The Parable of Lazarus in "Abraham's Bosom"

[Minister Monardo]

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

 

[Dan Perez]

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

And verse 31 says EXACTLY who the rich man is TALKING ABOUT , it is ISRAEL !!

dan p

 

[Minister Monardo]

And verse 31 says EXACTLY who the rich man is TALKING ABOUT , it is ISRAEL !!

dan p

Of course. He only addressed the lost sheep of Israel during His ministry on earth.
This does not dismiss the Gentiles from the same standard applied by the apostolic doctrine.
Romans 10:
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart”
(that is, the word of faith which we preach): (as you know, quoting Torah)
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.”
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek,
for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
1 Corinthians 15:
12 Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead,
how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen.
14 And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is vain and your faith is also vanity.
15 Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God,
because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ,
whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise.
16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!

The Resurrection was the issue being addressed in the Parable.

 

[Dan Perez]

Of course. He only addressed the lost sheep of Israel during His ministry on earth.
This does not dismiss the Gentiles from the same standard applied by the apostolic doctrine.
Romans 10:
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart”
(that is, the word of faith which we preach): (as you know, quoting Torah)
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.”
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek,
for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
1 Corinthians 15:
12 Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead,
how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen.
14 And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is vain and your faith is also vanity.
15 Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God,
because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ,
whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise.
16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!

The Resurrection was the issue being addressed in the Parable.

AND IF when the rich died , his body was taken to a GRAVE .

Hs spirit went to God that GAVE IT , as written in ECCL 12: 7 .

And his SOUL is in HELL and all those under the OLD COVENANT WENT !!


Since are ALL SAVED BY GRACE is what I belkeve .

# 1 The BODY goes to a GRACE .

# 2 So where does those SAVED , SOUL and SPIRIT GO ??


dan p

 

[DamianWarS]

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

One thing the parable shows us is two characters on opposite ends. one is honoured by outward standards, the other not even counted. In the end, it is Lazarus that is embraced by Abraham and the rich man tossed aside, and not even given a name to remember him by. The embrace shows us that Lazarus is implicitly called a son of Abraham, where the rich man's heritage is withdrawn.

Christ uses the term "Hades" (or at least the author of the gospel uses it in a Greek base text) Hades is Greek mythology for the place of the dead (also a Greek god) where all must pass through and it's important to understand Hades, the Greek understanding of the place, is based on myth not truth. This use of "Hades" is not the Greek position but there is a nuance taken from it still.

In this parable, it shows Lazarus in a place of comfort, while the rich man a place of despair; both may be called "Hades" in a general sense, but this parable isn't about affirming mythologies, it instead uses them to contrast Lazarus and the Rich man. This is not a text about the afterlife or its descriptions, it is a warning for those still living.

Christ also uses the account to foreshadow his own death and resurrection in v31. A takeaway from this should not be extracting exact details of the afterlife; what we take away from the afterlife should be broad strokes but not fine detail, since there are other accounts that contradict these details. It's enough to say there is a separation in death between the redeemed and unredeemed a concept repeated throughout scripture, the former of which is desired and the latter undesired. It is faith through Christ that rewards us with the former. There certainly is an implicit challenge in the text, especially for those in positions of wealth and power to help those in need. This is consistent with Christ's law of loving your neighbour as yourself, where neighbour is revealed to mean even those you historically should avoid.

 

[Jeff Saunders]

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

I do not know if this is true or not but I was listening to a Jewish scholar and he said what Jesus did was to use a parable that the Pharisees had, that there was a rich man who dies, and only the rich were blessed by God becauses riches come to the Godly, and he was carried away to Abrahams bosom , there was also a poor beggar who died and he was in sheol and was in misery wanting the rich man to help him.
Jesus flipped the script to show the Pharisees their error,and call them out.
Like I said I don't know if its true but if so, maybe some of the ideas that have been taken from it might be not what was intended.

 

[Minister Monardo]

I do not know if this is true or not but I was listening to a Jewish scholar and he said what Jesus did was to use a parable that the Pharisees had, that there was a rich man who dies, and only the rich were blessed by God becauses riches come to the Godly, and he was carried away to Abrahams bosom , there was also a poor beggar who died and he was in sheol and was in misery wanting the rich man to help him.
Jesus flipped the script to show the Pharisees their error,and call them out.
Like I said I don't know if its true but if so, maybe some of the ideas that have been taken from it might be not what was intended.

We may not be sure of the details, but Jesus, when teaching in the ears of "the teachers" constantly corrected their hypocrisies and made up doctrines. As I stated, I have zero doubt about this, for it is what I received from the Lord. He was definitely correcting this notion that "the righteous" as they defined it, went to Paradise. You know the rest.
As I also stated, how could a Christian knowing the doctrines of FAITH that actually establishes our righteousness, would buy into it. Truth be told, I had not given it that much thought, until I saw how often people on forums try to use this Parable for doctrine about Hades and the afterlife.
The Logos (or intent) is clearly stated in the conclusion of the narrative, and in the OP.
The Resurrection was a divisive issue!
The Lord, if you consider this carefully, literally sets the table for Paul
to blow his interrogation out of the water.

