The 3 magi visitation with Christ

[Justasurvivor]

priests in Zoroastrianism, the ones to first meet Christ were major practitioners of occultism and it was by reading the skies; astrology and astronomy they found where he was born. what view points can clarify this realization?

 

[tz620q]

priests in Zoroastrianism, the ones to first meet Christ were major practitioners of occultism and it was by reading the skies; astrology and astronomy they found where he was born. what view points can clarify this realization?

Our recent Epiphany homily shed some light (pun intended) on what the Star was that guided them. In our modern scientific era, there have been many theories to try to give this a natural explanation; but they all fail to explain that the Star proceeded before the Magi to guide them. No natural comet or supernova would do that. The answer that our priest gave was that often in the Bible angels are called stars such as in Revelations when it tells that a third of the stars were swept from Heaven. We know that there were angels that fell with Lucifer, not stars. So the supernatural angels could have been the guide for the Magi. This relates to your post because if God sent these men an angel to guide them to Christ, who are we to say they were cursed by their occult beliefs. God finds each of us where we are and tries to lead us to Christ.

 

[pescador]

Our recent Epiphany homily shed some light (pun intended) on what the Star was that guided them. In our modern scientific era, there have been many theories to try to give this a natural explanation; but they all fail to explain that the Star proceeded before the Magi to guide them. No natural comet or supernova would do that. The answer that our priest gave was that often in the Bible angels are called stars such as in Revelations when it tells that a third of the stars were swept from Heaven. We know that there were angels that fell with Lucifer, not stars. So the supernatural angels could have been the guide for the Magi. This relates to your post because if God sent these men an angel to guide them to Christ, who are we to say they were cursed by their occult beliefs. God finds each of us where we are and tries to lead us to Christ.

Matthew 2:1-2, "After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, in the time of King Herod, wise men from the East came to Jerusalem saying, “Where is the one who is born king of the Jews? For we saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

This says nothing about angels, even though they're mentioned many times elsewhere in Scripture. The Bible clearly has them saying "we saw his star", not "we saw an angel". So angels could not possibly have been the guide for the Magi.

Of course in Luke an angel is mentioned in relation to Christ's birth: "Now there were shepherds nearby living out in the field, keeping guard over their flock at night. An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were absolutely terrified." Luke 2:8-9 That is not reading something into Scripture that isn't there (as your priest did).

Your priest is giving his own flawed interpretation of the Bible. Sola scriptura!

 

[Taodeching]

Jimmy Akin has a good write up of the Star here:

http://jimmyakin.com/wp-content/uploads/Understanding-the-Star-of-Bethlehem.pdf

and a video here about the same:

 

[Michie]

Fr. Dwight Longenecker

We're not exactly sure who they were. The evidence from the Gospels is found in the first 12 verses of St. Matthew's account. All we can glean from that passage is that they are called Magi, or "magicians," that they came from the East to Jerusalem, and that they had seen a star announcing the birth of the King of the Jews. The Gospel doesn't say there were three Wise Men. That idea comes from the three gifts they brought.

To track down who the Wise Men were, we must first look East. The obvious choice is the Parthian Empire. During the time of Jesus, the Parthian Empire was the name of what was formerly the Persian Empire. It was centered on present day Iran and Iraq. In the Parthian Empire there was a caste of astrologer priests based in the ancient religion of Zoroastrianism. Most scholars think the Magi were Zoroastrian priest-astrologers from Persia.

However, none of this is recorded in Matthew's Gospel. Neither is there a mention that the Wise Men were kings — nor are there camels in Matthew's account. So, where did the idea come from that the Wise Men were camel-riding kings? The idea of three kings and the presence of camels is linked with two Old Testament prophecies. Psalm 72:10-11 reads:

"May the kings of Tarshish and the islands bring tribute,
the kings of Sheba and Seba offer gifts.
May all kings bow before him,
all nations serve him."

Continued below.
"We Three Kings" Who were the Magi?

 

[pescador]

Jimmy Akin has a good write up of the Star here:

http://jimmyakin.com/wp-content/uploads/Understanding-the-Star-of-Bethlehem.pdf

and a video here about the same:

This makes a lot more sense than tz620q's priests flawed interpretation.

 

[Trusting in Him]

If it the star was just a natural phenominom, it is not that likely that the Magi, who were experts in the study of Stars would have taken any special notice. Maybe this was something which was truely supernatural and this was something which they knew was of extraoridary importance. What lit up the burning bush? Now we know that was of God, but we can't explain it! At the time of Christ, Persia was part of the Parthian Empire who had fought and beaten the Romans in several really serious battles and wars.

The Magi were the king makers on the Partian empire and they were all powerfull, anyone will any sense was not going to upset these guys. The bible says that they were wise men, not three kings. Three kings is not in the bible at all. These guys were wise and a force to be reconded with, we are not told how many they were, they probably had their own military escort with them, to keep them safe. They were from a major power in the area and judea was a small coutry sandwiched between the Romans and the Parthians.

Look at the history books, this is not as Hollywood film makers and others have presented this. Historians have recorded a lot about the facts of the part of the world at this time. Partia was the major power east of Judea at this time. The bible does not name where they came from, it was just wise men from the east. I just that some of us who have heard a little bit of the history of the area, will have heard mention of the Partians and the Medes. In case you may be wondering, the Medes are the modern day Kurds. Check out the History, it's really interesting and well worth looking it up!

 

[Trusting in Him]

The Magi is where we got the name Magisrates from, they were not Magicians, but were considered in that part of the world to be the wisest of the wise and they appointed the rulers of the Partians. They wielded great power in that part of the world. Rome was a major power at that time and they fought the Partians and lost very badly. The Partians were the real dudes in that part of the world in those days.

 

[Justasurvivor]

Our recent Epiphany homily shed some light (pun intended) on what the Star was that guided them. In our modern scientific era, there have been many theories to try to give this a natural explanation; but they all fail to explain that the Star proceeded before the Magi to guide them. No natural comet or supernova would do that. The answer that our priest gave was that often in the Bible angels are called stars such as in Revelations when it tells that a third of the stars were swept from Heaven. We know that there were angels that fell with Lucifer, not stars. So the supernatural angels could have been the guide for the Magi. This relates to your post because if God sent these men an angel to guide them to Christ, who are we to say they were cursed by their occult beliefs. God finds each of us where we are and tries to lead us to Christ.

I appreciate your insight on finding the connection between the heavenly bodies and angels that's new to me, whenever it comes to occultism and it's practices I don't see it as inherently evil. now when it concerns applications that effect the spiritual realm for the pursuance of physical gain I understand the fear of it, I'm more so interested in the informational aspect of this matter. just like exorcists would study demonology, witchcraft, and other forms of black magik in order to discern which spirit was summoned based on characteristics being presented or sigils left at a summoning site

 

[Justasurvivor]

The Magi is where we got the name Magisrates from, they were not Magicians, but were considered in that part of the world to be the wisest of the wise and they appointed the rulers of the Partians. They wielded great power in that part of the world. Rome was a major power at that time and they fought the Partians and lost very badly. The Partians were the real dudes in that part of the world in those days.

you're absolutely right about them being practitioners and legislators of law just as the wise men of Egypt, Babylon, and other smaller nations have advised on edicts presented by their kings. and they're have been many instances where occultism influenced the decisions they made by reading omens, partaking in divination, or other forms of receiving information.