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it has fallen many times but you can still find it -I agree. It is a city. John makes this very clear. It is Jerusalem.
what?It is futile to attempt to find something in history that fits a future event.
how can you say that?
-how will you recognize the fulfillment of prophecy if you don't understand when a city is a city?
-look at chapter 18 and look for the word city
-seven times
It is explained in Rev. 17 we just have to solve the WHO part, of the Seven Heads, five are Fallen (Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece) ONE IS (Rome) the other is YET TO COME (Revived Rome/Anti-Christ and 10 Kings). We understand this by looking at what all of these nations have in common. They all conquered are enslaved Israel at some point in time. Israel was basically no more for 2000 years, then she was reborn in 1948, setting the stage for her to again be conquered by the last Head of the Seven Headed Beast, the Anti-Christ and his 10 Kings.I agree that the 7 mountains are indeed 7 nations with 7 kings or leaders. My guess would be 7 Muslim nations that surround Israel.
I see your history is lacking. How many world wars started in Europe (part of the 1/4 of the earth). Where was the black plague (part of the 1/4 of the earth)? I found a list of all the wars of Europe in the first thouand years of the church. It was a VERY long list: hardly a year anywhere where there was not a war somewhere. Although I could not find records, i suspect Africa was worse. Speaking of Africa, WHERE have the terrible times of starvation been in our lifetimes?Now I see why you have a faulty rendering of Revelation's unfolding .... the first 5 portents do not match any historical events of the past
John's spirit was taken to heaven and into the future to be shown the "things hereafter" and not events of history or even the things present in his day [Revelation 19:1; 4:1]
All of the things "hereafter" are still pending and still to come
The coming tribulation is still future as we speak and this time frame parallels the 70th week decreed for Israel which is still pending
Jerusalem will continue. But MYSTERY Babylon (Jerusalem as the world center for deception) will be destroyed. NEVER AGAIN will Jerusalem be a harlot city. Both "great cities" are in reference to Jerusalem. But one is a mystery city that is a harlot city. The harlot city will be destroyed. Jerusalem the physical city will be rebuilt, a new temple will be erected, and she will be God's city forever - no more mystery, no more harlotry."I agree. It is a city. John makes this very clear. It is Jerusalem"
There are two "great cities" noted in Revelation's unfolding
The great city of the nations of the Gentiles at MBG's core .... this one will be destroyed in one day by Satan's beast in the little horn of Daniel's visions and his 10 other kings [Revelation 14:8; 17:16-18; 18] .... this city [civilization] is enormous with far reaching global influence
Jerusalem .... the Lord's city .... this one is eternal and will continue on [Revelation 11:8]
Waters represent people.it has fallen many times but you can still find it -
it has never been famous for trade -
it does not have many waters -
it does not fit
The Seals have to happen after the Abomination of Desolation. And we know that is after the Gospel has been preached unto all the world. KEYS !! Are important. Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. (KEY) 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains { As we see, the Abomination can only come after the Gospel has been preached into all the world, then Israel flees into the Wilderness, just like in Rev. 12:7 and Daniel 12:1-2. In Daniel 12:1-2 and Matthew 24:21 we see that there will be Tribulation like that which has never been seen before or since. THAT HAS TO BE FUTURE, it could not be AD 70. WW1 and WW2 was much worse, along with all the murders by Hitler, Mao, Stalin etc. etc.I see your history is lacking. How many world wars started in Europe (part of the 1/4 of the earth). Where was the black plague (part of the 1/4 of the earth)? I found a list of all the wars of Europe in the first thouand years of the church. It was a VERY long list: hardly a year anywhere where there was not a war somewhere. Although I could not find records, i suspect Africa was worse. Speaking of Africa, WHERE have the terrible times of starvation been in our lifetimes?
If you read after many of the "experts" they say the first few seals are parallel to the first part of Matthew 24. I agree with them.
