The Ethics of Posting a negative Yelp review

[Pavel Mosko]

I blasted a former land lord today in a Yelp review because they were extremely punitive in their close out fees and I had put up with a lot from them and believed I deserved better from them especially since they often did not hold up to their own end of things. I'm OK with what I wrote as far as my conscience goes but thought it might make an interesting thread because some Christians have different ideas about things like: gossip and back biting, getting revenge, and the general duties of Christians when it comes to warning the public.


My review of my former landlord (Company name withheld) in case you are interested or curious....

• I must second the bad reviews! I was going to give them a two-star rating because there were a few times they did give me timely help when I needed it, but I felt the need to warn the public off this property management company.
  
  1) All the stuff about them doing everything possible to extract money from you is true.
  
  A) I would emphasize the new scheme is to try to keep locking you into a yearly lease, rather than let you go month to month after the first year or two. Basically, they are always engineering to either move in a hurry when it is inconvenient or extend the lease so they can extract a lot of money from you when you have to move because that next big life change, new job etc.
  
  B) They are extremely punitive of enforcing the letter of the lease when it comes to any nickel and dime way to charge you. For example, if you were to leave behind some small easy to carry thing for a Maintenace guy like a step ladder (because you have a much better one than the one, he uses), they will charge $50 as if you were leaving a large hard to carry sofa. This kind of thing is very aggravating due to what I'm writing in 2) and is the main reason why I am writing this my first Yelp review.
  
  2) While they are extremely punitive, and I will add threatening in their communications (warning you of some new problem and how if you are found doing such and such you might be evicted), while they are often themselves really guilty of delivering a below average product where you can find yourself living in slum conditions due to no fault of your own.
  
  For example, I had a persistent black mold problem in a spare bedroom that hounded me persistently until it was nearly time to move out. (The problem was temporarily solved with bleach etc. but they never really were able to get to the root of it because their staff was always busy with other projects until I was a month from moving out....
  
  Another example, I had a one foot by one foot hole in my bathroom ceiling above the tub/shower due to faulty building maintenance and negligence (a water leak of the upstairs apartment and workers ignoring my banging on the door that water was leaking!). This was not repaired until about two weeks before we had inspectors come so the company could keep it's rental license.
  
  Besides all this they are fussy about having "assigned parking", yet they do not bother to actually mark the spaces with a sign or paint them. Basically, it is up to you to realize you are so many spaces from the dumpster etc. And I'm not sure how people ever know which spaces are for visitors other than keep their occasional mail notices on the topic and give them to any guests that might be staying with them.
  
  In addition to all the above, they are not set up like your typical landlord, or Property Management company. By this I mean there is no office that is in town, or at least easy to get to that you can walk in give them your check in the first three days of the month while you are doing errands etc. Their office is not set up to receive visitors at least not renters, and do not expect the customary three day grace period on your rent at the start of the month.
  
  Anyway, unless you are in danger of being homeless and got nobody else to rent from, I advise you to look elsewhere.
  
  
  

 

[Lost Witness]

WWJD

 

[Landon Caeli]

WWJD

Speak the truth probably.

 

[Landon Caeli]

I blasted a former land lord today in a Yelp review because they were extremely punitive in their close out fees and I had put up with a lot from them and believed I deserved better from them especially since they often did not hold up to their own end of things. I'm OK with what I wrote as far as my conscience goes but thought it might make an interesting thread because some Christians have different ideas about things like: gossip and back biting, getting revenge, and the general duties of Christians when it comes to warning the public.


My review of my former landlord (Company name withheld) in case you are interested or curious....

• I must second the bad reviews! I was going to give them a two-star rating because there were a few times they did give me timely help when I needed it, but I felt the need to warn the public off this property management company.
  
  1) All the stuff about them doing everything possible to extract money from you is true.
  
  A) I would emphasize the new scheme is to try to keep locking you into a yearly lease, rather than let you go month to month after the first year or two. Basically, they are always engineering to either move in a hurry when it is inconvenient or extend the lease so they can extract a lot of money from you when you have to move because that next big life change, new job etc.
  
  B) They are extremely punitive of enforcing the letter of the lease when it comes to any nickel and dime way to charge you. For example, if you were to leave behind some small easy to carry thing for a Maintenace guy like a step ladder (because you have a much better one than the one, he uses), they will charge $50 as if you were leaving a large hard to carry sofa. This kind of thing is very aggravating due to what I'm writing in 2) and is the main reason why I am writing this my first Yelp review.
  
