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The Adventist Dilemma

Telaquapacky

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Perhaps it's only my dilemma.

The things that originally attracted me to the Seventh-day Adventist Church were it's peculiarity and intensity, it's unflinching non-conformity to the rest of the Christian world- it seemed to me that these people couldn't care less if the world accepted them. They had a unique and distinctive message, one every member fully expected they might die or be tortured for. I did not come in through an evangelistic crusade or radio or TV program. God brought me here supernaturally.

Now the church has changed, and I have changed. The worship style I would have considered ideal when I first joined- simple and austere- is very different from what I prefer now- much more lively and youth-oriented. But at the same time, I am still attracted to very conservative doctrine. And, the reason I am attracted to lively, youth oriented worship style, is not that I like drums in church for example, or guitars more than organ, or pallid, doctrineless praise songs, but only one reason:

Nobody will join a church that appeals to old, conservative people. It seems as if we can't both have the kind of reverence in our services that we used to have, and at the same time obey the Great Commission, to win souls. It also seems that nobody is interested in the doctrines and teachings, or at least in any kind of orthodoxy that is "too different" from the rest of the Christian world.

Here's the double question I put to you all, and this is the dilemma: How can we preserve the "I could die for this" non-conformity and distinctiveness that used to give our movement it's fiery intensity, and yet have the kind of open-minded self examination essential to intellectual honesty, or the pluralistic "nobody's wrong" attitude that of acceptance, without which we will never attract new members? And how can we preserve any kind of decorum and reverence in our services when it seems we have to make them more entertaining and exciting?

I don't want to dumb down our message, or lose the intense, defiant personality of our movement, or lose my sense of reverence in worship- yet I don't want to grow old and die in a dying church of old fuddy-duddies, worshipping all alone because we're so weird, nobody will ever join us.
 

Adventtruth

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Perhaps it's only my dilemma.

The things that originally attracted me to the Seventh-day Adventist Church were it's peculiarity and intensity, it's unflinching non-conformity to the rest of the Christian world- it seemed to me that these people couldn't care less if the world accepted them. They had a unique and distinctive message, one every member fully expected they might die or be tortured for. I did not come in through an evangelistic crusade or radio or TV program. God brought me here supernaturally.

Now the church has changed, and I have changed. The worship style I would have considered ideal when I first joined- simple and austere- is very different from what I prefer now- much more lively and youth-oriented. But at the same time, I am still attracted to very conservative doctrine. And, the reason I am attracted to lively, youth oriented worship style, is not that I like drums in church for example, or guitars more than organ, or pallid, doctrineless praise songs, but only one reason:

Nobody will join a church that appeals to old, conservative people. It seems as if we can't both have the kind of reverence in our services that we used to have, and at the same time obey the Great Commission, to win souls. It also seems that nobody is interested in the doctrines and teachings, or at least in any kind of orthodoxy that is "too different" from the rest of the Christian world.

Here's the double question I put to you all, and this is the dilemma: How can we preserve the "I could die for this" non-conformity and distinctiveness that used to give our movement it's fiery intensity, and yet have the kind of open-minded, self examining, pluralistic "nobody's wrong" attitude that is popular today, without which we will never attract new members? And how can we preserve any kind of decorum and reverence in our services when it seems we have to make them more entertaining and exciting?

I don't want to dumb down our message, or lose the intense, defiant personality of our movement, or lose my sense of reverence in worship- yet I don't want to grow old and die in a dying church of old fuddy-duddies, worshipping all alone because we're so weird, nobody will ever join us.

I don't either. But take a look around the Adventist church...what does she preach and teach? How do we bring people in? The Revelation and Daniel seminar? go figure.


-AT:)
 
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reddogs

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I have found that people online are interested or want to know what religion can do for them as they have had a taste of it at one time or another and came away perplexed, confused, or disgusted. Very few come away with a good experience as they are ignored at churches, given no real interaction except to follow what has been the norm such as be greeted at the door, and are usually sent home with a sermon unrelated to the everyday issues they face. I think the real question is how do we change that so the world hears Gods truth and experiences his love instead of the silent stares, cold handshakes or unitelligible theological debates that we see at most churches or read online on religious sites.

