The challenge for Theistic Evolutionists

[Sayre]

I am a theistic evolutionist.

My two greatest struggles in faith are loving creationists, and not damaging the faith of creationists.

I half wonder why I bother trying to correct them. Evolution IS a fact of the matter, but sometimes I feel like, if I were to prove that to them, it would damage their faith. My mother is all or nothing - either there is a literal 6 day creation and a literal world wide flood, or there is no God. I would win the battle but lose the war if I were to prove evolution to her. Surely the end goal in all this is to encourage others to have faith, and for that faith to remain strong?

So the question for other Theistic Evolutionists is - why do we bother? Why don't we just let the creationists believe in 6 day creation and be done with it?

And how on earth are we supposed to LOVE them when, from my point of view, they are so dogmatic and deceptive in their arguments?

I think to truly reflect Christ, we ought to spend more time loving those we disagree with. If anyone has any suggestions on how to do this, I am all ears.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I am a theistic evolutionist.

My two greatest struggles in faith are loving creationists, and not damaging the faith of creationists.

I half wonder why I bother trying to correct them. Evolution IS a fact of the matter, but sometimes I feel like, if I were to prove that to them, it would damage their faith. My mother is all or nothing - either there is a literal 6 day creation and a literal world wide flood, or there is no God. I would win the battle but lose the war if I were to prove evolution to her. Surely the end goal in all this is to encourage others to have faith, and for that faith to remain strong?

So the question for other Theistic Evolutionists is - why do we bother? Why don't we just let the creationists believe in 6 day creation and be done with it?

And how on earth are we supposed to LOVE them when, from my point of view, they are so dogmatic and deceptive in their arguments?

I think to truly reflect Christ, we ought to spend more time loving those we disagree with. If anyone has any suggestions on how to do this, I am all ears.

I am a creationist and I believe in a literal Genesis. I believe that evolution as defined is evident. There are things within ToE that are not in evidence as well. Does a literal interpretation demand days that contain 24 hours as we see today...I think there is no reason to believe they do when the sun is not even present for three days. Does the Bible claim the universe is only 6000 years old, no. There is no date for the beginning of the universe. So there are certain beliefs that creationists hold that are based on what they think the literal Genesis account claims that it really doesn't. Yes, six days but what constitutes a day to God and what does it mean when there is no sun? So there are ways we can come and reason together, those of us that see that evolution happens but we have to remember that evolution as a theory and has its own interpretations that can lead to certain elements being viewed presuppositionally as well.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I am a theistic evolutionist.

My two greatest struggles in faith are loving creationists, and not damaging the faith of creationists.

I half wonder why I bother trying to correct them. Evolution IS a fact of the matter, but sometimes I feel like, if I were to prove that to them, it would damage their faith. My mother is all or nothing - either there is a literal 6 day creation and a literal world wide flood, or there is no God. I would win the battle but lose the war if I were to prove evolution to her. Surely the end goal in all this is to encourage others to have faith, and for that faith to remain strong?

So the question for other Theistic Evolutionists is - why do we bother? Why don't we just let the creationists believe in 6 day creation and be done with it?

And how on earth are we supposed to LOVE them when, from my point of view, they are so dogmatic and deceptive in their arguments?

I think to truly reflect Christ, we ought to spend more time loving those we disagree with. If anyone has any suggestions on how to do this, I am all ears.

Perhaps if you could very kindly ask them why their faith is so weak that they cannot believe in the Bible and accept what is obviously true from a scientific viewpoint.

Also you could point out, again kindly, how the various creationist sources lie in their publications. And of course there is the arch-creationist Kent Hovind who not only lied in debates but lied to the government too. There is no earthly punishment for lying in a debate. The U.S. government is not willing to wait until you die.

 

[juvenissun]

I am a theistic evolutionist.

My two greatest struggles in faith are loving creationists, and not damaging the faith of creationists.

I half wonder why I bother trying to correct them. Evolution IS a fact of the matter, but sometimes I feel like, if I were to prove that to them, it would damage their faith. My mother is all or nothing - either there is a literal 6 day creation and a literal world wide flood, or there is no God. I would win the battle but lose the war if I were to prove evolution to her. Surely the end goal in all this is to encourage others to have faith, and for that faith to remain strong?

So the question for other Theistic Evolutionists is - why do we bother? Why don't we just let the creationists believe in 6 day creation and be done with it?

And how on earth are we supposed to LOVE them when, from my point of view, they are so dogmatic and deceptive in their arguments?

I think to truly reflect Christ, we ought to spend more time loving those we disagree with. If anyone has any suggestions on how to do this, I am all ears.

