Taking God's Name in Vain

[MercyBurst]

The hatred against a Christian's brother and sister Christians inherent in the assumptions of the original post is most unfortunate.

Simply put, no human is ever in a position to judge another's faith in this matter, ever. That some feel such an entitlement is a shame.

Many people are genuinely offended by the association of "gay" and "Christian", and some brothers and sisters have genuine issues with it in their faith. As the Bible tells us, whether it is sin or not isn't the issue. The issue is that it causes some of those in the faith to stumble. In summary, if what you eat causes another brother or sister to stumble, then it is sin. We have two sections of the bible that are dedicated to this subject: Romans 14 and Ist Corinthians 8. I recommend you read them before you flaunt "gay Christianity" as righteous when that is debatable at a moral level as well.

Here are the proof texts that tell us "gay Christianity" is sin by definition:

Ist Corinthians 8:

9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of your's become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.

11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?

12But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.




Hence, Gay Christianity is sin by definition.


Romans 14 :

14 But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean.
15 If your brother is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love.

 

[MercyBurst]

Under the rules of this board the contents of this post, accusing another Christian of not being a Christian, should earn you an infraction.

Can you show me where I made such infraction? I stated my concerns that hell is a real place and I don't want anyone to go there. As a Christian this should be your concern as well. Hell is mentioned in the Bible, and discussed numerous times in detail, but seldom discussed on this forum. You'll never hear a gay bring it up. Why not?

Instead, I'd like to answer it. Chalice Thunder is a member in good standing of my communion, born again according to the tenets of our faith, and by his own witness chaste.

But there is only ONE advocate before the Father, and it is not you. Yet, here you are standing in the doorway... Jesus said ye must be born again to see the kingdom of God. It includes repentance, even as Jesus said.

Your allegations redound on you, sir, and you owe him an apology, and your, my, and his Lord an act of repentance.

My intention is not to offend. Hell is a hot subject (no pun intended). This is a theology sub-forum, and Jesus mentioned hell on several occassions. It seems that would be a fair subject to discuss here. If hell is not an appropriate subject then either move this forum out of the theology section or shut it down.

What kind of "Christian" are you?

A person that is honest to their own conscience. Aren't you being rather condescending here?

If born again by the Spirit, why do you not display the fruits of the spirit in your posting?

ok poly, how do we talk about hell without sending you in orbit?

I see little or no evidence of love, joy, peace, patience, lovingkindness. gentleness, or self-control in them.

Likewise, I see your response as a very bitter fruit that opposes our Savior's message of salvation, where He said "ye must be born again to enter the kingdom of God." This tenet is supported by the CF forums guidelines on how to become a Christian. If you object to it, I recommend you take it up with the forum administration.

Like the followers of Jesus mockingly called 'Christians' I decided to lay claim to an insult directed at me and wear it proudly. This was, by the way, in a thread you were quite active in.

Well, just for your information, that's one of satan's monikers as well. Perhaps your witness would be more credible if weren't a sheep in wolve's clothing. I'm not counting on an improvement from you. Didn't I hear you say the abyss is a good place, or was it one of your like-minded pro-gay proselyters?

 

[KCKID]

Um ...to anyone who may not know any better ...'hell' is (merely) 'the grave'. I don't want to derail the thread with a long and drawn out explanation but 'hell' is not the X-rated horror scenario as taught by mainstream Christianity. And God is not the super-fiend who supposedly designed such a place for the sinner. According to the Bible the righteous are the ONLY ones who receive eternal life. According to the same book the unrighteous are those who receive eternal death. The 'lost' perish (see John 3:16) so don't be misled by the scare tactics of popular Christian tradition. It's unbelievable how many Christians seem to RELISH the idea of the unrighteous writhing in torment on a bed of hot coals.

