The difference between OT and NT

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In worship, there have been times I have been overcome with emotions and felt close to God. I go to a Charismatic church and worship is very much an emotional experience.

But the thing is, although I FEEL that these emotions were from God and I'm sure they were, there is no way to prove that these feelings were truly from God. I have seen others experience the same thing in church services and yet remain unconverted. Our feelings can be manipulated and we can be deceived by them. If the heart is not changed, the experiences are nothing more than an emotional feeling of the flesh.


Saying the above I still believe God reveals Himself through experiences in our lives, but the fact is: our feelings are untrustworthy and unreliable when it means a foundation for our faith. Faith is only to be placed in Jesus Christ, His word is our firm foundation, we know that He loves us not because we cried in church yesterday but because the Word says He laid down His life for us. We place our faith in the latter because it is unchanging, although our tears will eventually dry up His word will remain firm and true.

I trust in the unchanging (unlike feelings) word of God, there is no shadow of turning in Christ and His word, He is the same yesterday, today and forever.

1 Corinthians 13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

Faith is like an emotion.
It's good feeling to have faith in the Bible, isn't it?
It may be only in my case, but I don't know the Bible tells me truth or not, to be honest, I just believe it is true or truth in it, because I don't know what is true.

But I know I am believing in God is that God is good against evil bad, I know that as matter of the fact and nobody can tell me difference.
And I don't believe in God for eternal life or to get in Heaven, it's not for me and I believe that I am in Heaven if I worship God and obey God's heart.
When I can do that I don't need the Bible, but the realty is that I will keep reading it to find where is the heart of God not just for reading sake.

We can believe the Bible as is and still God can say your heart wasn't with my heart.

Mtthew7: 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Through my life, I've met so many people claim they are Christians because they are brought up that way.
Certainly they know the words of Bible 100 times more than I do.
But I've lived through with the words and spirit many years.
One of those words is "Let not your heart be troubled."
Knowing the words and knowing what that words mean to me are 2 different things, specially when I felt the meaning through Holy Spirit at that time.
It may not mean anything to you, if you are not in spiritual world of the Bible.
I know it is between Spirit and I, and I don't see no-one between us, meaning
between Holy Spirit and you relationship is yours only.
However, I'd like to share with someone who has similar experience.
That makes me feel the existence of spirit between us.
I call that a Church with spirit.
I have thought faith is the most important thing for a Christian, but 1 Corinthians 13 changed my mind and these words were brought to me by someone through a Christian forum about 10 years ago.
I don't know many words of the Bible, but when you know love is greater than faith and if you know what love is, even you do wrong you know you did wrong.
You may not correct it right away by your will, but when you have love of God in your heart, it will correct yourself soon or later.
Trust me on this one.
It happened to me.
And that's what I've been telling my friends around me, some are now out of prison, some are still in prison.
 
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SoldierOfSoul

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It may be only in my case, but I don't know the Bible tells me truth or not

"If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. He that believes on the Son of God has the witness in himself: he that believes not God has made him a liar; because he believes not the record that God gave of his Son." (1 John 5:9,10)

We can believe the Bible as is and still God can say your heart wasn't with my heart.

Christianity is a religion of absolutes, it is truth, Jesus was born of a virgin, died and was resurrected, there are fundamentals that must be believed before salvation can be received. Emotional experiences are important as far as they go, but not when it comes to the truth. Our emotions can deceive us, we need to know the truth in Christ and it will set us free. Jesus is the truth and His word is our guide to full assurance in a faith foundationally grounded in the Cross.

You may not correct it right away by your will, but when you have love of God in your heart, it will correct yourself soon or later.

I agree with this, love for the brethren is an important aspect of assurance, if we love others we know the Spirit of God is within us working. Holiness in life and a desire not to sin is a another proof that God is living in us.
 
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"If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. He that believes on the Son of God has the witness in himself: he that believes not God has made him a liar; because he believes not the record that God gave of his Son." (1 John 5:9,10)



Christianity is a religion of absolutes, it is truth, Jesus was born of a virgin, died and was resurrected, there are fundamentals that must be believed before salvation can be received. Emotional experiences are important as far as they go, but not when it comes to the truth. Our emotions can deceive us, we need to know the truth in Christ and it will set us free. Jesus is the truth and His word is our guide to full assurance in a faith foundationally grounded in the Cross.