  2) While they are extremely punitive, and I will add threatening in their communications (warning you of some new problem and how if you are found doing such and such you might be evicted), while they are often themselves really guilty of delivering a below average product where you can find yourself living in slum conditions due to no fault of your own.
  
  For example, I had a persistent black mold problem in a spare bedroom that hounded me persistently until it was nearly time to move out. (The problem was temporarily solved with bleach etc. but they never really were able to get to the root of it because their staff was always busy with other projects until I was a month from moving out....
  
  Another example, I had a one foot by one foot hole in my bathroom ceiling above the tub/shower due to faulty building maintenance and negligence (a water leak of the upstairs apartment and workers ignoring my banging on the door that water was leaking!). This was not repaired until about two weeks before we had inspectors come so the company could keep it's rental license.
  
  Besides all this they are fussy about having "assigned parking", yet they do not bother to actually mark the spaces with a sign or paint them. Basically, it is up to you to realize you are so many spaces from the dumpster etc. And I'm not sure how people ever know which spaces are for visitors other than keep their occasional mail notices on the topic and give them to any guests that might be staying with them.
  
  In addition to all the above, they are not set up like your typical landlord, or Property Management company. By this I mean there is no office that is in town, or at least easy to get to that you can walk in give them your check in the first three days of the month while you are doing errands etc. Their office is not set up to receive visitors at least not renters, and do not expect the customary three day grace period on your rent at the start of the month.
  
  Anyway, unless you are in danger of being homeless and got nobody else to rent from, I advise you to look elsewhere.
  
  
  

Maximizing profits, even over ethics, is bad practice. If more people complain about these things, perhaps things will change.

...Remember when "the customer is always right"..? We need a return to that kind of attitude.

 

[Fervent]

I'd say there are multiple considerations regarding posting a Yelp! review or any other sort of review. The first consideration would be the motivation of the post. Is it intended as a petty form of vengeance, or is it simply to warn others of what they might encounter? Is it written with the hopes of being compensated in some way to remove or otherwise edit it? The next consideration is the truthfulness of it, is it exagerrated in any way? Or deceptive in some other way? Are the opinions within it fair, or are they uncharitable and assume malicious intent? The next consideration is the possibility of hypocrasy, are the criticisms within it things that you are also guilty of? So while I see nothing inherently unethical about posting reviews, there are ethical and unethical ways of going about it.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

@Fervent I would probably challenge your first point fervent. There is a little spite on my part, but I see it as spite for a good cause. Basically, that is directed and moderated to at least achieve some kind of good outcome or end.


1) In Philippians 1:12-18 Paul speaks about people who preach the Gospel for bad reasons (they don't like him and actually hope it will stir up trouble for him). But he is nevertheless thankful that they preach it anyway.


2) That point became very clear and important a few years back when dealing with questionable ministers of my distant and not too distant past, especially ones in the charismatic movement where people believe they are a prophet or some other kind of minister and have special license to do questionable things like to berate people publicly for not giving to them the way they think they should etc. even strongly implying such people will be cursed by God etc. for not giving them a tithe of their bank account, inheritance or other income.


3) If you confront such people with specific Bible passages that seem to contradict what they are doing they tend to rely on motive questioning as a kind of a red herring to change the topic with the hopes of getting you on the defensive. They also like to attempt to use the "go to your brother in secret" passage also to get you on the defensive but this one is easy to refute when you look at the context, they often like to do this for things they are doing in public rather than private!


4) For such tactics I like to point out the nature of Truth both in the Greek and Hebrew. In the Greek especially Alethia points to things that are objectively true in fact etc. In this sense, the Bible also fits into other secular notions of logic etc. basically, it doesn't matter the motive if something is true and can be demonstrated as harmful and there is a good reason to take action etc. and this also does go back to saint Paul's earlier passage as well as being more interested in the outcome rather than the reasons for it.


5) There are many other related points I would make on related things like forgiveness especially from the Hebraic standpoint of Hesed etc. I actually draw lots of inspiration from Jesus as far as what he actually did in contrast to how people preach as far as WWJD? Jesus approach often mirrored his surrounding with the people he was around. He was very gentle and meek with the shy and the fragile, but often was the opposite with the hardnosed and the harsh.