 

[MercyBurst]

Um ...to anyone who may not know any better ...'hell' is (merely) 'the grave'. I don't want to derail the thread with a long and drawn out explanation but 'hell' is not the X-rated horror scenario as taught by mainstream Christianity. And God is not the super-fiend who supposedly designed such a place for the sinner. According to the Bible the righteous are the ONLY ones who receive eternal life. According to the same book the unrighteous are those who receive eternal death. The 'lost' perish (see John 3:16) so don't be misled by the scare tactics of popular Christian tradition. It's unbelievable how many Christians seem to RELISH the idea of the unrighteous writhing in torment on a bed of hot coals.

If hell is not a real place, then this would make Jesus Christ a liar because He warned us about it on several occassions. Jesus said hell is a terrible place, and that God takes no pleasure in sending people there. Jesus came so people wouldn't have to go there. It sure got my attention before I became a Christian. I believed it as a non-Christian and I still believe it is true as a Christian. I was going to a terrible place called hell until Jesus saved me. I deserved hell, but His righteousness excedes my sin. Thank you Lord for saving me. Without the precious blood of Jesus Christ, I would be on my way to hell.

 

[Texas Lynn]

What if a board member accuses another poster's beliefs as indicating they weren’t Christian? Should the board member who makes the accusation get an infraction for this for implying those beliefs were somehow not Christian? (especially where a number of other board members share those same beliefs.)

This thread is an unwarranted attack on other Christians and the constant assertions other Christians are somehow not are not appropriate and certainly not delivered in a proper humble Christian spirit.

 

[brightmorningstar]

Don’t be fooled by false teaching that says there is no eternal life and eternal death.
Consider this and look at what Jesus Christ teaches…

And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.- Matthew 25:46 NKJV They are opposites

Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish.- Luke 13:4-5 NKJV If one repents one doesn’t die like those who died when the tower fell on them?

that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life – John 3:15-16 NKJV Opposites, perish versus eternal life.

If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. – John15:6 NKJV What would be the problem with being thrown into the fire of we all ended up happily ever after? When are we thrown into the fire, during this earthly life before our death? The answer is never if we abide in Christ

For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 NKJV as opposed to those who don’t belong to Him.

and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved – 2 Thessalonians 2:10 NKJV Perish and saved are opposites, if we all end up saved how can some of us perish?

If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. 21It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them.- 2 Peter 2:20-21 NKJV How could it be worse for them in the end than the beginning, if Jesus Christ is saviour?

The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.- John 12:25 NKJV Opposites, losing ones life as opposed to keeping it eternally.

 

[brightmorningstar]

This thread which makes no attacks on other Christians whatsoever, It makes no claim that anyone isn’t a Christian. It does however address the misuse of the association of words gay & Christian together as ‘gay Christian’ which is taking the Lord’s name in vain by association.

A number of posters who claim to be Christians, seem very unhappy that a number of other posters who claim to be Christians, seem to hold this viewpoint. Claims that valid Christian viewpoints are somehow not indicative of a Christian spirit are not indicative of a Christian spirit.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Many people are genuinely offended by the association of "gay" and "Christian"

So it goes. Fifty years ago many people were genuinely offended by the association of "Black" and "Christian". Clergy who marched for civil rights were urged to tone it down by squeamish parishioners.

and some brothers and sisters have genuine issues with it in their faith.

Nobody lives in a vacuum. Every church has issues of one kind or another. That's no reason to make grandiose and spurrious claims.

As the Bible tells us, whether it is sin or not isn't the issue. The issue is that it causes some of those in the faith to stumble. In summary, if what you eat causes another brother or sister to stumble, then it is sin. We have two sections of the bible that are dedicated to this subject: Romans 14 and Ist Corinthians 8. I recommend you read them before you flaunt "gay Christianity" as righteous when that is debatable at a moral level as well.

Here are the proof texts that tell us "gay Christianity" is sin by definition:

Ist Corinthians 8:

9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of your's become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.

11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?

12But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.