I agree with this, love for the brethren is an important aspect of assurance, if we love others we know the Spirit of God is within us working. Holiness in life and a desire not to sin is a another proof that God is living in us.


Love is blind, they say.
But a religion doesn't have to be blind, because God gave us wisdom after all.
And the Bible encourages us to use it.

1 Corinthians 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him. 30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”
(This is inserted afterword.)

You believe whatever suit you, that is fine with me, I respect that and I will never yell at you that my belief is right, because only God knows what is right.
I do not believe God literally created Adam with clay, but it's rather metaphor than a literal.
However, I don't know what the metaphor means, and no-one knows but God.
This kind of attitude toward the Bible is more acceptable by anyone included Agnostics.
If anyone against it, it's fine too.

If we don't know, say so.
We don't have to pretend "knows it all", because the Bible is written so, until Holy Spirit says so to you.

And love each other, this is the best attitude real Christians have.
 
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heymikey80

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6 Therefore, as you received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in him, 7 rooted and built up in him and established in the faith, just as you were taught, abounding in thanksgiving. 8See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the world, and not according to Christ. 9For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, 10and you have been filled in him, who is the head of all rule and authority. 11In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead. 13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him. 16Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. 17 These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ. 18Let no one disqualify you, insisting on asceticism and worship of angels, going on in detail about visions, puffed up without reason by his sensuous mind, 19and not holding fast to the Head, from whom the whole body, nourished and knit together through its joints and ligaments, grows with a growth that is from God. 20If with Christ you died to the elemental spirits of the world, why, as if you were still alive in the world, do you submit to regulations— 21 "Do not handle, Do not taste, Do not touch" 22( referring to things that all perish as they are used)—according to human precepts and teachings? 23These have indeed an appearance of wisdom in promoting self-made religion and asceticism and severity to the body, but they are of no value in stopping the indulgence of the flesh. Col 2
 
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now faith

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I Believe that Our lord's parables Were intended to present the gospel Terminology that was simple to understand I also believe Spiritual discernment Is necessary. The parables Are relevant And multi faceted. My understanding for this parable is that god is faithful to his word and that god is not a resecter of persons in other words you can be born in church go to seminary n do great work but nevertheless christ sacrifice was for all who would believe the the theith on the cross is a perfect example and is relative to the parable has he entered paradise even before the apostles.
 
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I Believe that Our lord's parables Were intended to present the gospel Terminology that was simple to understand I also believe Spiritual discernment Is necessary. The parables Are relevant And multi faceted. My understanding for this parable is that god is faithful to his word and that god is not a resecter of persons in other words you can be born in church go to seminary n do great work but nevertheless christ sacrifice was for all who would believe the the theith on the cross is a perfect example and is relative to the parable has he entered paradise even before the apostles.

How wonderful it is, now faith!
I am with you.
God can be everywhere, for He is almighty God, in your heart and in my heart at the same time and will listen to our problems accordingly.
I know so from my experience whether you believe it or not.
Spiritual discernment comes from Holy Spirit.
How do I know it?
It's not what I think but it's what given to me by Holy Spirit.

This is very important for me, because when I read a parable and I don't know the meaning of it or I can think a few different ways, Holy Spirit opens up for me what it is, if I keep seeking and if I am eager.

It could be my subliminal suggestion, however, my honesty to myself is the key here.
Like I said, God answers to everyone accordingly and like you said, now faith, God is faithful to his word.
That's the reason I keep reading the same phrase in the Bible over and over.

Gospel may have been simple to understand for Jewish people near two thousands years ago, still many Jewish people live in OT world.

For example,
Genesis 4:5 but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast. 6 Then the LORD said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? 7 If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.”

I do not know for sure why 4:4The LORD looked with favor on Abel and his offering.
I do not know for sure why the LORD said 7: If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? after He did not look with favor on Cain and his offering.
Is the reason because Cain killed Abel afterword or is the reason because the difference of offerings?

Didn't God of OT like veggies?
 
