Suffering

[popsthebuilder]

No matter what; we ourselves are not capable of stopping all pain that we have created and do create. This will happen, but not by the hand of man alone. Pain is needed at this point in time. When there is no pain, due to lack of cause rather than avoidance there of, we will have attained our goal. You seem to be actively in some pain. Relax and be still in the direction and will of God that has been imparted into your soul. Know that through the mere thankfulness and love that you hold towards God, which leads you to his direction in his time, with your patience and perseverance is literal assurance that nothing can harm you, not even the greed of self. Be calm. Find harmony in your patience and Faith, giving you perseverance in the direction you know to be of love and conditionless giving, and long suffering of GOD.

It seems like you have been saved in the past. Know that shame/suffuring on an inner level due to the misdirection of self are but chastisement, and so you can learn and act on the things placed on your heart through Crist under GOD.

I wish you the very best.

Oh yeah, side note; I know nothing but what was shown me, I am nothing but what God has given me.

peace and love sincerely

 

[katerinah1947]

No matter what; we ourselves are not capable of stopping all pain that we have created and do create. This will happen, but not by the hand of man alone. Pain is needed at this point in time. When there is no pain, due to lack of cause rather than avoidance there of, we will have attained our goal. You seem to be actively in some pain. Relax and be still in the direction and will of God that has been imparted into your soul. Know that through the mere thankfulness and love that you hold towards God, which leads you to his direction in his time, with your patience and perseverance is literal assurance that nothing can harm you, not even the greed of self. Be calm. Find harmony in your patience and Faith, giving you perseverance in the direction you know to be of love and conditionless giving, and long suffering of GOD.

It seems like you have been saved in the past. Know that shame/suffuring on an inner level due to the misdirection of self are but chastisement, and so you can learn and act on the things placed on your heart through Crist under GOD.

I wish you the very best.

Oh yeah, side note; I know nothing but what was shown me, I am nothing but what God has given me.

peace and love sincerely

Hi,

In reverse order. I am fairly certain that I am saved now, but salvation is a rather foreign set of words in my life now.

Instead I think of life, either with God or without God, now and in the hereafter.

As such, my daily life with God now, should continue after death, but that is up to Him and not me.



I have no shame anymore that I am aware of. I do not know why you said that.

I have interior and exterior pain and suffering.

The interior pain, is actually most prominent because I am stuck on earth, even though the ultimate question in the universe, to me, is no longer one. I actually, have seen The Essence of God, and interfaced with Jesus and The Holy Spirit on a factual basis.

It is hard to see God, in any form for real and still be stuck here. Paul said that. I though understand, it hurts even now, when I think about it, because I am telling you about it.

Soon I will no longer think about it, like now, and the pain diminishes.

I was ashamed at one time of being Transgendered. I no longer am, as God interfaced with me as I am transgender wise, therefore even if no one else knows, I know God sees me as my transgender self, and not what some humans think, in a non informed way.

I also know where that is backed up, Biblically as true.

It is though in being transgendered, honestly, and by that I mean it is in being honest that I am transgendered, that I am removed from much of the world, through a rather non Galileoian, misunderstanding of Scripture by most people, thus for the most part I am thrown out of society and most religions on that alone.

I live a hermitage/ermitage life, because of that and my relationship with God, and for the same reasons almost.

The reasons are few if any people know how to handle some Biblical items yet, if ever.

Relax.......you said. THERE YOU ARE PERFECTLY RIGHT AND CORRECT, and yes I do not lean on my own understandings but God's, just like you said, using a different set of words only.

LOVE,

 

[katerinah1947]

Hi,

To know what Agape love is, in what context you have given me so far, seems to mean, that was shown to you Biblically.

Is that guess of mine correct, or not?

LOVE,

 

[popsthebuilder]

Hi,

In reverse order. I am fairly certain that I am saved now, but salvation is a rather foreign set of words in my life now.

Instead I think of life, either with God or without God, now and in the hereafter.

As such, my daily life with God now, should continue after death, but that is up to Him and not me.



I have no shame anymore that I am aware of. I do not know why you said that.

I have interior and exterior pain and suffering.

