The Billionaires Who Own the U.S. AI Research Products, Should Perhaps "UP" Their Game

[Stephen3141]

https://www.cnn.com/2025/01/27/tech/deepseek-stocks-ai-china/index.html

The upstart Communist Chinese company DeepSpeak has released a
new AI tool. The company claimed that training the tool, cost a fraction
of what the new generative AI tools developed in America, cost.

Although this Computer Science grad takes a "wait, and see" approach,
I have been posting "AI Challenge Questions" on a thread in the Philosophy
and Ethics area, and answers that I expect these AI tools to reach (IF they
meet even minimal levels of human intelligence).

The AI Challenge Questions that I have posted, are what I would ask
HUMAN HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS in a class on critical thinking skills, in
a Christian high school. (So, the questions are not technical computer
algorithm design questions.)
---------- ----------

I SUGGEST that American Christians use the available AI tools to ask the
diagnostic questions, to see if the tools can emulate the answers that educated
human experts would formulate.

I have been saying FOR YEARS now, that the current AI research (in America)
is using hopelessly LOW standards and goals, and that the resulting tools are
not emulating the answers that educated human experts would give. ALSO,
I suspect that the AI tools are "trained" on a very limited set of input text,
which DOES NOT INCLUDE much of the expert knowledge in many areas.

Although the Communist Chinese AI tool descriptions may turn out to be another
release of superior Chinese BullSpeak rhetoric, still, the American AI research community
needs to WAKE UP, and stop accepting the hopelessly uneducated goals of the
billionaires who own the AI research companies, and start to deal with the very
much harder challenges that Computer Science has identified for decades. (A lot
of the advertizing of the American AI tools, is just American BullSpeak.)
---------- ----------

My guess is that the American AI tool producers are promoting the idea of massive
AI computing farms, BECAUSE they are relying on so much BRUTE FORCE computing,
in the algorithms that produce "AI answers" to queries. Brute force computing is not
smart, and should not be assumed to be the required platform for advances in AI
software tools.

 

[FireDragon76]

China is competitive in all kinds of areas in terms of technology related fields. The largest video game publisher in the world, TenCent, is a Chinese company, and it also owns shares in many major western video game publishing houses as well, with many popular eSports games being owned by it as well (such as Valorant and League of Legends). A few years ago, a Chinese developer even created the first AAA game from their own country, Black Myth: Wukong, a story based on traditional Chinese fiction and folk religion, and it's gotten alot of international awards.

When Intel chose to release their Arc GPU's a few years ago, they actually chose China, rather than the US or Europe, to begin the launch. So I think that's a sign of things to come.

 

[Stephen3141]

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/27/nx-s1-5276097/wall-street-stock-markets-tumble-deepseek-ai-tech-stock

A lot of this panic, is just investers who know little about AI, and the
algorithms and approaches currently in use.

BUT, American AI companies seem to have taken the easy-to-train
approach, rather than the much more difficult approach of trying to access
a map of all human knowledge. You can throw billions of dollars around.
But, if you choose to use a dumb machine training approach, the result will
still have serious limitations. Expensive advertising, will not fix the quick-and-dumb
approach.

If an AI tool cannot give authoritative references, to justify its answers, then
it is useless as a research tool. The electronic screen generations in America,
who often do not read books, don't understand this.

 

[Stephen3141]

On DeepSeek, you can watch AI navigate censorship in real time

A Chinese Embassy spokesperson said, “Artificial intelligence is not outside the law, and all governments are managing it according to law, and China is no exception.”

www.nbcnews.com

DeepSeek has a builtin censoring of queries that may deal with the criticism
of Communist China.

Because of this, it will not be a good research tool, if someone is dealing with
topics that the Chinese government scensors, within China.

Also, by the way, some American AI developers do not think that the abilities
of DeepSeek are all that remarkable. I am a bit skeptical, as this is what I
expect the billionaire American developers, to say.

 

[Stephen3141]

China is competitive in all kinds of areas in terms of technology related fields. The largest video game publisher in the world, TenCent, is a Chinese company, and it also owns shares in many major western video game publishing houses as well, with many popular eSports games being owned by it as well (such as Valorant and League of Legends). A few years ago, a Chinese developer even created the first AAA game from their own country, Black Myth: Wukong, a story based on traditional Chinese fiction and folk religion, and it's gotten alot of international awards.