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now faith

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Cain sought to honor himself instead of god.when adam and eve sined in the garden they tried to covet their sin from god. God chose to do it for them by using coats from animal skin this was the first blood sacrafice.The bible doesent say what animal was used i belive it was a lamb. The old testament has many examples of blood sacrafice they are a precurser to the finial blood shed at the cross for all mankind.we are covered by the lamb of god for our sins. The main thing is god chose this way in the garden and god does not change.the old testament shows and gives us deeper understanding in our walk with god. Cain sought to honor himself much like satan and was not obedient to god by not providing a blood sacrafice in the way able did.
 
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now faith

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I ment cover their sin not covet my voice to text has bugs please excuse.and i may have posted ssme blog twice.I cant imageine the horror that adam and eve felt when god killed the animal for their covering. I love the passage when god asked who told you that you are naked.i was always confused as to why christ had to shed his blood. Now i know god does no change
 
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Cain sought to honor himself instead of god.when adam and eve sined in the garden they tried to covet their sin from god. God chose to do it for them by using coats from animal skin this was the first blood sacrafice.The bible doesent say what animal was used i belive it was a lamb. The old testament has many examples of blood sacrafice they are a precurser to the finial blood shed at the cross for all mankind.we are covered by the lamb of god for our sins. The main thing is god chose this way in the garden and god does not change.the old testament shows and gives us deeper understanding in our walk with god. Cain sought to honor himself much like satan and was not obedient to god by not providing a blood sacrafice in the way able did.


The Sin.
Where did it come from?
Obviously Adam did not have it before he ate the fruit of knowing bad from good, because all he must have had was good since he could see or hear God which God is nothing but good and all light without darkness.
I guess that Adam was a spiritual being without sinful body when he lived in the garden of Eden.
Therefore, I think, after our death with good spirit we can see Jesus face to face without any hesitation, because there will be no sinful body.
Before he realized they are naked which was before they ate the fruit, Adam did not have sin or a sinful body.
Therefore he could not commit a sin.
What I'd like to think is that when they ate the fruit, God instantaneously gave them sinful body as God planned.

> i belive it was a lamb.

Now faith, I deeply appreciate you thought.
You showed us your imagination toward the Bible and this may come from the deep thought about God.
This is what I treasure in conversation of other brothers and sisters.
It may not be written in an exact word or not even suggested, but the heart feeling idea is what God may have meant, without it Jesus could be a mere prophet or just another story teller.

Nowadays, we all have a pc and we can read the Bible on it and we can "google" any words in the Bible.
I do not have vast knowledge of the Bible, but if I want to, I can find information about any words by clicking my mouse.
So, without posting your idea of the words of the Book, you just tell me where it is in the Bible , I can read it later.

The original sin is believed in our flesh inherited from Adam and Eve among Christians - at least that is my understanding, there is no word of original sin in the Bible.

Here is what I've found in Wikipedia about "Original sin."

Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—
13 To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law. 14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

15 But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many! 16 Nor can the gift of God be compared with the result of one man’s sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!

18 Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people. 19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

20 The law was brought in so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21 so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans says because all sinned -
Moses let us know what sin is, Jesus let us know where the sin is.
The sin is in flesh not in spirit, that's why Jesus put himself on the cross, sacrificed his blood.

I understand that, but I am not a ancient Hebrew, I don't understand it like them.
I know even human sacrifice in Aztecan religion or custom, however, how did it get to human's mind?

Laying flowers for someone who died, it's a symbolic action to console the spirit of the dead.
Actually it's consoling our sole and spirit who is alive.
Jesus died for living human.
So, we can live in Heaven without death, if we have love to each other.

And those who do that and those who meat each other, I think that is a beautiful church in the eye of God.


1 Corinthians 15: 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he “has put everything under his feet.”[c] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

We all die because of sin.
If we don't know what is sin, where it came from, why we have it, we may not know why Jesus died for us.

I believe I can see my sin in the bottom of my deep heart and sin is there where even I could not see-the sin I could commit without myself knowing it.
Personally, that's why I need Holy Spirit here in my heart.
 
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now faith

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The sin came from disobedience by eating of the tree of knowedge between good and evil, god forbid them to eat. disobedience to god is sin, therefor they were cast out and fulfiled what god told them if you eat of you will die. Until then they knew not sin or death.
 