The interior pain, is actually most prominent because I am stuck on earth, even though the ultimate question in the universe, to me, is no longer one. I actually, have seen The Essence of God, and interfaced with Jesus and The Holy Spirit on a factual basis.

It is hard to see God, in any form for real and still be stuck here. Paul said that. I though understand, it hurts even now, when I think about it, because I am telling you about it.

Soon I will no longer think about it, like now, and the pain diminishes.

I was ashamed at one time of being Transgendered. I no longer am, as God interfaced with me as I am transgender wise, therefore even if no one else knows, I know God sees me as my transgender self, and not what some humans think, in a non informed way.

I also know where that is backed up, Biblically as true.

It is though in being transgendered, honestly, and by that I mean it is in being honest that I am transgendered, that I am removed from much of the world, through a rather non Galileoian, misunderstanding of Scripture by most people, thus for the most part I am thrown out of society and most religions on that alone.

I live a hermitage/ermitage life, because of that and my relationship with God, and for the same reasons almost.

The reasons are few if any people know how to handle some Biblical items yet, if ever.

Relax.......you said. THERE YOU ARE PERFECTLY RIGHT AND CORRECT, and yes I do not lean on my own understandings but God's, just like you said, using a different set of words only.

LOVE,

In shame I didn't mean in any particular way. I associate shame on an inner most level to do with my personal direction under GOD, or more specifically the lack of adherence to it. Which is the reason for my personal need for Faith in God and my direction under him.

Please refer to my pm about my what I know of agape as this place doesn't seem the best suited for my explanation and I really do try to keep attention off of my personal experiences for the most part in hopes that people can observe humility and equality with me.

Peace

 

[katerinah1947]

In shame I didn't mean in any particular way. I associate shame on an inner most level to do with my personal direction under GOD, or more specifically the lack of adherence to it. Which is the reason for my personal need for Faith in God and my direction under him.

Please refer to my pm about my what I know of agape as this place doesn't seem the best suited for my explanation and I really do try to keep attention off of my personal experiences for the most part in hopes that people can observe humility and equality with me.

Peace

Hi,

I have referenced your PM.

I would love for you to post your conversion story here. It is quite compelling.

Workmates, especially Narcissistic ones, make the innocent feel guilty, to control them.

Narcissism is a form of child abuse, caused by one member of their own family usually. The abuse is forgotten, and at some point by telling a childhood lie, everyone is used by them to get what they need out of life to survive, even though only one of their own personal family members abused them, and not everyone in the whole world.

The abuse is so bad, and the first incident is always forgotten, that if they were younger, they would have died from neglect, just like we know babies die if they are not given enough attention after they are born.

Pain is felt quite acutely internally by the victims, until Narcissists and their like are handled professionally.

It is not until the Narcissist, or any of the forms of that and there are five more forms, are told what happened to them, and for them to be asked to find the lie they told when they were younger, that they get some relief also.

Narcissism is brain damage in that the abuse is strong enough to cause that part of the brain dealing with empathy and remorse to be damaged or not there at all. At least that is my present research findings so far, and the findings of some other researchers in part.

LOVE,

 

[ananda]

One seemingly quite similar to yours. Is Brahman or Brahmin the highest power. I may be confused. I'm not speaking of man under GOD, but the creator or creative force that is eternal and ultimately responsible for all existence. My Faith is a peculiar one in comparison to most traditional faiths at this time. I believe whole heartedly that all who are faithful to GOD, Brahmin, Allah, Christ, or just the one creator GOD, will unite in peace on a universal level. This will bring about a level of selfless consciousness that will be global and wholly new compared to any haphazard proclamation of faith seen today. My Faith doesn't exclude any. All must change. All can change. None are perfect, and we can all grow in the direction of the Lord at his will. I can literally go on for hours attempting to describe my beliefs or Faith.

To sum it up sorta; it supports no separation or division among those peaceful, and with Faith on any level. Similar ideals can be found in the Bahia, and Druze faiths, some of Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, and encorperates Judaism Islam and some forms of paganism. There are twelve tribes that were divided and spread across the world by God's will. These tribes or faiths or candles will come back together and finally be under the real direction of the one creator GOD, ushering in a new age of peace unity and prosperity never before witnessed.

