The Journey Comes Full Circle...

[Katallina]

Hi all! I have several questions so I figured that I would bring them here. Before we get to those, though, perhaps I should share a bit of background about myself to add some context?

I grew up in a family that toed the line between Christian and Agnostic. I say this because while my grandparents took all the grandkids to church, Vacation Bible Camp, etc. and my parents would attend if we were in a play, etc. "church stayed at church" in our home. I mention the Agnostic angle because as I have grown older, my parents have admitted to me that they aren't sure what is actually true, either.

Anyway, back to me (nothing against Mom or Dad, but if I tried to cover everyone this would get more lengthy than it will already be.). By the time I was in 8th grade I grew extremely obsessed with Greek Mythology. I've always been a writer and a storyteller, and to me those "characters" had more "character" than what I had learned about in church. (Ah, the mindstance of a 13 year old girl...)

By the time I was 17 I had discovered the Internet and had found Wicca. For someone who has always felt a strong pull toward having some form of active religion, and yet who cannot drive (I'm legally blind and have cerebral palsy) this was extremely appealing. (When added to the mythological context above, which had vastly expanded over the previous 5 years).

I stuck with that until I was about 20 but ultimately lost connection with it. It was empty--there was nothing / no one there. About a year later some friends told me they had found a "great church" and that I totally needed to check it out. The idea of studying religion with my friends, and being able attend and be part of an actual spiritual community, was extremely appealing.

So by the time I was 21 I had become a Mormon. This went on well for roughly a year and a half and I honestly quite enjoyed it... Until my friends made a few wrong turns and the church we were attending (and the people in it) reacted in what I viewed as an extremely non-Christian way. This lead me to question whether the church I was attending was the type of church I should be attending to truly connect with God, or whether human interference was causing some type of block which was making me uncomfortable.

I ultimately stopped going to that church. (Ten years later they're still knocking at my door. I suppose I should give them points for being consistent? There was a time when that level of passion was extremely appealing, but in the aftermath it has become rather bothersome.)

And from there I've been Stuck. I turned my focus away from religious studies aside from some purely intellectual stuff for some of my writing (I like having certain undertones to my fantasy works) and did my best to keep moving forward in life. I found a guy I love immensely and we've been dating for over 7 years. (Long distance, two countries, would've married years ago otherwise.) And I have tried to "fulfill" myself by writing (very excited about Kindle Direct Publishing) and blogging (I focus on Young and New Adult fiction.)

Several days ago I was working on developing a scrapbook project that I had losely themed as 40 Things To Do Before 40. (I originally envisioned it in a SmashBook, which are 40 pages long. Looking at it -now-, I can see something interesting about that right away.) As I went through the list, I had a whole bunch of things on it and had just two more spots I needed to fill. Out of nowhere, the weirdest feeling came over me and I ended up writing down "Re-explore the Bible and determine whether it is possible to have a true relationship with [the Christian] God." (I am clarifying this as I have spent my entire life knowing / believing there is--Must Be--divinity and on a search to figure out who or what that is.)

When I saw what I had written I was a little confused. The rest of my list was stuff like "Publish my first novel", "Go to Disney Word and experience it as an adult", or "Get a pet Siamese cat and name it Zakariah.". Within hours this second to last item on my list had eclipsed all others on it. I'm glad I have the list saved for when I have time to look at it again, but for now it's on hold because -this- is my focus.

So, first thing I do? Go to find my bible. And wouldn't you know it, my Bible Isn't Here. I have books from every other faith I've studied--either personally or academically--but neither of my Bibles (my ESV my grandparents got me or the KJV my friend's great-grandmother gifted me) are anywhere in our home. How does something like that even happen?(!)

Which leads to my questions:

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

I've spent the past few days lurking around here and reading verses people have put up on various threads. When I did this, I would take a look at what version was being quoted to get a feel for how different ones read / how I reacted to them. (As a writer, words are important to me.) I've found that I can enjoy quite a variety of different translations, which is great (I have lots of choice) but also overwhelming (I have lots of choice).

I'm also considering buying two Bibles. I want one that can be held in my hands, that I can mark, study, etc. and that will likely get used publicly. I also want one for my Kindle since I am legally blind and have arthritis in my hands. I cannot hold a large, heavy book for extreme amounts of time.

Do I want these Bibles to hold the same, or different, translations? (Advice welcome!)

There are so many different types of Bibles--regular ones, study ones, devotional ones, parallel ones, Bibles designed to be read in a year, Bibles set up in story order rather than traditional order... The list goes on and on.)

Any thoughts and opinions on which type(s) each of my new Bibles should be? (and while we're at it--how to people -feel- about someone wanting a Bible on Kindle, anyway?)

From there we must move onto what will be done with the Bibles. (They're not being purchased as a pair of bookends.) From what I've read searching on here, my reading of the Bible has been completely -weird-. What do I mean? I've read the entire Old Testament, all four Gospels, and Revelations. Does anyone see what's missing?

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

The pattern I'm seeing is: Matthew, John, Mark, Luke, Go through the New Testament, then work on the Old Testament. If anyone has further ideas, or would like to advise something different, I'm open to suggestions.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

I don't think an audio version can take the place of a written version--I feel that owning an actual Bible is very important and very personal. (I still can't get past the idea that both of mine have vanished.) But I know from an academic standpoint that I am an auditory learner and I wonder if this will help enhance my studies. (Especially in late fall when my arthritis tends to kick in and I can't even lift a Kindle.)

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

I know there are tons of great books that have been written to tackle various topics related to Christianity. I read quite a few of these in my twenties and know I enjoy them. At this stage I need to be careful not to let these texts get in the way of actually getting in touch with my new Bibles (and even more importantly with Jesus). I would assume (please correct me if I'm mistaken) that it is vital to be consciously aware that while these types of books may assist in enhancing understanding, there is a definite distinction between them (words of men and women who claim to love God) and the Bible (the living word of God). Despite this, I would still love to add a few of these to my library. (As with the Bibles, my collection here is gone. I'm slightly more okay with this--I plan to restock these via Kindle and use them with my physical Bible.)

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

I am aware this is -not- a replacement for real life fellowship with other Christians in an actual church. But for the time (again, can't drive and currently don't have anyone interested in going to a Church) this is what is available to me. When is it appropriate for me to get involved in something like this? Or should I hold off on this since I have other things my attention (spiritually) should be focused on? One of the groups I was thinking of joining is planning to study Acts, which seemed a fitting subject matter given what I mentioned above.

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

Not sure if this is the right time for that or not. On one hand, it would be interesting to find out what type of church I should be looking for. On the other hand, (1) I may not be able to get to whatever church I find from this, and (2) even if something sounds like the "right" church, it may or may not be the church I am meant to attend.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

I am pretty sure at this point that the way I was taught -- or at least understood what I thought people were teaching me -- was / is backwards. My understanding of Christianity clearly had Jesus playing second fiddle to God and I'm starting to have doubts that's correct. Could that be why I've been having so much trouble with this? Why it hasn't worked? With this in mind, any ideas or feedback that you can give with regard to any earlier questions that will enhance this would be very appreciated.

Thanks very much for taking the time to read all of this and for giving any answers that you can. Have a nice day!

 

[oi_antz]

Hi all! I have several questions so I figured that I would bring them here. Before we get to those, though, perhaps I should share a bit of background about myself to add some context?

I grew up in a family that toed the line between Christian and Agnostic. I say this because while my grandparents took all the grandkids to church, Vacation Bible Camp, etc. and my parents would attend if we were in a play, etc. "church stayed at church" in our home. I mention the Agnostic angle because as I have grown older, my parents have admitted to me that they aren't sure what is actually true, either.

Anyway, back to me (nothing against Mom or Dad, but if I tried to cover everyone this would get more lengthy than it will already be.). By the time I was in 8th grade I grew extremely obsessed with Greek Mythology. I've always been a writer and a storyteller, and to me those "characters" had more "character" than what I had learned about in church. (Ah, the mindstance of a 13 year old girl...)

