The decline of hell doctrine and church attendance

[P1LGR1M]

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Again, the context is completely ignored:


Romans 11:26-32
King James Version

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.


The context deals with Israel being brought into relationship with God through the New Covenant. The point is that Gentiles were not "believers" but have become believers and Israel, who used to be in relationship with God through the Covenant of Law are unbelievers.

When "all Israel is saved" speaks of Christ's return. It does not mean everyone who has ever been or ever will be a member of Israel will be saved, it means that when Christ the Deliverer returns—only those who are brought into the New Covenant will be saved, because the rest will be destroyed as is taught in all of Christ's prophetic teachings.

The unbelieving members of Israel will be destroyed in the Supper of the Great God and the Sheep and Goat Judgment.

Israel's unbelief has led to mercy being shown unto Gentiles in that now all who believe in Christ receive that mercy.

And the single greatest issue missed is that those who receive mercy...

...believe.

So once again an out-of-context proof text.


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

Titus 2:11 ESV
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people,

Titus 2:11-14
King James Version

11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.


Again, specific to the Church.

That the grace of God that bringeth salvation has indeed appeared to all men. In other words, the provision for salvation, Christ—has been given to men. Not salvation itself.

And how are we saved?


Titus 3:4-5
King James Version

4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;


Again, we see that the kindness and love of God our Savior has appeared to all men (same word, and these are two of the four places epiphainō is found in the New Testament) but we don't make that mean God has given salvation to all men.

We are saved when we receive the washing of regeneration (New Birth through Baptism into Christ) and the renewing of the Holy Ghost (made new by the Spirit of God, and this through the receiving of the Spirit of God).

Consider:


Luke 3:4-8
King James Version

4 As it is written in the book of the words of Esaias the prophet, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

5 Every valley shall be filled, and every mountain and hill shall be brought low; and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough ways shall be made smooth;

6 And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.

7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

8 Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.


Same thing: all flesh "seeing" the salvation of God does not equate to "all flesh will be saved."

John the Baptist warns that there is a judgment coming and that God's wrath will fall on those who do not repent.

And it is given in imagery also given by the Lord and the Apostles: one of fiery destruction.


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

1 Timothy 4:10
That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.

That is because there is only One Savior.

Not because all people will be saved.

Again, a no-brainer.


1 Timothy 4
King James Version

1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;


1 Timothy 4:10
King James Version

10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.


1 Timothy 4:16
King James Version

16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.


The Son of God came into the world to save sinners, but there is a need to believe in Him:


1 Timothy 1:15-16
King James Version

15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.


Believing in Him is always associated with everlasting life.

Unbelief is always associated with everlasting condemnation and death:


John 3:36
King James Version

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

1 John 4:14 NIV
And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.

Getting deja vu.


1 John 4:14-15
King James Version

14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.

15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.


The very next verse shows the out-of-context application of this verse to universal salvation.

Much less the teaching of the Epistle itself:


1 John 4
King James Version

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.


One must believe in Christ in this lifetime and be born again.

Only by believing in Christ can we have life, and escape the condemnation we are born into.

One is either of God, or not.

The proof texts of universal salvation can easily be seen to be used out of context.

The context of the Lord's statement...

John 3:36
King James Version

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

...can easily be seen to be a Basic Principle taught throughout the New Testament by Christ and the Apostles.

We can't have universal salvation when there are those who will never see life and have the wrath of God abiding on them.

There is only one way to be saved:


Acts 16:29-31
King James Version

29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.


God bless.

 

[P1LGR1M]

@P1LGR1M
Reposting this from a previous post. You talked all around it but totally ignored what I said,

It is true when I responded to your post it was late and it had been a long day of posting, but I wanted to respond to it and I did.

And all of that was ignored, apparently, because I see absolutely no quote of what was given to you.

Would this be because you don't want to bring up the fact that Christ could be the One sanctified? And that you are simply reiterating your view—which you continually lament about concerning those you debate universal salvation with?

There's a word for this, my friend.

Why don't you post what I said and address it?


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

(25) Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
(26) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,Who is “we” in this verse? Christian brothers. Heb 10:19

No, actually it is his Hebrew brethren.

This is why the Epistle is usually called Hebrews, lol.

And the Hebrews are seen in three distinct groups as provided by the context: Hebrew people that have been saved (are thus brethren in Christ), Hebrew people that associate with Christian Hebrews but have not been saved yet, and Hebrews that have forsaken the assembling of the brethren who have not been saved.

