Taking Questions on the Creation

[AV1611VET]

how did tropical animals and insects live then?

Don't know --- I wasn't there.

also, does it say in the bible that the climate changed in the way you say it did?

No.

 

[agentorange20]

Or the notion that God not creating a pebble is absurd,

Evidence said God created or is needed to create pebbles?

and God not creating Life is absurd and God not creating the Sun is most absurd

Ditto...

The more evidence you bring to the table,

Speaking of evidence, where is yours?

because of order and complexity and atomic structure, it just screams out Creator even

Right, just like the complexity and order in a snowflake also requires a supernatural origin for its creation right?

GULO, ERV, Human Chromosome 2, hominid fossils, care to finally respond to them in detail?

 

[agentorange20]

The people I email and talk to are sacred to me. I would NOT betray them by name dropping.

So then WHY bother insisting to appeal to their authority in the matter in the first place? This would be like me claiming famous scientist(s) support proposition X and when I am called on my bluff to show indeed he/they do I don't back my claim (this is what you're doing here).

Go ahead CITE your sources and from their research and how it backs your claims based on EVIDENCE.

 

[agentorange20]

I remember him now. If you had said Kent Hovind, the guy who had to declare chapter 11 and was in all kinds of trouble, then I would have probably remembered.

We said 'Hovind' quite a few times, both his name and Ken Ham as being the quintessential YEC boneheads that they are.

It has nothing to do with whether the evidence should be interpreted with the absolute knowledge of the existence of God as the Creator.

Like Kent Hovind was a REAL scientist in the first place, right?

 

[agentorange20]

T. Rex wasn't on the Ark, in my opinion, his kind was.

Ok, so not the Tyrannosaurus species, but instead an equally large one like Albertasaurus then? Any way you try to slice it, a huge carnivore like that on a boat being maintained by 8 is absurd.

AV, define 'kind', is it species, genus, order, family?

 

[agentorange20]

Now I don't understand what your asking. The dinosaur kinds that disembarked the Ark after the Flood lived their lives and died --- probably in the Ice Age that immediately followed.

WHICH Ice Age, we have a recent record of at least 6 in the past 650,000 years!

Maybe they lived about a thousand years afterward, then died out.

Maybe you have no evidence again, so you're bluffing?

 

[agentorange20]

When the Water Canopy was broken up and rained on the earth in Noah's time, the earth took on a whole new climate --- and the early years would have generated a massive Ice Age on the earth that the animals that disembarked couldn't handle.

Yeah, speaking of that Water Canopy, lets hear what a scientist think about it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvprBLhJx_o

 

[AV1611VET]

AV, define 'kind', is it species, genus, order, family?

None of the above --- QV please.

 

[AV1611VET]

WHICH Ice Age, we have a recent record of at least 6 in the past 650,000 years!

Maybe if you scrunched those 650,000 thousand years into 6100 years, you'd have one big one?

Maybe you have no evidence again, so you're bluffing?

Maybe you don't either?

 

[AV1611VET]

Yeah, speaking of that Water Canopy, lets hear what a scientist think about it...

Science can take a hike.

 

[agentorange20]

None of the above --- QV please.

So this would make 'kind' = Phylum then??

"A kind is a plant or animal at the top of God's taxon that contains all the genetic blueprints necessary to replenish the earth as God intended."

This would seem to indicate so based on your reasoning above...

In early Genesis, the kinds are not easily identified, as they probably only lived for one or two generations - (but their lifespans were very long).

And it says that animals lived longer generations where in the bible?

They would have been of the more docile, domestic kind, and certainly would not have included carnivores in their incipient stages.

Right, a big lion with nice huge flesh ripping incisors to eat cabbage with, huh? No wonder people mock your religion at times.

These may have included such creatures as the winged horse, but that's just a guess.

A winged horse huh? Evidence for this? Or the Cockatrice? Satyrs? Unicorn? thought not... A guess indeed.

These kinds would have included the animals that are not currently mentioned in man's taxons; such as behemoth, leviathan, fowled bats, four-legged grasshoppers, satyrs, unicorns, et. al.

Funny how we don't find any fossil or genetic evidence for any of the creatures mentioned in the bible, huh?

Did it ever occur to to you that the biblical authors obviously had no clue in terms of biology? That would go a long way to explaining why they thought presenting striped patterns to a animal would result in it giving striped patterns of its offspring. Or why they defined bats as birds and all insects as having 4 legs. Time to call a spade a spade here and quit with the gross rationalizing.

 

[agentorange20]

Maybe if you scrunched those 650,000 thousand years into 6100 years, you'd have one big one?

And why would we find evidence for so many waves of ice ages and not a single one then? Why the chemical evidence left in geology and geochemistry? Why the physics evidence indicating such things? You're flailing.

Maybe you don't either?

Wrong, we do. It's called Ice Cores, from which we can obtain the atmospheric conditions for the past 650,000 years. Where is your evidence for an Ice Age(s) in the Bible? If you're literalist, then the sly interpretations, if the bible never mentions it/them, then you shouldn't be posturing as if it does.