By the time I was 17 I had discovered the Internet and had found Wicca. For someone who has always felt a strong pull toward having some form of active religion, and yet who cannot drive (I'm legally blind and have cerebral palsy) this was extremely appealing. (When added to the mythological context above, which had vastly expanded over the previous 5 years).

I stuck with that until I was about 20 but ultimately lost connection with it. It was empty--there was nothing / no one there. About a year later some friends told me they had found a "great church" and that I totally needed to check it out. The idea of studying religion with my friends, and being able attend and be part of an actual spiritual community, was extremely appealing.

So by the time I was 21 I had become a Mormon. This went on well for roughly a year and a half and I honestly quite enjoyed it... Until my friends made a few wrong turns and the church we were attending (and the people in it) reacted in what I viewed as an extremely non-Christian way. This lead me to question whether the church I was attending was the type of church I should be attending to truly connect with God, or whether human interference was causing some type of block which was making me uncomfortable.

I ultimately stopped going to that church. (Ten years later they're still knocking at my door. I suppose I should give them points for being consistent? There was a time when that level of passion was extremely appealing, but in the aftermath it has become rather bothersome.)

And from there I've been Stuck. I turned my focus away from religious studies aside from some purely intellectual stuff for some of my writing (I like having certain undertones to my fantasy works) and did my best to keep moving forward in life. I found a guy I love immensely and we've been dating for over 7 years. (Long distance, two countries, would've married years ago otherwise.) And I have tried to "fulfill" myself by writing (very excited about Kindle Direct Publishing) and blogging (I focus on Young and New Adult fiction.)

Several days ago I was working on developing a scrapbook project that I had losely themed as 40 Things To Do Before 40. (I originally envisioned it in a SmashBook, which are 40 pages long. Looking at it -now-, I can see something interesting about that right away.) As I went through the list, I had a whole bunch of things on it and had just two more spots I needed to fill. Out of nowhere, the weirdest feeling came over me and I ended up writing down "Re-explore the Bible and determine whether it is possible to have a true relationship with [the Christian] God." (I am clarifying this as I have spent my entire life knowing / believing there is--Must Be--divinity and on a search to figure out who or what that is.)

When I saw what I had written I was a little confused. The rest of my list was stuff like "Publish my first novel", "Go to Disney Word and experience it as an adult", or "Get a pet Siamese cat and name it Zakariah.". Within hours this second to last item on my list had eclipsed all others on it. I'm glad I have the list saved for when I have time to look at it again, but for now it's on hold because -this- is my focus.

So, first thing I do? Go to find my bible. And wouldn't you know it, my Bible Isn't Here. I have books from every other faith I've studied--either personally or academically--but neither of my Bibles (my ESV my grandparents got me or the KJV my friend's great-grandmother gifted me) are anywhere in our home. How does something like that even happen?(!)

Which leads to my questions:

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

I've spent the past few days lurking around here and reading verses people have put up on various threads. When I did this, I would take a look at what version was being quoted to get a feel for how different ones read / how I reacted to them. (As a writer, words are important to me.) I've found that I can enjoy quite a variety of different translations, which is great (I have lots of choice) but also overwhelming (I have lots of choice).

I'm also considering buying two Bibles. I want one that can be held in my hands, that I can mark, study, etc. and that will likely get used publicly. I also want one for my Kindle since I am legally blind and have arthritis in my hands. I cannot hold a large, heavy book for extreme amounts of time.

Do I want these Bibles to hold the same, or different, translations? (Advice welcome!)

There are so many different types of Bibles--regular ones, study ones, devotional ones, parallel ones, Bibles designed to be read in a year, Bibles set up in story order rather than traditional order... The list goes on and on.)

Any thoughts and opinions on which type(s) each of my new Bibles should be? (and while we're at it--how to people -feel- about someone wanting a Bible on Kindle, anyway?)

From there we must move onto what will be done with the Bibles. (They're not being purchased as a pair of bookends.) From what I've read searching on here, my reading of the Bible has been completely -weird-. What do I mean? I've read the entire Old Testament, all four Gospels, and Revelations. Does anyone see what's missing?

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

The pattern I'm seeing is: Matthew, John, Mark, Luke, Go through the New Testament, then work on the Old Testament. If anyone has further ideas, or would like to advise something different, I'm open to suggestions.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

I don't think an audio version can take the place of a written version--I feel that owning an actual Bible is very important and very personal. (I still can't get past the idea that both of mine have vanished.) But I know from an academic standpoint that I am an auditory learner and I wonder if this will help enhance my studies. (Especially in late fall when my arthritis tends to kick in and I can't even lift a Kindle.)

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

I know there are tons of great books that have been written to tackle various topics related to Christianity. I read quite a few of these in my twenties and know I enjoy them. At this stage I need to be careful not to let these texts get in the way of actually getting in touch with my new Bibles (and even more importantly with Jesus). I would assume (please correct me if I'm mistaken) that it is vital to be consciously aware that while these types of books may assist in enhancing understanding, there is a definite distinction between them (words of men and women who claim to love God) and the Bible (the living word of God). Despite this, I would still love to add a few of these to my library. (As with the Bibles, my collection here is gone. I'm slightly more okay with this--I plan to restock these via Kindle and use them with my physical Bible.)

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

I am aware this is -not- a replacement for real life fellowship with other Christians in an actual church. But for the time (again, can't drive and currently don't have anyone interested in going to a Church) this is what is available to me. When is it appropriate for me to get involved in something like this? Or should I hold off on this since I have other things my attention (spiritually) should be focused on? One of the groups I was thinking of joining is planning to study Acts, which seemed a fitting subject matter given what I mentioned above.

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

Not sure if this is the right time for that or not. On one hand, it would be interesting to find out what type of church I should be looking for. On the other hand, (1) I may not be able to get to whatever church I find from this, and (2) even if something sounds like the "right" church, it may or may not be the church I am meant to attend.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

I am pretty sure at this point that the way I was taught -- or at least understood what I thought people were teaching me -- was / is backwards. My understanding of Christianity clearly had Jesus playing second fiddle to God and I'm starting to have doubts that's correct. Could that be why I've been having so much trouble with this? Why it hasn't worked? With this in mind, any ideas or feedback that you can give with regard to any earlier questions that will enhance this would be very appreciated.

Thanks very much for taking the time to read all of this and for giving any answers that you can. Have a nice day!

I will respond to all of this tomorrow, as I have only a mobile phone but this requires a mouse. Meanwhile, can you think a bit and then let me know - why do you feel that you don't know God, or that there is a special way to get to know Him? Also, if you imagine knowing Him one day as others do, what value do you think you will find by asking for help on this website? It is not that this is the chatroom where He hangs out. Jesus says "I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears me knocking and opens the door, I will come in and share a meal with them." - What is this describing "knocking on the door"? It is certainly not describing your physical abode. How did the door get shut anyway? What stops you opening the door? Have a great day. Www.biblegateway.com btw it has many translations and there is mobile apps too. Don't know about kindle, I have never owned one.

 

[oi_antz]

I ultimately stopped going to that church. (Ten years later they're still knocking at my door. I suppose I should give them points for being consistent?

Jesus said to the Pharisees: "the healthy do not need a doctor". If you do find your standing in faith, you will find either on of two things: they may try to coach your spiritual growth, or you may find that The Holy Spirit informs them that you are in His care so they can spend effort on other who need their guidance.