I would like to speak with you further. It is difficult for me to not be so vague unless you ask particular questions. If you are interested then please feel free to ask away. I've found some comfort in your stating that Buddhist do not literally worship void. Won't take your word for it as if fact, but still. To be clear on one point; it is my findings that most Christians indeed act for reward either on this plane or another. This is not true direction under God and you have supported the statement of such. However true faithful Christians do not act for reward of any form but because it is the only right thing to do. This is more of a stance on what Faith is to be, and not descriptive of what is falsely is for many.

Peace and respect

Yes, I call that which is eternal, the "All". I have no doubt that the various religions are very real in the sense that anything that can be imagined can be realized into existence. They are legitimate goals, but continue in the round of suffering in samsara within the All due to the very nature of existence itself, whereas - IMO - certain masters like Buddha or Lao-tse have transcended the All and have realized something far greater than samsaric existence as we know it itself.

I suspect that our beliefs are far closer than we may expect!

Metta.

 

[ananda]

Attachment to what?

Reciprocation is itself attachment. The god(s) of the Abrahamic religions require that his subjects love and/or be attached to him (e.g. Deu 6:5, Mark 12:30, 1John 4:19, Rev 2:4, Surah 23:76, etc.), to achieve his promise of rebirth. The craving for continued existence is, in the end, suffering.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Deuteronomy 6 (KJV) - ዘዳግም
5: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
A reference to not partially following in the direction of what is placed on your heart by his grace, that your direction may not b in vain.

Mark 12 (KJV) - ማርቆስ
30: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

The love we are to show towards life is indeed in reciprocation of God's love for his creation. However not for reward. Attachment to the direction of God and his will is for our sake. Seperation from the material and wants of the flesh are also for our benefit and needed to more fully perceive true direction.

Revelation 2 (KJV) - ራእይ
4: Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

A reference to the things taught upon salvation, and how one can err in loosing sight of their own faults while discerning others.

23:76. And We did seize them with punishment (in the past) but they did not humble themselves before their Lord, nor would they supplicate (to Him for mercy).

A reference to consequince and shame and not learning from mistakes make obvious by the word of God.

Again our love for God and life is indeed reciprocal outwardly in response to the giving nature of the one creator GOD. That isn't the same as attachment to negative things or things that lead to negativity which must also be negative. Attachment in terms of wants of self can skew perception. But how does a want to follow God's will- the will of the very thing that created and sustains selfish? You are actively casting out posessions of any sort for the benefit of other existence, so how is that attachment?

I agree that some scripture speaks in terms of fear and gain. These generally of the Old Testament are based on the comprehension and need of those civilizations in that era.


You do make a valid point. But to me separation is for our benefit, as is the love of GOD and although we are are to allow Crist to indwell in us wholly, it is also the means of detachment from all wants of the flesh.

Peace

If one completely detached from everything then they wouldn't be living in my personal view. No offence, just opinion.

Peace

 

[ananda]

... how does a want to follow God's will- the will of the very thing that created and sustains selfish? You are actively casting out posessions of any sort for the benefit of other existence, so how is that attachment?

I do not believe that the deities in these books are the "Creator" per se. IMO they are lesser devas or brahmas with their own agenda, requiring attachment to them for an illusory benefit (e.g. temporal rebirth), and from which they benefit as well.

... You do make a valid point. But to me separation is for our benefit, as is the love of GOD and although we are are to allow Crist to indwell in us wholly, it is also the means of detachment from all wants of the flesh ... If one completely detached from everything then they wouldn't be living in my personal view. No offence, just opinion.

The detachment which Buddha spoke about is not merely from wants of the flesh, but also wants of the mind and spirit, resulting in achievement of nibbana. The existence as found in Nibbana is not the existence we know of, so yes, you're right in the sense that detachment from the things in this samsaric world is not "living" (in the samsaric sense).

 

[toLiJC]

The Buddha taught that the basic undercurrent in life which motivates most individual's behavior is suffering. Others tend to disagree, pointing to the fact that there are joys in life.