Jerusalem will continue. But MYSTERY Babylon (Jerusalem as the world center for deception) will be destroyed. NEVER AGAIN will Jerusalem be a harlot city. Both "great cities" are in reference to Jerusalem. But one is a mystery city that is a harlot city. The harlot city will be destroyed. Jerusalem the physical city will be rebuilt, a new temple will be erected, and she will be God's city forever - no more mystery, no more harlotry.
Waters represent people.
It WILL BECOME famous for trade, for when the Beast makes Jerusalem his headquarters, he will do MUCH merchandising, bring billions of dollars worth of goods into Jerusalem. You do know Satan LOVES merchandising?
It DOES fit. Not now, but THEN.
water is not water -Waters represent people.
The Seals have to happen after the Abomination of Desolation. WHO SAID? God certainly did not say this. There is no scripture anywhere that even hints of this.The Seals have to happen after the Abomination of Desolation. And we know that is after the Gospel has been preached unto all the world. KEYS !! Are important. Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. (KEY) 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains { As we see, the Abomination can only come after the Gospel has been preached into all the world, then Israel flees into the Wilderness, just like in Rev. 12:7 and Daniel 12:1-2. In Daniel 12:1-2 and Matthew 24:21 we see that there will be Tribulation like that which has never been seen before or since. THAT HAS TO BE FUTURE, it could not be AD 70. WW1 and WW2 was much worse, along with all the murders by Hitler, Mao, Stalin etc. etc.
The first few seals can not parallel with Matthew 24 until after the Abomination which must come after the Gospel is preached unto all the world. We have to use our KEYS !!
There is no Mystery Babylon. The Angel Revealed the Mystery, thus it stopped being a Mystery. COME I WILL SHOW YOU the Mystery of the Beast and the Woman. How can you be many Nations, Tongues and Peoples and be a "City". Just not realistic. Babylon was a City, God is comparing the Wickedness of False Religion (Harlot) and False Gov. (Babylon the Great) with Babylon the EX-CITY.
Babylon is the whole World at enmity with God that is being judged. The Harlot is False Religion.
now that's goodIf it is not still a mystery, tell me why even here on this thread no one agrees?
We aren't speaking about the Preaching of the Gospel by the 144,000 or Angels. We are speaking about when the time of the Gentiles will be fulfilled. You are a bright guy, so I enjoy the conversation, but remember, there is never a time when the Holy Spirit stops teaching us, I change daily from old thoughts I used to have, when the Holy Spirit leads me that way. If a person has beliefs that never change, he isn't adding knowledge.The Seals have to happen after the Abomination of Desolation. WHO SAID? God certainly did not say this. There is no scripture anywhere that even hints of this.
WHEN will the gospel be preached in all the world? Did you not notice in Rev. 14, a MIDPOINT chapter, that angels will take the gospel to every human in their own language so all will know the truth? That is when this scripture will be fulfilled. And the end Jesus was speaking of is the end at the battle of Armageddon. The end of the church age will come over 7 years before then.
You are all mixed up in your chronology. Read Matthew 24 up to verse 14. These verses with earthquakes, wars pestilence etc are a parallel to the first five seals. And if you look closely at what Jesus said in verse 6, HE IS NOT TALKING ABOUT THE END (the end is not yet). Neither are the first 5 seals about the end. These are church age events. The abomination (verse 15) comes AFTER all these things that are the beginning of sorrows and the beginning of birth pains.
I kind of agree, but I think they have barley started. A child is not seen until its here, but the effects or pain of birth is felt immediately before the birth, so we do see some of the pangs of the coming Anti-Christ, like world trade, gays being allowed to marry, Christians being reviled, etc. etc. I think the Anti-Christ is about 40-50 today and is just waiting to come to power. But the pangs do not last long, so either way, its here or very close.The birth pangs for Israel have not yet started ..... but coming
Not until the 70th week decreed for the nation will they come [Jeremiah 30; Ezekiel 20:33-44;Daniel 12:1-4; Zechariah 13; 14; 15; Matthew 24:15-16; Luke 21:20-36]
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