• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.
  6. We are no longer allowing posts or threads that deny the existence of Covid-19. Members have lost loved ones to this virus and are grieving. As a Christian site, we do not need to add to the pain of the loss by allowing posts that deny the existence of the virus that killed their loved one. Future post denying the Covid-19 existence, calling it a hoax, will be addressed via the warning system.

The African Ancestors of Jesus

Discussion in 'Christian Scriptures' started by Humble_Disciple, Jul 27, 2021.

  1. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
    The concept of "race" didn't exist in ancient history like it does today. Inter-racial marriage was practiced throughout the Bible, including the genealogy of Jesus.



    It makes sense that King Solomon would become romantically involved with the Queen of Sheba, if his mother, Bathsheba, was a black woman.


    The Bible's only descriptions of Jesus' skin color are in Daniel 10:6 and Revelation 1:15.

    Daniel 10:6
    …his arms and legs had the color of burnished bronze, and the sound of his speech was like the noise of a multitude.

    Revelation 1:15
    His feet were like burnished bronze, refined in a furnace, and his voice was like the roar of many waters.


    According to the Jim Crow era’s one drop rule, anyone with even a drop of African ancestry was denied access to public accommodations. This would have included Jesus if He were around in the segregationist South, including in churches that claimed to worship Him.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    The historical, Biblical Jesus, with "burnished bronze" skin, whose foremothers were Tamar, Rahab, Ruth and Bathsheba, loves you.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2021
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. TzephanYahu

    TzephanYahu Active Member

    258
    +210
    United Kingdom
    Christian
    Married
    Well, it's a good thing that skin colour is not important isn't it! But imagine someone actually being concerned about such a topic - that would be very sad.

    The Messiah certainly never wanted His skin tone discussed over His words. But if He was black or closer to black than semitic in appearance, your OP has been very unconvincing to bolster this theory.

    But again, imagine actually researching and being concerned about this topic! That would be such a poor way to spend time in the Word.
     
  3. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
     
  4. IceJad

    IceJad Regular Member

    827
    +482
    Malaysia
    Lutheran
    Single


    I dislike it when people try to misread the Bible to suit their own interpretation. What race Jesus is is important because it is to fulfill the prophesy about the messiah. Not because of race but because of God's promise. If God promise that the messiah would come from India, I would be anticipating a person of Indian facial features and complexion. And He would still be God incarnate.

    Lucky there is a video made recently to explain the Bible verses in original language. I can't be sure how Jesus look like but I can be very certain He is neither a blue eyes blond nor curly black African.

    He is Jewish and will look like every other people of the Levant during that age. Even if and that is a very big IF there is a mixing of blood by the times of Jesus' birth the facial features will look like everyone around Levant.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  5. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
    The concept of "race" didn't exist in ancient history like it does today. Inter-racial marriage was practiced throughout the Bible, including the genealogy of Jesus.
     
  6. IceJad

    IceJad Regular Member

    827
    +482
    Malaysia
    Lutheran
    Single
    The concept of race did exist but as a collect of people from a region. Like how the Egyptian know there are difference between native and the immigrant Hebrews. All over the Bible there is a division of race. Egyptian are genetically distinct from central and southern Africans.

    Also the Rahab, Tamar, Ruth, and Bathsheba have no reference to any relations to people from the the central and southern Africans. Neither in Rabbinic traditions nor original Hebrew/Aramic verses.
     
  7. Ignatius the Kiwi

    Ignatius the Kiwi Anti-Democratic Monarchist

    +2,874
    New Zealand
    Eastern Orthodox
    Single
    What special reason is there to believe that the Egyptians were similar in complexion to either Ethiopian or Sub-Saharan Africans? Copts are the most direct descendants of the ancient Egyptians and given their resistance to conversion to Islam and forbidding of that community intermarrying with the Arab part of the population it does not seem like such a leap to suppose ancient Egyptians more resembled the Copts than the Nubians.

    Also what reason is there to suppose that Bathsheba was black?
     
  8. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
     
  9. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
  10. Ignatius the Kiwi

    Ignatius the Kiwi Anti-Democratic Monarchist

    +2,874
    New Zealand
    Eastern Orthodox
    Single
    This doesn't really answer my question. I skimmed the article and saw nothing about it showing Bathsheba to be an African. The only connection you have to go on is the Egyptian connection and the references to Ethiopia. With regards to Egypt you have a difficult case in establishing the sort of narrative you've given since the Copts as a minority apart from Islamic Egyptians and the influence of Arabization managed the preserve themselves to the current day.

    I suppose we could go on Hieroglyphs but they aren't exactly clear either. Take this scene of circumcision for instance:

    [​IMG]

    Or this image of Rameses II conquering some people:

    [​IMG]

    I don't think there is a clear reason to believe the ancient Egyptians were black, at least insofar as they resemble sub-saharan Africans or Ethiopians. More likely I think they had Mediterranean/Arab/Middle Eastern features.
     
