In the future, if a Sunday Law does become reality, does this mean Sunday keeping is the mark of the beast? Are there verses in scripture that tell us this?
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Sunday Keeping Mark of the Beast?
- Thread starter MidnightCry
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Kira Light
Shinigami love apples
Yes. Those who go to church on Sunday will get a computer chip inserted in their arm and forehead that allows them to buy and sell goods. No scripture needed.
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The Bible predicts the devil will force the mark of the beast on the inhabitants of Earth:
He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. (Revelation 13:16,17)
A story that runs parallel to the mark of the beast is told in Ezekiel 9. Although this story did not actually take place, the concept of separating people according to a mark was presented to Ezekiel in a vision.
The Greek word for "mark" is charagma, which means "an etching or engraving." Could the mark of the beast be a non-removable, non-transferrable tattoo on the right hand or the forehead?
The fifth trumpet will be the physical appearing of the devil, the Antichrist himself, pretending to be Christ. He will deceive the world with his mighty miracles. His supreme miracle will be that of calling fire down out of heaven at will. Attended by millions of demons, billions of people will believe that this glorious being is Almighty God.
The sixth trumpet is even worse. The devil will kill a third of mankind (those who oppose him) as he sets himself up as King of kings and Lord of lords. Everyone who submits to his authority will voluntarily receive a tattoo on their right hand. This tattoo will be necessary to buy and sell.
If the trumpets are literal and not treated as prophetically insignificant, I don't think a tattoo is out of the question. In fact, if we put the seven trumpets where they belong, the seven trumpets will explain how, why, and when false worship will become a great controversy throughout the whole world.
YSIC
MidnightCry
He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. (Revelation 13:16,17)
A story that runs parallel to the mark of the beast is told in Ezekiel 9. Although this story did not actually take place, the concept of separating people according to a mark was presented to Ezekiel in a vision.
The Greek word for "mark" is charagma, which means "an etching or engraving." Could the mark of the beast be a non-removable, non-transferrable tattoo on the right hand or the forehead?
The fifth trumpet will be the physical appearing of the devil, the Antichrist himself, pretending to be Christ. He will deceive the world with his mighty miracles. His supreme miracle will be that of calling fire down out of heaven at will. Attended by millions of demons, billions of people will believe that this glorious being is Almighty God.
The sixth trumpet is even worse. The devil will kill a third of mankind (those who oppose him) as he sets himself up as King of kings and Lord of lords. Everyone who submits to his authority will voluntarily receive a tattoo on their right hand. This tattoo will be necessary to buy and sell.
If the trumpets are literal and not treated as prophetically insignificant, I don't think a tattoo is out of the question. In fact, if we put the seven trumpets where they belong, the seven trumpets will explain how, why, and when false worship will become a great controversy throughout the whole world.
YSIC
MidnightCry
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Kira Light
Shinigami love apples
If the anti-christ is pretending to be Jesus, won't people get kind of confused when he is forcibly tattooing everyone and slaughtering Saturday worshipers?
This is supposed to be the second coming, afterall. Where is all that eternal life and a trip to heaven?
This is supposed to be the second coming, afterall. Where is all that eternal life and a trip to heaven?
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There is a sea change afoot. It starts with about 1200 new planets found in our Galaxy. Scientists around the world are changing their views on a lot of things. So also the Catholic church in its statements about our "neighbors" out there.
That would change religion as we know it.
Rev 13:13 predicts a great "signs and wonders" based "Change" taking place BEFORE the mark of the beast and the image to the beast.
2Thess 2 predicts a huge "signs and wonders" based change for all of humanity at the end of time.
in Christ,
Bob
That would change religion as we know it.
Rev 13:13 predicts a great "signs and wonders" based "Change" taking place BEFORE the mark of the beast and the image to the beast.
2Thess 2 predicts a huge "signs and wonders" based change for all of humanity at the end of time.
in Christ,
Bob
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I asked this question and I didn't get a response, so I went ahead and threw a thought out there.
I cannot find any scripture that supports Sunday will be enforced as a day of worship or that Sunday is the mark of the beast. Is there any?
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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When the Hebrews were released from Eygpt, God forbid them from wearing tattoos.
"Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the Lord." (Leviticus 19:28)
Perhaps the reason behind this command is that God's people are never slaves, because they are always free to exercise the power of choice. God did not want His people to deface their bodies with markings associated with slavery.