I agree that there are temporary joys in life. However, I would say that we constantly seek out those joys, pleasure, and other activities, in order to achieve a measure of happiness in order to temporary eliminate the suffering we feel in our daily lives. The fact that we do not seek out suffering to eliminate happiness proves to me that suffering is truly the underlying factor which motivates our decisions in life.

it is about overall sanctification for abundant and everlasting life in the Bible, i.e. it is a lunacy that we suffer (in order) to live, but the idea is that we work for overall sanctification so that all human (and other besouled) beings can have abundant and everlasting life in That Who really is the true Lord God, and then we may be accompanied by suffering(s) e.g. in the form of persecution(s) against us, while the self-realization is a kind of delusion/deception that we can ostensibly have eternal salvation in that way, because the self-interest is ultimately a kind of unrighteousness or incomplete righteousness including the participation in the following of the human(666) religion/spirituality

Matthew 16:24-26 "Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world(i.e. the kingdom of the human(666) religion/spirituality), and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?",

Mark 10:29-30 "Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house(i.e. human(666) religion/spirituality), or brethren, or sisters(i.e. or spiritual brothers or sisters thereof), or father(i.e. or spiritual father/teacher of human(666) religion/spirituality), or mother(i.e. or spiritual mother thereof), or wife(i.e. or unrighteous (doctrine of) faith), or children(i.e. or disciples thereof), or lands(i.e. or occult realms), for my sake, and the gospel's, But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.",

1 Corinthians 10:24-33 "Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth..... Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God: Even as I please all men in all things, not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved."

Blessings

 

[ananda]

it is about overall sanctification for abundant and everlasting life in the Bible, i.e. it is a lunacy that we suffer (in order) to live, but the idea is that we work for overall sanctification so that all human (and other besouled) beings can have abundant and everlasting life in That Who really is the true Lord God, and then we may be accompanied by suffering(s) e.g. in the form of persecution(s) against us, while the self-realization is a kind of delusion/deception that we can ostensibly have eternal salvation in that way, because the self-interest is ultimately a kind of unrighteousness or incomplete righteousness including the participation in the following of the human(666) religion/spirituality ...

The difference being this: I know directly and personally for myself, that working towards self-realization and enlightenment brings definite relief of suffering in the very present; whereas you have blind faith that your god will potentially bring relief of suffering in your next life (even while such promises are made by other deities in other religions as well).

 

[toLiJC]

The difference being this: I know directly and personally for myself, that working towards self-realization and enlightenment brings definite relief of suffering in the very present; whereas you have blind faith that your god will potentially bring relief of suffering in your next life (even while such promises are made by other deities in other religions as well).

the next life can only be some next eternity, but then we will not be exactly the same, because there is an interchange of the souls' positions/personalities/roles each consecutive eternity, (according to the Bible the eternity is both endless and periodic/reiterative), so if we do not work for true salvation of others in this eternity, nor will there be such salvation for us in next eternities, because some "day" we will be in the places of the people that have no salvation now, for there is an absolute repetition of all events of the eternity, that is why the Lord came to save the humans/souls in order to reduce/shorten their afflictions/sufferings along the eternity(-ies), because Lord God takes good care with range i.e. in the longest possible run/term...

Blessings

 

[ananda]

the next life can only be some next eternity, but then we will not be exactly the same, because there is an interchange of the souls' positions/personalities/roles each consecutive eternity, (according to the Bible the eternity is both endless and periodic/reiterative), so if we do not work for true salvation of others in this eternity, nor will there be such salvation for us in next eternities, because some "day" we will be in the places of the people that have no salvation now, for there is an absolute repetition of all events of the eternity, that is why the Lord came to save the humans/souls in order to reduce/shorten their afflictions/sufferings along the eternity(-ies), because Lord God takes good care with range i.e. in the longest possible run/term...

Blessings

Do you know this as truth, or have faith that this is true?

 

[toLiJC]

Do you know this as truth, or have faith that this is true?

both

Blessings

 

[ananda]

both

Blessings

That's good. I can only say that I only had faith that it was true before (when I was within Christianity), but I did not know directly for myself that it was true.

 

[Eudaimonist]

I agree that there are temporary joys in life. However, I would say that we constantly seek out those joys, pleasure, and other activities, in order to achieve a measure of happiness in order to temporary eliminate the suffering we feel in our daily lives. The fact that we do not seek out suffering to eliminate happiness proves to me that suffering is truly the underlying factor which motivates our decisions in life.

