The Law: what commands apply to us now

[CSMR]

How do we distinguish, in the Old Testament, what commands are binding now and what are not.
I can normally look at a command in the OT and say the meaning is:
1. we must do it literally
2. we must obey the spirit of it, but the literal message applies only to that society in those times
or 3. to convey some truth to the Jewish people which is fully conveyed to us in Christ

However, is there a sure way of telling? I have recently realized that things may not be so clear as I thought.

Grateful for any insights into this.

For a start, here are two views:

Article VII of the 39 articles of the Anglican Church:
Although the law given from God by Moses, as touching ceremonies and rites, do not bind Christian men, nor the civil precepts thereof ought of necessity to be received in any commonwealth; yet, notwithstanding, no Christian man whatsoever is free from the obedience of the commandments which are called moral.

Luther talked about spiritual and temporal laws, the spiritual laws binding us now.

Thanks

Charles

Edit: I forgot to look up previous threads. There was one yesterday "When do we observe Moses' law?" The replies didn't give a decisive answer though: "love" was given (but we love God by obeying his commandments, and the question is what are they?) and then the thread moved to other subjects.

 

[Crazy Liz]

I think Acts and Galatians give the answer (or an approach to deciding) for Gentile believers. I highly recommend you read each of these NT books in one sitting, prayerfully asking the Holy Spirit to help you find the answer to this question. When you've had an opportunity to do that, post your thoughts here.

IMHO, these NT books approach the question from the perspective of which of the OT Laws should be imposed on Gentile believers, rather than on the question of which OT Laws are binding now. IOW, you should consider the possibilty that today's Jewish believers should continue to follow the OT Laws to a greater extent than today's Gentile believers.

 

[Carico]

The law has to be seen through Christ's words and the Holy Spirit. Paul sheds light on the law after Christ's death. He talks about it in Romans. Jesus died because we cannot obey the law. As jesus said, the spirit is not in "the rules and regulations of men." It is in the heart. "Love thy God with all your heart soul and mind." The second commanment is "Love thy neighbor as thyself." Jesus said these are the greatest commandments. It does not good to "obey" the laws if we don't have love.

 

[colossi3]

The law has to be seen through Christ's words and the Holy Spirit. Paul sheds light on the law after Christ's death. He talks about it in Romans. Jesus died because we cannot obey the law. As jesus said, the spirit is not in "the rules and regulations of men." It is in the heart. "Love thy God with all your heart soul and mind." The second commanment is "Love thy neighbor as thyself." Jesus said these are the greatest commandments. It does not good to "obey" the laws if we don't have love.

colossi3: Truth has such a sweet sound! Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; blessed is the man to whom the Lord does not impute sin. Ro 4

 

[CSMR]

I think Acts and Galatians give the answer (or an approach to deciding) for Gentile believers. I highly recommend you read each of these NT books in one sitting, prayerfully asking the Holy Spirit to help you find the answer to this question.

Thanks! I'll do that.

 

[CSMR]

The law has to be seen through Christ's words and the Holy Spirit. Paul sheds light on the law after Christ's death. He talks about it in Romans. Jesus died because we cannot obey the law. As jesus said, the spirit is not in "the rules and regulations of men." It is in the heart. "Love thy God with all your heart soul and mind." The second commanment is "Love thy neighbor as thyself." Jesus said these are the greatest commandments. It does not good to "obey" the laws if we don't have love.

I agree. We need to obey the laws not just externally, but with our hearts, with love, love of God. (And as you say, we fail, and Christ died for us.)
1 John 5:3 says: This is love of God, that we keep His commandments.
To me to understand what love of God is, I must find what His commandments are. To put it another way, it's not clear to me what love of God and love of others are, until I know God's commandments. You seem to go the other way, starting from a love of God and love of man and letting the particular commandments follow from that?

 

[Carico]

The reason I go the other way is that I find it hard to keep all of His commandments. Let's take coveting, for example. How many of us NEVER covet our neighbor's car or house or intellect or spiritual maturity or looks, talent, etc. How many of us NEVER put money or career or reputation before God? Otherwise we'd all sell everything we have and give to the poor. How many of us NEVER lie? How many of us honor our father and mother? If we could keep these commandments then we wouldn't need forgiveness. But each time we confess that we don't keep His commandments then we receive His love, mercy, and forgiveness which replaces our desire to sin. That is how we cultivate the fruits of the spirit.