Hebrews 10:19
(19) Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.This vs. is saying that Christian brothers who sin willfully will experience “judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.”

Why no response on what I said?

After explaining that the Holy of Holies of the Covenant of Law was a parable, and not the true, this Hebrew Writer tells his Hebrew brethren about the true Holy of Holies, the Holiest of All—Heaven.

To make it even more specific that this is written to the Hebrew People and that this is the brethren spoken of, consider that the Temple is never once mentioned in the Epistle.

Only the Tabernacle.

That is because in the wilderness, despite the "mixed multitude," the Covenant of Law was specific to Israel.

He is telling His Hebrew brethren that the way into God's presence (formerly vicarious entrance unto type/shadow/parable/figure by the Levitical High Priest alone) is through, not the veil of the Tabernacle, but the true Veil, the flesh of Jesus Christ, or in other words—by the Sacrifice of Christ God's People, Israel, can now go into God's presence through the Great High Priest Jesus Christ.

Read Hebrews 5:10-Hebrews 6:3 again.

The principles of the Doctrine of Christ were not relevant to Gentiles, and they weren't relevant to Hebrew Christians, because those are they who are of full age, that is, those who have already gone on unto perfection concerning the Doctrine of Christ.

It doesn't seem you are too familiar with the Book of Hebrews. I recommend fervent study of this Epistle, because it contains, in my view, the strongest doctrinal presentation of the Gospel Paul penned (also in my view, anonymous because of the hatred of many of the Hebrew People that remained loyal to Moses' Law).


Continued.

 

[P1LGR1M]

(28) He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
(29) Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, [i.e. made Holy, a Christian] an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?This vs. is saying that anyone who was sanctified by the blood, i.e. a Christian,

Again, it cannot possibly be referring to the sanctification of a believer because...

1. in view are unbelievers, not people who have been once for all sanctified;

2. Hebrews 10:10-14 makes it clear that those who have been sanctified by the Sacrifice of Christ have been forgiven in an eternal context as the Promise of the New Covenant they have been brought into states;

3. Hebrews 10:14 guarantees that there will be no further debt of sin to those sanctified and Hebrews 10:26-29 deals with those who reject Christ, His Covenant, His Sacrifice, and the Spirit of Grace (The Comforter) and speaks in terms of Eternal Judgment, not chastisement (Hebrews 12:5-8);

4. Those in vv.26-29 are identified as adversaries, not brethren, not children of God.

We also have good reason to see the Great High Priest sanctified by blood because we see the precedent in the Law:


Exodus 28:41
And thou shalt put them upon Aaron thy brother, and his sons with him; and shalt anoint them, and consecrate them, and sanctify them, that they may minister unto me in the priest's office.


Leviticus 8:30
And Moses took of the anointing oil, and of the blood which was upon the altar, and sprinkled it upon Aaron, and upon his garments, and upon his sons, and upon his sons' garments with him; and sanctified Aaron, and his garments, and his sons, and his sons' garments with him.


Is the Law fulfilled if the Great High Priest is not also sanctified?

Jesus was sanctified of the Father:


John 10:36
Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?


So too was Jesus Christ the Great High Priest sanctified by the Blood of the Covenant.

Just as I told you that I view the interpretation of "maturity" in Hebrews 5:14 to be an error and out of the context of the teaching, even so here I view interpreting the sanctification to be the sanctification of the believer to not only be error, but great error.

You can't have two conflicting teachings being taught in the chapter.

So, like I asked you before and was never answered—are you going to now reverse your position about what forever means?


Hebrews 10:14
King James Version

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.


Does this mean forever or not?

Please answer.


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

who treads that blood underfoot and considers it an unholy thing is deserving of worse punishment than the Jews who despised Moses law!

Correct.

And in view are the unbelievers of the Covenant of Law and the unbelievers of the New Covenant.

Both Hebrew People.

Again, this is why the Book is generally known as "The Epistle to the Hebrews."

(30) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
(31) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.“Vengeance belongs unto me, I will recompense, The Lord shall judge his people.

Right. Now compare that with a few other verses:


Deuteronomy 32:35
King James Version

35 To me belongeth vengeance and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste.


Deuteronomy 32:36
For the Lord shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants, when he seeth that their power is gone, and there is none shut up, or left.