 

[Fervent]

@Fervent I would probably challenge your first point fervent. There is a little spite on my part, but I see it as spite for a good cause. Basically, that is directed and moderated to at least achieve some kind of good outcome or end.


1) In Philippians 1:12-18 Paul speaks about people who preach the Gospel for bad reasons (they don't like him and actually hope it will stir up trouble for him). But he is nevertheless thankful that they preach it anyway.


2) That point became very clear and important a few years back when dealing with questionable ministers of my distant and not too distant past, especially ones in the charismatic movement where people believe they are a prophet or some other kind of minister and have special license to do questionable things like to berate people publicly for not giving to them the way they think they should etc. even strongly implying such people will be cursed by God etc. for not giving them a tithe of their bank account, inheritance or other income.


3) If you confront such people with specific Bible passages that seem to contradict what they are doing they tend to rely on motive questioning as a kind of a red herring to change the topic with the hopes of getting you on the defensive. They also like to attempt to use the "go to your brother in secret" passage also to get you on the defensive but this one is easy to refute when you look at the context, they often like to do this for things they are doing in public rather than private!


4) For such tactics I like to point out the nature of Truth both in the Greek and Hebrew. In the Greek especially Alethia points to things that are objectively true in fact etc. In this sense, the Bible also fits into other secular notions of logic etc. basically, it doesn't matter the motive if something is true and can be demonstrated as harmful and there is a good reason to take action etc. and this also does go back to saint Paul's earlier passage as well as being more interested in the outcome rather than the reasons for it.


5) There are many other related points I would make on related things like forgiveness especially from the Hebraic standpoint of Hesed etc. I actually draw lots of inspiration from Jesus as far as what he actually did in contrast to how people preach as far as WWJD? Jesus approach often mirrored his surrounding with the people he was around. He was very gentle and meek with the fragile, but often was the opposite with the hardnosed and the harsh.

I certainly wouldn't place these concerns as absolute, but I'm not sure I see the relevance of Paul being thankful the gospel was being preached regardless of the motive of those preaching it, as your use of it seems to be implying an ends justifies the means sort of ethic which I don't think is supportable.

The ethic I specifically have in mind regarding motive is Romans 12:18. As acting in a way that intends to damage another for the sake of damaging, or to get a petty vengeance, is not seeking to be at peace with all people. Demanding rights and entitlements is not in keeping with a servant mindset, as Paul points out when chastising believers for suing each other asking them "why not let yourselves be wronged? Why not let yourselves be cheated?"(1 Cor 6:7)

 

[Pavel Mosko]

I an ends justifies the means sort of ethic which I don't think is supportable

It's not really ends justifies the means... Actually, more along the lines of the Parable of the Unforgiving Servant, except I have been the one bending over backwards to be merciful to them for them previously...

On this stuff I got to say I trust my instincts because many things in life are not that simple but have a few different important considerations that need to be dealt with. In this case, I feel like I got to do this and in fact the review was finished two days ago and I feel good about it conscience wise. It's harsh but accurate and constructive. In all honesty, I really felt like I had to write it otherwise I would be carrying some kind of grudge against them etc. And I do believe this benefits the public, some organizations take advantage of the fact they got the power in most situations and are happy to use that to their own advantage.


I also realize much of my life I have had to face really strong criticism; rebukes being chewed out etc. While it has been painful, it also has often helped me in the long run. So, I am passing that blessing on, but in a much more measured way than what has been done to me in my past.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

I blasted a former land lord today in a Yelp review because they were extremely punitive in their close out fees and I had put up with a lot from them and believed I deserved better from them especially since they often did not hold up to their own end of things. I'm OK with what I wrote as far as my conscience goes but thought it might make an interesting thread because some Christians have different ideas about things like: gossip and back biting, getting revenge, and the general duties of Christians when it comes to warning the public.


My review of my former landlord (Company name withheld) in case you are interested or curious....

• I must second the bad reviews! I was going to give them a two-star rating because there were a few times they did give me timely help when I needed it, but I felt the need to warn the public off this property management company.
  
  1) All the stuff about them doing everything possible to extract money from you is true.
  
  A) I would emphasize the new scheme is to try to keep locking you into a yearly lease, rather than let you go month to month after the first year or two. Basically, they are always engineering to either move in a hurry when it is inconvenient or extend the lease so they can extract a lot of money from you when you have to move because that next big life change, new job etc.
  