"... I am the Lord, and I will bring you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians. I will free you from being slaves to them, and I will redeem with with an outstretched arm and with mighty acts of judgment. I will take you as my own people, and I will be our God. Then you will know that I am the Lord your God, who brought you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians." (Exodus 6:6,7)
For thousands of years, slaves have been marked with tattoos or hot-iron brands. A person cannot remove or lose a brand or tattoo. It is not transferable. Even as late as WWII, Hitler tattooed millions of prisoners in his concentration camps. The reason for making slaves is simple. The owner/slave relationship is permanent. Children born of slaves are also slaves. Normally, a slave is never freed because ownership never ends. This is the ugly power of slavery (sin). Pharaoh's slaves could have been marked with tattoos or brands. This mark would prevent any possibility of escape from Egypt, for no one would dare purchase property belonging to the Egyptian Pharaoh.
When the devil appears on Earth (fifth trumpet), he will pretend to be God. He will destroy all religious systems and all governments. He is the eighth king referred to in Revelation 17:11. He will appoint ten kings to rule with him at the end of time. (Revelation 17:12,13)
Only those people who unite with his government can conduct commerce, survival buying and selling. (Revelation 13:17). Anyone who refuses to unite with the devil's one-world government will be killed. The permit to conduct business will be a physical mark on the hand or forehead. The mark will be a tattoo or hot-iron brand. This mark will not be transferrable, so it cannot be stolen or lost.
After the destruction of the first four trumpets, there will be no electricity or any computers. A mark or tattoo requires neither. This form of identification will work in any country, village or remote location on this planet.
When Israel finally entered the promised land after 40 years of wandering in the wilderness, the new generation did not bear the marks of slavery on their bodies. They were truly free.On the other hand, the same adults whom God miraculously delivered from Egypt died in the wilderness. Even though they were freed of Pharaoh's slavery by God's mighty power, they never did escape the bondage of their carnal rebellion against God.
YSIC,
MidnightCry
"Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the Lord." (Leviticus 19:28)
Perhaps the reason behind this command is that God's people are never slaves, because they are always free to exercise the power of choice. God did not want His people to deface their bodies with markings associated with slavery.
"... I am the Lord, and I will bring you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians. I will free you from being slaves to them, and I will redeem with with an outstretched arm and with mighty acts of judgment. I will take you as my own people, and I will be our God. Then you will know that I am the Lord your God, who brought you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians." (Exodus 6:6,7)
For thousands of years, slaves have been marked with tattoos or hot-iron brands. A person cannot remove or lose a brand or tattoo. It is not transferable. Even as late as WWII, Hitler tattooed millions of prisoners in his concentration camps. The reason for making slaves is simple. The owner/slave relationship is permanent. Children born of slaves are also slaves. Normally, a slave is never freed because ownership never ends. This is the ugly power of slavery (sin). Pharaoh's slaves could have been marked with tattoos or brands. This mark would prevent any possibility of escape from Egypt, for no one would dare purchase property belonging to the Egyptian Pharaoh.
When the devil appears on Earth (fifth trumpet), he will pretend to be God. He will destroy all religious systems and all governments. He is the eighth king referred to in Revelation 17:11. He will appoint ten kings to rule with him at the end of time. (Revelation 17:12,13)
Only those people who unite with his government can conduct commerce, survival buying and selling. (Revelation 13:17). Anyone who refuses to unite with the devil's one-world government will be killed. The permit to conduct business will be a physical mark on the hand or forehead. The mark will be a tattoo or hot-iron brand. This mark will not be transferrable, so it cannot be stolen or lost.
After the destruction of the first four trumpets, there will be no electricity or any computers. A mark or tattoo requires neither. This form of identification will work in any country, village or remote location on this planet.
When Israel finally entered the promised land after 40 years of wandering in the wilderness, the new generation did not bear the marks of slavery on their bodies. They were truly free.On the other hand, the same adults whom God miraculously delivered from Egypt died in the wilderness. Even though they were freed of Pharaoh's slavery by God's mighty power, they never did escape the bondage of their carnal rebellion against God.
