The Irish Monks of Yore....

[Suzannah]

I just like the word "yore"....

Let's talk about the Irish monks who...(you fill in the blanks)

Did they really "save" civilisation? Have you read T. Cahill's book?

As an Irish person, I have to say that he makes a few odd statements about pre-Christian Ireland, but in the main, I enjoyed his book...

 

[MariaRegina]

I "read" his book on tape.

I also studied the history of English which covered the Celts, the Anglos and the Saxons.

The Celts were not of Anglo-Saxon origin. The Anglos and the Saxons were Germanic peoples. When the Celts were being persecuted by the Picts, another Germanic peoples, the Celts asked the Anglos to come and defend them from the Picts who were pirates. The Anglos did come but invaded England, forcing the Celts to move to Ireland, Scotland and Brittany (France). The Celts were Christians and built most of the monasteries in England and Ireland. If it wasn't for the Celtic monks, the Anglos and the Saxons wouldn't be Christian today.

So the people of the UK owe a great deal of gratitude to the Orthodox Celtic monks.

 

[Suzannah]

I agree! I daresay also that many other non-biblical texts would not have been preserved....

I would also say that later Scottish monks carried on great work in their own monasteries and helped to stablise the region for quite some time.

 

[MariaRegina]

Do you know the history of the Scottish monks -- weren't they influenced by the Celts also?

 

[Suzannah]

Well, perhaps Clann Donald will visit this thread as he's a Scot and probably knows more. The Scots are Celts themselves....

My understanding of all this "history" has had to undergo surgery as of late... The Scots were descended of the Angli .... They had a common language "Gaelige" by the time of around 900... Whether the Scots spoke it by common heritage I don't really know...Irish Gaelic has some differences but the twain can meet, so to speak....Also, although a different culture, they would have had some customs in common.

Scots Gaelic has some words that we don't have and vice versa. Columba's famous mission to the Picts was another matter, since they were of a different tribe, and I'm not at all certain that they spoke Gaelic or if they had their own language. The Gaelic that Columba spoke was likely to be spoken among the Scots as he came from northern Ireland, a place that had much "traffic" back and forth between the islands. This, in addition to the fact that at the time of St. Padraig, there were probably (and I say that without basis) a few other Christians running around the UK . I intend to do a little research and find out,but it's not a stretch of imagination I don't think, just common sense. While Padraig was busy in Ireland I rather doubt that the Scots/English/Welsh were idle...I'm certain they were at least found in "pockets" throughout the land. Then, when Columba and his missionaries came along, they must have had another "common frame of reference" ....so while I think that Columba was certainly "king of the Irish monks", it also enters my mind that there must have been Scots/Welsh missionaries already who, when they "linked up" with him and his followers, simply joined forces.

 

[Suzannah]

Chanter: This link has some fascinating articles regarding how Orthodox Christianity came to Ireland and blossomed there....the article called : On the Trail of Seven Monks From Egypt is a real eyeopener...it would appear, that the Irish owe a great debt to the Copts of Egypt.

http://www.orthodoxireland.com/history

 

[MariaRegina]

Suzannah:

The Picts were a barbarian Germanic tribe who were pirates. They weren't known to be very kind. Do you know what happened to them? I found a site (will look it up later) that went into the various Germanic tribes who settled in English. I don't have time to study it now, but the English language is not homogeneous but a mixture of many languages: Latin, Greek, French, German, Russian, Spanish, etc.

 

[MariaRegina]

Chanter: This link has some fascinating articles regarding how Orthodox Christianity came to Ireland and blossomed there....the article called : On the Trail of Seven Monks From Egypt is a real eyeopener...it would appear, that the Irish owe a great debt to the Copts of Egypt.

http://www.orthodoxireland.com/history

A lot of Orthodox monks came to Ireland to convert the people. Some people have visited Churches in the UK that have preserved the Orthodox styles. I'm not surprized that the Copts also came.

 

[Suzannah]

RE: the Picts : well, yes, they were barbaric...but comparing them with Irish tribes, it's sort of hard to make the Picts out to be "worse"....Irish tribes were notoriously bloody...The Irish pagans give them a run for their money on the title barbarian. As far as I am aware, they simply were assimilated over time into the culture.

As far as the language: English did not become a wide spread language in Ireland until around the 12th century...after that as the Anglo Saxons gained ground, this is when Gaelic became outlawed....Irish priests became the last bastion of learning.....It lasted far into the nineteenth century that Irish people were forbidden to speak their langugage. Gaelic would be a "dead" language today were not for underground priests....

 

[Lotar]

The Scottish and Irish languages are in the same celtic group, and the Welsh, Cornish and Brittany (what were the called again?) are in another language group. Celtic England, and Wales were closely related to the Gaules, while it is believed the Irish came from Celtic Spain. The Scotts were conquered by the Irish, and that is the reason for their close ties.
On another note, in Roman times, the Irish were refered to as Scotts.

I read that book, it was a long time ago though. I think I remember it being interesting.

 

[Suzannah]

Hiya Lotar! Just glad to see you!