  B) They are extremely punitive of enforcing the letter of the lease when it comes to any nickel and dime way to charge you. For example, if you were to leave behind some small easy to carry thing for a Maintenace guy like a step ladder (because you have a much better one than the one, he uses), they will charge $50 as if you were leaving a large hard to carry sofa. This kind of thing is very aggravating due to what I'm writing in 2) and is the main reason why I am writing this my first Yelp review.
  
  2) While they are extremely punitive, and I will add threatening in their communications (warning you of some new problem and how if you are found doing such and such you might be evicted), while they are often themselves really guilty of delivering a below average product where you can find yourself living in slum conditions due to no fault of your own.
  
  For example, I had a persistent black mold problem in a spare bedroom that hounded me persistently until it was nearly time to move out. (The problem was temporarily solved with bleach etc. but they never really were able to get to the root of it because their staff was always busy with other projects until I was a month from moving out....
  
  Another example, I had a one foot by one foot hole in my bathroom ceiling above the tub/shower due to faulty building maintenance and negligence (a water leak of the upstairs apartment and workers ignoring my banging on the door that water was leaking!). This was not repaired until about two weeks before we had inspectors come so the company could keep it's rental license.
  
  Besides all this they are fussy about having "assigned parking", yet they do not bother to actually mark the spaces with a sign or paint them. Basically, it is up to you to realize you are so many spaces from the dumpster etc. And I'm not sure how people ever know which spaces are for visitors other than keep their occasional mail notices on the topic and give them to any guests that might be staying with them.
  
  In addition to all the above, they are not set up like your typical landlord, or Property Management company. By this I mean there is no office that is in town, or at least easy to get to that you can walk in give them your check in the first three days of the month while you are doing errands etc. Their office is not set up to receive visitors at least not renters, and do not expect the customary three day grace period on your rent at the start of the month.
  
  Anyway, unless you are in danger of being homeless and got nobody else to rent from, I advise you to look elsewhere.
  
  

honestly i had a similar situation with my car lease. Toyota employee sat me down at lease end stating that they would do x and y for me and when i gave them my vehicle they claimed it's value was around $17,000 and could only sell it for $1000 more and then i went on their site after the negotiation and they were selling said car same year and make for $5000 more than they stated as well as the fact that they didn't do the x and y they told me they would do. I wrote a very aggressive yelp and review on other sites. They responded begging me to take it down, when i asked for a fair price as i basically sold the vehicle for over $5000 less than what they said they could sell it and for $2000 less about for what i could have gotten on car vana. They refused to give me anything and just ended with "i hope you'll do the right thing and take it down". Long story short i understand the importance of leaving a good review up and recommend you leave it up as i want good reviews like yours to stay to help warn people of the future if they continue.

 

[Fervent]

It's not really ends justifies the means... Actually, more along the lines of the Parable of the Unforgiving Servant, except I have been the one bending over backwards to be merciful to them for them previously...

On this stuff I got to say I trust my instincts because many things in life are not that simple but have a few different important considerations that need to be dealt with. In this case, I feel like I got to do this and in fact the review was finished two days ago and I feel good about it conscience wise. It's harsh but accurate and constructive. In all honesty, I really felt like I had to write it otherwise I would be carrying some kind of grudge against them etc. And I do believe this benefits the public, some organizations take advantage of the fact they got the power in most situations and are happy to use that to their own advantage.


I also realize much of my life I have had to face really strong criticism; rebukes being chewed out etc. While it has been painful, it also has often helped me. So, I am passing that blessing on, but in a much more measured way than what has been done to me in my past.

I agree many things are not simple, and the fact that you're sensitive enough to consider whether something as simple as writing a yelp post violates some form of ethic itself appears to be evidence of ethical character. I'm a staunch believer in virtue ethics, so right or wrong isn't in either rule-following/breaking or in motive but in resemblance to the Virtuous One. I'm not the biggest fan of WWJD, but I think if we modify it to "What would Jesus have me do?" we can more or less solve most ethical dilemmas.

 

[returntosender]

I blasted a former land lord today in a Yelp review because they were extremely punitive in their close out fees and I had put up with a lot from them and believed I deserved better from them especially since they often did not hold up to their own end of things. I'm OK with what I wrote as far as my conscience goes but thought it might make an interesting thread because some Christians have different ideas about things like: gossip and back biting, getting revenge, and the general duties of Christians when it comes to warning the public.