Hence, Gay Christianity is sin by definition.


Romans 14 :

14 But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean.
15 If your brother is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love.

Actually, the conclusion is far from certain and the scripture given more correctly supports the refraining from antigay rhetoric suxch as is engaged in by the gay-baiters posting here. For, in dehumanizing LGBT Christians and Non-Christians, they are indirectly responsible for the injustices committed to them, and in cases where they vote on such things, directly. By causing young toughs to be encouraged to gay-bash folks those who spew antigay rhetoric from pulpits indeed caused those fellows to do worse than stumble.

 

[Texas Lynn]

This thread which makes no attacks on other Christians whatsoever, It makes no claim that anyone isn’t a Christian. It does however address the misuse of the association of words gay & Christian together as ‘gay Christian’ which is taking the Lord’s name in vain by association.

This is most unfortunate rhetoric supported by nothing except bald assertion. There is no "misuse" occurring in the association of the two terms; they are merely descriptors.

Those who hate their LGBT brothers and sisters try their darndest to steal Jesus from them but they are incapable of doing so.

 

[KCKID]

Hell is the grave.

Eternal life means eternal life. Eternal death means eternal death. Eternal death does not mean eternal life but with added suffering. If you're going to use the Bible to guide your every move then PLEASE understand what it says about these issues! Learn what is literal and what is figurative.

Hell is 'hades' or 'the grave'. You can thank the RCC for the X-rated horror scenario of hell.

 

[MercyBurst]

So it goes. Fifty years ago many people were genuinely offended by the association of "Black" and "Christian". Clergy who marched for civil rights were urged to tone it down by squeamish parishioners.

When the black clergy marched for civil rights, this did not cause christians to abandon their faith in Jesus Christ as their Savior.


"Gay Christianity", on the otherhand, is an open invitation to turn away from God for another carnal gospel.

Nobody lives in a vacuum. Every church has issues of one kind or another. That's no reason to make grandiose and spurrious claims.

Paul said tempting a brother or sister to participate in what they view as sin, is in itself a sin. Given what the apostle Paul said about tempting others, aren't you indeed committing a sin when you advocate "gay Christianity?" Isn't this "taking God's name in vain" when The Holy Spirit says "NO, don't do this thing to your weaker brother or sister!"

Actually, the conclusion is far from certain and the scripture given more correctly supports the refraining from antigay rhetoric suxch as is engaged in by the gay-baiters posting here. For, in dehumanizing LGBT Christians and Non-Christians, they are indirectly responsible for the injustices committed to them, and in cases where they vote on such things, directly. By causing young toughs to be encouraged to gay-bash folks those who spew antigay rhetoric from pulpits indeed caused those fellows to do worse than stumble.

The verse says specifically, do not offend your Christian brothers and sisters by what you EAT. I did not say that, rather the apostle Paul said that. How can you, a self-professed lesbian, advocate gay conduct to Christians? Paul said NO to this.


If you want to talk about my shortcomings then do it in another thread. This thread is about TAKING GOD'S NAME IN VAIN.

 

[brightmorningstar]

Originally Posted by brightmorningstar

This thread which makes no attacks on other Christians whatsoever, It makes no claim that anyone isn’t a Christian. It does however address the misuse of the association of words gay & Christian together as ‘gay Christian’ which is taking the Lord’s name in vain by association.

Response.:

This is most unfortunate rhetoric supported by nothing except bald assertion. There is no "misuse" occurring in the association of the two terms; they are merely descriptors.

There is misuse as outlined in the OP.

Those who hate their LGBT brothers and sisters try their darndest to steal Jesus from them but they are incapable of doing so.

The OP argument means that brothers and sisters in Christ are Christians, not LGBT.

 

[brightmorningstar]

To me eternal death being separation from God is an X-Rated horror of the ultimate extreme, I cannot think of a worse one.