What people is this spoken to?

Kind of makes sense that a Hebrew would quote Hebrew Scriptures to Hebrew People. Wouldn't you agree?

Oh, and let's not forget the difference between falling into the hands of an angry God and...


John 10:27-29
King James Version

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.


...being preserved by being in the Hand of God.


Continued...

 

[P1LGR1M]

(30) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
(31) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.“Vengeance belongs unto me, I will recompense, The Lord shall judge his people. [Jews and Christian NOT unrepentant sinners]

Actually, the original quote is to Hebrews who were not called Jews at that time.

The term "Jew" is a shortened form of one who was part of the Southern Kingdom when Israel was divided. It was also known as "Judah." Hence those there were called "Jew."

This quote is given to people who had already heard it before. The "Lord's People" are Jews, not Christians.

It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

Again, those who have been once-for-all sanctified and forgiven in an eternal context cannot "fall into the hands of an angry God:"


John 10:27-29
King James Version

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.


So let's see why God would be angry:


Hebrews 3:12
King James Version

12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.


Why did the Hebrew People not enter into His rest? Unbelief.

Why do men fall into the hands of an angry God? Unbelief.

Those in view in Hebrews 10:26-31 are unbelievers, just as we see in every passage where those who will not be saved are discussed.

One has to believe in order to be sanctified, hence it is Jesus Christ Who is Sanctified by the Blood of the Covenant in Hebrews 10:29.


Continued...

 

[Saint Steven]

I like to think I've been very clear.

Imagine what "heaven" would be like knowing loved ones are burning in unspeakable torture down in the dungeon. Could you really trust a god like that? How long until you join them?

Saint Steven said: ↑
Perhaps you aren't clear about the source and reach of salvation.

 

[P1LGR1M]

It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.” This is all referring those who were sanctified by the blood in. vs.29.

Sorry, no.

Those who are sanctified by the Blood of Christ have been forgiven all sins.

Those who do not see that "forever" means forever might take a view that salvation in Christ may be lost, but they will find themselves in conflict with Scripture.

So you have to ask yourself, if forever doesn't mean forever here...


Hebrews 10:14
King James Version

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.


...can you be sure it means forever here...


Matthew 25:41
Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:


...?


Continued...

 

[Saint Steven]

I see a Basic Bible Principle in Scripture that God has always judged men according to the revelation He provides to them and would go so far as to say I believe He judges according to their understanding of that revelation, rather than "to the letter," so to speak. Meaning mentally challenged people will still be held accountable according to the ability of their mind to understand.

Thanks.
Interesting that we have to make concessions for the angry volcano god to make him not look quite so sadistic and cruel.

 

[P1LGR1M]

The writer of Hebrews is talking to and warning Christians.

Then perhaps we should rename the Epistle to "The Epistle to the Christians."

The sinners of his day would not read or hear any of this.

On the contrary, that was the purpose of the writing of the Epistles, that they be dispersed among the churches.

This one happened to have a focus on Hebrews.

It was written by a Hebrew.

The contrasts drawn are relevant to Hebrews.

It isn't all that hard to see that much of what is written would mean nothing to those who were never under Law.

Paul did not have to tell the Corinthians not to return to the Levitical Priesthood and the offering given for the remission of sins, right?


God bless.

 

[Saint Steven]

1 John 4:14-15
King James Version

14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.

15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.


The very next verse shows the out-of-context application of this verse to universal salvation.

We agree on this point. Here's how:

Anyone who has knees to bow and a tongue to speak, in heaven and on earth and under the earth (in the realm of the dead), will whole-heartedly, and without reservation, acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord. No one can say that “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” you will be saved. Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. (the reason for the bodily resurrection) Scriptural support below.

Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart
that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that
he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11 from Strong's Concordance
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).

Further reading: (Isaiah 45:23, Romans 14:11, Philippians 2:10, Revelation 15:4)

 

[P1LGR1M]

Imagine what "heaven" would be like knowing loved ones are burning in unspeakable torture down in the dungeon.

We aren't going to be the ones who hold them in shame and everlasting contempt, they will.

As for Eternity and how we will feel about it:


Revelation 21
King James Version

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.


First, I would suggest to you that when we are in Heaven (when we die, prior to the passing away of this universe and the Eternal State) we will have a far greater understanding of God's holiness and sin, and will not be trying to make excuses for people that have, of their own decision—rejected God.

