• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

The common factor in almost all revivals.....

G

gideons300

Guest
I have done a bit of study on old revivals and almost without fail, at least until our "revivals" of the modern era, they centered on repentance for sins committed as believers, sins that, although paid for, have not been confessed, or even acknowledged. Our hearts have gotten hardened to them.

The danger of letting sin remain in the heart of believers is two fold. First, after falling victim to the same sin again and again, our faith erodes that Jesus is even changing us at all and following on its heels is a feeling that our repentance is becoming less and less genuine over time to the point it hardens our heart. Tears are fewer and fewer, the horror of still sinning after receiving the Holy Spirit becomes more a mild annoyance at ourselves, then just a sigh as we resign ourselves to the truth we believe that since we are only human, why fight what we cannot ever gain complete victory. At that point, our faith is so wounded that we cling to grace for salvation alone, because we feel powerless to stand against the attacks of satan, or the myriad of accusations he flings at us day in and day out.


At some point the danger increases. Here, the believer is tempted to fall again his or her "Achilles heel" sins, but there is no resistance at all. There is simply resignation and a dangerous temptation to use grace to cover up a heart where the battle against evil has ceased. A truce has been arrived at by the new us and the flesh that wants to kick loose every now and then, and the part of us that wants God says:

" Look, I will accept you in my life under these controlled circumstances, IF you allow me to not feel condemned and to go to church and serve God as best I can."

It is a pact we ought to flee from, but I myself tried to adopt it. Unfortunately, my sin was so disgusting, so easily outwardly identifiable as evil, that I was unable to ever shut out the shouts of self condemnation. But for many, the enemy offers us freedom from FEELING guilty and here is what that thought looks like.


"I know I am only human, and no one is perfect. Thank God I am forgiven no matter what I do. So if I sin again, it is no big deal because I will just confess it (after I do it) and get forgiveness later. I really do not want to sin (after having fallen to it for the 172nd time) and God knows my heart so....here I go anyway."

Ring anybody's bell? Do we not see? This is turning the grace of God into lasciviousness. License to sin. We are not resisting unto blood. We are free of any blood, no eyes plucked out, both hands functioning quite well.


Martin Luther split from the mother chuch and much of it was over the selling of "indulgences". Back then, rich folks would buy indulgences, pre-paid sin licenses, so that they could sin guilt free and avoid the hassle of repentance and confession. Although that shocks us, we have done worse. Not only do we think the thought above, we do not even pre-pay for the privelidge, we look to God and tell him to put it on Jesus's tab!


What will the ultimate revival look like? It will be massive repentance, especially our unbelief that is limiting the Holy one of Israel in our lives, followed by teaching on how to put on the armor of God and wield our shields of faith so that when we are tempted to sin, we actually stand against it as new creatures in Christ, victorious, and overcome the attacks of satan by coupling the blood of the lamb WITH our testimony as to who we are in Christ.... light in the Lord!


Unfortunately, our limited view of what salvation is does not yet include salvation from the hand of the one who hates us, and from the sin he tempts us with. We do not believe that we have been delivered from the power of sin, but rather just its penalty.

So we hear the same message again and again, that Jesus loves us and forgives us and that He died for us, all true. But at some point, as sin still is allowed to run rampant inside our hearts, we let our hearts get hardened because of the deceitfulness of those sins, and slip into an unbelief of the promises of God altogether. Our walls of protection are now down, and satan can come in any time he wants to, tempt us and all we have to fight is our "resolve", which we all should know is simply not enough.


Every true revival of Christians is based upon the inner knowledge that many of us have squashed down that God wants us holy, victorious. We think that if we ignore the word sin and "concentrate on Jesus" we will be fine. The sad fact is that by doing so, we are being ignorant of satan's devices, and it really does not matter then what we concentrate on....sin is still our bedfellow. Not tlking about it might make us feel better, but that is just the point. God longs for us to acknowledge our sins, to come before Him broken and needy of deliverance from the clutches of Romans 7.

