Brother I pray this does not come across in any way but love but your answer floored me. Have we drifted so far that now the Bible, God's word, is "almost" totally useless?? Are we to believe it is all mythology and historical error. May I ask a question? How in the world can any man truly believe God if he distrusts what God has given us. Faith becomes impossible and thus, pleasing God does as well, for without faith it is impossible (unless, of course, that too is not true!).
Let me be a voice crying out loudly to all here who read this. God's word does not contain some "truth". It is TRUTH. We are not to judge the word of God. It is to judge us. We are to live by every word of it, heed its warnings, be encouraged by its promises, and guard our hearts when satan comes whispering "Hath God said.....?" Jesus fought of the attacks of satan by quoting the word. Shall we be so bold as to think we do not need it. Careful, for we must not underestimate the power of satan to deceive and overestimate ourselves and our wisdom to know truth all by ourselves. God help us.
I have always said there is enough truth to be found in even the Living Bible, a poor paraphrase of the Word, that a man on a desert island, finding one washed up on the beach, would be thoroughly equipped to get saved and make Heaven His home.
The minute we allow doubts and our human logic to take precedance over God's word, God is now under the microscope and we are now God, creating the God we choose.
May God forgive us. We are to live by every word that proceeds out of His mouth. If we find an areas we do not understand, we move on and trust that at the proper time, our God will reveal His truth to our understanding.
We have entered the last time, and men are departing from the faith and giving heed to satan's lies. Paul told us the the word of God is perfectly adequate to equip us to walk in holiness if we will stop judging it and simply obey it, and let it search our hearts and judge us.
God has clearly spoken:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."
2 Timothy 3:16
Brother, we have a choice. Either we can believe God is lying here and that it is not inspired at all, or we can choose to submit ourselves to it and ask God to bless us with all it has to offer us, leading us more fully into abiding in Him.
May God open the eyes of His sheep.
Blessings,
Bruce
Well Bruce, I said I would get backj with you and everyone on this thread. I appreciate your patience
Please re-read what I wrote, because I did not say that the Bible was totally useless. This is not a Black and White ....ALL or NOTHING Issue.
First, we appear to have some different opinions in the Origins of the Bible. I do not, and never have, believed that "God gave it to us" Instead, I have shown through much exploration, prayer, and even old fashion research how it came into being. And while parts of it were weritten by persons who were probably and ibviosusly inspired by God, much of it remains myth and allegory. But I will say again, it is the MESSAGE not the story that is important.
For example, I remember my son asking me once if Noah's Arc ever really happened. I explained that no, it did not and could not. Now that he is old enough, we are able to talk about the laws of physics, epecially fluid dynamics and evaporation and condensation and show how a worldwide 40 day flood would have been as impossible then as it is now. (BTW, All major relgions have a flood myth of some type) But what lesson can be learned about man vs nature, about coexistance and about perseverence through that story? the lessons around it are good, even if the story is a myth. Kind of like the Aeosp Fable about the bird who was thirsty and could not reach the water in the bottom of a cup. SO, he took small pebbles in his beak and dropped them, one at a time, into the cup and slowly the water level rose. He continued this until the water level was high enough that he could reach it. So the story ends with a moral that "Little by Little does the trick" (Patience)
My favorite myth from the Bible is the garden of Eden myth. It involves a talking snake, who supposedly walked upright but was for his "sins" , forced to slither sometime thereafter the appearance of humans on the plaent. Of course, everyone knows that snakes have been "Slithering" we know since at least the Cretaceous Period, which was 130 Million years ago. And no, they never evolved vocalizations. Of course we know the importance of this myth in organized Christianity.
Many of the stories, although grounded in myth and lacking any scientific or historical fact, have morals. But not all. Some aspects of the Bible are totally reprehensible, and encourage actions that we as more enlightened humans in the 21st century know better than to follow. Such then is the point I have always made that the Bible is NOT intended as an authority or guide for us.
It is a great look into how a few early Christians worshipped. It is a great look into how early superstitious Romans and Jews interpreted "God"
But since then our understanding of what "God" is has changed and evolved. We know more about life and the Universe and yes, even "God" than 2000 years ago.