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

You need one that does not hinder your growth, and that allows Him to develop a relationship with you. Usually you will find that the translation is the least hinderance in that respect, but it is the personal shame of sin that prevents us from drawing near to Him. As for translations, I suggest get one that reads comfortably. If you need to study, you will find yourself consulting many different translations and at that point it is most efficient and comfortable to use a service as biblegateway.com, which enables you to switch between versions with a click of the mouse, so you can compare a given passage in multiple translations. It is also almost always valuable to consult an interlinear translation when you are studying the subtleties of translation. I have a paperback bible The Living Bible, which is very confortable, light, soft, easy to flick through, and He speaks to me through it. It is a nice bible to carry around and read. I found it at an opportunity shop advertised for 0c. I would suggest the same. Go around some second hand book shops and read them. Just open them, and start reading, and choose the one that spaks to you.

I've spent the past few days lurking around here and reading verses people have put up on various threads. When I did this, I would take a look at what version was being quoted to get a feel for how different ones read / how I reacted to them. (As a writer, words are important to me.) I've found that I can enjoy quite a variety of different translations, which is great (I have lots of choice) but also overwhelming (I have lots of choice).

Life is in His Word, even when different words are used. All scripture is breathed by God; it is the same breath of life that He breathed into man (Genesis 2:7, John 1:4).

There are so many different types of Bibles--regular ones, study ones, devotional ones, parallel ones, Bibles designed to be read in a year, Bibles set up in story order rather than traditional order... The list goes on and on.)

Any thoughts and opinions on which type(s) each of my new Bibles should be? (and while we're at it--how to people -feel- about someone wanting a Bible on Kindle, anyway?)

Have a bible for each purpose. I am finding the column references in the NWT very useful these days, and the precision of it's translation is interesting too. Though, it is a bit controversial to some people, especially in fervently traditional Christian circles. You will not find it on biblegateway.com, and I often find that inconvenient when studying.

From there we must move onto what will be done with the Bibles. (They're not being purchased as a pair of bookends.) From what I've read searching on here, my reading of the Bible has been completely -weird-. What do I mean? I've read the entire Old Testament, all four Gospels, and Revelations. Does anyone see what's missing?

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

Get all the information into you so that you can digest as He leads you each day. Do not waste time on what you have already read, because He will bring it forth from your memory at will.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

I suggest rather, you make time to spend with Him. To use audio bible is not practical when your mind starts wandering (as it does), then you come back and need to rewind to cover what you read past. Whereas with text, it is right there. However, while driving to work for example when you can't use text, it probably would have some benefit.

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

I know there are tons of great books that have been written to tackle various topics related to Christianity. I read quite a few of these in my twenties and know I enjoy them. At this stage I need to be careful not to let these texts get in the way of actually getting in touch with my new Bibles (and even more importantly with Jesus). I would assume (please correct me if I'm mistaken) that it is vital to be consciously aware that while these types of books may assist in enhancing understanding, there is a definite distinction between them (words of men and women who claim to love God) and the Bible (the living word of God). Despite this, I would still love to add a few of these to my library. (As with the Bibles, my collection here is gone. I'm slightly more okay with this--I plan to restock these via Kindle and use them with my physical Bible.)

Do not rely on your own understanding. In everything that you do, especially WRT spiritual truth, acknowledge Him and allow Him to direct your path. I observe, you really need to acknowledge He is not to be achieved, but rather accepted. He is already right there, knocking.

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

Not everyone who calls me "Lord! Lord!" will enter heaven, rather I will tell them "I never knew you". He says "why do you call me 'Lord!', 'Lord!' - yet do not do as I say? Yes, beware of the wolves who wear sheeps clothing. They take His name for vain purposes, to appear holy and right, but inwardly they seek to devour you. However, Jesus also said to St Peter (three times) "If you love me, feed my sheep". So indeed, find His apostles who love Him, and they will feed you, but beware of the ones who say in their heart (despite what their lips might say) "there is no God" - not even one of them does good.

I am aware this is -not- a replacement for real life fellowship with other Christians in an actual church. But for the time (again, can't drive and currently don't have anyone interested in going to a Church) this is what is available to me. When is it appropriate for me to get involved in something like this? Or should I hold off on this since I have other things my attention (spiritually) should be focused on? One of the groups I was thinking of joining is planning to study Acts, which seemed a fitting subject matter given what I mentioned above.

Don't study yet. Read it all, pray and reconcile with Him. Read in Jeremiah: - The Lord knew Him while he was in the womb. Yet, The Word came to him much later, as he says "I am still too young to speak". Read this in Jeremiah chapter 1: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jeremiah 1&version=TLB

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

I suggest you should get your house in order first. Once you have firmly fixed your faith in Him, you can go to all the churches and they will not be able to snatch you from His hand.

Not sure if this is the right time for that or not. On one hand, it would be interesting to find out what type of church I should be looking for. On the other hand, (1) I may not be able to get to whatever church I find from this, and (2) even if something sounds like the "right" church, it may or may not be the church I am meant to attend.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

We know Jesus laid down His human life to His aggressors, and that Jehovah God has allowed The Holy Spirit to speak to all people who will listen. Therefore, do not expect Jesus to sit with you physically at your dining table, but expect The Lord God to be with you at all times. Therefore, if the world is fleeting but the spirit of God is forever, do not look outwardly to physical things. Instead, look inwardly to know Him in your heart, mind and soul. All of creation testifies of Him. Please consider that understanding to obtain the full meaning of it.

I am pretty sure at this point that the way I was taught -- or at least understood what I thought people were teaching me -- was / is backwards. My understanding of Christianity clearly had Jesus playing second fiddle to God and I'm starting to have doubts that's correct. Could that be why I've been having so much trouble with this? Why it hasn't worked? With this in mind, any ideas or feedback that you can give with regard to any earlier questions that will enhance this would be very appreciated.

Go and Jesus are in full agreement. Though Jesus is human, we can relate to Him as human, though no man has seen God. So it is difficult for us to envisage the fullness and real likeness of Jehovah God. But it is possible to know Him, as men hav known him all through history. We therefore take Jesus as our king, knowing He is in perfect union with the will of God, even laying down His natural human desires to become fully obedient to God's will, even to the point of death. Because He is found perfectly obedient, and we are loyal to Him, He is trusted to have access to the tree of life that is in the paradise of God. He says "to everyone who is victorious, I will give fruit from the tree of life thatis in the paradise of God". (Revelation 2:7). Though indeed, Jesus does not ever take glory that is due to the Father, but instead instructs us to pray: "Our Father in heaven, hallowed is your name."

Thanks very much for taking the time to read all of this and for giving any answers that you can. Have a nice day!

Nice to meet you and to see the beginning of your journey. Please remain active on this website and share with us what The Spirit will have you say.

 

[Katallina]

I will respond to all of this tomorrow, as I have only a mobile phone but this requires a mouse. Meanwhile, can you think a bit and then let me know - why do you feel that you don't know God, or that there is a special way to get to know Him? Also, if you imagine knowing Him one day as others do, what value do you think you will find by asking for help on this website? It is not that this is the chatroom where He hangs out. Jesus says "I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears me knocking and opens the door, I will come in and share a meal with them." - What is this describing "knocking on the door"? It is certainly not describing your physical abode. How did the door get shut anyway? What stops you opening the door? Have a great day. Www.biblegateway.com btw it has many translations and there is mobile apps too. Don't know about kindle, I have never owned one.

Q: Why don't you feel that you know God, or that there's a special way to get to know him?

A: To me, these are two separate questions. From what I've been reading, if I had ever truly "known God" I would never have wandered and taken part in all the searching, study, etc. that I did. If I had known God, according to what I hear people saying, my actions would have seemed absurd to me.

As for a "special way" to get to know him? No. I don't buy into that at all. The path seems to be so simple that it's difficult. (As in, it's not like you get the "I found Jesus!" pin when you figure it out the way a little kid might find an egg from the Easter Bunny.) It obviously takes faith and belief, which seem simple--possibly even childish--yet which are anything but in reality. (Again, if this was "easy" I wouldn't feel "stuck".