The church is catering now to the youth and so every few years the marketing changes and some things are added or taken away. What we need to do is start to interact by creating a Bible Study or Online Bible group to find the truth again and bring back the fire from within instead of the drifting sermons, useless theological arguing and cold "fellowship" that has now permeated every church except for a realitive few.....
 
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Adventtruth

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I have found that people online are interested or want to know what religion can do for them as they have had a taste of it at one time or another and came away perplexed, confused, or disgusted. Very few come away with a good experience as they are ignored at churches, given no real interaction except to follow what has been the norm such as be greeted at the door, and are usually sent home with a sermon unrelated to the everyday issues they face. I think the real question is how do we change that so the world hears Gods truth and experiences his love instead of the silent stares, cold handshakes or unitelligible theological debates that we see at most churches or read online on religious sites.

The church is catering now to the youth and so every few years the marketing changes and some things are added or taken away. What we need to do is start to interact by creating a Bible Study or Online Bible group to find the truth again and bring back the fire from within instead of the drifting sermons, useless theological arguing and cold "fellowship" that has now permeated every church except for a realitive few.....


What we need to do is start to interact by creating a Bible Study or Online Bible group to find the truth again and bring back the fire from within instead of the drifting sermons, useless theological arguing and cold "fellowship" that has now permeated every church except for a realitive few....


So what is this truth you speak of?

-AT:)
 
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Telaquapacky

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So what is this truth you speak of?

-AT:)
Echoing Pilate's question, "What is truth?" To answer that, you would have to say what are the essential teachings that make Seventh-day Adventists different, and therefore worth having another denomination.

Reddog posed a good test. He complained about sermons "unrelated to the everyday issues" we face. What relates to the daily issues we face, and what doesn't? For example, you know I am serious about 1844 and I understand your feelings about it, but what does it have to do with daily life? - that is, what difference would it make to my life today if the antitypical Day of Atonement and the pre-advent judgment started in 31 A.D. or 1844? No difference, really. But take for example the Great Controversy, or the Larger View. Every day I am confronted with choices and have to decide how to respond to what life throws at me- and there, the knowledge that I am part of vindicating God's character and His fitness to rule the universe (and my life), the challenge of whether I will trust Him fully or not, and how to go about trusting Him- these are issues I face minute by minute, and I find that the Larger View gives me a perspective and help I wouldn't get anywhere else.
 
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Adventtruth

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God truth is unchanging and if you thirst for it, you need to seek it and read his word and listen to the Holy Spirit as it quides you to the understanding of it.......

I ask you again...what is truth, not how I get it.

-AT:)
 
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Adventtruth

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Echoing Pilate's question, "What is truth?" To answer that, you would have to say what are the essential teachings that make Seventh-day Adventists different, and therefore worth having another denomination.

So you are saying Adventism is truth and what is outside of Adventism is not???

For example, you know I am serious about 1844 and I understand your feelings about it, but what does it have to do with daily life? - that is, what difference would it make to my life today if the antitypical Day of Atonement and the pre-advent judgment started in 31 A.D. or 1844? No difference, really.

There is a big difference. Really! This false doctrine is a judgment based on works...and a god who has not forgiven sin...and not based on grace...while the truth of the matter is that those who trust wont be judged for righteousness, because it about Jesus, and not about us...we are found in Him.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.




But take for example the Great Controversy
, There is no controversy...iis all about Jesus! Satan is a defeated foe and he knows it.


the knowledge that I am part of vindicating God's character and His fitness to rule the universe (and my life), the challenge of whether I will trust Him fully or not, and how to go about trusting Him- these are issues I face minute by minute, and I find that the Larger View gives me a perspective and help I wouldn't get anywhere else.

God was vindicated at the cross.

Col 2:15 " And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. "


Satan was proven to be a defeated foe once and for all. It is by the grace of God that you tust Him daily. If you are worried about it as you say then you make it about you and not Jesus. Do you trust Him??? Are you resting in Him as the bible says?? Then if you are why is it a challenge?


