tire of describing those who can't bring themselves out of that 'cozy' spiritual condition they emit.

That is a good word in two ways. It is a reminder that many of the earlier tongue talkers faced quite a bit of resistance. Now, few seem to mind. Secondly, we are reminded that it is all up to God for any believer, so there is no glory in self. In another thread I was reminded of the role of holiness in the operation of the gifts. It could very well be that the decline of tongues and the gifts are related to the condition of the believer's heart? This decline too seems to have reduced prayer meetings and often those prayer meetings don't have people really interceding in the spirit, like I witnessed in the 80s and even 90s.
All I can say is that I am glad to have been able to stay a bit in Asia off and on. Growth is great and I do not notice the doctrinal issues that I saw in the USA. I rarely see the freedom in tongues and the gifts that I witnessed in the wave of the 80s. That is a pretty hard standard to achieve because charismatic churches were exploding, the mega churches were just getting their starts.
So the healing revivalists in the 50s, carried the church to the gifts in the 80s, and seemingly the last two or three decades have been at best tepid. There has been some movement in churches like the Vineyard, and Bethel (Redding) or the Intl House of Prayer (Kansas City) Their doctrine and vision is somewhat different
Expansion has come from churches like the Intl House of Prayer with their 24/7 worship and movement in doctrine. This doctrine seems to cast of the rapture notions and to various extent replace it with Kingdom now/dominionist type of thinking. While they have been successful too, I think that God is and will further broaden out the renewal/revival. I think their movement could very well decline with Trump if things go poorly as some expect. The new emerging church is I think one of a diffusion of power, that God is not looking for great individual leaders, he is looking for a church that is about doing what is on his heart involving as many lay people that will heed His call. Of course my views can be subject to vast error but is there a feeling that something has to give to break us out of the current status quo? I'd love to hear other's vision for what they thinkwGod is leading them into in the next few years or so.

To answer more directly on the question were their more baptisms of the Holy Spirit in the past the answer is i believe so. I'll try and find those stats I mentioned. That the AOG noted that the baptism rate was very low seemed to be a real concern. (I was in a meeting where this was briefly reported). In a sense I think the AOG could be losing their branding. Some of the most successful AOG churches in the USA don't even use the AOG in their name. I went to one top 20 in attendance AOG churches in the USA and the months I was there I can't recall them ever mentioning AOG in a service. It seemed to repurpose itself into a community church and it was working as far as attendance goes. People were getting saved, praise God but I rarely saw any gifts in operation. Perhaps there is a plan for this though, I can't judge it to be wrong, but we have seen lots of denominations change over the years. Some ministers too have left the AOG, some for being restrained (Hagin comes to mind) and perhaps some for being too liberal?

 

[rocknanchor]

It could very well be that the decline of tongues and the gifts are related to the condition of the believer's heart?

Here we go, yes! Dare we utter the word once more? Distraction. ''Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things.” This exhortation occurs in Paul’s letter to the believers in Colossae, a church facing pressures from various teachings that threatened to dilute or distort the sufficiency of Christ. Paul writes to remind them-and present-day readers-that our true life is hidden with Christ. This instruction signals that believers should reorient their thoughts and priorities around the reality of God’s reign, ,Paul addresses earthly distractions-habits, desires, or worldviews that can pull one’s attention away from Christ. This does not imply that practical concerns such as family, work, or daily responsibilities are unimportant. Instead, “earthly things” become problematic when they eclipse or oppose the kingdom-focused priorities that Scripture lays out.'' - SOURCE

Could be a staggeringly high 'eclipse' probability brought on by this very environment, those bittersweet affairs we tap with the internet and phone. Paul had his hands full warning believers in his day. Thinking, how interesting it would be to see how he would council today's distraction - technology?

 

[Richard T]

Speaking of tongues, how would you paint today's Pentecostal pulpit, large or small amount of time dealing with speaking in tongues? Would your response likely include a frequent amount of time Church oversight deals with the subject? Should a Church mirror the frequency the Apostle Paul and others exhibited in the book of Acts?

Currently, I would like to be shown by someone to be in gross error by the good report of congregations who are so pumped by the subject they break out in applause whenever the Pastor sets the subject in motion! My experience to date cannot provide such a report.

What is a good or healthy frequency for a Pentecostal assembly to be thought friendly with the subject of tongues?