At the same time, perhaps the problem is that I have made it seem more difficult to myself than what it really is. Maybe I'm just suppose to pray--the spiritual equivalent of picking up the phone and calling an old, dear friend--and then I'm to use all of the things I talked about earlier the way I might go to the beach, shopping, etc. with another person?

The bottom line likely boils down to Pride. (and we all know how bad -that- is.) I was one of those kids who had scripture memorization on lockdown and who got a lotta praise for that. But the problem is that I spent so much focus on memorizing strings of words that I didn't actually bother learning what they were actually saying. Y'know how a kid will pick up phrases from an adult and will have no clue about actual context?

Q: If you imagine knowing him as others do, what value do you think you will find by asking for help on this website?

I come from an academic background when it comes to studying religions. (And therein is likely my first mistake--from what I've been reading that's not how this should be looked at. Religions are man-made; it's a relationship with God that we are after / that he wants with us.) From the outside looking in, it's not surprising to me that I gave you the list I did and turned it into a mix between a bunch of studying and a shopping trip. (Yeah, I like to shop. I can see that came through up there a *lot*.) There's nothing "wrong" with study, but if we focus too much on using our heads we can ignore our heart and that (if I understand correctly) is what we should be listening to.

I tend to be so focused on "How do I do this?", "What do I do now?" and "What do I do next?" that I am likely forgetting that it's not about what I can do--it's about what He has done and what He would have me do. It's about letting go, giving up control, and realizing that this isn't something where I can study for it, get an A, and that's that. It's simple, and yet it seems so overwhelming.

I have this on a few different forums for feedback and the main thing people have told me is that this is all well and good, but that I can study, listen to stuff, etc. until my face turns blue but it will do me no good until I first learn to pray, and have that prayer be sincere. That the words are just letters on paper until I actually get God involved.

Q: What is this describing "knocking on the door"?

I'm going to guess that's how I wound up here? As I stated at the beginning of the thread, this came seemingly out of nowhere and has not let up since. I'm going to guess that now I have to decide whether to open the door or hide upstairs until my dogs stop barking. (At least, that's what it would be like if that were literal. I've seen my family do that before.)

I think that ultimately I'm standing at a crossroads where I'm going to need to decide whether this is "research" or "Real". There's a *lot* in my life that could get bounced around if I open that door, which makes me more stubborn. (Guessing here. A lot of stuff seems like I'm stalling as I try to look at it from another point of view.)

Anyway, thank you very much for taking the time to write back. I hope that I have answered the questions you asked. Have a nice day!

 

[oi_antz]

Q: Why don't you feel that you know God, or that there's a special way to get to know him?

A: To me, these are two separate questions. From what I've been reading, if I had ever truly "known God" I would never have wandered and taken part in all the searching, study, etc. that I did. If I had known God, according to what I hear people saying, my actions would have seemed absurd to me.

As for a "special way" to get to know him? No. I don't buy into that at all. The path seems to be so simple that it's difficult. (As in, it's not like you get the "I found Jesus!" pin when you figure it out the way a little kid might find an egg from the Easter Bunny.) It obviously takes faith and belief, which seem simple--possibly even childish--yet which are anything but in reality. (Again, if this was "easy" I wouldn't feel "stuck".

At the same time, perhaps the problem is that I have made it seem more difficult to myself than what it really is. Maybe I'm just suppose to pray--the spiritual equivalent of picking up the phone and calling an old, dear friend--and then I'm to use all of the things I talked about earlier the way I might go to the beach, shopping, etc. with another person?

The bottom line likely boils down to Pride. (and we all know how bad -that- is.) I was one of those kids who had scripture memorization on lockdown and who got a lotta praise for that. But the problem is that I spent so much focus on memorizing strings of words that I didn't actually bother learning what they were actually saying. Y'know how a kid will pick up phrases from an adult and will have no clue about actual context?

Q: If you imagine knowing him as others do, what value do you think you will find by asking for help on this website?

I come from an academic background when it comes to studying religions. (And therein is likely my first mistake--from what I've been reading that's not how this should be looked at. Religions are man-made; it's a relationship with God that we are after / that he wants with us.) From the outside looking in, it's not surprising to me that I gave you the list I did and turned it into a mix between a bunch of studying and a shopping trip. (Yeah, I like to shop. I can see that came through up there a *lot*.) There's nothing "wrong" with study, but if we focus too much on using our heads we can ignore our heart and that (if I understand correctly) is what we should be listening to.

I tend to be so focused on "How do I do this?", "What do I do now?" and "What do I do next?" that I am likely forgetting that it's not about what I can do--it's about what He has done and what He would have me do. It's about letting go, giving up control, and realizing that this isn't something where I can study for it, get an A, and that's that. It's simple, and yet it seems so overwhelming.

I have this on a few different forums for feedback and the main thing people have told me is that this is all well and good, but that I can study, listen to stuff, etc. until my face turns blue but it will do me no good until I first learn to pray, and have that prayer be sincere. That the words are just letters on paper until I actually get God involved.

Q: What is this describing "knocking on the door"?

I'm going to guess that's how I wound up here? As I stated at the beginning of the thread, this came seemingly out of nowhere and has not let up since. I'm going to guess that now I have to decide whether to open the door or hide upstairs until my dogs stop barking. (At least, that's what it would be like if that were literal. I've seen my family do that before.)

I think that ultimately I'm standing at a crossroads where I'm going to need to decide whether this is "research" or "Real". There's a *lot* in my life that could get bounced around if I open that door, which makes me more stubborn. (Guessing here. A lot of stuff seems like I'm stalling as I try to look at it from another point of view.)

Anyway, thank you very much for taking the time to write back. I hope that I have answered the questions you asked. Have a nice day!

Yes, that has answered my questions fully. I can see from all of this, a very simple, single addition to your understanding would help you to know how to make it real. I mean, you do want it to be real eh? You don't seem to be here because you are trying to make yourself look Christian for your family and friends.

Consider these scriptures:

If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth.
1 John 1:6 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1 John+1:6&version=CEB

Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.
John 3:19-20 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john+3:19-20&version=NLT

When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”
John 8:12 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+8:12&version=MSG

Whoever walks in the dark does not know where they are going.
John 12:35 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+12:35&version=YLT

Note that I have quoted these words from NIV and provided links to alternative translatioins so you can see a handful of comparisons between the translations, that will help you get a feel for the strengths and weaknesses of each. That last verse is interesting too, because as the NIV allows it to be stated in this context if the reader is not careful, actually the YLT shows more clearly that Jesus was not saying it for that purpose. He was describing instead that His disciples that had physically known Him during His time on earth had a unique knowledge of the purpose of life, that everyone who was to live after Jesus' time would not have. As it is, we only have some very small fragments of His statements as recorded in the four canonical gospels, and the rest is left for us to theorise, discuss and hope based on the faith we are given via The Holy Spirit.

There is a consistent theme in those scriptures, especially observed in the first, that even if someone believes they are Christian and on the path of salvation, it is possible that they are deceiving themselves by walking in darkness (that is, to be doing things that they are afraid to admit to doing in His name). What this shows in the first verse here (1 John 1:6), is that someone who is walking in darkness cannot truthfully claim to have fellowship with Him. If they do make that claim, they are lying and they need to also be deceiving themselves to believe it. I understand this (from genuine experience btw), as the real meaning "I stand at the door and knock". It is when a person is in that state of not having fellowship with Him, that He has been put out of their heart and life and we have closed the door to Him. Yet He does not go away and nor does He barge in, but rather He waits there and knocks. Notice in this He says "if anyone should hear me knocking". Doesn't this show that He respects our need for privacy by not imposing on our conscience continually? Indeed, if someone is standing at the door knocking, they can choose to knock forcefully that we cannot ignore, and they can choose to knock gently in case we might have forgotten they were there.

So this opening of the door to Him is not a once in a lifetime event. Rather, it is required of us every time that we choose to live in a way that makes us unable to truthfully claim that we are walking in the light in His name.