 

[Dad Ernie]

How do we distinguish, in the Old Testament, what commands are binding now and what are not.
I can normally look at a command in the OT and say the meaning is:
1. we must do it literally
2. we must obey the spirit of it, but the literal message applies only to that society in those times
or 3. to convey some truth to the Jewish people which is fully conveyed to us in Christ

However, is there a sure way of telling? I have recently realized that things may not be so clear as I thought.

Grateful for any insights into this.

When you looked at what Jesus preached, it was much more stringent than OT laws. i.e. walk the extra mile; forgive 7x7; lust in your heart, etc.

But under the New Covenant, I believe the one verse which most clearly delineates our obedience is:

Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is ****** if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Of course, as it has already been said, that this is done in love for our God. But what may be sin to one person, may not be sin to another. I'll give a couple examples.

I used to drink quite heavily, then the Lord took it completely out of my life. I have lost all desire for it. However, I do not believe that drinking "in moderation" is a sin namely because of Paul's instructions to Timothy: Take a little wine for your stomach; and also the fact that Jesus first miracle was to turn water into wine at a wedding ceremony. I do not go along with those who claim it was just "grape juice". To me drinking would be a sin.

I also like to play cards for amusement, even for some modest gambling between friends. However, I had a friend who was so enraptured with card playing that it was consuming his time. The Lord said: "No more!" and he quit. He too sees nothing wrong with card playing - for others, but to him it is sin.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[Carico]

Again, we CANNOT obey these laws and He knows it. He preached those words to show us how much sin we actually have in us. He was showing even the righteous who claim to be above reproach, how much sin they still have in them and why they need Him. He is the ONLY way to God, not through obeying rules and regulations. Only He can save us from our sins through His blood.

 

[themuzicman]

Romans 8:1-4 make it quite clear that Christ fulfilled the requierments of the law in us, and that we are not required to obey any of the law.

Paul also quite clearly says that in response to our freedom from the law, we should offer ourselves a living sacrifice to God, Holy and acceptable to Him, and be transformed by the renewing of our minds.

This means that we go beyond mere law-obeying people, and become real servants of God.

Michael

 

[Bro_Brown11233]

The death and resurrection of Christ initiated major alterations in the way God was to both affect and effect man's salvation.

No longer would Moses and the Law, which God gave through him, be a high priority item.

No longer would the Levitical Priesthood be the medium through which priest would come.


No longer would the shed blood of animals be essential to, or associated with the expiation (making mends) of man's sin.



No longer would the fleshly descendants of Abraham through Isaac be considered the "chosen" of God.



No longer would Jerusalem be the primary place where acceptable worship was to be offered.



No longer would God dwell among His people in the darkness of a material structure, called the temple.



No longer would sinful men represent sinful men before God, but sinful men would be represented by the sinless Christ. These very elementary yet basic truths, along with countless others, which could be mentioned should of necessity demand it, indicated very clearly that the fundamental facts of the Gospel, the death, the burial and resurrection of Christ, radically changed heaven and earth, in terms of man's eternal destiny. The studious and honest Bible reader cannot escape the very precise truth that the death of the Christ brought about a change regarding the Law. We read, "For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law" (Hebrews 7:12)



Again we read, "And for this cause he is the mediator of the New Testament, that by means of death..." (Hebrews 9:15)



The New Testament explicitly states, "...we are no longer under the school master" (Galatians 3:25)



And again we read, "...for ye are not under the law" (Romans 6:14)



Furthermore the Bible teaches that saints, Christians, are "dead to the law" (Romans 7:4). Since under the New Covenant, believers in Christ, Christians, are:



"Dead to the law" (Romans 7:4)



"No long under the schoolmaster" (Galatians 3:25)



"Not under the law" (Romans 6:14)



The rationale from the superiority of information relating to the revocation, abolishment and doing away of the law, was to make clear to the reader of the New Testament, that Christ "was the end of the law" (Romans 10:14), and "took it out of the way" (Colossians 2:14). Jesus nailed that Old Law to the cross brothers and sisters. The law, in this age, the Gospel Age, the Christian Age, is GONE, ABOLISHED. The word, "abolished" is a God ordained word, that is, God declared the law "abolished."



