The Lord's Day is Sunday.

eleos1954 said:

Anglicanism, one of the major branches of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation and a form of Christianity that includes features of both Protestantism and Roman Catholicism. ... Although the Anglican Communion has a creed—the Thirty-nine Articles—it has been disposed to allow widely divergent interpretations.

Get to have your cake and eat it too ;o)

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You found a paragraph in some book or website and now you're an authority on Anglicanism?

My skepticism aside, pose a question and I'll try to answer it for you.

Albion said:

You found a paragraph in some book or website and now you're an authority on Anglicanism?

My skepticism aside, pose a question and I'll try to answer it for you.

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well .... contact wikipedia about it if you think they are in error ...

Anglicanism - Wikipedia

My skepticism aside, pose a question and I'll try to answer it for you.

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ok ... tell me where wikipedia has it wrong

eleos1954 said:

Anglicanism, one of the major branches of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation and a form of Christianity that includes features of both Protestantism and Roman Catholicism. ...

"The Sabbath was Saturday, not Sunday. The Church altered the observance of the Sabbath to the observance of Sunday. Protestants must be rather puzzled by the keeping of Sunday when God distinctly said, 'Keep holy the Sabbath Day.' The word Sunday does not come anywhere in the Bible, so, without knowing it they are obeying the authority of the Catholic Church." Canon Cafferata, The Catechism Explained, p. 89.

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ok I found this

"And where are we told in the Scriptures that we are to keep the first day at all? We are commanded to keep the seventh; but we are nowhere commanded to keep the first day... The reason why we keep the first day of the week holy instead of the seventh is for the same reason that we observe many other things, not because the
Bible
, but because the Church, has enjoined it." Isaac Williams, Plain Sermons on the Catechism, pages 334, 336.

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"There is no word, no hint, in the New Testament about abstaining from work on Sunday. . . . Into the rest of Sunday no divine law enters…, The observance of Ash Wednesday or Lent stands exactly on the same footing as the observance of Sunday." -CANON EYTON, 'The Ten Commandments," pages 52, 63, 65.

"Is there any command in the New Testament to change the day of weekly rest from Saturday to Sunday? None."-"Manual of Christian Doctrine," page 127.

eleos1954 said:

ok ... tell me where wikipedia has it wrong

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Better yet, tell me what you are talking about. I know that Wikipedia probably has an entry for Anglicanism. I also know that Henry Cafferata wrote a book.

so, without knowing it they are obeying the authority of the Catholic Church." Canon Cafferata, The Catechism Explained, p. 89.

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Bible Highlighter said:

To all:

Some have suggested that it is wrong to work on Sunday:

Yes, it is true; Nothing is stated about how we cannot work on Sunday. It is simply the Lord's day because Christians gathered for the Lord's supper (1 Corinthians 11:20, 1 Corinthians 10:21) on the first day of the week (Acts of the Apostles 20:7).

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Exactly. There is nothing here to argue about.

Yet the Sabbatarians want to take us into a dozen other topics about which there might be some disagreement. We should stick to this topic, i.e. why does historic Christianity worship on the first day of the week? And that's long since been answered. It's from the Bible. We accept the Bible as being God's word. Done.

Albion said:

Better yet, tell me what you are talking about. I know that Wikipedia probably has an entry for Anglicanism. I also know that Henry Cafferata wrote a book.

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"Probably has an entry ..." therefore you did not even go look ... it is quite extensive .... so maybe actually go look .... and then tell me where they are in error ...

You say I am mistaken .... I got my info from Wikipedia ... so if they are wrong .... then someone should correct them .... perhaps that should be you ???

eleos1954 said:

"Probably has an entry ..." therefore you did not even go look ... it is quite extensive

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But you want me to go looking for some entry on page 89 of a book I am expected to have (I guess is the idea).

For the last time, pose a question about Anglicanism if that is the intention and I will try to answer it.

Albion said:

Exactly. There is nothing here to argue about.

Yet the Sabbatarians want to take us into a dozen other topics about which there might be some disagreement. We should stick to this topic, i.e. why does historic Christianity worship on the first day of the week? And that's long since been answered. It's from the Bible. We accept the Bible as being God's word. Done.

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Where did Jesus teach to worship on Sunday? Where did Jesus tell the aposltes to keep Sunday rather than the 7th day Sabbath? What day did Jesus keep? Are we not to follow in the steps of Jesus? Yes we are. His steps include keeping the 7th day Sabbath.