What do you call it when God's children discover this truth. On its heels will come revival. It is time we lit our lamps and started arguing against sin, rather than being satan's messangers to promote that for a believer it is not dangerous at all. Any who suggests such a thing had best examine exactly which side they are on.


Blessings,


Gideon
 

ByTheSpirit

Come Lord Jesus
May 17, 2011
11,460
4,690
Manhattan, KS
✟198,594.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
... at this point I fell asleep.

:sleep::sleep::sleep:

Why even make such a disrespectful comment? If you dont like what he is saying then either ignore him or dont even read his thread.

I agree gid! I appreciate what you have to say.
 
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
24,341
4,478
47
PA
✟194,816.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Why even make such a disrespectful comment? If you dont like what he is saying then either ignore him or dont even read his thread.

Because these folks are the "enlightened" messengers of God, "defending" the Church with their rudeness and disrespect, donchaknow?

It just makes one feel all warm and nauseous inside. ;)

:cool:
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Tobias

Relationship over Religion
Jan 8, 2004
3,734
482
California
✟29,264.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Private
I have done a bit of study on old revivals and almost without fail, at least until our "revivals" of the modern era, they centered on repentance for sins committed as believers, sins that, although paid for, have not been confessed, or even acknowledged. Our hearts have gotten hardened to them...



Hmmm. Does repentance bring revival, or does revival bring repentance? :idea:
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Iambatman2u

Newbie
Jan 28, 2013
70
11
✟22,746.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
In Relationship
Because these folks are the "enlightened" messengers of God, "defending" the Church with their rudeness and disrespect, donchaknow?

It just makes one feel all warm and nauseous inside. ;)

:cool:

How is your comment better than hers?

I think both of you need a love walk check up.
 
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
24,341
4,478
47
PA
✟194,816.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
How is your comment better than hers?

I'm simply repeating her own words. In another thread earlier today, she said she was "defending the Church" from Gideon, or anyone she deemed was "attacking" the church. Do you see how her post in this thread is in any way in defense of the Church? I don't. Personally, I found it rude and disrespectful, as did my brother Bryan.

I think both of you need a love walk check up.

Hi Batman. My name's Pete. Pleased to meet you. :wave:

I have over 17,000 posts spanning approximately three quarters of a decade to my credit in this forum, and I've never once hidden behind a sock account for any reason, much less to level an admonition at someone.

All of these people hiding behind sock accounts pretending that they're on the moral high road are rather amusing to me. When someone can't even be honest about who they are, then I have little reason to give serious heed to anything they say.

:cool:
 
Upvote 0

Iambatman2u

Newbie
Jan 28, 2013
70
11
✟22,746.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
In Relationship
I'm simply repeating her own words. In another thread earlier today, she said she was "defending the Church" from Gideon, or anyone she deemed was "attacking" the church. Do you see how her post in this thread is in any way in defense of the Church? I don't. Personally, I found it rude and disrespectful, as did my brother Bryan.



Hi Batman. My name's Pete. Pleased to meet you. :wave:

I have over 17,000 posts spanning approximately three quarters of a decade to my credit in this forum, and I've never once hidden behind a sock account for any reason, much less to level an admonition at someone.

All of these people hiding behind sock accounts pretending that they're on the moral high road are rather amusing to me. When someone can't even be honest about who they are, then I have little reason to give serious heed to anything they say.

:cool:

Hi Pete, I'm Batman :wave:

Congratulations on your 17,000 posts and three quarters of a decade posting here. It's a good badge of honor. Shows commitment.

I'm not a sock - a lurker maybe because I often look in, yet seldom post. I am just as honest about who I am as anyone else here - it's a forum name. Shall I assume you think everyone here uses their real life name? Funny boy! you maka me gafaw.

As for hiding, beyond the BatCave I stand out in public. ^_^

If you'd like my real name, be civil and ask, I would most likely share.