We read, "And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not steadfastly look to the end of that which is abolished." (1 Corinthians 3:13).



For the law has been changed. Just so, God changed the law, we are now under "the Law of Christ" (Galatians 6:2), and no longer under the Law of Moses, and we are expected to be governed wholly by "the Law of Christ". This "Law of Christ", the new covenant, is "better" (Hebrews 7:19, 8:6), and will last until "the end of the world" (Matthew 28:20). No person can justifiably claim to be subject to, and under the authority of the Old Testament Law today, for no person now lives who also lived before the New Testament became of force. The Bible teaches that the New Testament Law became of force, when Christ died on the cross.



We read, "For where a testament is, there also of necessity is the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth." (Hebrews 9:16, 17) And the Bible is right and somebody is wrong.



The testament or will of Christ, is the second (Hebrews 10:9) or New Covenant (Hebrews 8:13). It is the will, by which we are sanctified.



We read, "By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10).



What every individual living today must keep clearly focused in his mind or her mind is the indisputable and inescapable fact that it is by the "word that I have spoken" (John 12:48), the words of Jesus, the Christ, that all living persons today shall be saved and judged. It is serious, sensible, and spiritually smart to OBEY THAT WORD, HIS WORD, THE WORD, THE TEACHINGS OF CHRIST, IN THE NOW, BEFORE BEING JUDGED BY THAT WORD LATER.



But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you wholeheartedly obeyed the form of teaching to which you were entrusted. (Romans 6:17).

Bro. Brown

 

[puriteen18]

I'll probably be repeating some stuff already said here, but for the sake of clarity in my post I have to.



Jesus sums up the law thus



Love God



Love your fellow man.

_____________________



These are the topics of the two tablets of the Law (i.e. the Ten Commandments)



The First 4 fall under Love God



1 Have no other gods

2 Make not a graven image

3 Take not the LORD's name in vain

4 Remember the Sabbath (now the LORD's Day)



The latter 6 fall under Love your Fellow Man



5 Honor your parents

6 Do not take another's life

7 Do not commit adultery

8 Do not steal

9 Do not bear false witness

10 Do not covet



_____________



These are all binding. A lot of the levitical law is nothing more than commentary on these. So some of the particulars in Leviticus are also binding.

_____________________________



Also the fact that our bodies are the temples of the Holy Spirit tells us that we are to take care of it and treat it as a temple.



I Corinthians 6



19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.


Some may take this to different degrees. Such as, I do not believe that a tattoo is appropriate for the temple of God.



Leviticus 19
28 And cuttings for a dead person shall ye not make in your flesh, nor put any tattoo writing upon you: I am Jehovah.



Another may think differently and only say that a tattoo is a sin when you do it for the dead, but I think from my understanding of the wording that it is not to be done. This is where it may get hard, but pray, study, and do your best to find His will.



Also I think we ought to eat properly (I fail there a lot), exercise not to bulk up (that might be vanity) but to be healthy. Do not use drugs. Keep from harming your body.

(just my opinions again)

____________________________________



Some also think that there may be some dietary laws for us today

Acts 15
29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.



But you must also read 1 Corinthians 8, and get what Paul is saying.

_______________________________
Also, you should not mistreat animals

1 Corinthians 9

9 For it is written in the law of Moses, thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?
_______________________________________




That's my two cents (and a dash extra). Hope it helps.

 

[puriteen18]

A lot of what you believe is binding has to do with whether you believe in Covenant Theology or Dispensationalism.

I agree with the first.

 

[puriteen18]

Romans 8:1-4 make it quite clear that Christ fulfilled the requierments of the law in us, and that we are not required to obey any of the law.

Oh, missed this one.

No obey the Law?!?!?

Read Romans 6

Please forgive me if I misunderstand your post.

 

[Achichem]

I will make this simple:

"Do God's Holy will", that means do all the laws you can, as you understand(not to be confused with "feel like"), to the best of your abilitys, and "be not afride" to fall short to perfection,or to slip up, for christ blood perfects those who love him.