The Word of God ... Remember the Sabbath day and KEEP it Holy .... how much more plain can it be?

I am the Lord thy God ..... I change not. - Malachi 3:6

Church traditions are included in the teachings of the Anglican Church .... very similar to Catholic teachings.

Historic Christianity worship on Sunday ..... because it was a carry over (baggage) from their previous (church taught) beliefs. Many of the early protestants came out of the Catholic church .... but they hadn't yet learned (been given full light) of the entirety of His Word.

There was a long period of time the bible was not made available to the common man. Go back and read about the middle ages (dark ages)

As time goes on the Lord gives more light (understanding) to the truth of His Word .... and we now live in a day and age where we are without excuse .... have access to history .... His Word and easy access to it .... access including access of the Greek & Hebrew etc. Everything is accessible and researchable online.

Yet .... people still hang on to ancient church-taught traditions .... that indeed were not (and are not) taught in His Word.

I pray people will utilize and access all that is available to them.

Old secular saying ...

Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.

eleos1954 said:

Where did Jesus teach to worship on Sunday? Where did Jesus tell the aposltes to keep Sunday rather than the 7th day Sabbath? What day did Jesus keep? Are we not to follow in the steps of Jesus? Yes we are. His steps include keeping the 7th day Sabbath.

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I know where you are coming from.

Where the majority of Christians stand is with Acts 20:7.

We do consider the Bible to be the revealed word of God. There is no point in anyone trying to make out that Protestants and other Christians simply fell in line with the Catholic Church on this matter for no real reason. In fact, it's insulting to the early Protestants who sacrificed their careers and sometimes their lives when standing up to the Medieval Papacy for anybody now to even float such a nonsensical theory as that one!

What's more, the Sabbath was never moved, so all the type that's been devoted to that little myth is also a waste of time.

Bible Highlighter said:

To all:

Some have suggested that it is wrong to work on Sunday:
Yes, it is true; Nothing is stated about how we cannot work on Sunday.

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This is a good point -- if you disconnect Sunday from the Ten Commandments -- specifically the Sabbath commandment - then you have no restrictions or expectations set at all. Have it as a memorial day like Easter and celebrate it as you wish.

Bible Highlighter said:

Hitting the disagree button does not really prove anything.

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There is absolutely NO evidence for a Wednesday crucifixion, other than your "math", which is no proof...

Albion said:

I know where you're coming from. Where the majority of Christians stand is with Acts 20:7 which we do consider to be the revealed word of God.

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Agreed - most Christians accept Acts 20 ... including Acts 20:7 where we find a one-off single incident with people gathered because Paul was going to travel the next day.

Interesting that this WOULD have been an ideal text for "hey - guess what we forgot to tell you? We keep every week-day-1 as the Lord's day". If ever there was a place to insert that idea -- this would have been it.

But instead even in Acts 20 - it is still "week-day 1" and still even here - no mention at all of having week-day-1 called "The Lord's Day" nor even "we meet for worship every week-day-1" nor even "we have this farewell meeting every week".

BobRyan said:

No text in the Bible (not even the one you are not giving in the statement above) says that Christians "met every Sunday for worship because Jesus was resurrected on Sunday". (Nor even that Christians "met every Sunday for worship" for any reason whatsoever)

But I have to agree with you that it would have been nice to have such a text because then that could be a "sola scriptura" vetted argument.

Is it any wonder then that the "Sola scriptura" argument gets "hammered" right here by our Catholic friends - on this very point raised..?
see #161

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It is really an almost 2000 yr old church tradition and also I believe it is in the Didache.

eleos1954 said:

"The Sabbath was Saturday, not Sunday. The Church altered the observance of the Sabbath to the observance of Sunday. Protestants must be rather puzzled by the keeping of Sunday when God distinctly said, 'Keep holy the Sabbath Day.' The word Sunday does not come anywhere in the Bible, so, without knowing it they are obeying the authority of the Catholic Church." Canon Cafferata, The Catechism Explained, p. 89.

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Not in the East! The Sabbath day is still the 7th day. The Coptic Orthodox also.

parousia70 said:

Got it... So I am correct. You do not Follow, Observe, or Practice The Law of Moses.

Thank you for the clarification and admission.

Again, I challenge anyone who claims the OT law MUST be Followed today, to name even one person on the planet today that observes the Law of Moses. It's impossible. There isn't one. That's because there is no Law System extant anywhere on the planet to accommodate or demand observance. It went up in smoke at AD 70.