-AT:)
 
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reddogs

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Gods truth is what is openned to us through Christ's words in the Bible, the opening of our minds by the Holy Spirit and by Gods love as shown to us.
Christ answered part of that in his illustrations....
In Mk.10:17-22 We find a rich man running to Jesus and kneels asking him, “Good teacher (Rabbi) what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
Jesus says to the man “You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery,' 'Do not murder,' 'Do not steal,' 'Do not bear false witness,' 'Do not defraud,' 'Honor your father and your mother.” (the account in Matthew 19 adds- you shall love your neighbor as yourself) And he answered and said to Him, “Teacher, all these I have observed from my youth.”
Jesus then points this man who was seeking to do the commandments; trying to show the man the direction of Gods love. But instead of seeing God's truth of love in the commandments which he failed to keep, the man replies that he has kept them since he was young.
Jesus sees he is sincere in his pursuit and it says he loved him. He loved him enough to tell him what he needed to hear, pointing to the one thing hindering him. The ruler said to Jesus what he thought he kept, Jesus told him what he did not. He probably thought he kept it all and would be commended, that there would be nothing to hinder him. However, Jesus puts his finger on just one thing--“Go your way, sell whatever you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow Me
He failed to see what the laws were about because he saw and kept the letter of the law not the essense or spirit of the law which is love.
 
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Adventtruth

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Gods truth is what is openned to us through Christ's words in the Bible, the opening of our minds by the Holy Spirit and by Gods love as shown to us.
Christ answered part of that in his illustrations....
In Mk.10:17-22 We find a rich man running to Jesus and kneels asking him, “Good teacher (Rabbi) what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
Jesus says to the man “You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery,' 'Do not murder,' 'Do not steal,' 'Do not bear false witness,' 'Do not defraud,' 'Honor your father and your mother.” (the account in Matthew 19 adds- you shall love your neighbor as yourself) And he answered and said to Him, “Teacher, all these I have observed from my youth.”
Jesus then points this man who was seeking to do the commandments; trying to show the man the direction of Gods love. But instead of seeing God's truth of love in the commandments which he failed to keep, the man replies that he has kept them since he was young.
Jesus sees he is sincere in his pursuit and it says he loved him. He loved him enough to tell him what he needed to hear, pointing to the one thing hindering him. The ruler said to Jesus what he thought he kept, Jesus told him what he did not. He probably thought he kept it all and would be commended, that there would be nothing to hinder him. However, Jesus puts his finger on just one thing--“Go your way, sell whatever you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, take up the cross, and follow Me


He failed to see what the laws were about because he saw and kept the letter of the law not the essense or spirit of the law which is love.

Well said Reddogs

This is what I try to point out to others. Its not about the law and my performance its about Jesus and His perfromance for us. To treasure Jesus supreme is to love Jesus...and if we love Jesus we will love others. The two new commandments ,Love God supreme and your fellow man ...all of the whole law including the ten hang upon these two commands. Love is a fulfilling of the (whole) law.

-AT:)
 
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Jon0388g

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I don't either. But take a look around the Adventist church...what does she preach and teach? How do we bring people in? The Revelation and Daniel seminar? go figure.


-AT:)

Isn't that the distinctive mission of the Adventist Church? The three-angels' message??

Jon
 
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Jon0388g

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Echoing Pilate's question, "What is truth?" To answer that, you would have to say what are the essential teachings that make Seventh-day Adventists different, and therefore worth having another denomination.

Reddog posed a good test. He complained about sermons "unrelated to the everyday issues" we face. What relates to the daily issues we face, and what doesn't? For example, you know I am serious about 1844 and I understand your feelings about it, but what does it have to do with daily life? - that is, what difference would it make to my life today if the antitypical Day of Atonement and the pre-advent judgment started in 31 A.D. or 1844? No difference, really. But take for example the Great Controversy, or the Larger View. Every day I am confronted with choices and have to decide how to respond to what life throws at me- and there, the knowledge that I am part of vindicating God's character and His fitness to rule the universe (and my life), the challenge of whether I will trust Him fully or not, and how to go about trusting Him- these are issues I face minute by minute, and I find that the Larger View gives me a perspective and help I wouldn't get anywhere else.