 

[Texas Lynn]

When the black clergy marched for civil rights, this did not cause christians to abandon their faith in Jesus Christ as their Savior.

Actually I was speaking of white clergy; black clergy faced little opposition from their parishioners.

"Gay Christianity", on the otherhand, is an open invitation to turn away from God for another carnal gospel.

That is a ridiculous unsupportable assertion.

Paul said tempting a brother or sister to participate in what they view as sin, is in itself a sin. Given what the apostle Paul said about tempting others, aren't you indeed committing a sin when you advocate "gay Christianity?" Isn't this "taking God's name in vain" when The Holy Spirit says "NO, don't do this thing to your weaker brother or sister!"

Not at all as there is no sin whatsoever in being LGBT.

The verse says specifically, do not offend your Christian brothers and sisters by what you EAT. I did not say that, rather the apostle Paul said that. How can you, a self-professed lesbian, advocate gay conduct to Christians? Paul said NO to this.

Paul did not address sexual orientation. How do you get to be self-professed?

If you want to talk about my shortcomings then do it in another thread. This thread is about TAKING GOD'S NAME IN VAIN.

By your reasoning that is exactly what you have done by the things you do here.

 

[MercyBurst]

I re-ask the same question to the gay advocates on this forum:

When you die do you want to be remembered as an unrepentent "gay Christian" that was never born again? One that told others they need to have gay sex just like God made them?

What kind of testimony would this be after you die? Seriously.

 

[Texas Lynn]

There is misuse as outlined in the OP.

And it has been responded to and shown to be invalid.

The OP argument means that brothers and sisters in Christ are Christians, not LGBT.

Some are, some aren't; we have LGBT Christians, Heterosexual Christians, celibate Christians of various orientations, Armenian Christians, Stamp collecting Christians, Christian NASCAR drivers, Christian Civil War reenactors and so forth. Any assertion otherwise is a denial of reality.

 

[Texas Lynn]

I re-ask the same question to the gay advocates on this forum:

When you die do you want to be remembered as an unrepentent "gay Christian" that was never born again? One that told others they need to have gay sex just like God made them?

What kind of testimony would this be after you die? Seriously.

There are quite a few "Born Again Christian LGBTs" and to be acknowledged as such is certainly a badge of honor.

It is the purest testimony of the Love of Jesus Christ than can be made. It is certainly an act of love, while the constant attacks on one's LGBT brothers and sisters are nothing but expressions of the most evil hatred.

 

[MercyBurst]

Originally Posted by MercyBurst

When the black clergy marched for civil rights, this did not cause christians to abandon their faith in Jesus Christ as their Savior.
​

TL:
Actually I was speaking of white clergy; black clergy faced little opposition from their parishioners.

MB: Can you show where this turned christians away from their faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior for ALL of humanity, even as He said?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

"Gay Christianity", on the otherhand, is an open invitation to turn away from God for another carnal gospel.
​

TL:
That is a ridiculous unsupportable assertion.

MB: Let me show you an example of where this happend even on this forum.

This particular forum member struggles with his sexuality, and on more than one occassion a gay Christian told him he was sinning because he did not obey his gay nature that God gave him.

What more needs to be said?
-----------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

Paul said tempting a brother or sister to participate in what they view as sin, is in itself a sin. Given what the apostle Paul said about tempting others, aren't you indeed committing a sin when you advocate "gay Christianity?" Isn't this "taking God's name in vain" when The Holy Spirit says "NO, don't do this thing to your weaker brother or sister!"
​

TL:
Not at all as there is no sin whatsoever in being LGBT.

MB: But on the otherhand, it is sin for you to justify "gay Christianity", when it offends the conscience of christian brothers and sisters, even as the apostle Paul said. I'm sorry, but this point can not be made anymore clear. It's sin by definition.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

The verse says specifically, do not offend your Christian brothers and sisters by what you EAT. I did not say that, rather the apostle Paul said that. How can you, a self-professed lesbian, advocate gay conduct to Christians? Paul said NO to this.
​

TL:
Paul did not address sexual orientation. How do you get to be self-professed?