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now faith

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Satan tempted Eve he told her you will not surly die. Satan was a liar from the beginning he was a ark angel leading praise in the presence of god. He sought to be worshiped himself. God made man in his own image he gave man free will this is the perfection of god in that we are not mindless creatures who cannot make our own choices.
 
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The sin came from disobedience the tree of knowlage between good and evil god forbid them to eat disobedience to god is sin therefor they were cast out and fulfiled what god told them if you eat of you will die. Until then they knew not sin or death

Of course.
We are born with sinful flesh inherited from Adam and Eve according to the Bible.

>Until then they knew not sin or death

This is the reason why they lived in the garden with God.
When God created Adam, Adam was created perfect like God, otherwise he could not have lived with God.

Adam never had a sinful flesh until the serpent deceived Eve to eat the fruit.
This is my question.
We can sin easily because of our flesh inherited from Adam and Eve.
However, they (Adam & Eve) committed sin.
Where did the sin come from?

If I can say that Adam and Eve were like babies when they lived in the garden, since they did not know good and bad, anything they did must have pleased God.

When a baby did some thing wrong without any intention to do bad because the baby did not have knowledge to do wrong, his/her mother could not punish the intention of the baby.

But God did.
Not only Adam and Eve, but all of us human being.
It must be God's plan for us to have sins.
And because of our sin, Jesus was planned to come and dwelt among us for our redemption.

It seems to me somewhat similar things happened to Cain.

>Cain sought to honor himself instead of god.

True.
But, God did not look on Cain and his offering with favor.
So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.
I feel sympathy for Cain.
It was the ultimate joy when I felt the existence of Holy Spirit.
It must be the ultimate disappointment when I find God doesn't like me.
Why am I here, what I am here for, if God doesn't love me?
And we all are the descendants of Cain.
Is it the reason why we kill each other and go to wars to kill millions?
God was the one sent a serpent to deceive Eve.

I can't help this feeling inside of me: God, in OT, tested and punished human as much as He loved human. On the contrary Jesus never punished a human with His mighty power as far as my knowledge goes.
 
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LilLamb219

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Of course.
We are born with sinful flesh inherited from Adam and Eve according to the Bible.

>Until then they knew not sin or death

This is the reason why they lived in the garden with God.
When God created Adam, Adam was created perfect like God, otherwise he could not have lived with God.

Adam never had a sinful flesh until the serpent deceived Eve to eat the fruit.
This is my question.
We can sin easily because of our flesh inherited from Adam and Eve.
However, they (Adam & Eve) committed sin.
Where did the sin come from?

If I can say that Adam and Eve were like babies when they lived in the garden, since they did not know good and bad, anything they did must have pleased God.

When a baby did some thing wrong without any intention to do bad because the baby did not have knowledge to do wrong, his/her mother could not punish the intention of the baby.

But God did.
Not only Adam and Eve, but all of us human being.
It must be God's plan for us to have sins.
And because of our sin, Jesus was planned to come and dwelt among us for our redemption.

It seems to me somewhat similar things happened to Cain.

>Cain sought to honor himself instead of god.

True.
But, God did not look on Cain and his offering with favor.
So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.
I feel sympathy for Cain.
It was the ultimate joy when I felt the existence of Holy Spirit.
It must be the ultimate disappointment when I find God doesn't like me.
Why am I here, what I am here for, if God doesn't love me?
And we all are the descendants of Cain.
Is it the reason why we kill each other and go to wars to kill millions?
God was the one sent a serpent to deceive Eve.

I can't help this feeling inside of me: God, in OT, tested and punished human as much as He loved human. On the contrary Jesus never punished a human with His mighty power as far as my knowledge goes.

You're accusing God of creating sin and He did not do that. That is not scriptural. He knew that Adam and Eve would sin though and He planned to redeem us with the Savior. You can't just fill in the blanks and accuse God of things that aren't biblical to make them all tidy for yourself.
 