:amen:
 
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Telaquapacky

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So you are saying Adventism is truth and what is outside of Adventism is not???
No, I wasn't thinking or saying that. Seventh-day Adventists share many truths with other denominations. My phrase, "essential teachings that make Seventh-day Adventism different" means truths we teach that are either opposed or unknown by some other denominations, which gives a reason for our denomination to exist (no point in creating another label, another company of saints and another split in the already shattered Christian world if we are teaching everything identical to everyone else), and truths essential in the sense- not that they are essential to salvation- no, but only essential in that we as Adventists would not want to give them up.

There is much truth in other denominations, and to say there was not would be silly.

I'd like to ask you the converse question: If there are teachings that we Adventists teach that no other Christian church teaches, does that automatically mean that they are false?
There is a big difference. Really! This false doctrine is a judgment based on works...and a god who has not forgiven sin...and not based on grace...while the truth of the matter is that those who trust wont be judged for righteousness, because it about Jesus, and not about us...we are found in Him.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
That you believe 1844 elevates righteousness by works in place of grace, or that 1844 in any way undermines God's forgiveness of sin shows that you do not understand 1844.
, There is no controversy...iis all about Jesus! Satan is a defeated foe and he knows it....God was vindicated at the cross.

Col 2:15 " And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. "
No controversy? I believe that the testimony of Scripture and a quick glance at the planet we live on would say the opposite.

Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Our faith being "all about Jesus" doesn't negate the fact that we are combatants in spiritual warfare, part of a big picture of a cosmic controversy between Christ and Satan since sin began in heaven. On the contrary, it calls for us to depend upon Him more and more, because we dare not battle in our own power. The whole Bible is about that, and though Christ's name wasn't mentioned, for the faithful, it was always about Christ from the beginning.

Satan was proven to be a defeated foe once and for all. It is by the grace of God that you tust Him daily. If you are worried about it as you say then you make it about you and not Jesus. Do you trust Him??? Are you resting in Him as the bible says?? Then if you are why is it a challenge?

-AT:)
Suppose you have to make a business decision involving hundreds of thousands of dollars, and investment in commercial real estate and growing a promising small business, albeit in a beleaguered industry with an uncertain future. You can't just sit on your hands and hope for the best to happen. You have to make decisions and take decisive action. At the same time you have to pray and hope that this is God's will for you, ask Him to open and close the appropriate doors (and not force any closed door open with a crowbar!) To you it may seem very simple. Believe me, when the consequences are greater it gets more complicated. I am resting in Jesus in this one, in a way I never could have before. But because there is much more at stake with stewardship and end-times financial vulnerability, It would be irresponsible for me not to approach this with caution and concern. Also my trust in Jesus doesn't negate the fact that though He promised us He knows what's best for us and His plans work, whereas ours fail, He also never promised that it would be easy. I know it will be challenging and that there may be some pain. That doesn't mean that I am not trusting in Jesus. It is the wrestling and pain I have experienced before, and seeing how Jesus works it out in the end that helps me trust Him now. Faith doesn't mean you take a "la-dee-da" approach to life. It only means you commit to gratefully accepting whatever Jesus brings you, whether it's what you planned for or not.
 
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Telaquapacky

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This is what I try to point out to others. Its not about the law and my performance its about Jesus and His perfromance for us. To treasure Jesus supreme is to love Jesus...and if we love Jesus we will love others. The two new commandments ,Love God supreme and your fellow man ...all of the whole law including the ten hang upon these two commands. Love is a fulfilling of the (whole) law.

-AT:)
I heartily agree that Jesus performance FOR us (His perfect life, His atoning death) is a Christian essential. Anyone who neglects that is not a Christian.

But I believe that our full appreciation of Jesus' love is only found in Jesus' work IN us. If a person could look upon Jesus and be motivated by His lovliness, to perform loving deeds to others in that person's own strength, that love wouldn't be a very selfless love. AT, I would add to what you have said that besides Jesus' work FOR us, Jesus must complete a perfect work IN us, to make us more loving to others, and even more loving to Him. We cannot truly love Jesus or others except by the Spirit of love that He works in our hearts. Certainly without Jesus' work in us, His love working through us, we would be unable to obey any of the Commandments in the way that pleases God. We are able to overcome sin only to the extent that Christ lives in us.

1 John 2:5,6
5 But if anyone obeys his word, God's love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him:
6 Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.

1 John 3:24
24 Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

This is not to say that there is no effort on our part. Our part is to seek to receive Jesus' power in our lives.

