The hell-bound "bit"

[Dominus Fidelis]

Someone made a comment in TAW the other day in reference to Catholic beliefs about mortal sins, confession, and Hell.

They refered to it as a "bit" in programmer-jargon, which I immediately understood because I am a programmer too.

But it got me thinking that non-Catholics must think that we believe a person can be one day in good-standing with God, mess up the next day (have our bit turned on), and if we die without confession (bit turned off), we go to Hell.

Obviously that is an extreme oversimplification, but I imagine it is a prevalent one.

Anyone here care to take a stab at clarifying the issue?

 

[Bastoune]

I think a lot of people think of things that way, rather than sin like a cancer that if we let it go untreated eats us up.

 

[Oblio]

Someone made a comment in TAW the other day

/me raises hand

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Oh it was you...hi Oblio...

 

[ShannonMcCatholic]

As Scripture points to the fact that there are mortal sins-- I think it is a matter of repentence. If I commit a mortal sin today, but repent and ask God's forgiveness, and vow to get to Sacramental Confession as soon as I can-- but then die before I get there-- well, I think God takes our intentions. The cancer of sin, as was just mentioned, is to me, an intentional disobedience in one area which then spreads to other areas- when there is no sorrow for one''s hurting the Lord through our sin.

Also- with as many indulgences as one can gain throughout the day (read chances to show Jesus we do desire to please Him and that we are sorry for hurting Him)- it seems like someone would actually have to be trying to stay in a state of rejecting God's grace- to be denied that sanctifying grace.

In the Sacred Heart of Jesus,
Shannon

 

[nyj]

Obviously that is an extreme oversimplification, but I imagine it is a prevalent one.

Well, it is that simple and it isn't that simple. If you murder someone, they don't get a redo at the life you've taken from them, do they?

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Well, it is that simple and it isn't that simple. If you murder someone, they don't get a redo at the life you've taken from them, do they?

The point is that a person filled with grace on Monday is not going to murder someone on Tuesday...its a gradual process of sin eating away until a person falls into grave sin, no?

 

[nyj]

The point is that a person filled with grace on Monday is not going to murder someone on Tuesday... its a gradual process of sin eating away until a person falls into grave sin, no?

It may be a gradual process, it may not be. Depends on the person, depends on the circumstances.

 

[Benedicta00]

The point is that a person filled with grace on Monday is not going to murder someone on Tuesday...its a gradual process of sin eating away until a person falls into grave sin, no?

No, not really. I believe you can snap psychologically. There are many factors to why people do the things they do. You can be in grace because you sincerely confess your sins but sometimes a person can be oppressed in sin by Satan and as Jesus says, some types can only be delivered with prayer and fasting.

 

[NDIrish]

Maybe God uses something more akin to fuzzy logic than boolean logic?

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Maybe God uses something more akin to fuzzy logic than boolean logic?

Yeah, that would be my opinion on it. I just don't see God being well-pleased with you on Monday, you are filled with His spirit, you are His son/daughter, and then you mess up on Tuesday and you go burn in Hell forever.

 

[nyj]

I just don't see God being well-pleased with you on Monday, you are filled with His spirit, you are His son/daughter, and then you mess up on Tuesday and you go burn in Hell forever.

That's what the Sacrament of Confession is for. It only took a day for the prodigal son to ask his father for his inheritance and run off with it.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

That's what the Sacrament of Confession is for. It only took a day for the prodigal son to ask his father for his inheritance and run off with it.

Yeah, but would someone that is in a state of Grace decide to murder someone the next day?

 

[nyj]

Yeah, but would someone that is in a state of Grace decide to murder someone the next day?

This is the complex issue of free-will. We're given that grace but have the option of rejecting it.

Also, there are plenty of other sins aside from murder, that are more palatable to society as a whole, but still hated by God, which are mortal. Adultery for example.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

This is the complex issue of free-will. We're given that grace but have the option of rejecting it.

Oh, I know, I'm just talking about the practical application of it. I mean, I guess its possible for that to happen, but I imagine it is usually not that simple.

 

[nyj]

Oh, I know, I'm just talking about the practical application of it. I mean, I guess its possible for that to happen, but I imagine it is usually not that simple.

The Catechism clearly says that venial sins are to be denied and avoided because they predispose us to mortal sin. So the Church does agree that there can be a lead up, up to committing mortal sins. However, you can commit a venial sin an still remain in a state of grace as venial sins do not break that familial bond between oneself and God.

 

[Miss Shelby]

Yeah, that would be my opinion on it. I just don't see God being well-pleased with you on Monday, you are filled with His spirit, you are His son/daughter, and then you mess up on Tuesday and you go burn in Hell forever.

When you say mess up on Tuesday, what do you mean by mess up on Tuesday? I can't imagine that a person would sin mortally if they are, theoretically speaking, as close to God as your example states.

But I think it brings up a good question. Can venial sin turn mortal if left unrepented long enough? Like what Bastoune said about cancer eating away at the soul? I think it could probably lead us to the point where we don't care and then gradually led into a path of mortal sin as well.

Michelle

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

The Catechism clearly says that venial sins are to be denied and avoided because they predispose us to mortal sin. So the Church does agree that there can be a lead up, up to committing mortal sins. However, you can commit a venial sin an still remain in a state of grace as venial sins do not break that familial bond between oneself and God.

Right...thats what I meant about gradual.

 

[nyj]

Right...thats what I meant about gradual.

I agree, but I wanted to add that while it may be gradual for a few, for some or for most, it may not be the case for all. That was my only point.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

When you say mess up on Tuesday, what do you mean by mess up on Tuesday? I can't imagine that a person would sin mortally if they are, theoretically speaking, as close to God as your example states.

But I think it brings up a good question. Can venial sin turn mortal if left unrepented long enough? Like what Bastoune said about cancer eating away at the soul? I think it could probably lead us to the point where we don't care and then gradually led into a path of mortal sin as well.

Michelle

Venial can't turn mortal over time, but it can predispose us to mortal, as nyj listed from the Catechism.