I found the stats that I mentioned basically quoted in an article. It is worse than I thought as far as tongues go. Great though on new attendance. The margin of newcomers to the church (many of course are already born again) to those that speak in tongues is 9 reported to be 9 to 1. If that is true in ten years, a church would have 90 come into the church while 10 of those will speak in tongues. So a lot of room for growth there, otherwise if the ratio holds it will nearly cease to be a Pentecostal church. Some are like that already. I suspect though that the numbers vary greatly from church to church. I am sure that some churches do have those new people being baptized in the spirit, while others do not stress tongues at all and get none or few people being baptized in the spirit.
So should tongues be preached? Yes, but the pastor and church body has to "desire earnestly" the spiritual gifts themselves, and understand them more to be able to really allow the Holy Spirit to help with others. Alternatively, those in the pews who exercise their prayer language and are disappointed in a church's progress in this area may end up gravitating to more charismatic bodies.

Here is an excerpt from the article and the link.

"It is a foundational experience in the life of every Pentecostal believer. Yet there is evidence that Spirit baptism is in decline in the Assemblies of God.

Worship service attendance grew by 9% from 2009–19, AG (USA) statistics reveal. Yet the number of Spirit baptisms during that period was basically flat (1% growth).

Additionally, data from the Acts 2 Journey shows that from 2016–19, most conversions in the Fellowship took place in larger churches (200+ attenders). However, larger churches also experienced a 13% decline in Spirit baptisms during that time.

These figures suggest that although we are successfully leading people to Christ, we are falling behind in leading adherents into Spirit baptism. The question is, what can we do about it?"

The article continues on the importance of tongues and offers some suggestions.

Speaking in Tongues

Why and how we should seek God for a fresh outpouring of the Holy Spirit

influencemagazine.com

 

[rocknanchor]

I found the stats that I mentioned basically quoted in an article. It is worse than I thought as far as tongues go. Great though on new attendance. The margin of newcomers to the church (many of course are already born again) to those that speak in tongues is 9 reported to be 9 to 1. If that is true in ten years, a church would have 90 come into the church while 10 of those will speak in tongues. So a lot of room for growth there, otherwise if the ratio holds it will nearly cease to be a Pentecostal church. Some are like that already. I suspect though that the numbers vary greatly from church to church. I am sure that some churches do have those new people being baptized in the spirit, while others do not stress tongues at all and get none or few people being baptized in the spirit.
So should tongues be preached? Yes, but the pastor and church body has to "desire earnestly" the spiritual gifts themselves, and understand them more to be able to really allow the Holy Spirit to help with others. Alternatively, those in the pews who exercise their prayer language and are disappointed in a church's progress in this area may end up gravitating to more charismatic bodies.

Here is an excerpt from the article and the link.

"It is a foundational experience in the life of every Pentecostal believer. Yet there is evidence that Spirit baptism is in decline in the Assemblies of God.

Worship service attendance grew by 9% from 2009–19, AG (USA) statistics reveal. Yet the number of Spirit baptisms during that period was basically flat (1% growth).

Additionally, data from the Acts 2 Journey shows that from 2016–19, most conversions in the Fellowship took place in larger churches (200+ attenders). However, larger churches also experienced a 13% decline in Spirit baptisms during that time.

These figures suggest that although we are successfully leading people to Christ, we are falling behind in leading adherents into Spirit baptism. The question is, what can we do about it?"

The article continues on the importance of tongues and offers some suggestions.

Speaking in Tongues

Why and how we should seek God for a fresh outpouring of the Holy Spirit

influencemagazine.com

Thank you! With all confidence, the watchful eyes and ears are not surprised at this. And I should probably clear up the little matter of my 'click-bait' title of this thread, there is no tongues apart from receiving the Spirit (Spirit baptism, subsequent to or at the time of conversion) as the word defines, ''Have you received the Spirit when you believed?'' (Acts 19:2).

Thanks also for that link to I.M. which I was unfamiliar with. Maybe, they are the exception to what I have seen, reports on Spirit Baptism in step with that frequency of occurrence in the Church. Hopefully wrong about that. One other thing which I have stated before, like you, I had a stint west of the Mississippi was an AOG mega-church which was a weekly promoter of being filled with the HS, but in my four years (82'-86') there, we were doing good to see a concerted Baptism in the Holy Spirit service once a year. A tongues/interpretation Pentecostal teacher on the local TBN channel every Tuesday night.