It seems to me that Jesus' work for us is appreciated by most Christian denominations. Sadly, Jesus' work in us is appreciated by but few, including Seventh-day Adventists. Jesus' work in us, in my opinion, is perhaps not an Adventist "distinctive," because there are a few other denominations that teach it, but it is an Adventist essential, because Christ, only Christ is our Sanctification.
 
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O

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Perhaps it's only my dilemma.

The things that originally attracted me to the Seventh-day Adventist Church were it's peculiarity and intensity, it's unflinching non-conformity to the rest of the Christian world- it seemed to me that these people couldn't care less if the world accepted them. They had a unique and distinctive message, one every member fully expected they might die or be tortured for. I did not come in through an evangelistic crusade or radio or TV program. God brought me here supernaturally.

Now the church has changed, and I have changed. The worship style I would have considered ideal when I first joined- simple and austere- is very different from what I prefer now- much more lively and youth-oriented. But at the same time, I am still attracted to very conservative doctrine. And, the reason I am attracted to lively, youth oriented worship style, is not that I like drums in church for example, or guitars more than organ, or pallid, doctrineless praise songs, but only one reason:

Nobody will join a church that appeals to old, conservative people. It seems as if we can't both have the kind of reverence in our services that we used to have, and at the same time obey the Great Commission, to win souls. It also seems that nobody is interested in the doctrines and teachings, or at least in any kind of orthodoxy that is "too different" from the rest of the Christian world.

Here's the double question I put to you all, and this is the dilemma: How can we preserve the "I could die for this" non-conformity and distinctiveness that used to give our movement it's fiery intensity, and yet have the kind of open-minded self examination essential to intellectual honesty, or the pluralistic "nobody's wrong" attitude that of acceptance, without which we will never attract new members? And how can we preserve any kind of decorum and reverence in our services when it seems we have to make them more entertaining and exciting?

I don't want to dumb down our message, or lose the intense, defiant personality of our movement, or lose my sense of reverence in worship- yet I don't want to grow old and die in a dying church of old fuddy-duddies, worshipping all alone because we're so weird, nobody will ever join us.

I can relate to what you said. I was attracted the SDA church because their doctrines can be proved by the whole bible. The bible really came alive when I study more the (historic/traditional) SDA doctrines.

I'd say I'm not loyal the SDA organization but to the SDA movement: the endtime calling-out/seperation message.

In my opinion, you don't need to concern yourself who you will offend or attract. Just deliver the biblical message. The word is a sword that divides. Jesus said you shall be hated by all men for my name sake. We must seek the approval of God not men. Don't think by doing so the church will be left with a few old geezers. The SOP says when we preach the endtime message(3AM) with power of the holy spirit, the luke warmers will be shaken out, and God will multiply and bring those who are really on fire. Then you don't have to worry about having a celebration style of worship to attract the outsiders.

The enemy has been attacking our doctrines from within. If you look at our schools, universities and seminaries, the more formal adventist education, the more confused you are with all the 'new doctrines' that confuse and contradict the bible and SOP.

It has gone so far, it's beyond what you and me can do. The SDA church in the end will cease to exist as an organization, only the true remnants, the movement will survive and triumph to carry on the message.

God doesn't want the water-downed version of the truth. If you are alone but with the Lord, you are already the majority. But remember He reserved for Himself 7000 who have not bowed their knees to Baal. So rejoice during these troubleous times and know that the Lord is nigh.
 
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Adventtruth

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I'd like to ask you the converse question: If there are teachings that we Adventists teach that no other Christian church teaches, does that automatically mean that they are false?

Why should it. But it does not make them true either.

That you believe 1844 elevates righteousness by works in place of grace, or that 1844 in any way undermines God's forgiveness of sin shows that you do not understand 1844.

Kindly show me where I'm wrong.

No controversy? I believe that the testimony of Scripture and a quick glance at the planet we live on would say the opposite.


You avoid the passage in Col 2:15. It says Christ made an open show of Satan and his darkness. Please remember that EGW said the controversy was between Christ and Satan...not us, we are caught in the middle. Its not about us.