Secondly, I would point out that God will be the reason why we won't live in Eternity despondant over those who chose to reject God.

Could you really trust a god like that?

More than I could trust a God that says one thing and does another.

More than I could trust a God that lies.

More than I could trust a God that is not holy and has no concern for holiness.

More than I could a God that has no Justice.


Do you think Satan will be redeemed? Do you think Satan deserves mercy? Is the unending evil that he has wrought upon mankind no big deal to you?

Do you think Satan deserves Eternal Separation?

How long until you join them?

Never.

Because I believe in Jesus Christ I have passed from death unto life and am no longer under the condemnation I was born into. I have been forgiven my sins eternally (Hebrews 10:14) and the God of the Bible keeps His promises.

When you can show why I would believe universal salvation as opposed to the teaching of Christ your position might have some merit:


John 3:36
King James Version

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.


Until then you will have to continue philosophizing from a human perspective.

Saint Steven said: ↑
Perhaps you aren't clear about the source and reach of salvation.

As I said, I feel I have been very clear. If something has confused you please post it and I will try to help you understand it.


God bless.

 

[P1LGR1M]

Thanks.
Interesting that we have to make concessions for the angry volcano god to make him not look quite so sadistic and cruel.

This means about as much as an atheist's reference to the Spaghetti Monster in the sky.

Is a Jury sadistic and cruel when they determine that a serial killer is guilty and punishes him?

Is a mother or father sadistic and cruel when they punish their child?

We see punishment in the temporal realm and never wink an eye. Because God's Justice results in everlasting torment, punishment, and separation doesn't make it any better or worse than that which takes place here. And God has given all men warning about it.

So which is sadistic and cruel, to sentence a serial killer to life in imprisonment? Or death?

Or should the serial killer be released back into society?

Please answer.


God bless.

 

[P1LGR1M]

We agree on this point. Here's how:

Anyone who has knees to bow and a tongue to speak, in heaven and on earth and under the earth (in the realm of the dead), will whole-heartedly, and without reservation, acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord. No one can say that “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” you will be saved. Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. (the reason for the bodily resurrection) Scriptural support below.

Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart
that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that
he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11 from Strong's Concordance
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).

Further reading: (Isaiah 45:23, Romans 14:11, Philippians 2:10, Revelation 15:4)

It's not Scriptural Support: you are forgetting that it is the Holy Spirit that enlightens men, and when men are judged and all men acknowledge that Jesus is Lord it will not be in repentance:


Revelation 6:15-17
King James Version

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


These are the men that will go into everlasting torment:


Revelation 14:10-13
King James Version

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.


Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11 from Strong's Concordance
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).

Further reading: (Isaiah 45:23, Romans 14:11, Philippians 2:10, Revelation 15:4)


Further reading? Don't mean further proof texts yanked out of context which you will not respond to correction of?

You do not respond to your proof texts being placed back into the Biblical Context, and you do not show how the verses given as support for Everlasting Punishment of unbelievers denies your doctrine.

I have piped unto you, and ye have not danced. I have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.

So another look:


Philippians 2:8-11
King James Version

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.


Sounds familiar. Oh, that's right, because we've seen this argument before. Let's look at another proof text of universal salvation and see if we see a similarity in Paul's teaching:


Colossians 1:20
King James Version

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.


This too sounds like all things in earth and Heaven are going to be reconciled. Not if we understand that in earth and Heaven is a reference to the redeemed.


Colossians 1:16-20
King James Version

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.


Another no-brainer: all things that remain will be reconciled to Him.

That doesn't change the fact that all things and all people are not going to be reconciled.

Do you thnk Satan is going to be reconciled?

You have to, because it states clearly in both passages...


10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.


20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.


Satan will confess Christ is Lord.

Will he be reconciled? Because "No one can say that “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” you will be saved."

Does this apply to Satan?

Please answer.


God bless.

 

[Der Alte]

@P1LGR1M
FYI. I don't spend 24 hrs a day here breathlessly waiting for you to post.
Sorry, you are NOT reading what the writer of Hebrews is saying. You are only seeing what you want to see.
…..Yes, the writer is speaking to Hebrews, Hebrew Christians, and they are the only ones who will see what is written in this book. Christ hating and Christian hating Torah observant Hebrews will never read one word of this. Throughout the NT the Hebrews persecuted Christians. Paul was the main persecutor until his Damascus road experience. Now reread it with that in mind!