Perhaps the "we" above is only a statistical "we", but I seek personal flourishing, not "joy" as such.

It may be that "joy" is to some extent entailed by personal flourishing, but so is suffering. No pain, no gain.

Suffering as such isn't what motivates me at root.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Ahermit]

The Buddha taught that the basic undercurrent in life which motivates most individual's behavior is suffering. Others tend to disagree, pointing to the fact that there are joys in life.

I agree that there are temporary joys in life. However, I would say that we constantly seek out those joys, pleasure, and other activities, in order to achieve a measure of happiness in order to temporary eliminate the suffering we feel in our daily lives. The fact that we do not seek out suffering to eliminate happiness proves to me that suffering is truly the underlying factor which motivates our decisions in life.

In this world, most people are fearful most of the time. It can be as subtle as the fear of being judged, to the fear of dying. Anger, disappointment, sadness, remorse, regret, guilt, resentment, anxiety, depression, jealousy, envy, greed, critical, judgmental, impatience, intolerant, controlling, wanting to be right and liked, etc. are all forms of fear. This is the suffering Buddha was referring to.

Unfortunately, most of our motivation, based on fear, is avoidance. We go to great lengths to avoid responsibility for our own thoughts and actions. This is the world we live in. Thank God we know of a better way of life and truth in Christ Jesus.

 

[toLiJC]

That's good. I can only say that I only had faith that it was true before (when I was within Christianity), but I did not know directly for myself that it was true.

just in case you are not aware, the doctrine of "samsara" is false, and there is a difference between the biblical doctrine of eternal judgment and the vedic and buddhistic doctrine of samsara, the biblical doctrine says there is a possibility for the soul to be born at the eternity, which is possible only once within one eternity(one eternal cycle/repetition), while the vedic doctrine talks about a myriad of inevitable births/lives for each soul along one enormous eternity(eternal circle), which is absurd and impossible, because there is no way that God let each soul be successively passed through a myriad of vain/painful forms of existence (i even do not venture to call them "lives", because according to the vedas such lives are accompanied by/full of all kinds of evils/afflictions), otherwise, if He let it be so, He would be unrighteous for causing great/too much evil to the souls, for He is the system Administrator of the life for the entire universe and cannot afford to let the souls suffer more than one life within one eternity, otherwise He would be responsible for their severe exploitation, so all the vedic doctrine is false throughout, because, according to the vedas, samsara is not alone, but it is just a part of the integral system and mechanism of the so-called "maya/prakrti" including "gunas", "karma", "yugas", "kalpas", "brahma", "vishnu", "shiva", "kundalini", "chakras", "aum" as a whole, etc., for if there were no gunas, nor would there be karma, nor samsara, but this means there can be no such things at all but only in the human minds in which the satanic delusion/deception dwells..., moreover, according to the biblical scriptures this eternity began about 5-6 millennia ago when God started to create for the first time having made all the universal creation in six days(144 hours), which means there have been no yugas, kalpas, etc.

Blessings

 

[ananda]

Perhaps the "we" above is only a statistical "we", but I seek personal flourishing, not "joy" as such.

It may be that "joy" is to some extent entailed by personal flourishing, but so is suffering. No pain, no gain.

Suffering as such isn't what motivates me at root.


eudaimonia,

Mark

Why do you wish to "flourish"?

I wish to flourish and grow because to not do so is a form of suffering for me.

 

[ananda]

In this world, most people are fearful most of the time. It can be as subtle as the fear of being judged, to the fear of dying. Anger, disappointment, sadness, remorse, regret, guilt, resentment, anxiety, depression, jealousy, envy, greed, critical, judgmental, impatience, intolerant, controlling, wanting to be right and liked, etc. are all forms of fear. This is the suffering Buddha was referring to.

Unfortunately, most of our motivation, based on fear, is avoidance. We go to great lengths to avoid responsibility for our own thoughts and actions. This is the world we live in. Thank God we know of a better way of life and truth in Christ Jesus.

I agree, all action in samsara stem from greed/craving, fear/hatred, or delusion - as the Buddha taught.

You state that you "know" of your better way. How do you "know" (for yourself, directly), or is it simply "faith"?