As I asked in the OP,

Should a Church mirror the frequency the Apostle Paul and others exhibited in the book of Acts?

It is said, we ''lay hands on no man suddenly'', does not interfere with the spontaneity of Acts 19:2. I take that little clue as an Apostolic tradition to set in stone. And once again, I am about to hit the Pentecostal visiting trail again. Wherein, no matter where we worship, the blessing of ''liberty'' of the Spirit for the sons of God to experience is never snuffed out. Common to be misinterpreted, but of infinite supply if that is, convenience for a Pentecostal assembly isn't there.

But back to your stats, are we at the cusp of apostacy? For there are a few choice drills the word lays out for us if an assembly lays claim to bible-believing.

 

[Richard T]

Thanks for sharing some personal experience and theological views, which if I understand them right agree with you on. For instance, about not
worrying in some contexts about laying hands on no man suddenly. I once witnessed a pastor of a mega church in the foyer after a service just chatting and shaking hands. All of a sudden, and quite out of the blue, he went straight to a man and asked him if he had received the Holy Spirit. The man replied no, and the pastor just laid his hands on him and he was baptized in the Spirit right there with no or few other English words spoken. Now that is flowing in God. There are some possible reasons why that is rarer today. Some I might have suggested before.

We could be a seasonal lull?

There is a grieving of the Holy Spirit that needs to be addressed? This grieving might include some fleshly counterfeits of the gifts of the Spirit. Are some churches trying to recreate the emotion and experience, but God is not in it? For example, On an occasion the Holy Spirit might ask someone to run around the church a couple of times. This of course stirs things up and if God was in that activity, it may prepare the crowd for something more. However, if the following weeks someone does it in the flesh, the emotion is there but God is not in it.

Other types of grieving exist too. Like if God expects someone to step out and they fail to even try. We all have done this but if we confess and are willing to try again, that can reopen the door. I think that is far better than quashing things (intentionally or not). I have attended some
services where the Holy Spirit does not have a chance to speak. Churches can be so busy with their own plans and just assume that is what God has for the day. So any deviation is rare as they devote little or no time to really invite the Holy Spirit.

Though not AOG, I like Eastwood Anabe a Pastor from Ghana that will shift directions during a service, even having the church pray in tongues for some time before moving the service on. Not to mention those services can last three hours.

But perhaps the biggest culprit is of a lack of movement in tongues and many other things of the Spirit is a lack of faith. Do members and even Pastors come to service and try to draw out the faith that is required for God to move in the service? Can Pastors not only allow others to engage but can they cultivate the gifts in their congregation by raising expectations of God moving and then allowing it to happen? Along with this is the ability to discern and shut down any distractions that are not of God. So that is where teaching can move a congregation along. Natural barriers to tongues do exist. Some are theological misunderstandings while others are practical such as communicating exactly what may happen and letting go of all the intellectual considerations.

So a confluence of things possibly but God will move on those whose heart and mind is centered and who expect. Thanks for sharing the thread. I pray you can be a catalyst to bring out the gifts in whatever place you worship.

 

[rocknanchor]

I pray you can be a catalyst to bring out the gifts in whatever place you worship.

Woe - thank you! Agree at any such enablement whatsoever, amen.

There is a grieving of the Holy Spirit that needs to be addressed?

Interesting question, and I guess I have been dancing around the cultural underestimations long enough. For though it likely wouldn't be found, I suspect the undercurrent today is exacerbated from his day: ''And you are [spiritually permissible] puffed up, and have not rather mourned, , '' at an assortment of social fashions we have come to know. How well would today's flock be willing to heel? For we have no such Apostle of authority to stand before. They WERE as we ARE, quietly stouthearted in fruit. I would have to affirm as yes, quite the chosen means.

 

[Richard T]

If i may I'll share a little on grieving the Holy Spirit and at least what it means to me.

Psalm 78:40-41 (KJV)
40 How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!
41 Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

Ephesians 4:29-32 (KJV)
29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Seems like more things grieve God than what I had previously thought. Our speech for sure, but anything that exalts itself against God is grieving.
I can recall services where there is resistance to God, in a way there is sort of a mass resistance to what God wants to do. Religious traditions can be the culprit. We always think we know so much but in reality are knowledge of the move of God is far more limited.
Matthew 9:24-26 (KJV)
24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is not dead, but sleepeth. And they laughed him to scorn.
25 But when the people were put forth, he went in, and took her by the hand, and the maid arose.
26 And the fame hereof went abroad into all that land.