I will keep you in my prayers, as I well know the pressures of such situations. I hope likewise that I can endure to the end.

 

[Katallina]

Thank you. This is extremely helpful and addresses the big concern that I was contemplating: essentially, how can we know if we truly believe in Jesus / have a relationship with Him and God. My issue has never been "Is there God?" -- I've spent half my life asking "Who is God?" -- but upon reaching the conclusion that God is reached through Jesus, making -sure- (as much as one is humanly able--can we ever truly be sure? Or does that lead to complacency and sin?) that I have a True relationship with him, and that what I know as true is from him (not from any other source) becomes the next great step.

I appreciate that you have addressed the fact that there is and should be awareness that it is uncomfortable to be truly honest with God, because that first requires being honest with oneself. Since we have all sinned, and will sadly all sin again, that's not a fun feeling. Yet it is necessary for both sincerity and growth.

As for my family? My decision here isn't going to earn me any brownie points. *shakes head* If anything it's going to be a big pain for them as time progresses, since I will likely want to find a church within our community, will study here at the house, and (most importantly) will undoubtedly not be as I was as I strive to grow closer to Jesus and to model his teachings. My family, sadly, has had much first hand experience with false Christians and is very wary of this faith for that reason.

The next truly challenging thing will be learning what is actually right and wrong, especially in translating from an ancient to a modern context. For if we do not know what qualifies as sin, we cannot repent. And if we cannot repent, then there is a block keeping us separate from God. The trouble, of course, is that there have come to be many ideas about what constitutes sin and that some are based on pure fact, while others have been interpreted or even invented by humans to fulfill their own agendas. (the ten commandments tend to give good examples of things to pay attention to, even though Jesus made sure to teach us that loving God with all our heart and soul, and that loving our neighbour as ourselves are the two most key things.) On the plus side, I *suppose* that the goal initially may be the simple recognition that we have sinned and that we repent for the fact that it has caused such separation? From there we trust in God / Jesus / The Holy Spirit to guide us to a full awareness of right and wrong?

The two primary areas of my life that leave me with cause for concern are that I am dating a non-Christian. He's agnostic, he believes much as I did that there is "something", but he has had even worse experiences with "christians" (those claiming the title without following even the two key points I stated above...) then I have. I've tried to pique his interest with this quest of mine to figure everything out, but he actually laughed at me. (That was kind of a shock.)

My other key concern is that I do write fantasy romance novels. I think I may be over-worrying with this one and confusing human ideals with God's ideals. This is likely a case where I'll need to listen to what I am told once I sort everything else. But I know up front and clear that I'm worried I have to give this up--and I should be (both with this and my bf) since we are asked to lose our life if we want to save it. The great majority of us are not going to be physically martyred the way the original Christians were, but that does not mean that we will not be asked to give up worldly trappings if we want true closeness with God and to separate ourselves from sin.

Anyway, now I'm rambling. Thanks again for the help.

 

[aiki]

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

I would encourage you to obtain a Bible that does not crowd Scripture itself with endless notes, comments, and clarifications. Some Bibles are so bad in this regard that on each page only a small fraction of the page actually contains Scripture. Avoid these! If you wish to use commentaries, and Bible dictionaries, and other study helps, by all means do so, just don't buy a Bible that jams all these things into its pages. Also, I would urge you to avoid like the plague Bibles that are actually "dynamic equivalents" or paraphrases. The Message, in particular, I would stress that you reject stringently. You don't need God's Word pre-chewed for you. God is more than capable of illuminating His Word to you.

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

You would do well to start in the Gospel of John, proceed through the rest of the Gospels as you like, and then embark on the rest of the New Testament in the order the books appear in your Bible. When you have familiarized yourself with the New Testament, then take a crack at the Old Testament.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

Inevitably, the narrator applies his/her own emphasis to what he/she is speaking. Such emphasis is often highly personal, reflecting one's spiritual journey and understanding (or lack thereof). Apart from this, there is no problem that I can see in using an audio Bible.

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

You can reduce Bible study to an academic exercise, or to a kind of religious ritual satisfying a desire for "spirituality." But God has given us the Bible as the special revelation of Himself to the world. To read the Bible and miss the One the Bible reveals would be the very worst of ironies. So it is that Scripture itself warns,

Hebrews 4:2
2 ...but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it.

If you regard the Bible as anything less than the Word of God to you, it will profit you nothing.

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

It's a bit of a crap-shoot, really. You have no idea of a person's qualifications for teaching God's Word online. There are a great many Bible nutballs online because it is so easy to just set oneself up as a Bible teacher. Churches usually have a process of vetting those they choose to teach God's Word that can be avoided entirely online by would-be Bible teachers. If you want to study the Bible online, I would recommend very, very highly Dr. Vernon McGee's "Through the Bible Radio Program":

http://www.ttb.org/

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

Before fussing over denominational affiliations I would exhort you to make sure your adoption into God's family. Knowing and loving Christ is infinitely more vital than choosing a denomination.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

A relationship with God begins by knowing and responding positively to the Gospel. Do you know what the Gospel is?

Selah.

 

[oi_antz]

I appreciate that you have addressed the fact that there is and should be awareness that it is uncomfortable to be truly honest with God, because that first requires being honest with oneself. Since we have all sinned, and will sadly all sin again, that's not a fun feeling. Yet it is necessary for both sincerity and growth.

The hardest part is to give up that sin that we love. But it might help to consider my own observation from experience. He does begin with the one that is most difficult. If you can overcome that obstacle then you know you are capable of repenting all other sins. I reckon probably this is because of all the sins we have accumulated desires to do, it is the one that is most valuable to us that we most don't want to let go of. It's onl an idea though that makes sense to me at this time.

The next truly challenging thing will be learning what is actually right and wrong, especially in translating from an ancient to a modern context. For if we do not know what qualifies as sin, we cannot repent. And if we cannot repent, then there is a block keeping us separate from God.

That isn't how it works though. We all know the sins that are blocking us from God, and just as the writer of 1 John 1:6 said, we deceive ourselves so that we can justify walking in the darkness.

The two primary areas of my life that leave me with cause for concern are that I am dating a non-Christian. He's agnostic, he believes much as I did that there is "something", but he has had even worse experiences with "christians" (those claiming the title without following even the two key points I stated above...) then I have. I've tried to pique his interest with this quest of mine to figure everything out, but he actually laughed at me. (That was kind of a shock.)

Pray about it. Jesus did say that there are people in other flocks that will follow Him, and that He will bring them also. I take that statement in the context that there are people of other faith disciplines who have never recognized Him or been taught sound doctrine about Him, that if they did have the opportunity to recognize Him, would follow Him. But also do not be surprised if your partner is one who hates the light and loves to do evil, who will never repent and love Jesus no matter what. You would probably have an expectation since you know his nature.

My other key concern is that I do write fantasy romance novels. I think I may be over-worrying with this one and confusing human ideals with God's ideals. This is likely a case where I'll need to listen to what I am told once I sort everything else. But I know up front and clear that I'm worried I have to give this up--and I should be (both with this and my bf) since we are asked to lose our life if we want to save it. The great majority of us are not going to be physically martyred the way the original Christians were, but that does not mean that we will not be asked to give up worldly trappings if we want true closeness with God and to separate ourselves from sin.

Anyway, now I'm rambling. Thanks again for the help.

It sounds as though you can see the narrow gate, though I am not the right person to make judgements about what is sin for you. That judgement belongs to the one who can give you fruit from the tree of life (Revelation 2:7). - Oh, I agree with Aiki about MSG translation, but I think you really need to know the information in the book of Acts at this stage of your growth.

 

[Hospes]

Out of nowhere, the weirdest feeling came over me and I ended up writing down "Re-explore the Bible and determine whether it is possible to have a true relationship with [the Christian] God."