Next time you get sick, would you ask your doctor to reference a 2000 year old medical book and use it as a guide to diagnose and treat you? I hope not !!!
So why reference a book that was intended as a reference for early Christians? Why have a relationship with a Book when you can have a relationship God?
And why wrap your whole faith up in a book? Especially when it contains errors? How much more of it is "errant" that we have not yet realized?
And above all else, WHY hold to an ancient Superstitious concept of a god who is humanized, a
Super Human with an Ego who demands worship or casts non-believers into Hell? How primitive is that?
Now let me remind you of a couple of items if I could. As far as we know, Jesus never commanded ANYONE to write anything down. We know that after Jesus died, His followers got together and started asking questions and sharing stories. So, after 90 or so years, when those stories could have changed a little, had some embellishments and editing in the retelling, someone put one into writing. We call it the Gospel of Mark. 'Again, we never had a command from Jesus to "use a Bible as a sole basis of faith" (
Sola Scriptura) in fact, think about this: Jesus, as a jew, would have been instructed purely in the Oral tradition. And as a laborer, as the son of a carpenter (day laborer) He would have been uneducated and possibly illiterate!!! So what concern would Jesus have had with keeping a book !!!!!
You mentioned a passage of Scripture from 2nd Timothy . Normally I do nto respond to "Verse Mining" because it keeps the Bible totally out of context. To understand the Bible, one must not only read it as a whole, but have an understanding of Jewish, Egyptian and Roman mythology because so much of that influenced early Christianity. but to respon, when that passage was written, there was NO Bible. It did not yet exist. There was no "New Testament" Canon.
So if you are going to apply that to future canon, then do we have to give equal time and countenence to later scriptures, such as the Koran, the Book of Mormon and yikes! the Teachings of Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh? Seriously, The first one I have read, the second one bored me to tears and the third one, well, it misses the mark for me altogether ! And what about scripture such as the Bhagtava Gita? It may have precluded Christ. If Paul said "All Scripture" well I guess that is part of it too. Certainly Buddhist Scripture existed in Christ's time. (Which if you read them you would find amazing similarities to parts of Jesus' teachings)
I guess my final question would be do you put your faith in the words of Paul? Because those are not the Words of God, those are the wrods of man. And what kind of a man was Paul? check out the book
Peculier Treasures by Frederick Beauchener. After reading that, you may find it very hard to equate the words of Paul with the Words of God. Remember that when you quote anything Paul said. Paul was about relgion. He was fanatical about his new found religion. And fanatics tend to have more zeal and be a lot more vocal than mystics. But he was not an "enlightened" figure so to speak. He lacked the insight to know that God, being Omniscient and Eternal, will work through all people in His way, not Paul's way. So please to try to keep that in perspective.
Ah but I wander here.
God has
never Lied to us. If the Bible contains errors, it is because Humans put them there. And we, by our nature, sometimes make mistakes. We sometimes mess up along the way. Some of us will even admit it when we do. And we may mistakenly equate something for which it is not. Seriously, how could a God, who is universal, omnipotent, perfect and eternal be described in human language by humans who are imperfect, limited and mortal? It cannot be done. Our language and our limited human capacity prevents us from totally understanding God. That is why the descriptions of God from 5000 years ago in Jewish mythology were so
humanized. We cannot do it. We can try, and many good books,
the Bible, and others may come out of it. There have been many books published which I would say are inspired by God. I do know this. But in the end, they remain the creations and inspirations of humans. After all, that is what we are. And than You God, for giving us Intellegence and Reason. and we look to Christ to elevate us. that is what is meant by the Christ Consciousness. Christhood is that Link with God, that realization of "God Made Flesh" of God "Dwelling amongst us" ..In terms that we as Humans can understand. Christ as God. Think of that for a moment.
Then think of this. Go out tonight, take your telescope and point it at the constellation Orion and find a star called Rho Caseopea. The light you are seeing now reaching our planet left that star 4000 years ago, long before Jesus was born, and is just now reaching us. And here's the fun part. God is just as much there and then as He is here and Now. THAT is AMAZING !!!! and within that cluster of Stars, are planets. And some of those planets may have life on them. and that Life, the essence of all that is Living in the Universe, is God. God is there too.
But did you see this:
