The "Default Position"

[ChetSinger]

Yes, that's been established. But there is no evidence that any ancient society interacted with anything supernatural.

At this point I'll let this drop. I think it's going off-topic.

 

[justlookinla]

Atheism is a decision, a choice. Newborns do not have the awareness to make a choice, a decision concerning the existence of God. They're neither atheists or theists, that's not part of their awareness/consciousness.

 

[selfinflikted]

At this point I'll let this drop. I think it's going off-topic.

Eh. It's my thread. If you want to discuss something off-topic here, I won't mind. I rather enjoy the tangents, sometimes.

 

[selfinflikted]

Atheism is a decision, a choice. Newborns do not have the awareness to make a choice, a decision concerning the existence of God. They're neither atheists or theists, that's not part of their awareness/consciousness.

Atheism isn't a choice.

This will fall into whether belief/disbelief is a choice, and I would argue that it isn't.

I don't know why people have to try to make atheism into all manner of things that it isn't. Atheism, for the purposes of this thread, simply means: without god(s).

 

[justlookinla]

Atheism isn't a choice.

This will fall into whether belief/disbelief is a choice, and I would argue that it isn't.

I don't know why people have to try to make atheism into any manner of things that it isn't. Atheism, for the purposes of this thread, simple means: without god(s).

But doesn't it mean a conscious decision to not believe in God? Isn't thought and reason required for a belief? I don't think a newborn has that capability.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Atheism isn't a choice.

This will fall into whether belief/disbelief is a choice, and I would argue that it isn't.

I don't know why people have to try to make atheism into any manner of things that it isn't. Atheism, for the purposes of this thread, simple means: without god(s).

So you believe that there are no gods. It is a belief not just a lack of one.

 

[Davian]

But doesn't it mean a conscious decision to not believe in God? Isn't thought and reason required for a belief? I don't think a newborn has that capability.

Do *you* have that capability? Can you choose, right now, to believe that every god to date is simply a product of the human imagination?

 

[selfinflikted]

But doesn't it mean a conscious decision to not believe in God?

No. Or, at least, not in my case. And I really don't believe it is the case for many others, either. Belief is contingent upon being convinced of something. It (belief) isn't a conscious effort, but rather a result of being convinced.

Isn't thought and reason required for a belief? I don't think a newborn has that capability.

Yes, and no, they don't - which is why atheism is the default position.

Atheism is derived from atheos (greek): a - without, theos - god(s). Literally.

 

[selfinflikted]

So you believe that there are no gods. It is a belief not just a lack of one.

Is that what I said?

 

[justlookinla]

Do *you* have that capability? Can you choose, right now, to believe that every god to date is simply a product of the human imagination?

I have the ability to think about it and make a decision. A newborn doesn't.

 

[selfinflikted]

I have the ability to think about it and make a decision. A newborn doesn't.

So, then, you agree that people are born without a god concept.

That makes them atheists.

 

[selfinflikted]

The one poster I was hoping would be posting in this thread, is not posting in this thread. lol

 

[justlookinla]

No. Or, at least, not in my case. And I really don't believe it is the case for many others, either. Belief is contingent upon being convinced of something. It (belief) isn't a conscious effort, but rather a result of being convinced.

But it's not an unconscious effort is it? My belief is the result of conscious behavior on my part, not a mindless decision.

Yes, and no, they don't - which is why atheism is the default position.

Atheism is derived from atheos (greek): a - without, theos - god(s). Literally.

A newborn has no idea if they're with or without God though, in my opinion. No way to prove that, but it seems that one's theistic view is determined at some after becoming self-aware. Their theistic view is neutral, at best....IMO.

 

[bhsmte]

I believe that most societies, past and present, have such beliefs because there are things to which we as a species do not currently have answers. So people make up answers.

Is this simplistic? Yes, extremely. That said, I believe this is 100% the case, though.

Exactly.

All you need to do, is look around the world and see how different religious belief is regionalized.

 

[justlookinla]

So, then, you agree that people are born without a god concept.

That makes them atheists.

No, that makes them neutral. No thought about it at all.

 

[justlookinla]

The one poster I was hoping would be posting in this thread, is not posting in this thread. lol

But.....I'm here!

 

[Hetta]

Rodgers & Hammerstein sum it up for me.

http://youtu.be/OAZ8yOFFbAc

(as in, it's not nature, it's nurture)

 

[justlookinla]

A new born has no idea about anything other than the instincts it is given by being born human, which religion are they instinctively born with? Samoan idol worship, the Inca religion or what? every country has it's own religion born of countless years of fear, you were told that A is true so you without question believe that A is true, that's how it works,
try telling someone that it's not A that is true but B, it would be just like telling them they would walk better if they had no legs.

Deciding to embrace A or B is a decision made by evaluating information. Newborns do not evaluate theistic claims, pro or con.

 

[Oncedeceived]

The one poster I was hoping would be posting in this thread, is not posting in this thread. lol

Perhaps you should message them and ask if they would participate?

 

[Davian]

But it's not an unconscious effort is it? My belief is the result of conscious behavior on my part, not a mindless decision.
...

Then make that choice, right now, to believe that every god to date is simply a product of the human imagination.