Jesus said "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him." Your statement above has all the earmarks of God drawing you. This is encouraging. In the posts above you have been given some sound advice on what steps to make in your search, but keep in mind all your efforts do not arrange a quid pro quo with God. Regardless of what we do, we are never entitled to His adoption as his son or daughter. I encourage you to pursue him with all you've got, desiring him to meet you in your effort. Another thing Jesus said to a man: "You are not far from the kingdom of God."; I believe this could be said to you.

Grace to you.

 

[CGL1023]

Hi all! I have several questions so I figured that I would bring them here. Before we get to those, though, perhaps I should share a bit of background about myself to add some context?

I grew up in a family that toed the line between Christian and Agnostic. I say this because while my grandparents took all the grandkids to church, Vacation Bible Camp, etc. and my parents would attend if we were in a play, etc. "church stayed at church" in our home. I mention the Agnostic angle because as I have grown older, my parents have admitted to me that they aren't sure what is actually true, either.

Anyway, back to me (nothing against Mom or Dad, but if I tried to cover everyone this would get more lengthy than it will already be.). By the time I was in 8th grade I grew extremely obsessed with Greek Mythology. I've always been a writer and a storyteller, and to me those "characters" had more "character" than what I had learned about in church. (Ah, the mindstance of a 13 year old girl...)

By the time I was 17 I had discovered the Internet and had found Wicca. For someone who has always felt a strong pull toward having some form of active religion, and yet who cannot drive (I'm legally blind and have cerebral palsy) this was extremely appealing. (When added to the mythological context above, which had vastly expanded over the previous 5 years).

I stuck with that until I was about 20 but ultimately lost connection with it. It was empty--there was nothing / no one there. About a year later some friends told me they had found a "great church" and that I totally needed to check it out. The idea of studying religion with my friends, and being able attend and be part of an actual spiritual community, was extremely appealing.

So by the time I was 21 I had become a Mormon. This went on well for roughly a year and a half and I honestly quite enjoyed it... Until my friends made a few wrong turns and the church we were attending (and the people in it) reacted in what I viewed as an extremely non-Christian way. This lead me to question whether the church I was attending was the type of church I should be attending to truly connect with God, or whether human interference was causing some type of block which was making me uncomfortable.

I ultimately stopped going to that church. (Ten years later they're still knocking at my door. I suppose I should give them points for being consistent? There was a time when that level of passion was extremely appealing, but in the aftermath it has become rather bothersome.)

And from there I've been Stuck. I turned my focus away from religious studies aside from some purely intellectual stuff for some of my writing (I like having certain undertones to my fantasy works) and did my best to keep moving forward in life. I found a guy I love immensely and we've been dating for over 7 years. (Long distance, two countries, would've married years ago otherwise.) And I have tried to "fulfill" myself by writing (very excited about Kindle Direct Publishing) and blogging (I focus on Young and New Adult fiction.)

Several days ago I was working on developing a scrapbook project that I had losely themed as 40 Things To Do Before 40. (I originally envisioned it in a SmashBook, which are 40 pages long. Looking at it -now-, I can see something interesting about that right away.) As I went through the list, I had a whole bunch of things on it and had just two more spots I needed to fill. Out of nowhere, the weirdest feeling came over me and I ended up writing down "Re-explore the Bible and determine whether it is possible to have a true relationship with [the Christian] God." (I am clarifying this as I have spent my entire life knowing / believing there is--Must Be--divinity and on a search to figure out who or what that is.)

When I saw what I had written I was a little confused. The rest of my list was stuff like "Publish my first novel", "Go to Disney Word and experience it as an adult", or "Get a pet Siamese cat and name it Zakariah.". Within hours this second to last item on my list had eclipsed all others on it. I'm glad I have the list saved for when I have time to look at it again, but for now it's on hold because -this- is my focus.

So, first thing I do? Go to find my bible. And wouldn't you know it, my Bible Isn't Here. I have books from every other faith I've studied--either personally or academically--but neither of my Bibles (my ESV my grandparents got me or the KJV my friend's great-grandmother gifted me) are anywhere in our home. How does something like that even happen?(!)

Which leads to my questions:

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

I've spent the past few days lurking around here and reading verses people have put up on various threads. When I did this, I would take a look at what version was being quoted to get a feel for how different ones read / how I reacted to them. (As a writer, words are important to me.) I've found that I can enjoy quite a variety of different translations, which is great (I have lots of choice) but also overwhelming (I have lots of choice).

I'm also considering buying two Bibles. I want one that can be held in my hands, that I can mark, study, etc. and that will likely get used publicly. I also want one for my Kindle since I am legally blind and have arthritis in my hands. I cannot hold a large, heavy book for extreme amounts of time.

Do I want these Bibles to hold the same, or different, translations? (Advice welcome!)

There are so many different types of Bibles--regular ones, study ones, devotional ones, parallel ones, Bibles designed to be read in a year, Bibles set up in story order rather than traditional order... The list goes on and on.)

Any thoughts and opinions on which type(s) each of my new Bibles should be? (and while we're at it--how to people -feel- about someone wanting a Bible on Kindle, anyway?)

From there we must move onto what will be done with the Bibles. (They're not being purchased as a pair of bookends.) From what I've read searching on here, my reading of the Bible has been completely -weird-. What do I mean? I've read the entire Old Testament, all four Gospels, and Revelations. Does anyone see what's missing?

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

The pattern I'm seeing is: Matthew, John, Mark, Luke, Go through the New Testament, then work on the Old Testament. If anyone has further ideas, or would like to advise something different, I'm open to suggestions.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

I don't think an audio version can take the place of a written version--I feel that owning an actual Bible is very important and very personal. (I still can't get past the idea that both of mine have vanished.) But I know from an academic standpoint that I am an auditory learner and I wonder if this will help enhance my studies. (Especially in late fall when my arthritis tends to kick in and I can't even lift a Kindle.)

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

I know there are tons of great books that have been written to tackle various topics related to Christianity. I read quite a few of these in my twenties and know I enjoy them. At this stage I need to be careful not to let these texts get in the way of actually getting in touch with my new Bibles (and even more importantly with Jesus). I would assume (please correct me if I'm mistaken) that it is vital to be consciously aware that while these types of books may assist in enhancing understanding, there is a definite distinction between them (words of men and women who claim to love God) and the Bible (the living word of God). Despite this, I would still love to add a few of these to my library. (As with the Bibles, my collection here is gone. I'm slightly more okay with this--I plan to restock these via Kindle and use them with my physical Bible.)

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

I am aware this is -not- a replacement for real life fellowship with other Christians in an actual church. But for the time (again, can't drive and currently don't have anyone interested in going to a Church) this is what is available to me. When is it appropriate for me to get involved in something like this? Or should I hold off on this since I have other things my attention (spiritually) should be focused on? One of the groups I was thinking of joining is planning to study Acts, which seemed a fitting subject matter given what I mentioned above.

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

Not sure if this is the right time for that or not. On one hand, it would be interesting to find out what type of church I should be looking for. On the other hand, (1) I may not be able to get to whatever church I find from this, and (2) even if something sounds like the "right" church, it may or may not be the church I am meant to attend.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

I am pretty sure at this point that the way I was taught -- or at least understood what I thought people were teaching me -- was / is backwards. My understanding of Christianity clearly had Jesus playing second fiddle to God and I'm starting to have doubts that's correct. Could that be why I've been having so much trouble with this? Why it hasn't worked? With this in mind, any ideas or feedback that you can give with regard to any earlier questions that will enhance this would be very appreciated.

Thanks very much for taking the time to read all of this and for giving any answers that you can. Have a nice day!

One lifelong goal, I and the bible suggest, would be to develope a sincere love for the truth, which is the Word, aka Jesus. See how it is given in 2 Thess 2:9-10; this has the endtimes in view, which we are in, and the verse says that people are in the tribulation because they did not develop a sincere love for the truth.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Hi all! I have several questions so I figured that I would bring them here. Before we get to those, though, perhaps I should share a bit of background about myself to add some context?