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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Kira Light
Shinigami love apples
Revelation 12:17, "Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to make war against the rest of her offspring--those who obey God's commandments and hold to the testimony of Jesus." NIV
The remnant (SDA's) obey God's (10) commandments.
From this, we get that Sabbath-keepers are the remnant. Sabbath is the dividing line, so not keeping it must be the mark of the beast.
I think that is as close to finding a Sunday law in scripture as you will get.
The remnant (SDA's) obey God's (10) commandments.
From this, we get that Sabbath-keepers are the remnant. Sabbath is the dividing line, so not keeping it must be the mark of the beast.
I think that is as close to finding a Sunday law in scripture as you will get.
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Greetings Kira Light,
Thank you for your reply.
I think you are stretching it a bit. I do not see a Sunday law in scripture from your comments.
Let's take a look at your first comment: "The remnant (SDA's ) obey God's (10) commandments."
First of all, church membership is not required for salvation. The eternal destiny of each person is determined by his or her response to the prompting of the Holy Spirit. Those obeying the Holy Spirit are living by faith. Those refusing to obey His voice are living in rebellion. No religious organization or clergy person can send a person to hell or save him from it.
Many people believe that salvation is church specific. That is not true. Salvation is not dependent upon belonging to "the right church." Instead, you determine your own salvation by your response to the Holy Spirit. I would be cautious of church groups that think they are better than all the others. Be wary of church groups that declare themselves to be the only true Church of Jesus Christ. I would stay away from churches that believe they alone are God's people.
No one can be saved on the merits of his religious zeal, knowledge, or practice. A person is justified in God's sight when he obeys the prompting of the Holy Spirit (lives by faith). Unless God specifically gives each of us the gift of salvation, we cannot be saved. God determines salvation and He promises it to all who will live by faith. (Ephesians 2:8,9)
Every person who obeys the prompting of the Holy Spirit is a person of faith. When a person does what he believes to be righteous and true, no matter the consequences, that person is living by faith. When a person persistently refuses to follow the prompting of the Holy Spirit, God sees the rebellion and there is no provision in His plan of redemption to redeem defiant sinners.
Not only that, I cannot see Jesus elevating one church group above another in heaven. I don't believe He will have one group of people in heaven walking around with their heads just a little higher than others because they belonged to "the right church." There is no such thing as a perfect church. There is not one church who has all of God's prophetic light.
Rather, as end time prophecies unfold, those who continue to follow God's light and God's truth will form the end time remnant church. This remnant will be made up of people from all walks of life, from all churches, all different cultures and languages. These are people that will live by faith during the most distressing circumstances to occur up Earth.
(to be continued--the Sabbath is a test)
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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stinsonmarri
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Kira Light:
Pray tell where do you get any where in the Bible since the Church/Nation of Israel (known as Judah during the time of Yashua) a church is called the remnant?
SDA are acting just like the Jews that salvation come through them and not through the message or testimony of Yashua. Also, please show me where does the Bible speak of a Sunday law? I am a SDA by faith and have been a member and I grew up in the church since 1995. I am taking a stand that the enemy has come into the camp and sown weed or false doctrines. Because at one time, I included, believed in this false propaganda. I begin to question my faith, certain issues and doctrines in the church and found them to be a lie!!!!!
The Bible makes it clear that 144,000 in the Time of Trouble will finish this work. Along with them for a while will be others who remain faithful but will give up their lives for the truth. But the refreshing comes it will only be them and they are the Three angels message who will swiftly bring in the multitude of souls of all religions, nations and creed. Who are the 144,000 they are the five wise virgins who receive the Loud Cry and were awaken but had their extra oil (Holy Spirit). This awakening is they begin to study and when the time is ripe they are ready to deliver the message. These few will be SDA but both the 144,000 and the great multitude will be the remnant and not a church known today. The final True Church of Elohim is called: The Commandment Keeping Saints of Elohim Having the Testimony of Yashua.
Also, the beast is not the Papacy, he like the 144,000 will come out of a corrupt church but he will do the opposite. He will turn and hate the harlot (his church), and he will also hate Elohim. He join with Satan and his posse of angels. He will acomplish his goal of destoying her with his side kick USA. Just the day of worship is not the complete issue. It will be not keeping all the Commands and laws of Elohim. Worshiping a false being on earth which is the pact that Satan will make with the beast/man. And Satan will be worship as the top dog in the universe. The beast will rule and be worship here on earth, but the beast/man will still worship Satan as above him. Why don't we get father/son thing and the false prophet (USA) is like the Holy Spirit.
