The Ethics of Cloning

[Gwenyfur]

but are clones truly human, genetically probably...??? But at the same time, should a clone truly have the same "human/civil" rights as an uncloned human?

 

[DailyBlessings]

but are clones truly human, genetically probably...??? But at the same time, should a clone truly have the same "human/civil" rights as an uncloned human?

Of course they are, and should. They are created by the same processes and with the same materials as anyone else.

 

[laptoppop]

But would clones really be the same, or would there be differences too?

 

[chaoschristian]

The world's commercial crop of bananas are all clones. If you are buying and eating bananas bought from a generic grocery store, you are buying and eating clones.

The cloning of the banana crop has made bananas affordable and available to the general US market, and provides a serious economic driver for many developing nations.

However, there is a fungal infection that has proved resistant to available and commercially viable fungicides. If a solutions isn't found soon, we could witness the collapse of the world's banana market within the next decade.

Not that bananas will go extinct. There are legacy crops and niche crops that aren't vulnerable tot the fungus. It's just that bananas will be $50 a pound rather than 89 cents.

 

[laptoppop]

Ahhh, so some diversity within the sameness can be good.

 

[DailyBlessings]

The world's commercial crop of bananas are all clones. If you are buying and eating bananas bought from a generic grocery store, you are buying and eating clones.

The cloning of the banana crop has made bananas affordable and available to the general US market, and provides a serious economic driver for many developing nations.

However, there is a fungal infection that has proved resistant to available and commercially viable fungicides. If a solutions isn't found soon, we could witness the collapse of the world's banana market within the next decade.

Not that bananas will go extinct. There are legacy crops and niche crops that aren't vulnerable tot the fungus. It's just that bananas will be $50 a pound rather than 89 cents.

That is the problem with monocropping, and why it isn't actually good for the "third world". But in that respect, perhaps a collapse of the commercial banana, and the resulting diversification of banana types found in the market, would be a good thing.

I think it is clear that if humanity were to cease reproduction by other methods than cloning, it might not be a very good thing. However, this seems an unlikely scenario given the inordinate cost. Those in the price bracket for such operations are not the most productive segment in terms of offspring, nor would they want to be (more people with wealth= less money for the men on the top)

 

[USincognito]

I think clones would be a bane on society and would, deservedly so, be marginalized. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable meeting or working with clones.

 

[chaoschristian]

As has been pointed out earlier in the thread, cloning does not equate to xeroxing people, with memories, personalities, etc, in tact.

One benefit of cloning, if one were so predisposed, would be to test the various theories on nature vs nurture that exist in psychology and sociology.

Right now twin studies are used, but I've always have been dissatisfied with the low sample populations in those studies.

Now, imagine the boon to the social sciences if one could have thousands of clones of the same person, but study that person within a myriad of socio-economic and cultural settings!

But would clones really be the same, or would there be differences too?

 

[chaoschristian]

So you have a problem with twins and triplets and what not?

I think clones would be a bane on society and would, deservedly so, be marginalized. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable meeting or working with clones.

 

[DailyBlessings]

Actually, since mostly the wealthy would clone themselves, such an echelon would more likely be "ruling elite" than "marginalized drudge". The preservation of certain genetic traits has long been a factor in the perception of class- examine for instance the endogamous marriages of the monied families of Europe, or the use of headboards and similar deformative methods in the Classical world.

 

[chaoschristian]

Seriously, I have this image of everyone thinking the same things, wearing the same things... all 1984-style.

This is over the top. People wearing the same things, like that's ever going to happen.

 

[chaoschristian]

This is over the top. People wearing the same things, like that's ever going to happen.

I agree. Clones simply won't be thinking the same things and agreeing with one another.

 

[USincognito]

So you have a problem with twins and triplets and what not?

Identical multiple births are the product of a well known and understood natural process. The embryo just splits a few more times before serious baby making gets started. They are also the same age and raised (generally in a similar environment).

None of this would be true for clones. If one of my friends were cloned today, and twenty years from now I meet someone who looks almost like he did 10 or 20 years ago I would just creep me out.

 

[DailyBlessings]

This is over the top. People wearing the same things, like that's ever going to happen.

Too much.....

 

[USincognito]

Seriously, I have this image of everyone thinking the same things, wearing the same things... all 1984-style.

A world of wide-spread cloning would not be the "Gun on Ice Planet Zero" episode of Battlestar Galactica. Obviously they're not going to dress alike, but we've a very visual species. What happens if someone you know has been cloned and they die and years later you meet their clone? I look a lot like my dad and when I went to his funeral I most of the attendees had never met or seen me before and I know a few we're taken aback by how much I looked like a younger healthier version of my dad.

How much stranger would it be if the appearance were almost identical?

 

[RavenPoe]

I'm have a "Clone Wars" flashback. If clones had no souls would it be moral to make them for war? Would not a clone feel pain?

 

[BigToe]

I have no problem with a human clone being given all the human rights as a nonclone. Nor do I think that is ultimately the question, at least it isn't really the question I was wondering. I am more interested in the ethical implications of the three types of cloning and if each carries the same weight ethically.

 

[Willtor]

I'm have a "Clone Wars" flashback. If clones had no souls would it be moral to make them for war? Would not a clone feel pain?

Tickle them, do they not laugh? Prick them, do they not bleed? Wrong them... will they not revenge?

Personally, I'm very glad for all the diversity in society.

 

[ravenscape]

"Send in the Clones" -- Danilo O'Dell, TNG.

 

[BigToe]

Tickle them, do they not laugh? Prick them, do they not bleed? Wrong them... will they not revenge?

Personally, I'm very glad for all the diversity in society.

Oh yeah, that's where I was going with my previous post. I wouldn't treat a clone as inferior. However, I am quite a fan of diversity too. But then, I went to a boarding school with students from around the globe. Not that clones wouldn't bring in some aspect of diversity with different life experiences. But diversity doesn't stop with the experiences one has had. And with genetic predisposition to a lot of the same things health wise, perhaps the overlap in life experiences would be greater between two people who happen to be clones than two people who aren't.

And if cloning becomes widespread and affordable (talking long time in the future), that would dilute the gene pool and limit diversity.

As for cloning for the purpose of raising organs/tissues/etc to save the life of an already existing individual, I don't really see the problem with it. I think that a lot of technology that develops can be used for good even if taking it further might not be for the species best interest.