I grew up in a family that toed the line between Christian and Agnostic. I say this because while my grandparents took all the grandkids to church, Vacation Bible Camp, etc. and my parents would attend if we were in a play, etc. "church stayed at church" in our home. I mention the Agnostic angle because as I have grown older, my parents have admitted to me that they aren't sure what is actually true, either.

Anyway, back to me (nothing against Mom or Dad, but if I tried to cover everyone this would get more lengthy than it will already be.). By the time I was in 8th grade I grew extremely obsessed with Greek Mythology. I've always been a writer and a storyteller, and to me those "characters" had more "character" than what I had learned about in church. (Ah, the mindstance of a 13 year old girl...)

By the time I was 17 I had discovered the Internet and had found Wicca. For someone who has always felt a strong pull toward having some form of active religion, and yet who cannot drive (I'm legally blind and have cerebral palsy) this was extremely appealing. (When added to the mythological context above, which had vastly expanded over the previous 5 years).

I stuck with that until I was about 20 but ultimately lost connection with it. It was empty--there was nothing / no one there. About a year later some friends told me they had found a "great church" and that I totally needed to check it out. The idea of studying religion with my friends, and being able attend and be part of an actual spiritual community, was extremely appealing.

So by the time I was 21 I had become a Mormon. This went on well for roughly a year and a half and I honestly quite enjoyed it... Until my friends made a few wrong turns and the church we were attending (and the people in it) reacted in what I viewed as an extremely non-Christian way. This lead me to question whether the church I was attending was the type of church I should be attending to truly connect with God, or whether human interference was causing some type of block which was making me uncomfortable.

I ultimately stopped going to that church. (Ten years later they're still knocking at my door. I suppose I should give them points for being consistent? There was a time when that level of passion was extremely appealing, but in the aftermath it has become rather bothersome.)

And from there I've been Stuck. I turned my focus away from religious studies aside from some purely intellectual stuff for some of my writing (I like having certain undertones to my fantasy works) and did my best to keep moving forward in life. I found a guy I love immensely and we've been dating for over 7 years. (Long distance, two countries, would've married years ago otherwise.) And I have tried to "fulfill" myself by writing (very excited about Kindle Direct Publishing) and blogging (I focus on Young and New Adult fiction.)

Several days ago I was working on developing a scrapbook project that I had losely themed as 40 Things To Do Before 40. (I originally envisioned it in a SmashBook, which are 40 pages long. Looking at it -now-, I can see something interesting about that right away.) As I went through the list, I had a whole bunch of things on it and had just two more spots I needed to fill. Out of nowhere, the weirdest feeling came over me and I ended up writing down "Re-explore the Bible and determine whether it is possible to have a true relationship with [the Christian] God." (I am clarifying this as I have spent my entire life knowing / believing there is--Must Be--divinity and on a search to figure out who or what that is.)

When I saw what I had written I was a little confused. The rest of my list was stuff like "Publish my first novel", "Go to Disney Word and experience it as an adult", or "Get a pet Siamese cat and name it Zakariah.". Within hours this second to last item on my list had eclipsed all others on it. I'm glad I have the list saved for when I have time to look at it again, but for now it's on hold because -this- is my focus.

So, first thing I do? Go to find my bible. And wouldn't you know it, my Bible Isn't Here. I have books from every other faith I've studied--either personally or academically--but neither of my Bibles (my ESV my grandparents got me or the KJV my friend's great-grandmother gifted me) are anywhere in our home. How does something like that even happen?(!)

Which leads to my questions:

What advice should I follow in buying myself a new Bible?

I've spent the past few days lurking around here and reading verses people have put up on various threads. When I did this, I would take a look at what version was being quoted to get a feel for how different ones read / how I reacted to them. (As a writer, words are important to me.) I've found that I can enjoy quite a variety of different translations, which is great (I have lots of choice) but also overwhelming (I have lots of choice).

I'm also considering buying two Bibles. I want one that can be held in my hands, that I can mark, study, etc. and that will likely get used publicly. I also want one for my Kindle since I am legally blind and have arthritis in my hands. I cannot hold a large, heavy book for extreme amounts of time.

Firstly, hey welcome to this crazy corner of the interwebs!

Speaking personally I've always valued using multiple translations. There are several reasons I think this can be helpful: The most obvious is that it allows you to compare how one translation renders the text from another, which can be fascinating and helpful. Sometimes the translations are working from the same base text (critical editions of Hebrew and Greek), sometimes they are using different base texts. Without being well studied on ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek (the common or "vulgar" Greek spoken by regular people at the time) having multiple translations can be the next best thing.

That said it may be a bit overwhelming to some people, I'd recommend finding a translation (or two) that are generally regarded highly by many different Christian traditions and denominations such as the ESV or NRSV (I say this because there are some obscure, idiosyncratic translations out there that seem more interested in asserting a particular tradition/denomination/sect perspective--such as the New World Translation published by the Jehovah's Witnesses). I mention the ESV and NRSV because those are the two I use virtually all the time, they also have a widespread use among many different Christian denominations and traditions, Roman Catholic, Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, Baptist, etc.

Do I want these Bibles to hold the same, or different, translations? (Advice welcome!)

There are so many different types of Bibles--regular ones, study ones, devotional ones, parallel ones, Bibles designed to be read in a year, Bibles set up in story order rather than traditional order... The list goes on and on.

Any thoughts and opinions on which type(s) each of my new Bibles should be? (and while we're at it--how to people -feel- about someone wanting a Bible on Kindle, anyway?)

Again, I this is largely up to you. Though if you are basically attempting a fresh start at reading the Bible a single translation may be the way to go, at least for now. Of the two translations I mentioned earlier, I think the ESV is probably in a lot of ways more approachable than the NRSV, but that may just be my opinion, and obviously those aren't the only options out there, those are just my preferences.

If you'd like (and it may be helpful) is have both a Protestant and Catholic Bible, or at least a copy of "the Apocrypha" (the books found in Catholic Old Testaments but not Protestant Old Testaments), both the ESV and NRSV have translations of these books either in a separate volume, included within the usual order of Catholic Bibles, or as historically done in Protestant Bibles included as a separate appendix. That's up to you of course. But it would expose you to more of the Bible perhaps than otherwise.

From there we must move onto what will be done with the Bibles. (They're not being purchased as a pair of bookends.) From what I've read searching on here, my reading of the Bible has been completely -weird-. What do I mean? I've read the entire Old Testament, all four Gospels, and Revelations. Does anyone see what's missing?

Tackling the Revelation of St. John is usually a good way, for people largely unfamiliar with the Bible--or more specifically people unfamiliar with the ancient apocalyptic genre of literature (which the Revelation is)-- to get really confused. It is by far the most esoteric and bizarre book in the entire Biblical Canon, and one of the most divisive and confusing texts in the history of Christianity. I can't think of any reason to ever suggest it to someone as basic introductory Bible reading, it's the last book I'd recommend--not because I think it's less valuable, but because it's so weird and isn't the sort of thing you can just pick up and read to figure out, there's a lot being said that isn't actually being said there.

I intend to read the entire Bible again, but from what I understand, starting and Genesis and going in order may not be the best way to do that. Does anyone have any thoughts on what way I should read the Bible?

The pattern I'm seeing is: Matthew, John, Mark, Luke, Go through the New Testament, then work on the Old Testament. If anyone has further ideas, or would like to advise something different, I'm open to suggestions.

My usual recommendation would be to start with the Gospel of Luke. Why Luke? Partly preference, I'd consider Luke to be my favorite of the Four Gospels. But also Luke's Gospel is addressed to an individual and is an attempt to give "the Jesus Story" and so you get a pretty holistic package, and also the author of Luke wrote a second work, a continuation from where Luke ends, the Acts of the Apostles. As such you could read Luke and Acts right after one another and get a rather complete story of Jesus, and the beginnings of the Church Jesus starts.