Hebrews 10:22-23
(22) Let us [Hebrew Christians] draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our [Hebrew Christians] hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our [Hebrew Christians] bodies washed with pure water.[nothing in this vs. applies to Torah observant Hebrews]
(23) Let us [Hebrew Christians] hold fast the profession of our [Hebrew Christians] faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised)
[Torah observant Hebrews will not be doing any of this]
...​

Hebrews 10:25-31
(25) Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.​

It is apparent that some of the Hebrew Christians were not assembling with other Christians.

(26) For if we [Hebrew Christians] sin wilfully after that we [Hebrew Christians] have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,[excludes Torah observant Hebrews their sins had not been yet forgiven]
(27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.​

The Hebrew Christians became adversaries when they sinned willfully after receiving the knowledge of truth.

(28) He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:[and that is what happened to Torah observant Hebrews in NT times. I seem to recall Stephen and others being stoned.]
(29) Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?​

These vss. are NOT referring to Torah observant Hebrews who will never read or hear it. They were not yet sanctified with the blood of the covenant, i.e. the blood of Christ. The Torah observant Hebrew were still under the law and the blood of bulls and lambs.

(30) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
(31) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.​

The writer of Hebrews still talking to Jewish Christians who sinned wilfully, trod under foot the Son of God, counted the blood of the covenant, with which he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and done despite unto the Spirit of grace.
Torah observant Hebrew were not under grace they were under the law. They were not sanctified by the blood of the covenant. And Jesus Christ was NOT their high priest.

Heb 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, [Hebrew Christians] partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;​

Okay. I have led you to water now...the rest is up to you.

 

[P1LGR1M]

@P1LGR1M
FYI. I don't spend 24 hrs a day here breathlessly waiting for you to post.
Sorry, you are NOT reading what the writer of Hebrews is saying. You are only seeing what you want to see.
…..Yes, the writer is speaking to Hebrews, Hebrew Christians, and they are the only ones who will see what is written in this book. Christ hating and Christian hating Torah observant Hebrews will never read one word of this. Throughout the NT the Hebrews persecuted Christians. Paul was the main persecutor until his Damascus road experience. Now reread it with that in mind!

Hebrews 10:22-23
(22) Let us [Hebrew Christians] draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our [Hebrew Christians] hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our [Hebrew Christians] bodies washed with pure water.[nothing in this vs. applies to Torah observant Hebrews]
(23) Let us [Hebrew Christians] hold fast the profession of our [Hebrew Christians] faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised)
[Torah observant Hebrews will not be doing any of this]
...​

Hebrews 10:25-31
(25) Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.​

It is apparent that some of the Hebrew Christians were not assembling with other Christians.

(26) For if we [Hebrew Christians] sin wilfully after that we [Hebrew Christians] have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,[excludes Torah observant Hebrews their sins had not been yet forgiven]
(27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.​

The Hebrew Christians became adversaries when they sinned willfully after receiving the knowledge of truth.

(28) He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:[and that is what happened to Torah observant Hebrews in NT times. I seem to recall Stephen and others being stoned.]
(29) Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?​

These vss. are NOT referring to Torah observant Hebrews who will never read or hear it. They were not yet sanctified with the blood of the covenant, i.e. the blood of Christ. The Torah observant Hebrew were still under the law and the blood of bulls and lambs.

(30) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
(31) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.​

The writer of Hebrews still talking to Jewish Christians who sinned wilfully, trod under foot the Son of God, counted the blood of the covenant, with which he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and done despite unto the Spirit of grace.
Torah observant Hebrew were not under grace they were under the law. They were not sanctified by the blood of the covenant. And Jesus Christ was NOT their high priest.

Heb 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, [Hebrew Christians] partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;​

Okay. I have led you to water now...the rest is up to you.

Sorry, but your argument doesn't represent what we see in Scripture. Paul ended up in prison and beheaded for being a Torah observant Jew (Acts 21:26).

And I see no address of a single point I made with the admission that the Book is written to Hebrews.

Now, I have one question that you keep refusing to answer: does forever mean forever or not?


Hebrews 10:14
King James Version

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.


God bless.

 

[FineLinen]

Again, the context is completely ignored:

Nonsense ! !

What part of all is escaping you?