MB:
If it causes another brother or sister to stumble, then don't advocate something they believe is wrong. This is the loving thing to do. This is what Paul said. Why aren't you getting this?


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

If you want to talk about my shortcomings then do it in another thread. This thread is about TAKING GOD'S NAME IN VAIN.
​

TL: By your reasoning that is exactly what you have done by the things you do here.

MB: How am I taking God's name in vain? I anticipated this repsonse. Show me exactly where this has happened or kindly drop it.

 

[brightmorningstar]

The misuse And it has been responded to and shown to be invalid.

for me and others it has been shown to be valid.

All are Some are, some aren't; we have LGBT Christians, Heterosexual Christians, celibate Christians of various orientations, Armenian Christians, Stamp collecting Christians, Christian NASCAR drivers, Christian Civil War reenactors and so forth. Any assertion otherwise is a denial of reality.

The OP argument means that brothers and sisters in Christ are Christians, not LGBT. I agree with those who hold this view, I think the Holy BIble makes this obvious

 

[Texas Lynn]

Originally Posted by MercyBurst

When the black clergy marched for civil rights, this did not cause christians to abandon their faith in Jesus Christ as their Savior.
​

TL:
Actually I was speaking of white clergy; black clergy faced little opposition from their parishioners.

MB: Can you show where this turned christians away from their faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior for ALL of humanity, even as He said?

Of course not; neither is the advancement of LGBTs.

The "Christians" who opposed civil rights continued to do so regardless of what their clergy did.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

"Gay Christianity", on the otherhand, is an open invitation to turn away from God for another carnal gospel.

TL:
That is a ridiculous unsupportable assertion.

MB: Let me show you an example of where this happend even on this forum.

This particular forum member struggles with his sexuality, and on more than one occassion a gay Christian told him he was sinning because he did not obey his gay nature that God gave him.

What more needs to be said?

That's strong language but the type of thing the individual needed to hear; God made him gay so he should embrace it. For him to do so honors God and christ in the fullest.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

Paul said tempting a brother or sister to participate in what they view as sin, is in itself a sin. Given what the apostle Paul said about tempting others, aren't you indeed committing a sin when you advocate "gay Christianity?" Isn't this "taking God's name in vain" when The Holy Spirit says "NO, don't do this thing to your weaker brother or sister!"

TL:
Not at all as there is no sin whatsoever in being LGBT.

MB: But on the otherhand, it is sin for you to justify "gay Christianity", when it offends the conscience of christian brothers and sisters, even as the apostle Paul said. I'm sorry, but this point can not be made anymore clear. It's sin by definition.

Not at all; only to those confused as to sexuality and religion. There is no sin whatsoever in being LGBT and being sexually active as such.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MB:

The verse says specifically, do not offend your Christian brothers and sisters by what you EAT. I did not say that, rather the apostle Paul said that. How can you, a self-professed lesbian, advocate gay conduct to Christians? Paul said NO to this.

TL:
Paul did not address sexual orientation. How do you get to be self-professed?

MB:
If it causes another brother or sister to stumble, then don't advocate something they believe is wrong. This is the loving thing to do. This is what Paul said. Why aren't you getting this?

For another to follow the positive example of a happy confirmed LGBT person is the opposite of causing them to stumble; it puts the cut in their strut and the glide in their stride; it climbs them into a custom Oldsmobile and takes them for a ride!

Remember, God can do anything; he put the bump in the bumpalumpalump, he put the ram in the ramalamdingdong and he made my baby fall in love with me!


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MB:

If you want to talk about my shortcomings then do it in another thread. This thread is about TAKING GOD'S NAME IN VAIN.

TL: By your reasoning that is exactly what you have done by the things you do here.

<Staff edit?