The Jewish and the New Testament

[fingerprint]

As my previous thread, I ask all of this with the utmost respect and true desire to learn. Ok you are going to have to fill me in on this area. From what I have been taught, Jews believe in and follow the Old Testament, the same Old Testament we have as Christians. Where we differ is where it comes to the New Testament and Christ. Of course there is the Torah and Kabbalah which I admittedly know very little about. Ok my questions are this:

1. Do Jews believe any of the New Testament or is that not read in Judaism at all?

2. I know Jews don't believe Christ is the son of God, what exactly do they believe of him. Just a man? A holy man? a heretic? Tell me the truth please, I won't be offended.

3. Where does the Torah come from and how does it relate to the Old Testament?

4. Kabbalah?

I know this is a thread that could literally never be completely answered and they are very complex questions. If someone has time to just summarize or has a good website that can explain in relative briefness that would be great. I'm just trying to expand my knowledge a bit. Thanks.

 

[Hix]

Shalom Fingerprint!!

1. Do Jews believe any of the New Testament or is that not read in Judaism at all?

The general opinion in mainstream Rabbinic Judaism is that the New Testament is not inspired or from G-d, but the opinion has changed to that it includes much wisdom....Messianic Jews such as ourselves believe it to be scripture though.

2. I know Jews don't believe Christ is the son of God, what exactly do they believe of him. Just a man? A holy man? a heretic? Tell me the truth please, I won't be offended.

Just a man, but ive heard many rabbinic Jews say he was the first practicioner of Reform Judaism, which I must say I disagree with also. Many say he was a false prophet, whilst others still dont believe he existed. Once again Messianic Jews differ from this.

3. Where does the Torah come from and how does it relate to the Old Testament?

The Torah is the first five books in the Old Testament, but it holds a special place within Judaism as it is said to be written by G-d himself before the world was even created and given to the Children of Israel at Mount Sinai. There is also, an Oral part to the Torah to help us understand its many laws. Also we in Messianic Judaism believe Yeshua (Jesus) to be the living form of the Torah.

4. Kabbalah?

Jewish Kabbalah is the in depth study of G-d, who he is and his many aspects. While it is impossible to know even a little bit of the true vastness of G-d, Kabbalah seeks to bring more enlightenment on who he is, why we are here and the role the Torah has in repairing the world.

I know this is a thread that could literally never be completely answered and they are very complex questions. If someone has time to just summarize or has a good website that can explain in relative briefness that would be great. I'm just trying to expand my knowledge a bit. Thanks.

Your very welcome more in depth answers are of cource available.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[fingerprint]

Great answers, thank you. Ok so Messianic Jews believe the New Testament is scripture. You believe Yeshua (Jesus) is the living form of the Torah. Do Messianic Jews then believe Yeshua (Jesus) is the son of God as Christians do? I guess I'm not seeing the difference in a Messianic Jew and a Christian yet. Thanks for enlightening me.

 

[iitb]

I'll take a crack at this.

1. Do Jews believe any of the New Testament or is that not read in Judaism at all?

That's almost like asking if a christian reads the book of mormon. A jew that doesn't accept Y'shua as messiah has no reason to read the New Testament. MJs read it, but it really isn't accepted by normative Judaism.

2. I know Jews don't believe Christ is the son of God, what exactly do they believe of him. Just a man? A holy man? a heretic? Tell me the truth please, I won't be offended.

It really depends who you ask. Some view him as a very devoute, nationalistic jew, and others seem him as some weird pagan mystic.

3. Where does the Torah come from and how does it relate to the Old Testament?

The Torah is known to most christians as the law, aka the first 5 books of the old testament. It comes from G-d himself, and the rest of the old testament is pretty much a commentary on it.

4. Kabbalah?

What about it? Simchat_torah has a fairly recent thread on it floating around somewhere. You could check that out. ]

 

[iitb]

The biggest difference between christianity and MJ is the Torah. Christians believe it to be done away with, we disagree.

 

[fingerprint]

Ok I see. Thank you both so much for being kind enough to answer my questions.

 

[fingerprint]

Found a good site which helps also http://www.messianic.com/articles/basics.htm

 

[Mordechai18]

Keep in mind also, that not all Jews accept Kabbalah as being at all valid or of G-d.
I have seen Kabbalah (Qabala, Cabala, Kabala, etc.) lead many astray into heresy.