I also highly recommend reading St. Paul's letter to the Romans, In this letter to the Church in Rome St. Paul the Apostle goes through a complex series of arguments addressing some of the very basic issues of Christianity: the universal problem of sin and death, the significance of Christ's death and resurrection (and thus the Gospel), of God's grace toward sinners in the Gospel, etc. It's certainly not the most simple book in the New Testament, but it's one of the deepest and richest in terms of content.

When tackling the Old Testament the reliable place to start is usually with the Psalms. The Psalms are, in a sense, ancient Israel's hymn book, and many of the psalms have frequently and continually been used within the worship practices of the Christian Church down through history. These are prayerful poems, laments, songs that speak often of the human condition. As such one will find absolutely beautiful language here, such as Psalm 23, "The LORD is my shepherd..." in other cases they are pleas of distress, in some cases they are even scornful and filled with bitter rage and anger. But they are honest, frank, raw depictions of human emotion displayed for God and for us.

Beyond that, it's really a matter of what you want. Mark's Gospel is often also picked as the first book of the Bible to read because it is poignant and short, with many (or most) scholars believing that both Matthew and Luke relied on Mark for their own gospel texts. So Mark is a good choice. Matthew is good, Matthew's angle in telling the Jesus Story is oriented more toward an ancient Jewish audience in order to speak more emphatically on the fact that Jesus is the Messiah/Christ. John, while usually recommended as a first or early choice, isn't something I recommend; of the Four Gospels it's the most theologically dense, being very unlike Matthew, Mark, and Luke; John is less about the Jesus Story itself and is more of a theological treatise on Jesus. It still tells the Story, but does so very, very differently.

How do you guys feel about Audio Bibles?

I don't think an audio version can take the place of a written version--I feel that owning an actual Bible is very important and very personal. (I still can't get past the idea that both of mine have vanished.) But I know from an academic standpoint that I am an auditory learner and I wonder if this will help enhance my studies. (Especially in late fall when my arthritis tends to kick in and I can't even lift a Kindle.)

It maybe be very helpful for you. I've never really done audio books in general, I like to be able to go back and re-read something if it didn't process properly or if I zoned out for a moment.

That said, long before Christians were reading the Bible they were hearing the Bible. In fact the way we got the books that are in the Bible is that over time a general consensus developed among churches throughout the ancient world on what ought to be read aloud to the gathered worshipers in Church. Scripture readings were part of Jewish worship before Christianity, and Christians continued to have Scripture readings as part of their worship practices. If you've ever been to a traditional Christian service (a liturgical service) such as a Roman Catholic, Episcopalian, or Lutheran service you'll notice that there are set Scripture readings every Sunday--what's known as the lectionary. In Western Churches there is a three year cycle (Eastern Churches, such as the Eastern Orthodox, have a one year lectionary cycle). The Bible, for the first 1400 years of Christian history, wasn't a single book you could go to a store and buy and read at your leisure, they were either collections of hand-copied scrolls and bound codices, incredibly time consuming and expensive to copy prior to the moveable-type printing press. So until Bibles were able to be mass produced, the only way most Christians could ever experience Scripture was to hear it being read.

So in that sense hearing the Bible is in some ways a much more traditional experience than reading the Bible.

Suggestions for further / complimentary study?

I know there are tons of great books that have been written to tackle various topics related to Christianity. I read quite a few of these in my twenties and know I enjoy them. At this stage I need to be careful not to let these texts get in the way of actually getting in touch with my new Bibles (and even more importantly with Jesus). I would assume (please correct me if I'm mistaken) that it is vital to be consciously aware that while these types of books may assist in enhancing understanding, there is a definite distinction between them (words of men and women who claim to love God) and the Bible (the living word of God). Despite this, I would still love to add a few of these to my library. (As with the Bibles, my collection here is gone. I'm slightly more okay with this--I plan to restock these via Kindle and use them with my physical Bible.)

Commentaries and various study guides can be invaluable. In fact it is almost impossible that one is really going to grasp much of the Bible if they were to simply pick up a Bible and read it one day. That's because the Bible wasn't written to 21st century modern Westerners, the books of the Bible are just that--books. The Bible isn't a book, but a library of books, and as in any library there are many different kinds of books. From history, to poetry, to fantasy fiction, etc. It is invaluable to learn from people who have spent their lives not just reading and engaging with Scripture but who have a far more intimate knowledge of the subtleties and nuances of the original language, with a keen understanding of the cultural and historical contexts in which the books were written (and so on and so forth). Which is why serious Bible study ought to be done with an ear toward good scholarship and within the community context of the historic Christian Church (that is, how have Christians throughout 2,000 years of history read and understood the Scriptures?)

So no, obviously commentary and study guides aren't divinely inspired Scripture; they are invaluable resources to serious Scripture study, as is plugging oneself into a theologically solid church so that one is getting a steady diet of good Christian teaching. Because first and foremost the Bible isn't a "book" that belongs to any one individual, it is the Church's "book" it belongs to the entire community of faith, and so ultimately should be experienced within that much larger community.

How do you guys feel about online Bible Study groups?

I am aware this is -not- a replacement for real life fellowship with other Christians in an actual church. But for the time (again, can't drive and currently don't have anyone interested in going to a Church) this is what is available to me. When is it appropriate for me to get involved in something like this? Or should I hold off on this since I have other things my attention (spiritually) should be focused on? One of the groups I was thinking of joining is planning to study Acts, which seemed a fitting subject matter given what I mentioned above.

I've never been part of one, but I suppose it depends. Hypothetically speaking, if I were to be part of an online Bible study group, I would want it to be through my church and and structured in such a way that it isn't independent of the pastoral ministry of my church (or at the very least a church). I believe accountability in leaders is necessary, and inevitably Bible studies have some sort of "leader" the person organizing it, or if not that, the most outspoken and opinionated person of the group--and I would like that it be structured so that competent persons take the reigns who are subject to more than just themselves.

Should I begin researching various denominations to figure out where I fit?

Not sure if this is the right time for that or not. On one hand, it would be interesting to find out what type of church I should be looking for. On the other hand, (1) I may not be able to get to whatever church I find from this, and (2) even if something sounds like the "right" church, it may or may not be the church I am meant to attend

At the very least, it can't hurt to visit different churches from different denominations and theological traditions.

And of course the most important question: how do I go about finding, establishing and maintaining that relationship with God? Perhaps even more important, with Jesus?

I am pretty sure at this point that the way I was taught -- or at least understood what I thought people were teaching me -- was / is backwards. My understanding of Christianity clearly had Jesus playing second fiddle to God and I'm starting to have doubts that's correct. Could that be why I've been having so much trouble with this? Why it hasn't worked? With this in mind, any ideas or feedback that you can give with regard to any earlier questions that will enhance this would be very appreciated.

That, almost certainly, will be answered differently depending on the views and denominational background of the person answering. As a Lutheran I believe that God relates to us through Word and Sacrament, thus being part of a church that preaches the Gospel and faithfully administers the Sacraments, I don't tend to stress "personal experience" in terms of Christian spirituality, I think there's a danger of allowing our feelings get the best of us. I believe that God has promised to meet us through His Word, by the preaching of the Gospel, hearing the Scriptures read, and in the Sacraments (Baptism and Communion). There is Grace where God has promised to be, and thus the encounter with God in His Word and Sacraments is the most meaningful definition of a relationship with God that I can think of. A dynamic encounter with Christ as He speaks to us through His Word and offers Himself to us in the bread and wine of the Lord's Supper. There is also regular prayer, personal Scripture reading, etc, but these are attached to and in conjunction with the communal experience of the Church that gathers to receive God's Word and Sacrament.

Thanks very much for taking the time to read all of this and for giving any answers that you can. Have a nice day!

Hopefully you've found my responses helpful

-CryptoLutheran