Awe heckendoodle

My real name is James. I work in Finance. Have you ever heard of City National Bank? Well, I work at one of their competitors. I am a Batman fanatic - down to the striping on my car and to my dear honey's chagrin - our bathroom is decorated as a batcave.

what else would the man with 17,000 posts and three quarters of a decade like to know?
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0
G

gideons300

Guest
Hmmm. Does repentance bring revival, or does revival bring repentance? :idea:
Excellent point, but either way, they do seem to be intricately linked, don't they. I do know this. In Ezekiel 36, where God is outlining the new covenant and it being unveiled to our ours to finally see, God says that for many, it will only be after they are revived that they will then look back upon how they have walked and finally find brokenness and repentance.

But God has spoken as well, that it is when we sow in tears that we are prepared to reap in joy. A broken and a contrite heart He will not despise, amen? When we get tired of our failing Him with how we are living out the gospel and cry out like the man in Romans 7 did, a cry of desperation from a wretched man, it is then that the chains will be broken and faith will begin to truly sprout in our hearts that God indeed can keep us from falling. He MUST, or we are in deep doo-doo. :)

Blessings,

Gideon
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

probinson

Legend
Aug 16, 2005
24,341
4,478
47
PA
✟194,816.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Hi Pete, I'm Batman :wave:

Congratulations on your 17,000 posts and three quarters of a decade posting here. It's a good badge of honor. Shows commitment.

I'm not a sock - a lurker maybe because I often look in, yet seldom post. I am just as honest about who I am as anyone else here -

You might wanna re-think using that as a comparison. ;)

it's a forum name. Shall I assume you think everyone here uses their real life name? Funny boy! you maka me gafaw.

No, not at all. But I see you just joined in January 2013, and you have just over 30 posts to your credit. That's why I assumed you were (as most people that fit that description are) a sock. If I assumed incorrectly, then please forgive me. Many years of dealing with less-than-honest sock accounts has made me somewhat leery of new people who suddenly show up out of the blue and start correcting people.

As for hiding, beyond the BatCave I stand out in public. ^_^

If you'd like my real name, be civil and ask, I would most likely share.

Awe heckendoodle

My real name is James. I work in Finance. Have you ever heard of City National Bank? Well, I work at one of their competitors. I am a Batman fanatic - down to the striping on my car and to my dear honey's chagrin - our bathroom is decorated as a batcave.

what else would the man with 17,000 posts and three quarters of a decade like to know?

Nothing right now, but there will be a cookie social later where you'll be required to divulge your entire personal life story...

It's nice to meet you, banker James. :wave:

:cool:
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Yitzchak

יצחק
Jun 25, 2003
11,250
1,386
59
Visit site
✟33,833.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Conservatives
Hmmm. Does repentance bring revival, or does revival bring repentance? :idea:


Both. God wants to send revival. Repentance prepares the way. Those who have been called by God to be forerunners, like John The Baptist was , come preaching a message of repentance , just like John did.

Isa 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.
Isa 40:4 Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain:


But when God comes with a visitation to his people , the message of repentance is still there in that season , as well. The first message that Jesus preached in his ministry was the message of repentance to the Jewish people , the "church " of his day.

Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.


The Holy Spirit preaches a message of repentance to the church. There is a promised reward to those who heed the call.

Rev 3:3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.



Our repentance opens the way for the Holy Spirit to do a deeper work in us. That deeper work , otherwise known as revival , enables us to take our repentance even farther which enables an even deeper work. Waves of revival bring about the conditions for even more waves of revival.
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Tobias

Relationship over Religion
Jan 8, 2004
3,734
482
California
✟29,264.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Private
People like revival. So I believe they have tried everything under the sun to make revival happen. Repentance is just one of those many ways.

Repentance that comes from a pure heart is beautiful. Repentance that comes from someone pointing out sin because they have an agenda is not.
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0
G

gideons300

Guest
People like revival. So I believe they have tried everything under the sun to make revival happen. Repentance is just one of those many ways.

Repentance that comes from a pure heart is beautiful. Repentance that comes from someone pointing out sin because they have an agenda is not.
If the agenda is seeing people really set free indeed, is this bad? I call it a burden but in truth, it is sort of an agenda, just an honorable one in my mind.