Nearly 1/2 of the Law of Moses consists in Temple practices/rituals/Levitical duties. The Law of Moses does not consist in reading a book. It consists in strict OBSERVANCE. There is no way to observe the Law of Moses and hasn't been since AD 70.

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That is a lie. Parts of the law that could be kept after the 1st Temple was destroyed were observed until the 2nd Temple was built...

Albion said:

Jesus rose on the first day, and that is why a later verse in the Bible says that the early Christians met for worship on Sunday. However, he did not ascend to the Father on the same day as he rose from the grave.

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No text in the Bible (not even the one you are not giving in the statement above) says that Christians "met every Sunday for worship because Jesus was resurrected on Sunday". (Nor even that Christians "met every Sunday for worship" for any reason whatsoever)

But I have to agree with you that it would have been nice to have such a text because then that could be a "sola scriptura" vetted argument.

Is it any wonder then that the "Sola scriptura" argument gets "hammered" right here by our Catholic friends - on this very point raised..?
see #161

Yeshua HaDerekh said:

It is really an almost 2000 yr old church tradition and also I believe it is in the Didache.

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Certainly it is an old tradition - and yet nothing in the NT supports it - nor does the Didache

"The Didache (/ˈdɪdəkiː/; Greek: Διδαχή, translit. Didakhé, lit. "Teaching"),[1] also known as The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles, is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise, dated by most modern scholars to the first century.[2] The first line of this treatise is "The teaching of the Lord to the Gentiles (or Nations) by the twelve apostles".[a] The text, parts of which constitute the oldest extant written catechism, has three main sections dealing with Christian ethics, rituals such as baptism and Eucharist, and Church organization"

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The Didache is mentioned by Eusebius (c. 324) as the Teachings of the Apostles following the books recognized as canonical:[21]

"Let there be placed among the spurious works the Acts of Paul, the so-called Shepherd and the Apocalypse of Peter, and besides these the Epistle of Barnabas, and what are called the Teachings of the Apostles, (Didache) and also the Apocalypse of John, if this be thought proper; for as I wrote before, some reject it, and others place it in the canon."

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"Many scholars have dated the text to the late 2nd century CE, a view still held today, other scholars have the Didache might go back to the first century. The document is a composite work, and the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls with its Manual of Discipline provided evidence of development over a considerable period of time, beginning as a Jewish catechetical work which was then developed into a church manual. Additionally, apart from two minuscule fragments, the Greek text of the Didache has only survived in a single manuscript, the Codex Hierosolymitanus. Dating the document is thus made difficult both by the lack of hard evidence and its composite character. The Didache may have been compiled in its present form as late as 150,"

Some feel more comfortable with “The Didache a Christian manual compiled before 300AD.”

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Some have imagined that the Didache says that the Lord’s Day is Sunday, or week-day-1… – but in fact – it does not.

The Greek expression in verse 14.1 in the Didache, is:
Κατὰ κυριακὴν δε κυριου [5].

The Greek term κυριακὴν is often transliterated as kuriaki/kyriake.

the Greek term for "day" (ἡμέρᾳ) is missing in verse 14.1 [9] and is not required by the context.

... the Greek kyriake, meaning “belonging to the Lord (kyrios),” from which the English word “church” is derived. [6]

Basically kuriaki means the Lord's way.

verse 14.1 in the Didache, is translated properly below (with two options):

According to the Lord's way, even the Lord's.
or
According to the Lordly {way}, even the Lord's.


The Translation of the Phrase “the Lord’s Day” (reformed Baptist)

Revelation 1:10, however, reads τῇ κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ (tē kyriakē hēmera [“the Lord’s day”]). The word κυριακῇ (kyriakē), translated “Lord’s,” is a dative feminine singular adjective, agreeing in case and gender with the noun it modifies (i.e., ἡμέρᾳ [hēmera; “day”]). It comes from κυριακός (kyriakos), an adjective meaning “belonging to the Lord.”[1] “Lord’s” is an adjective attributing a quality to the noun it modifies (i.e., “day”). The Lord’s Day, therefore, is a day belonging to Jesus Christ as Lord. The word κυριακῇ (kyriakē [“Lord’s]) is used twice in the New Testament—here in Revelation 1:10 and in 1 Corinthians 11:20.


day g2250 ἡμέρᾳ ἡμέρα hēmera