Our faith being "all about Jesus" doesn't negate the fact that we are combatants in spiritual warfare, part of a big picture of a cosmic controversy between Christ and Satan since sin began in heaven. On the contrary, it calls for us to depend upon Him more and more, because we dare not battle in our own power. The whole Bible is about that, and though Christ's name wasn't mentioned, for the faithful, it was always about Christ from the beginning.

Our relationship with Christ is from faith to faith. We trust Him daily. So how do we fight the good fight of faith? By trusting Jesus...its all about Him.

Suppose you have to make a business decision involving hundreds of thousands of dollars, and investment in commercial real estate and growing a promising small business, albeit in a beleaguered industry with an uncertain future. You can't just sit on your hands and hope for the best to happen. You have to make decisions and take decisive action. At the same time you have to pray and hope that this is God's will for you, ask Him to open and close the appropriate doors (and not force any closed door open with a crowbar!) To you it may seem very simple. Believe me, when the consequences are greater it gets more complicated. I am resting in Jesus in this one, in a way I never could have before. But because there is much more at stake with stewardship and end-times financial vulnerability, It would be irresponsible for me not to approach this with caution and concern. Also my trust in Jesus doesn't negate the fact that though He promised us He knows what's best for us and His plans work, whereas ours fail, He also never promised that it would be easy. I know it will be challenging and that there may be some pain. That doesn't mean that I am not trusting in Jesus. It is the wrestling and pain I have experienced before, and seeing how Jesus works it out in the end that helps me trust Him now. Faith doesn't mean you take a "la-dee-da" approach to life. It only means you commit to gratefully accepting whatever Jesus brings you, whether it's what you planned for or not.

Sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought you were talking about trust in the context of salvation. But you have a totally different Idea in mind. Yes we do struggle with making the right choices in life. But even in that we need to understand what ever choice we make...Jesus is there to help us make it right.

-AT:)
 
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Perhaps it's only my dilemma.

The things that originally attracted me to the Seventh-day Adventist Church were it's peculiarity and intensity, it's unflinching non-conformity to the rest of the Christian world- it seemed to me that these people couldn't care less if the world accepted them. They had a unique and distinctive message, one every member fully expected they might die or be tortured for. I did not come in through an evangelistic crusade or radio or TV program. God brought me here supernaturally.

Now the church has changed, and I have changed. The worship style I would have considered ideal when I first joined- simple and austere- is very different from what I prefer now- much more lively and youth-oriented. But at the same time, I am still attracted to very conservative doctrine. And, the reason I am attracted to lively, youth oriented worship style, is not that I like drums in church for example, or guitars more than organ, or pallid, doctrineless praise songs, but only one reason:

Nobody will join a church that appeals to old, conservative people. It seems as if we can't both have the kind of reverence in our services that we used to have, and at the same time obey the Great Commission, to win souls. It also seems that nobody is interested in the doctrines and teachings, or at least in any kind of orthodoxy that is "too different" from the rest of the Christian world.

Here's the double question I put to you all, and this is the dilemma: How can we preserve the "I could die for this" non-conformity and distinctiveness that used to give our movement it's fiery intensity, and yet have the kind of open-minded self examination essential to intellectual honesty, or the pluralistic "nobody's wrong" attitude that of acceptance, without which we will never attract new members? And how can we preserve any kind of decorum and reverence in our services when it seems we have to make them more entertaining and exciting?

I don't want to dumb down our message, or lose the intense, defiant personality of our movement, or lose my sense of reverence in worship- yet I don't want to grow old and die in a dying church of old fuddy-duddies, worshipping all alone because we're so weird, nobody will ever join us.
I think it is a huge mistake to try to convert people by making the church appear exciting or entertaining. Honestly if I was seeking entertainment I certainly wouldn't look to a church... hollywood is light years ahead in that department. So all you really get is second rate attempts at entertainment. If people leave the church because they think it's old fashioned or not cool then they definately wern't really in it to begin with.

This being said I am not against different styles of worship so long as it IS worship. The thing that makes a church truely exciting is to be where God is!! A solemn old-fashioned style church or a rockn hillsong format is irrelevant and equally as dead and useless if God is not there.

Whatever the church does people should seek to turn from all sin and Luk 10:27 Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

If that happens who cares what the format is it'll be a church with power.
 
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