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now faith

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You must understand gods love. He created man in his image he has emotions but we cannot fathom them. We know in our heart gods love but can we understand his pain his anger because of our continuous disobedience. He is our father he has shown great mercy on mankind through his ultimate sacrifice on the cross. The holy trinity is far beyond our comprehension but before we can draw closer to god we cannot just assume because god loves us and we have the gift of free will that god will stand idle and allow us to destroy our selves with sin.we have to look at the result from Cains sin he was jealous of able and killed him able was innocent. Satan is truly no threat to god he is a threat to gods creation due to his desire to be exulted as god. God could destroy him instantly but god even had given him mercy. We cannot grasp the full understanding of gods kingdom. Paul like nd it to looking through a glass and trying to clearly see what's on the other side. This context relates to the temporal world we reside in to gods celestial world. God did not leave us to Satan's will he gave us power over him. Even gods angels have the power to rebuke him. Our own carnal minds open the door we make the choice to life or death it is even in our own mouth blessings or cursing this is neither from god or Satan its our own free will.through the cross man has the power to go before the throne of god if we accept christ and believe. This power given should be cherished.It is often misunderstood because Satan and mans church's want us to believe were victims of gods wrath and are helpless to change our lives because we are mere unworthy sinners. I know this is philosophy but another time if needed I will provide Scriptures to support my references. Answering another statement we did not all come from Cain Adam had other children one of name is Seth.
 
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>You must understand gods love.

I am trying.
I am honest to my heart, I don't pretend to understand it when I have a little doubt such as an impression of the difference between God in OT and NT.
I feel the ultimate love in Jesus, not only it is mentioned in John 1:14 e.g., Jesus was patient to wait for disciples to believe Him is God.
My favorite part is, " “Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.” 28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
“Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

Many agnostic people don't believe the Bible as is.
I did not believe it first from bottom of my heart, with thinking if I said I believe that a pig is filthy to eat, I am lying to God which even NT suggest pigs are filthy animals. Mat.7:6, Mat.8:31

You must be an ancient Jewish to understand why pigs are filthy to eat, certainly seems they don't mind live in a filthy place.
May be pigs were food of gentiles and ancient Jewish people lived in a land where didn't suit for pigs?

I am a thinker as much as a believer.
I don't believe in the existence of God as Creator, but I believe He left the "Nature" for us with a rule how the nature turns on the Earth and the Universe.

When I see mountains and sun-set, I think of God Creator who created this many millions years ago, but I don't see Him there, no one has seen God at any time-Jon 1:18
Instead, we have Jesus and Holy Spirit, of course it's my own idea and no one else's.
What I like to say is that it's my feeling and idea about God, and it always comes from the words of the Bible.
My question is not against Christianity, I will seek what true Christianity is rest of my life.
Because I live my life with God, Jesus in my heart, between us, except the Bible no room for any one in there.

Now, you know I am not trying to disturb any other Christians if he/she has the same relationship as I have.
I respect their idea and relationship with God whatever it is, even it's not Christianity too.

Because I am writing this not only to you, but also to God.

I do not understand many part of the Bible such as virgin Mary e.g. in my brain, but in my heart the Bible tells truth, therefore I believe my question will be answered soon.
 
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LilLamb219

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One thing to consider...God was preserving a set of people for Himself. He wanted them to be healthy so that they would thrive.

Think about pork. We now know things about pork such as that it needs to be cooked at a specific temperature to be safe to eat. It needs to be refrigerated. Etc... These things the Hebrews/Israelites could not have always done and would have been ill a lot.

Just something for you to consider as to why God did something in the OT.
 
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now faith

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I apologize if I have confused the issues in my posting. The issue of pork and other ordenances of the law were for sanitary reasons. Paul addressed this in the new testament and Peter also as to the incumberances the Jews were trying to impose on the gentiles that were saved and had received the holy spirit. Christ also questioned the trivial circumstances they would criticized him for and responded by rebuking them. I am confused as to your statement that you don't believe the existance of god as a creator and left nature for us.this statement would lead someone to reason that you are influenced by a belief called pantheism in which nature is a spiritual being. Forgive me if I misinterpreted your statement. But panthesin negates belief in christ. Or belief in god and they are one in the same.you cannot say god is not the creator and have true belief in christ if this was so christ would be just a prophet separate from god and his sacrifice would be meaningless and we would find salvation from so called mother earth.
 
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Aibrean

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The Bible is whole truth or its not. I agree with now faith, if you don't believe God is the creator, then how can you believe anything else written in the Bible? Christianity is trinitarian and God the Father is an integral piece of the foundation.
 
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