 

[fingerprint]

Yeah like the Kabbalah Madonna practices and is so trendy with Hollywood celebrities has little to do with true Jewish Kabbalah I'm assuming.

 

[Mordechai18]

Yeah like the Kabbalah Madonna practices and is so trendy with Hollywood celebrities has little to do with true Jewish Kabbalah I'm assuming.

Don't even get me started on the Kabbalah Center's (frequented by popstars) abuses.
I am also referring to the Kabala as studied and taught by "authentic" Jews grounded in study of Torah.
Kabala is not accepted by all Jews as being holy or G-dly. Some believe it to be a huge mistake and a road to error and heresy.

 

[fingerprint]

Got it, thanks.

 

[INOrder]

Hello finger print,

I am a Jew, I attend a traditional Orthodox synagogue and define myself aswell to be Traditional and Orthodox.

Q1. Do Jews believe any of the New Testament or is that not read in Judaism at all?

A: Well, until I first came on to these forums there was no reason for me to look into the New Testament in a Jewish view. I was inspired to look into it in Jewish way of interpreting as soon as I saw a post rendering what each of the books degree of interpreting was.
So, I am beginning to look at the New Testament with my extra Jewish glasses to weed away the centuries of non-Jewish interpretation and reading from them.
I, in fact, am beginning to respect the writings much more.

But, do not come to a hope that I will believe in Jesus as everyone else does.

Q2. I know Jews don't believe Christ is the son of God, what exactly do they believe of him. Just a man? A holy man? a heretic? Tell me the truth please, I won't be offended.

A:Well, that is correct.
Most of us do not even want to be near those that even speak of his name in a good manner. I believe it is changing amoung us. My congregation tolerates those that we know of personally. We found out by meeting in one of the members houses and seeing christian bibles there. And so we eventually asked if they were christians, they humbly and respectfully responded to negate the charges but upheld that they do believe in Jesus.
So, many of us are growing tolerant to only those that are well within the boundaries of Judaism and that do not try to push their belief on any other Jew.


Q3. Where does the Torah come from and how does it relate to the Old Testament?
What is the Torah is called the Pentateuch, the first five books of the christian bible's Old Testament. These are the writings of our great leader and judge Moses. Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.
Jews can also mean the entire bible when we speak of Torah. But in its technical terminology is it called the Torah, prophets and writings.
Then what is rendered as rules from our Rabbi's and judges is also considered Torah and we are not to go right or left from their rulings and judgments.

4. Kabbalah?

Kabbalah is a way to understand G'd. Currently looking into the New Testament I see things spoken of many times. Paul speaks of this many times. I hear bells ringing "Kabbalah" or "Sod" [ which is the degree of interpretation that kabbalah adheres exclusively too] when I read of "the Mysteries..."
I have been plunging into the New Testament greatly after these forums to understand it as Jewish writing set properly before the destruction of our Holy Temple.

So, do I believe that Jesus is the Son of G'D, well yes, I believe that he was a good Rabbi, and followed the Rabbi's [from what i currently see in the New Testament]. The office of "Son of G'd" was an office given to the leaders of the Jews and today we have "Son's of G'd" by the leadership that is the Rabbis.

But the promised Messiah of the Jews? ummm, as I read, nu

bye

 

[simchat_torah]

I hear bells ringing "Kabbalah" or "Sod" [ which is the degree of interpretation that kabbalah adheres exclusively too] when I read of "the Mysteries..."

ahhh... I see how intuitive you are INOrder

 

[Mordechai18]

So, I am beginning to look at the New Testament with my extra Jewish glasses to weed away the centuries of non-Jewish interpretation and reading from them.

This is a very difficult exercise, I am finding.

But the promised Messiah of the Jews? ummm, as I read, nu

Haha - did you mean the english word "no," or the Yiddish word "nu" or was that a Freudian slip? I guess either one might apply, eh?

 

[INOrder]

Hello Mordechai,

yes it is a difficult task, but since I have those in my congregation who are adamately holding on to the belief of Jesus as the Messiah and yet they say that they agree with the Oral Traditions, I have put myself to study the writings of the New Testament to see if it does teach the same as our Rabbis do.
And what I am finding, so far, is that it is

bye

 

[Mordechai18]

I salute your bravery and honesty, INOrder. Regardless of your conclusions about Yeshua, it is good to learn.
I was stunned to hear how little my Rabbi knows about Christianity.