My review of my former landlord (Company name withheld) in case you are interested or curious....

• I must second the bad reviews! I was going to give them a two-star rating because there were a few times they did give me timely help when I needed it, but I felt the need to warn the public off this property management company.
  
  1) All the stuff about them doing everything possible to extract money from you is true.
  
  A) I would emphasize the new scheme is to try to keep locking you into a yearly lease, rather than let you go month to month after the first year or two. Basically, they are always engineering to either move in a hurry when it is inconvenient or extend the lease so they can extract a lot of money from you when you have to move because that next big life change, new job etc.
  
  B) They are extremely punitive of enforcing the letter of the lease when it comes to any nickel and dime way to charge you. For example, if you were to leave behind some small easy to carry thing for a Maintenace guy like a step ladder (because you have a much better one than the one, he uses), they will charge $50 as if you were leaving a large hard to carry sofa. This kind of thing is very aggravating due to what I'm writing in 2) and is the main reason why I am writing this my first Yelp review.
  
  2) While they are extremely punitive, and I will add threatening in their communications (warning you of some new problem and how if you are found doing such and such you might be evicted), while they are often themselves really guilty of delivering a below average product where you can find yourself living in slum conditions due to no fault of your own.
  
  For example, I had a persistent black mold problem in a spare bedroom that hounded me persistently until it was nearly time to move out. (The problem was temporarily solved with bleach etc. but they never really were able to get to the root of it because their staff was always busy with other projects until I was a month from moving out....
  
  Another example, I had a one foot by one foot hole in my bathroom ceiling above the tub/shower due to faulty building maintenance and negligence (a water leak of the upstairs apartment and workers ignoring my banging on the door that water was leaking!). This was not repaired until about two weeks before we had inspectors come so the company could keep it's rental license.
  
  Besides all this they are fussy about having "assigned parking", yet they do not bother to actually mark the spaces with a sign or paint them. Basically, it is up to you to realize you are so many spaces from the dumpster etc. And I'm not sure how people ever know which spaces are for visitors other than keep their occasional mail notices on the topic and give them to any guests that might be staying with them.
  
  In addition to all the above, they are not set up like your typical landlord, or Property Management company. By this I mean there is no office that is in town, or at least easy to get to that you can walk in give them your check in the first three days of the month while you are doing errands etc. Their office is not set up to receive visitors at least not renters, and do not expect the customary three day grace period on your rent at the start of the month.
  
  Anyway, unless you are in danger of being homeless and got nobody else to rent from, I advise you to look elsewhere.
  
  

 

[returntosender]

Yikes!! That's bad. Awful case of mold. You all could get seriously I'll. I would report them to the landlord board. Don't feel guilty about protecting your family and others.
I use yelp when i need to. People need to know the negatives as well as the positives.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

People need to know the negatives as well as the positives.

Yep, and that is why I gave a really good belated review to a trash removal service in Charlotte NC that treated me right.

I am doing my review of my Junk King experience a few years late, having horrible moveout experience with a former landlord and writing a review on it made me think, I should write the opposite for decent companies like Junk King that were good to me.

My Junk King experience wasn't flawless in spite of the max rating. They were late on arrival, due to bad luck, traffic, a van breaking down I think one hour and 45 minutes before the time they originally said they would arrive. They did however give me timely updates on things, so I am willing to be understanding on things that were out of their control.

They were really great when they arrived, fast efficient, courteous and professional! The one thing I really liked about Junk King and that prompted me to write the review was how they discounted my bill at different times, when I was throwing away something valuable. You see, much of the compensation they get, their bonus so to speak comes from picking up useful stuff from themselves by doing their job. Anyway, I was throwing out some good stuff and my bill did get marked down a lot from that I think I ended up paying less than half of the estimate. (I was quite happy at the time, but even more happy in retrospect when a former landlord / Property management company did opposite to me from useful stuff left over in a messy apartment that I knew for a fact that it's main workman wanted or could use. They charged me big bucks, for leaving light weight computer and consumer electronics, prompting me to write a bad review of my total experience with them and all their past failings etc.)

Anyway, I had fond memories of my one-time experience with Junk King and would gladly use them for future removal services if I continued to live in the area, so I recommend them for folks living in the greater Charlotte area.