Blessings Tobias,

Gideon
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Tobias

Relationship over Religion
Jan 8, 2004
3,734
482
California
✟29,264.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Private
Surly you've encountered man-made attempts at revival, haven't you? That's what I'm talking about.

Where people use hype to get people to show up, condemnation to fill the altar, lies to get everyone excited about the miracles that are not happening, and mystical practices to make up for the missing presence of the Holy Spirit.
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

lismore

Maranatha
Oct 28, 2004
20,940
4,593
Scotland
✟290,776.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Surly you've encountered man-made attempts at revival, haven't you? That's what I'm talking about.

Where people use hype to get people to show up, condemnation to fill the altar, lies to get everyone excited about the miracles that are not happening, and mystical practices to make up for the missing presence of the Holy Spirit.

Do you have any examples of this behaviour?
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0

Shimshon

Well-Known Member
Oct 5, 2004
4,355
887
Zion
✟114,964.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Do you have any examples of this behaviour?
Yes, I once fellowshiped with a Vineyard Church for about a year. I won't list the many examples, it would take too long to retreive them from my gray matter. Some things are best atrophied.

But, I can bring one thing to mind. One of the last things that broke the straw was a mason jar full of oil the pastor left up on his podium. For weeks. It was supposed to grow, and fill up with oil. Each week, it remained the same.....I have to give the pastor credit, at least he didn't just fill it up when nobody was looking.

And then there is the latter day rain theology with the likes of Bob Jones, the Terror of the Lord!!! Last days revival that will sweep the world with the latter day rain!! Whhooooooooooooo ....huh?

Angel dust, feathers, prophetic marching, a belief that the end will come with a Shout and only those completely filled and groooooaaannning will be saved.

My Lord, I pulled my wife out of that mess over 10 yrs ago. One night we were on the floor laughing for almost an hour. Oh yea, I remember forcing myself to speak in tongues.

I'm glad I can't garner the passion I had for (and against) this stuff any more. It's all a bad dream I had one year.

I will confess though, one night at bible study we were praying and I yelled out "Let your kingdom come!!" at the top of my voice. And the breaker tripped, lights out..... Everyone looked at me and I said, what!? It wasn't 'me'!! It was God. That was cool. But the rest of that stuff was as bogus as the vision of heaven they spoke of with ice cream on the trees..... oy vey
 
Upvote 0

Tobias

Relationship over Religion
Jan 8, 2004
3,734
482
California
✟29,264.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Private
Do you have any examples of this behaviour?


I went to a Vineyard church too where the pastor pretty much promised us revival and felt obligated to make it happen whatever the cost. His efforts centered mostly around repentance, (or was it condemnation?), and hype. I think it was because of the hype that he felt it was his responsibility to make it happen.


And you know what? I guess I'm having a bit of a change of heart concerning some of the things that these awful heresy hunters have been saying all along. :) I realize that I have compromised my integrity to support anybody who I sense the Holy Spirit is upon. Not that I think it is in any way wrong to support them, but I have overlooked many doctrines and practices which I do not agree with in favor of promoting anyone who operates in the Spirit.

I'm not apologizing, just stating a fact. I think that I erred on the correct side of things; yet it is still an error. :cool:

So if we take another look at the Lakeland revival, I would have to say that some of these factors were present there. Especially the hype and the exaggerated proclamation of miracles. I do not understand why TB would feel the need to self promote when God was obviously taking care of that for him, but he may have stirred up a hornet's nest in trying to gather more people faster than what God intended. IDK, but if you want an example of hype and faked (or at the very least promoting unsubstantiated) miracles, there you go.

As for substituting the presence of the Holy Spirit with mystical practices, perhaps I added that one simply because I concede some of the other points to the heresy hunters. :) I have however seen people go to great extremes to try to usher in the Holy Spirit. Usually this is done by repeating the same things that happened during the last time He showed up. Generally that would include singing the same songs, prolonging the altar calls, and in the case of holy laughter or other odd behaviour it might cross into things that are legitimately defined as mystical in nature.
 
  • Like
Reactions: psalms 91
Upvote 0