Most Christians including SDA do not understand that the Holy Spirit is a Being and all Three have the surname or title Elohim. YAHWEH Elohim, Yashua Elohim, Holy Spirit Elohim. Holy and reverence is the name of all Three and They work together as One!
Satan trio is: Satan the false father god, beast/man the false son (sun) god, lamb like beast/false prophet/USA god and the false prophet will get the whole world to make image to the beast/man. The image appears to be alive and can speak, go back to the Garden and the serpent. This magnificent animal could fly and had intellect but he could not speak. Satan once again speaks through the serpent and through the image. This is how it will end and may Elohim have mercy upon us!
Blessings,
stinsonmarri
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Those who receive the mark of the beast are those whose characters are like the beast. However, God promised that those who keep the Sabbath will be sanctified by Him.
The only authority for Sunday is the Papacy which claims to have changed it even though there is no Biblical authority. So it is a sign or mark of Papal authority, which claims greater power than God!
The followers of the beast break God's commandments, and also blapheme and persecute those who do keep God's commandments.
This is why Sunday is the mark of the beast, because God cannot sanctify those who deliberately break His commandments, reject the sign of the everlasing covenant, and the pledge of holiness to those who keep it, and instead offer homage to humans over God, thus worshipping the beast.
(There is more info in my book, "the mark of the beast and the seal of God")
Marc Rasell
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Greetings mrasell,
Thank you for your reply. It is most interesting. I do agree that those who deliberately break God's commandments and refuse to accept the terms of salvation will receive the mark of the beast.
So are you saying that the RCC (the Papal power) will be the beast or the power at the end of time that will require or enforce the mark of the beast?
Do you have scripture that supports this?
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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To give you a full answer would require an indepth Bible study. But in summary, we identify the Papacy as the little horn of Daniel, a power that appears after pagan Rome, persecutes the saints, and has a period of persecution lasting over 1000 years, it also seeks to change times and laws (the Sabbath). This is based on an indepth study of Daniel 2, 7, 8.
I've gone through this in more depth in my book, "exploring the heavenly sanctuary".
The little horn shares the same time period of 1260 days / 42 months / 3.5 years as the sea beast of Rev. 13. They have the same characteristics and so are the same power.
The greatest claim made by the Papacy is that it changed the Sabbath to Sunday. Thus it is a mark of its authority. Although we reject that any man can change God's law.
There are online Bible studies supplied by Amazing Facts and the Discover Bible School which go through this teaching.
The Biblical Research Institute has put one of its books in pdf format on its website which goes through the basics:
http://www.adventistbiblicalresearch.org/Books/Future%20Glory.pdf
Marc Rasell
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Greetings mrasell,
Thank you for your reply. I would like to comment on your first point. You state that the papacy is the horn power of Daniel 7 and 8. I disagree with you on this. The horn power in Daniel 8 is not the papacy. In fact, the horn power in Daniel 8 is many times more powerful than the RCC.
In Daniel 8, the two beasts represent empires, but the horns of the ram and the goat represent kings. This is important because the horn power in this vision is not attached to a beast (a world empire). Daniel was told this king will exalt himself to be as great as the Prince of the host, Jesus Christ. This horn power is a stern-faced king that will rule over Earth during the Great Tribulation. This coming king is the Antichrist, who will dazzle the world with his power, authority and ability to perform incredible miracles. The coming Antichrist will be Lucifer, appearing in the flesh.
Gabriel tells Daniel this vision concerns the time of the end and in the time of wrath, and the appointed time of the end.(Daniel 8:16-19)
The word appointed means the time of the end was set long ago. God has set a date for the Great Tribulation to begin. The appointed time of the end will be a time of wrath. Since the Ram and the Goat are not end-time players, (history tells us they disappeared more than 2,000yrs ago), the horn power or the stern-faced king is the only item left in this vision that relates to the appointed time of the end.
This horn power does not come from an earthly kingdom. He just appears out of nowhere. He comes from the north, out of one of the four winds. In the Old Testament, the direction of north is associated with divine destruction.