Acts Twenty-Three:
6 But when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Men and brethren, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee; concerning the hope and resurrection of the dead I am being judged!”
7 And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees; and the assembly was divided.
8 For Sadducees say that there is no resurrection—and no angel or spirit; but the Pharisees confess both. 9 Then there arose a loud outcry. And the scribes of the Pharisees’ party arose and protested, saying, “We find no evil in this man; but if a spirit or an angel has spoken to him, let us not fight against God.”

Oh yeah! That's how you roll with the Truth!

 

[Jeff Saunders]

We may not be sure of the details, but Jesus, when teaching in the ears of "the teachers" constantly corrected their hypocrisies and made up doctrines. As I stated, I have zero doubt about this, for it is what I received from the Lord. He was definitely correcting this notion that "the righteous" as they defined it, went to Paradise. You know the rest.
As I also stated, how could a Christian knowing the doctrines of FAITH that actually establishes our righteousness, would buy into it. Truth be told, I had not given it that much thought, until I saw how often people on forums try to use this Parable for doctrine about Hades and the afterlife.
The Logos (or intent) is clearly stated in the conclusion of the narrative, and in the OP.
The Resurrection was a divisive issue!
The Lord, if you consider this carefully, literally sets the table for Paul
to blow his interrogation out of the water.

Acts Twenty-Three:
6 But when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Men and brethren, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee; concerning the hope and resurrection of the dead I am being judged!”
7 And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees; and the assembly was divided.
8 For Sadducees say that there is no resurrection—and no angel or spirit; but the Pharisees confess both. 9 Then there arose a loud outcry. And the scribes of the Pharisees’ party arose and protested, saying, “We find no evil in this man; but if a spirit or an angel has spoken to him, let us not fight against God.”

Oh yeah! That's how you roll with the Truth!

I think the reason that so much of the Church believe that the parale is about heaven and hell is because if you believe in ECT you need every possible thing to hold up what your faith is built upon, true or not.

 

[Minister Monardo]

I think the reason that so much of the Church believe that the parale is about heaven and hell is because if you believe in ECT you need every possible thing to hold up what your faith is built upon, true or not.

The only doctrine being taught in that Parable is the Resurrection!

 

[Dan Perez]

The only doctrine being taught in that Parable is the Resurrection!

The only doctrine being taught in that Parable is the Resurrection!

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

The WHOLE CONTEXT and LUKE just show where [eople under the LAW ended when they died and has nothing to do

with RESURRECTION . and says IF // EAN , is a CONJUNCATION

ONE // TIS , is a INDEFINITE PRONOUN , in the NOMINATIVE CASE , in the SINGULAR , which means O NE .

FROM // APO , is a PROPOSITION

THE DEAD // NEKOS , is in the GENITIVE CASE , in the PLURAL , meaning more that ONE RAISED FROM THE DEAD

THEY WII REPENT // MEATANOEO , is in the Greek , FUTURE TENSE , in the ACTIVE VOICE in the PLURAL

MEANS that Israel will REPENT , Eze 36: 24-38

dan p

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

The Lord taught three ways

1. He explained doctrine privately to the disciples as they were ordained to receive.

2. He taught in parables to the masses, for they were not so ordained.

3. He spoke shrewdly to those who were devious, and opposed Him.

Who was He addressing here?

Luke Sixteen:
14 Now the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, also heard all these things, and they derided Him.
15 And He said to them, You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God.

While dealing shrewdly with the devious, the Lord consistently upended the "traditions of men". Here the Lord's intent is two-fold. One, to overturn the Tradition that "the righteous" (by their definition of blameless in the Law) go to be comforted at "Abraham's bosom", while the wicked are not dead, but in torment. Okay...why any Christian steeped in apostolic doctrine would buy that is hard to comprehend.

Here is the Main Point:
31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’

You may recall, the Resurrection was somewhat divisive among the doctrines of "the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

The Lord was not teaching us doctrine. He was dealing shrewdly with error.

Psalm Eighteen:

25 With the merciful You will show Yourself merciful;
With a blameless man You will show Yourself blameless;
26 With the pure You will show Yourself pure;
And with the devious You will show Yourself shrewd.

The account is a parable among several in that particular stretch.

In order to understand all parables we only need to understand one parable. Mark 4:13

Jesus identifies the parties in the parable immediately. God, people, Satan.

These parties are present in every parable.

Who is Satan in the parable?

Which party would God engage "shrewdly," as you see?

 

[Dan Perez]

The account is a parable among several in that particular stretch.

In order to understand all parables we only need to understand one parable. Mark 4:13

Jesus identifies the parties in the parable immediately. God, people, Satan.

These parties are present in every parable.

Who is Satan in the parable?

Which party would God engage "shrewdly," as you see?

The account is a parable among several in that particular stretch.

In order to understand all parables we only need to understand one parable. Mark 4:13

Jesus identifies the parties in the parable immediately. God, people, Satan.

These parties are present in every parable.

Who is Satan in the parable?

Which party would God engage "shrewdly," as you see?

 

[Dan Perez]

And I have three books on FIGURES of SPEECH and ELLIPSIS and METONYM and ALLEGORY and one called

OXYMORON and here are two # 1 , 2 COR 12:10 and # 2 1 TIM 5:6 .

Do you know a PARABLE really MEANS ??

dan p