The "elect" are the European Christian Nations.

[dana b]

 

[dana b]

 

[dana b]

 

[Interplanner]

No can do, dana. Don't rely on Rev for essential definitions. Go to doctrinally strong and non-symbolic passages. In Mt 24 & //s for ex., the elect are those in Judea in the 6th decade of intense turmoil. In Rom 8-11, the elect are those who believe on justification by Christ alone.

--Inter

 

[LastSeven]

dana, you are being distracted.

 

[dana b]

No can do, dana. Don't rely on Rev for essential definitions. Go to doctrinally strong and non-symbolic passages. In Mt 24 & //s for ex., the elect are those in Judea in the 6th decade of intense turmoil. In Rom 8-11, the elect are those who believe on justification by Christ alone.

--Inter

The elect are the Christian nations just as the chosen people were the Israelite nations. Whats so difficult about that. It works out a lot better than the so many jumbled up interloped opinions and ideas that anyone else seems to have. And believe it or not at this time, it is true.

The "elect" are as the "chosen." They are the two Covenants made by God with Mankind. They were communicated by Moses and by Jesus.

 

[John S]

The Elect consists of 144,000 first born males, who never lie and who have never had sexual relations - 12,000 from each Tribe of the House of Israel, except for Dan, from which the antichrist will come.
The Tribes of Israel not only make up most of Europe but their "children" also migrated to North and South America, Australia, and possibly a few other places.

 

[dana b]

The Elect consists of 144,000 first born males, who never lie and who have never had sexual relations - 12,000 from each Tribe of the House of Israel, except for Dan, from which the antichrist will come.
The Tribes of Israel not only make up most of Europe but their "children" also migrated to North and South America, Australia, and possibly a few other places.

The number 144,000 is used three times in the book of Revelation. It is used in the 7th, 14th and the 21 chapter. It is used to seal the time of 6000 years. At the end of 6000 years, such as today after the year 2000AD, Christ's followers are sealed in their own land. This corresponds to how Moses's followers became sealed and safe in the Land of Canaan. No outsiders were supposed to be tolerated there. That is what "sealed" effectively means in the physical geographical perspective of which there certainly is one.

The number means the conclusion of six days and therefore the preparation for the day of rest. In 2 Pet.3;8 it tells us that God's time will be a thousand years for us. Here is the formula of the number 144,000

...............................24 hours in a day
.........................times 6 days of Genesis Creation

..............................144

.....................times 1000 - a day = 1000 years

................equals 144,000


So each of the three times that this number comes up in Revelation it is the close of another 7 chapters. The Book of Revelations repeats the same story three times but in a physical, emotional/historical and a mental/spiritual dimension. There is much much more to this that collaborates it all together.

 

[ViaCrucis]

No.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[dana b]

No.

-CryptoLutheran

But the tribe of Reuben matches the Roman Empire during it's beginning.

 

[dana b]

 

[dana b]

Spain and France are today the Christian "regeneration" of Simeon and Levi. Jesus referred to the coming "regeneration." The Christian nations which formed following him are just that today.

 

[dana b]

 

[John S]

The Tribe of Reuben - which shall never be first (Genesis 49), MAY be the current nation of Ireland.
Dan MAY be the present country of Italy because the Roman Empire had the judicial system (Genesis 49) that had been the model for Great Britain and then the U.S.

 

[Interplanner]

You're right Dana, it is not complicated to understand. I didn't say that. I meant to say it has nothing to do with NT theology in Rom 9-11, Eph 2-3, Gal 3-4, Hebrews, 2 Cor 3-5. Did you not know those were complete treatments of what you are talking about already, by the apostles?

--Inter

 

[Interplanner]

To Dana B,
I hope you'll drop this nonsense today and go help a neighbor who is needy. This is not what the apostles sounded like, and is not our mission, and need not take up another minute of our time, got it?

--Inter

 

[LastSeven]

The 144,000 is clearly a symbolic number. There is no way God would call only 144,000 virgin jewish men "elect" when there are millions of non-Jewish, non-virgin men and women all over the globe who have the life of Jesus inside of them.

144,000 is 12 x 12 x 1000. It symbolizes completeness.

 

[dana b]

The 144,000 is clearly a symbolic number. There is no way God would call only 144,000 virgin jewish men "elect" when there are millions of non-Jewish, non-virgin men and women all over the globe who have the life of Jesus inside of them.

144,000 is 12 x 12 x 1000. It symbolizes completeness.

Yes Seven, the number 144,000 completes the set of each seven chapter of Revelation. It is at the end of Rev.7, 14, and 21.

And there is more to this special number. See at the right hand bottom of this chart how it is enmessed all the more in Biblical cosmology.

 

[dana b]

To Dana B,
I hope you'll drop this nonsense today and go help a neighbor who is needy. This is not what the apostles sounded like, and is not our mission, and need not take up another minute of our time, got it?

--Inter

It is what the diciples were concerned with. Look at what they asked Jesus.

"Lord, wilt thou at this time restore the kingdom to Israel." Act.1;6


They asked it because Jesus had previously said to them;

" ye who have followed me will sit upon twelve thrones." Matt.19;28


This stuff is really worth studying if you want to see what is happening today politically in this world.

 

[John S]

There will be 12,000 Jews, the Tribe of Judah (The ONLY Tribe to maintain it's identity - Genesis 49).
The rest of the Elect, 132,000, will be Christians.