It is a matter of whether the one you talked to can argue with you or not. Your mom can not, so evolution is a fact to you. I can, so evolution will NOT be a fact to you.

Want to try?

 

[Sayre]

You have all missed my point. I'm asking how theistic eevolution folk can be more loving towards creationists and respect the end goal, which is faith in Christ, not winning this debate.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Then I suggest that you just ignore your friends when they show their ignorance.

In Christianity not understanding evolution could only be considered the mildest of sins. As long as they keep their ignorance to themselves they are relatively harmless.

When they try to force their views on others the science behind their beliefs fail so badly that they always lose in courts of law. They are still smarting from the Dover trial.

 

[biggles53]

You have all missed my point. I'm asking how theistic eevolution folk can be more loving towards creationists and respect the end goal, which is faith in Christ, not winning this debate.

Why should the end goal be a strengthening of 'faith'...?

Why should we be encouraging a world view based upon pretence...?

 

[fireof god98]

i wonder when in the evolution processes that god interjected the soul into us as many Christians people i know believe god did

 

[biggles53]

i wonder when in the evolution processes that god interjected the soul into us as many Christians people i know believe god did

If you jump over to my Evolution and the Soul thread, you'll find a discussion on that one under way...

 

[sfs]

You have all missed my point. I'm asking how theistic eevolution folk can be more loving towards creationists and respect the end goal, which is faith in Christ, not winning this debate.

A good step toward the first goal is to avoid this place. Dealing one on one (or in small groups) in real life with creationists is much easier than dealing impersonally with the sort of folk we get here. My main goal in my church (especially when acting in an official capacity) is to persuade people to be accepting of multiple viewpoints, not to persuade them of mine. Start with what you have in common with them. And with some people, discussion is simply impossible.

 

[fireof god98]

A good step toward the first goal is to avoid this place. Dealing one on one (or in small groups) in real life with creationists is much easier than dealing impersonally with the sort of folk we get here. My main goal in my church (especially when acting in an official capacity) is to persuade people to be accepting of multiple viewpoints, not to persuade them of mine. Start with what you have in common with them. And with some people, discussion is simply impossible.

very wise words

 

[sfs]

Why should the end goal be a strengthening of 'faith'...?

Because the poster values faith, obviously. You were aware that you were posting on a Christian forum, right?

Why should we be encouraging a world view based upon pretence...?

You shouldn't be. But since you weren't one of the people he was addressing, who is this "we" you're talking about?

 

[biggles53]

Because the poster values faith, obviously. You were aware that you were posting on a Christian forum, right?


You shouldn't be. But since you weren't one of the people he was addressing, who is this "we" you're talking about?

Maybe I should have included a [/rhetoric] send off....?

 

[Sayre]

Because the poster values faith, obviously. You were aware that you were posting on a Christian forum, right?


You shouldn't be. But since you weren't one of the people he was addressing, who is this "we" you're talking about?

Thanks that helps. Faith is more valuable than ego. Last thing I want to do is damage someone else's faith.

 

[sfs]

Maybe I should have included a [/rhetoric] send off....?

What good would that have done? There was nothing subtle about your post.

 

[AV1611VET]

You have all missed my point. I'm asking how theistic eevolution folk can be more loving towards creationists and respect the end goal, which is faith in Christ, not winning this debate.

Can a house divided against itself stand?

 

[Sayre]

Can a house divided against itself stand?

How exactly is theistic evolution divided against itself? Surely you've seen that the intent of this thread is how te's can be loving towards creationists?

 

[sfs]

Can a house divided against itself stand?

It can't. So why are you always so divisive?

 

[Mr Strawberry]

And how on earth are we supposed to LOVE them when, from my point of view, they are so dogmatic and deceptive in their arguments?

I think to truly reflect Christ, we ought to spend more time loving those we disagree with. If anyone has any suggestions on how to do this, I am all ears.

It is more important to understand someone you disagree with than love them. Indiscriminately trying to love everyone sounds very noble, but is a fatuous exercise. Trying to understand them will give you a better idea of what is motivating their views and actions, and might lead you to sympathise with them or even empathise with them. And that might help with any bad feelings you have towards them. Or it might not. It depends what you uncover. But I'd say understanding is the most constructive thing to try and do.

 

[juvenissun]

How exactly is theistic evolution divided against itself? Surely you've seen that the intent of this thread is how te's can be loving towards creationists?

To a creationist of my type, the best love you could extend to me is to convince me that evolution is true.

And I don't think you can love me enough on that.