  11. coffee4u

    coffee4u Well-Known Member

    +2,137
    Australia
    Christian
    Married
    Jesus appearance would have been that of a brown skinned, brown haired, brown eyed Middle eastern Jew.

    As for black ancestors, Ruth was black, I don't know about the others.
    But like all of us the linage goes back to Adam and Eve who could not have been of any particular race since all races arose from them.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2021
  12. honey badger

    honey badger i am

    959
    +398
    United Kingdom
    Christian
    Married
    not that this has anything whatsoever to do with the skin pigment of Jesus ...

    and His feet are like fine bronze, as having been refined in a furnace; and His voice is like the voice of many waters;

    5474 chalkolibanon (fine copper, bronze or brass)

    STRONGS

    Neuter of a compound of chalkos and libanos (in the implied meaning of whiteness or brilliancy); burnished copper, an alloy of copper (or gold) and silver having a brilliant lustre -- fine brass.

    the book of Revelation of Jesus Christ is a book about the Father revealing Himself in the Son, who we all are ...

    feet ( ten toes (law)) relate to our walk , our walk relates to the path and the path relates to a mentality we are in having the law written in us as we are refined in His furnace, God being a consuming fire, as in a threshing floor where the chaff is separated from the seed ... the chaff being our own covering not His ...

    it is here where we speak with one mind and one voice as in His voice of many waters ...
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2021
  13. IceJad

    IceJad Regular Member

    827
    +482
    Malaysia
    Lutheran
    Single
    DNA from the Bible's Canaanites lives on in modern Arabs and Jews

    This insistence that Jesus is somehow genetically African as in Black African is stretching the biblical readings. Egypt while is located in African continent is not what honest historians would categorized as black people. Are there black pharaohs before? Yes. Is Egypt predominantly black? No. Jesus was born in Bethlehem and fled to Egypt to escape King Herod. When God called Him out of Egypt doesn't change Jesus into a black African.

    Levant is also located in Asia, is Jesus Asian like me an ethnic Chinese? I wish He was. But then I would be projecting onto Jesus whom I want Him to be.

    If the mixing was so pronounce that Israelites during the time of Jesus were African looking then why does the Middle Eastern Jews who have stayed in the region from the times of the Romans looked Middle Eastern? Why is the historical Jewish Roman historian Josephus looked like a modern day Middle Easterner?
     
  14. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
    [​IMG]
     
  15. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +7,343
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    The ethiopian enuch is called an ethiopian. Ethiopians are generally black as we know it. So yes. The Bible does refer to those who are of a different race.

    The problem is that whites are guilty of making a white version of Jesus, and blacks are guilty of doing the same by making a black version of Jesus. Jesus was neither white and nor was he black.

    Jesus was Jewish and Jewish people are from the middle east. People from the middle east are usually midtone in skin color and they are not European or black looking. This is what we see in ancient drawings of those who lived in the region who were Jewish, as well.

    Judas had to be able to point out Jesus among the disciples and He did so with a kiss. This means that Jesus looked very similar to His disciples in that they were all Jewish looking. They were able to recognize a Gentile when they seen one because they encountered Gentile people like the Canaanite woman, and the Roman centurion, etc.; But the Jews were not confused as being like that of Ethiopians.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2021
  16. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

    +7,343
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Here is what the Israelites most likely looked like:

    [​IMG]

    EXODUS & THE CROSSING OF THE READ SEA. WALL PAINTING FROM THE DURA EUROPOS ONE OF THE EARLYEST KNOWN SYNAGOGUES DATED C. 245

    Dura-Europos, also spelled Dura-Europus, was a Hellenistic, Parthian and Roman border city built on an escarpment 90 metres above the eastern bank of the Euphrates river. It is located near the village of Salhiyé, in today's Syria.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2021
  17. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

    +5,114
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    Yes, and our more close common relative would been Noah and his family.
     
  18. coffee4u

    coffee4u Well-Known Member

    +2,137
    Australia
    Christian
    Married
    Do you have some issue with Jesus being a brown skinned middle eastern Jew?
     
  19. Humble_Disciple

    Humble_Disciple Well-Known Member

    +359
    United States
    Protestant
    Divorced
    According to the one drop rule that was enforced during the Jim Crow era, anyone with even a drop of African ancestry was denied access to public accomodations. This would have included Jesus if He were around in the segregationist south, including in churches that claimed to worship Him.
     
  20. coffee4u

    coffee4u Well-Known Member

    +2,137
    Australia
    Christian
    Married
    The one drop rule was created by white colonial powers to control and enslave people. Since if someone had one drop they could legally enslave them. The one drop rule is of course nonsense.
     
Loading...