We also know from Isaiah 14:13,14 that the phrase, "the sides of the north," refers to the location of God's throne. God's throne was located on the higher side or the north side of Heaven's temple. This knowledge and God's consistent use of the direction of "north" in the Old Testament indicate that divine authority or judgment originates on "the sides of the north."
God will send Lucifer as a destroyer king to Earth during the Great Tribulation.If you look at Daniel 11, there are more verses that help clarify the identity of the horn power in Daniel 8. (Daniel 11:35,36; 40,41)
My question for you is: When is the appointed time of the end? If we know the appointed time of the end, then we can tell when the horn power in Daniel 8 will arise.
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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When you compare the visions there are parallels between them:
Daniel 2 Daniel 7 Daniel 8
Babylon Golden head / Lion /
Medo-Persia Silver arms / Bear / Ram
Greece Bronze belly / Leopard / Goat
Rome Iron legs / Terrible beast / Little horn expands geographically
Europe Feet of iron and clay / 10 horns and little horn / Little horn expands towards heaven
Heavenly Element Stone, God’s kingdom / Judgement, saints receive the kingdom / Cleansing of the sanctuary
And the angel in Daniel 8 gives an interpretation and identifies the Ram as the Medes and Persians and the Goat as Greece:
"20 The two-horned ram that you saw represents the kings of Media and Persia. 21 The shaggy goat is the king of Greece, and the large horn between its eyes is the first king."
The little horn comes from the west, this is where pagan Rome came from. In Daniel 8, we believe it covers pagan and papal Rome.
Marc
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Greetings mrasell,
The horn power in Daniel 8 does not arise from a kingdom. Nothing is said about Rome or the 4th beast of Daniel 7. It is not an extension of an earthly kingdom. It just appears out of the winds. Daniel 8 says the horn power starts out small and grows to the east, south and toward the Beautiful Land. From Daniel's position, Israel (the Beautiful land) is to the west. The only direction not mentioned is north. That means the horn power comes out of the north.
Rome, Papal Rome, or the 1,260 yr time period is not mentioned in Daniel 8. So how can you place it there?
"I will summon al lthe peoples of the north and my servant Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, declares the Lord, and I will bring them against this land and its inhabitants and against all the surrounding nations. I will completely destroy them and make them an object of horror and scorn, and an everlasting ruin." (Jeremiah 25:9)
Don't you see the parallel? When Israel became rebellious, failed to keep the Sabbath of the land (the Sabbath rest for the land), worshiped idols, became immoral, God sent a destroyer king from the north, the king of Babylon. Divine judgment comes from the north.
God will send Satan (king of the future Babylon) from the north (God's throne is located on the north side of Heaven's temple) to Earth because people would not believe the truth (the gospel).
The horn power in Daniel 8 is Lucifer. Didn't you read my above post? What about the appointed time of the end, you didn't address my question to you?
YSIC,
MidnightCry
The horn power in Daniel 8 does not arise from a kingdom. Nothing is said about Rome or the 4th beast of Daniel 7. It is not an extension of an earthly kingdom. It just appears out of the winds. Daniel 8 says the horn power starts out small and grows to the east, south and toward the Beautiful Land. From Daniel's position, Israel (the Beautiful land) is to the west. The only direction not mentioned is north. That means the horn power comes out of the north.
Rome, Papal Rome, or the 1,260 yr time period is not mentioned in Daniel 8. So how can you place it there?
"I will summon al lthe peoples of the north and my servant Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, declares the Lord, and I will bring them against this land and its inhabitants and against all the surrounding nations. I will completely destroy them and make them an object of horror and scorn, and an everlasting ruin." (Jeremiah 25:9)
Don't you see the parallel? When Israel became rebellious, failed to keep the Sabbath of the land (the Sabbath rest for the land), worshiped idols, became immoral, God sent a destroyer king from the north, the king of Babylon. Divine judgment comes from the north.
God will send Satan (king of the future Babylon) from the north (God's throne is located on the north side of Heaven's temple) to Earth because people would not believe the truth (the gospel).
The horn power in Daniel 8 is Lucifer. Didn't you read my above post? What about the appointed time of the end, you didn't address my question to you?
YSIC,
MidnightCry
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I put a table in my last post which shows the parallels between Daniel 2, 7 and 8. The formatting did not work, but I've tried to correct it now so its a bit more readable.
Marc
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