To love G-d is to keep what is G-ds,
To love your fellow, is to do what you know is good!

 

[1John5:3]

Sin is LAWLESSNESS. 1 Jn 3:4

 

[Carico]

The law can only be obeyed throguh the spirit, not by an act of will. As God changes the desires of our hearts from sin to the fruits of the spirit, it becomes uncomfortable to covet, lie, steal, lust and worship false idols. We begin to want more of God's word and the fruits of the spirit instead of the desires of the flesh. We do not obey the "rules and regulations of men". (Christ's words). We instead, respond out of the spirit which is love, patience, self-control, hope, and joy. It is not a decision, it is a response. We keep the Sabbath holy not because we are told to but because we WANT to. Greed becomes less important. Lust becomes less important, etc. Worldly desires become more uncomfortable compared to the fruits of the spirit. That is how the spirit grows in us until most of our responses come from the spirit, not the desires of the flesh.

 

[CSMR]

Thanks for the replies; lots of useful things said.

DaTzar: If our ability falls short of following God's will (as it does) or we don't follow it up to our ability then we haven't followed it. "Be perfect..."

Carico: that's interesting - from God's saving love to us we naturally understand what our love must be towards God. (I don't mean to suggest the two loves are similar.)

Even so, I think that we should still proclaim the old testament law, applying it to the new situation (how we should do this was the point in question). Even proclaim it as something which judges us. Because if we're not judged by the law, like the tax-collector in Luke 18:9, we cannot redeemed by Christ from this judgement. I'm not sure we should say we increase in our own virtue when saved, since then aren't we like the Pharisee in this parable, saying, "Lord, I thank you that by your grace you have made me obedient to you"? (All I'm saying is, I'm not sure )
Puriteen, thanks for your post. To add to one thing more, proclaiming the gospel (Jesus' command to make disciples of all nations) seems to be a good application of the OT command to love God and love our neighbour to the new situation.

I've gone on, when I should be reading Acts and Galatians

Charles

 

[Carico]

The truth of the law will never go away. Christ said t that the last letter of the law will never go away. However, the OT shows us how we fall short of the law that, in fact, trying to obey it causes us to sin more (much like someone telling you not to think of an elephant). The NT is the same law which has been FULFILLED. It is not we who are obeying the law, but Christ for us. All we have to do not is come to Him to obey the law instead of trying to do it ourselves.

 

[Achichem]

DaTzar: If our ability falls short of following God's will (as it does) or we don't follow it up to our ability then we haven't followed it. "Be perfect..."

That all depends on how you define perfect,
in ithimayic there are four words meaning perfect:
State of refined perfect(Su'dorr'neecomKalee"
State of created perfect(Su'dorr'VemCeeoolee)
The process of perfection(Me'delloolee)
State of Relitive perfect(Su'dorr'sorjilee)

We are told we have since the begining fo time, because of the blood of our passover lamb, blessed be Him.We are made clean VIA "Me'delloolee", and that makes us "Su'dorr'sorjilee", intill "Me'delloolee" brings us to "Su'dorr'neecomKalee".

Of course, if we know what is G-d's will(under charis, not law) and live otherwise(sin), and repent not, but instead,live against the "Chairis(grace) of G-d", or in medphoric terms spit in the face of the man helping us,and run from him.We are not "Su'dorr'sorjilee" for then spirit has no power in us,and we are as the spiritally blind and spirital deaf, waiting for the great:
"Now'sheeka-vesso-roomdee" or fufillment of the "day of atonement for the greater harvest"(is not what makes atonement, it has a diffrent purpose) so the Me'delloolee can take it's effect in all(relative).

So I am afride I do not know what you mean,
he who does not do the law of faith, which is the obedence of the law by faith, under charis, shall not hear,nor see in these days.

To follow Christ is to follow the word of G-d, by chairs, which I have said to do, why now do you say we are not "perfect" beofre the seat of the lord, surly we need still "Now'sheeka-vesso-roomdee", but he tells us still that intill that time we(the follows of the law by faith, understanding Charis, which i have just explained) are "perfect" in His sights.


Shalom(peace),
So' deerootree kemma halway,
(through the love of the father in it's purity),
-Datsar