When Intel chose to release their Arc GPU's a few years ago, they actually chose China, rather than the US or Europe, to begin the launch. So I think that's a sign of things to come.

Technology, in general, is not quite the same topic as artificial intelligence.

The American generations that have been raised on (graphical) video games
and interfaces, may not recognize this.

Graphical Processing Units may be excellent for rendering graphical images, or searching
for similarities or differences in graphical images. BUT, this is very different from logical
abilities. If you ask a software package (that allows queries) about philosophical
primitives, it will have no idea what you are asking. The ability to process graphical
images, is very different than the ability to process abstract logical concepts.

If all the 12 Apostles of Jesus, had been given the latest iPhones to record the 3
years of the teaching of Jesus, the resulting records still would not have been able to
explain how the teaching of Jesus, fits into the entire body of material that the Bible
presents to us. The logical interaction with the teaching of Jesus, is vital to
understanding what he was teaching, and why.

Note that many in the younger (electronic screen) generations in America, have no
ability to discuss philosophical primitives. Many are functionally illiterate, and cannot
read complex concepts represented in human languages, and explain what they
mean.

Confusing artificial intelligence, with stunning visual graphics, is a categorically
misunderstanding.

(And yes, Communist china has made a decades-long effort to invest in
technology.)

 

[FireDragon76]

Technology, in general, is not quite the same topic as artificial intelligence.

The American generations that have been raised on (graphical) video games
and interfaces, may not recognize this.

Graphical Processing Units may be excellent for rendering graphical images, or searching
for similarities or differences in graphical images. BUT, this is very different from logical
abilities. If you ask a software package (that allows queries) about philosophical
primitives, it will have no idea what you are asking. The ability to process graphical
images, is very different than the ability to process abstract logical concepts.

If all the 12 Apostles of Jesus, had been given the latest iPhones to record the 3
years of the teaching of Jesus, the resulting records still would not have been able to
explain how the teaching of Jesus, fits into the entire body of material that the Bible
presents to us. The logical interaction with the teaching of Jesus, is vital to
understanding what he was teaching, and why.

Note that many in the younger (electronic screen) generations in America, have no
ability to discuss philosophical primitives. Many are functionally illiterate, and cannot
read complex concepts represented in human languages, and explain what they
mean.

Confusing artificial intelligence, with stunning visual graphics, is a categorically
misunderstanding.

(And yes, Communist china has made a decades-long effort to invest in
technology.)

Inference is an important part of human intelligence. Otherwise, calculators would be great at philosophy.

 

[Stephen3141]

Inference is an important part of human intelligence. Otherwise, calculators would be great at philosophy.

I agree (given a rigorous definition of "inference").

As an aside, although a scientific calculator can do 1,000,000 math computations
a second (if it is software driven), Computer Science does not consider this to be
"complex human problem-solving". There are a lot of machines, that can do things
that human beings cannot do, but just for that, we do not consider that they have
artificial intellignece.

But, to follow your comment, there have been authors who warn that the younger
American generations cannot competently discuss philosophical basics. These
include what truth is, what (human) perception is, what our shared reality is, moral
theory, formal logic, methods to sift truth out of merely individual opinions, what a
fair rule of law is, morality-ethics, and what justice is. These involve very complicated
concepts and disciplined reasoning. And, our educational system (K12) has not passed
down this human intellignece effectively to our younger generations. I do not expect
the new AI tools to be able to do this, as they tend to quote common viewpoints on these
topics, without being able to evaluate them, critically.

I would say that AI tools that cannot competently handle queries about these philosophical
basic topics, do not reach the high Computer Science standard of doing "complex human
problem-solving".

 

[Stephen3141]

DeepSeek coding has the capability to transfer users' data directly to the Chinese government

DeepSeek coding has the capability to transfer users' data directly to the Chinese government

abcnews.go.com

Apparently, the new Communist Chinese AI tool DeepSeek has the ability to
send user's data directly to China.

American researchers in AI, need to recognize that the Chinese are waging
an all-technology war against America, and their AI products are completely
subject to the will of the Chinese dictator.

The American billionaires who own AI research companies, are still acting as
if the world is a completely benign place. It is not.