Yes, we too can scorn the very thing that God wants to do. Jesus had to put those people out before he brought this woman back to life. There are a lot of do's and don't s in some churches too concerning the gifts of the spirit. I always feel like the leader in charge is an orchestra leader. They have to control things but not so much as to stifle them. Most I think lean to limiting anything unusual or outside their own understanding. But Jesus ministered sometimes in unusual ways.

I once was in a really free church and a woman would go around the congregation waving a banner during worship. I kind of thought it was distracting and one service I basically had a scornful attitude concerning it. In this state of mind I tried see if God too thought it was out of order. Interestingly, the next time she passed by the presence of God just hit really hard. I might question unusual things again, but I will try to do it in a way that is not judgmental and negative. I think it is best to shelve our own preconceptions and let God rule in every service and extend grace to those trying to do what God has asked them. Sure some things fall flat and seem to be of the flesh, but I think those are helpful learning experiences.
A church leader does have to stop distractions whenever possible because Satan will try and bring someone forward that will shut down what God wants to do. An example for this occurred when I was at a downtown mission church that was basically set up in a homeless shelter. The speaker that day was wrapping things up and just starting to offer salvation. The Holy Spirit was moving, when suddenly a man went up and told the preacher that the U.S. President had been shot. So, he immediately shut down the salvation appeal and went straight to praying for the President ( I think it was as far back as the second Bush). When he tried to switch back to salvation, the message was now totally flat. The shift of gears to the false report hampered what God was going to do. The minister should have listened and discerned but I am sure he is more careful since then. Flowing in God requires some risk taking, some trust of other believers, and total dependence on God. Our own ambitions need to be checked.

Other grieving is personal sin. like our speech or other characteristics that are mentioned in the scripture above. We do not have to feel condemned though, God does use imperfect vessels. he seems to shun human confidence and self image and will sometimes chooses the weak things of the world to confound the wise. (I Cor 1:27). Those that especially think they can not do what God is asking, are often the one's being called to do something.

i once attended a Phil Driscoll concert. his message was along the lines of allowing God to move and expecting the things of God, even if they are unusual. After the message he was playing some songs and I felt led to swing dance. Even I thought how unusual, but given the message I just said Ok, God but I can't do this alone. So I asked a woman I brought there is she felt Ok to swing dance right there in the aisle of the service. She amazingly said yes, and we danced well enough, but I could feel the brakes of the audience at least to some extent. No one asked us to stop, but even Phil Driscoll seemed a bit surprised. I still believe it was God though I am sure that some would object to it as improper. I suppose a weak conscience though will not permit most things. Sort of like I might try to judge a Christian cover of a secular song used during a church service. The rock song lyrics are just changed to Godly one's. If it brings additional people to the seats, is it worth it? I think so. No one should go so far as to alter the word of God but God uses lots of unusual things and actions sometimes. You have to love freedom in Christ.

 

[rocknanchor]

If i may I'll share a little on grieving the Holy Spirit and at least what it means to me.

Psalm 78:40-41 (KJV)
40 How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!
41 Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

Ephesians 4:29-32 (KJV)
29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Seems like more things grieve God than what I had previously thought. Our speech for sure, but anything that exalts itself against God is grieving.
I can recall services where there is resistance to God, in a way there is sort of a mass resistance to what God wants to do. Religious traditions can be the culprit. We always think we know so much but in reality are knowledge of the move of God is far more limited.
Matthew 9:24-26 (KJV)
24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is not dead, but sleepeth. And they laughed him to scorn.
25 But when the people were put forth, he went in, and took her by the hand, and the maid arose.
26 And the fame hereof went abroad into all that land.

Yes, we too can scorn the very thing that God wants to do. Jesus had to put those people out before he brought this woman back to life. There are a lot of do's and don't s in some churches too concerning the gifts of the spirit. I always feel like the leader in charge is an orchestra leader. They have to control things but not so much as to stifle them. Most I think lean to limiting anything unusual or outside their own understanding. But Jesus ministered sometimes in unusual ways.