 

[AV1611VET]

So this would make 'kind' = Phylum then??

How would I know? Or you? Adam was told to name the animals, and he did so. I don't thing taxonomy was a science back then.

"A kind is a plant or animal at the top of God's taxon that contains all the genetic blueprints necessary to replenish the earth as God intended."

Who on earth made this statement???

Right, a big lion with nice huge flesh ripping incisors to eat cabbage with, huh? No wonder people mock your religion at times.

Either that, nor no lion at all --- yet.

A winged horse huh?

Yesiree.

Evidence for this?

Nosiree.

Or the Cockatrice? Satyrs? Unicorn? thought not... A guess indeed.

But an educated guess at that.

Funny how we don't find any fossil or genetic evidence for any of the creatures mentioned in the bible, huh?

Big deal --- you can't find Jimmy Hoffa's, either.

Did it ever occur to to you that the biblical authors obviously had no clue in terms of biology?

Yes, it did; but being's they're not writing science, but making entries in Someone's Diary, it doesn't matter.

That would go a long way to explaining why they thought presenting striped patterns to a animal would result in it giving striped patterns of its offspring.

They weren't told to think it --- they were told to do it --- then write it down. (Actually, this was a one-time occurence by one man: Jacob.)

Or why they defined bats as birds and all insects as having 4 legs.

Again, they weren't asked if they agreed with what they were writing --- they just wrote it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Wrong, we do. It's called Ice Cores, from which we can obtain the atmospheric conditions for the past 650,000 years. Where is your evidence for an Ice Age(s) in the Bible? If you're literalist, then the sly interpretations, if the bible never mentions it/them, then you shouldn't be posturing as if it does.

It may not have occurred to you yet, junior member, that I actually agree with most of what science says. All you see here in these posts is where I disagree.

Since the Bible doesn't speak of an Ice Age, and since science does, and since science does without contradicting anything in the Bible, I have no choice but to agree.

I put my faith in science as well --- I only draw the line when science disagrees with Scripture - (or itself).

 

[agentorange20]

How would I know?

I thought you had the omnipotent and infallible word of God, shouldn't you be wise to such things, or does it not offer hope in this arena of knowledge?

Either way, I would like for you to define 'kind' here so at least we can mutually agree on terminology and what we talking about before going forward. It helps after all to pin down the details in order to objectify and qualify certain things.

Who on earth made this statement???

YOU did, I quoted directly from your QV please, remember?

Either that, nor no lion at all --- yet.

Evidence that they weren't carnivores? Why for instance do we find fossils with evidence of a T-Rex (and other species, not even dinosaurs too) leaving its teeth and or bite marks in the bones of other dinosaurs or species?

If they weren't a lion yet, how'd they change to become lions? Did they....evolve?

Yesiree.

Evidence AV? Anything in genetics of in the fossil record? If not, then why conclude they existed while at the same time with not a mention of any ice ages in the bible so you conclude it/they did occur? Talk about wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

But an educated guess at that.

Guess none the less.

Big deal --- you can't find Jimmy Hoffa's, either.

Ah, but we know he existed as we have so many external records and from multiple sources. With all the fantasy land animals mentioned in the bible the only source for them is in the bible. Jiffi Homa existing or not isn't an extraordinary claim, but a winged horse and cockatrice are, they require the evidence and so far nada.

(Actually, this was a one-time occurence by one man: Jacob.)

Still, it exemplifies how horrid their understanding was in biology.

Again, they weren't asked if they agreed with what they were writing --- they just wrote it.

So, you're saying then they writing God's word is merely obediece, in which case we can justly say God defined bats as birds and insects as having 4 legs? Hilarious rationalization there.

 

[AV1611VET]

I thought you had the omnipotent and infallible word of God, shouldn't you be wise to such things, or does it not offer hope in this arena of knowledge?

My favorite way of expressing the fallacy of your thinking is is this way:

• Expecting to use the Bible as a science book is like expecting to build a computer with Bill Gate's diary.

 

[Breckmin]

BTW,"kind" is usually synonymous with "genus" in my opinion.
~Michael

 

[AV1611VET]

BTW,"kind" is usually synonymous with "genus" in my opinion.
~Michael

Well, whatever it is/was, I don't think T. Rex boarded the Ark. Like I've said before, if we were there in person, and actually witnessed the animals getting on the Ark, I wonder if we would even recognize half of them.

 

[Cabal]

Well, whatever it is/was, I don't think T. Rex boarded the Ark. Like I've said before, if we were there in person, and actually witnessed the animals getting on the Ark, I wonder if we would even recognize half of them.

Yes, crazy weird creatures, like "dove" and "raven."

 

[Naraoia]

BTW,"kind" is usually synonymous with "genus" in my opinion.
~Michael

Tell that to Robert Byers when he next tells me a marsupial cat and a placental cat are the same kind