I once was in a really free church and a woman would go around the congregation waving a banner during worship. I kind of thought it was distracting and one service I basically had a scornful attitude concerning it. In this state of mind I tried see if God too thought it was out of order. Interestingly, the next time she passed by the presence of God just hit really hard. I might question unusual things again, but I will try to do it in a way that is not judgmental and negative. I think it is best to shelve our own preconceptions and let God rule in every service and extend grace to those trying to do what God has asked them. Sure some things fall flat and seem to be of the flesh, but I think those are helpful learning experiences.
A church leader does have to stop distractions whenever possible because Satan will try and bring someone forward that will shut down what God wants to do. An example for this occurred when I was at a downtown mission church that was basically set up in a homeless shelter. The speaker that day was wrapping things up and just starting to offer salvation. The Holy Spirit was moving, when suddenly a man went up and told the preacher that the U.S. President had been shot. So, he immediately shut down the salvation appeal and went straight to praying for the President ( I think it was as far back as the second Bush). When he tried to switch back to salvation, the message was now totally flat. The shift of gears to the false report hampered what God was going to do. The minister should have listened and discerned but I am sure he is more careful since then. Flowing in God requires some risk taking, some trust of other believers, and total dependence on God. Our own ambitions need to be checked.

Other grieving is personal sin. like our speech or other characteristics that are mentioned in the scripture above. We do not have to feel condemned though, God does use imperfect vessels. he seems to shun human confidence and self image and will sometimes chooses the weak things of the world to confound the wise. (I Cor 1:27). Those that especially think they can not do what God is asking, are often the one's being called to do something.

i once attended a Phil Driscoll concert. his message was along the lines of allowing God to move and expecting the things of God, even if they are unusual. After the message he was playing some songs and I felt led to swing dance. Even I thought how unusual, but given the message I just said Ok, God but I can't do this alone. So I asked a woman I brought there is she felt Ok to swing dance right there in the aisle of the service. She amazingly said yes, and we danced well enough, but I could feel the brakes of the audience at least to some extent. No one asked us to stop, but even Phil Driscoll seemed a bit surprised. I still believe it was God though I am sure that some would object to it as improper. I suppose a weak conscience though will not permit most things. Sort of like I might try to judge a Christian cover of a secular song used during a church service. The rock song lyrics are just changed to Godly one's. If it brings additional people to the seats, is it worth it? I think so. No one should go so far as to alter the word of God but God uses lots of unusual things and actions sometimes. You have to love freedom in Christ.

Wow, good word. I would term, His power over the powers of fashion. Overall, you force me to ask for insight, for I am not a showman, which when it happens to me, I know it surely IS of God, who can make the weak strong - instantly. One service decades ago, I visited an AOG north of the city. Evangelist Dwight Thompson was guest-speaker. Maybe 400, I was on the way to the restroom (which I never ordinarily do), all of a sudden while Dwight was speaking, I turn around in the aisle and start waving-hands in large slow sweeping motion. I really was not all that aware of those who may have watched except, did catch the attention and had Dwight a bit surprised too. Again, knowing myself in such a capacity for such occurrences may be amusing, but I keep it as should be thankful for expectations of things to come.

I always feel like the leader in charge is an orchestra leader. They have to control things but not so much as to stifle them. Most I think lean to limiting anything unusual or outside their own understanding. But Jesus ministered sometimes in unusual ways.

Ah yes, from the text, it is most interesting to me the concurrent mechanics of both the integrity and liberty of His will. God of the living, yet Shepherd of the soul. Liberty of the Spirit of Christ, who is also being formed to become, the inner-man.

Seems like more things grieve God than what I had previously thought. Our speech for sure, but anything that exalts itself against God is grieving.
I can recall services where there is resistance to God, in a way there is sort of a mass resistance to what God wants to do. Religious traditions can be the culprit. We always think we know so much but in reality are knowledge of the move of God is far more limited.

Such a resistance far outnumbers my chosen stripe in my neck of the woods. And while I visit and worship among them, they know the Pentecostal loves them, or he wouldn't have tarried long and in numerous settings. Once I sample oversight to see the power during 'coffee hour', its back to conference, conference amongst, glory to God. Longsuffering has an interesting effect too, even if they are wise to it, God is able to catch all manner of fox at his device.