Study

[th1bill]

If we take the time to meditate [bless and do not curse]on the Word of God as and after we read it the Holy Spirit will teach us the Life Application we need to learn at that time. [bless and do not curse]Inferred here is the truth that the Word of God is the Living Word of God. [bless and do not curse]Some will scream at you for worshiping the Bible but that is not your, nor is it my, problem. [bless and do not curse]I have read the Bible a few times in the past twenty-five years and as I read a passage I know well for the lesson God has taught me, He teaches me a new application of the same scripture. [bless and do not curse]And no, neither one is in error, the two compliment each other and each application shed more light on other scripture a the same time making the Word a never ending exploration map.

In 1Peter 3:7 we learn to love our wives in knowledge. [bless and do not curse]Now, I gained knowledge of the, then, brand new HU-1 (Huey) by going to school on the aircraft and before I was allowed to place a finger on the craft I studied books. [bless and do not curse]Only after a nearly full course was I allowed to turn a wrench on, what became, my baby. [bless and do not curse]After I had spent five years working on the Huey and had turned down a promotion twice that would move me from the Crew Chief position, I was the Senior Crew Chief on the Flight Line and the Senior Mechanic in my short stint in Field Maintenance.

In like manor I wed my Christian Wife, at first I kinew she was a very good lookin' lady and I knew I had her fooled into thinking I was a good man. [bless and do not curse]Because I have spent the last twenty-four [bless and do not curse]years studying her I not only love her, I know we will work together in Heaven for the LORD and there is nothing better than living forever with your best friend.
When we look at Deuteronomy 11:19, Proverbs 29:15 and Ephesians 6:4 along with a ton of other scriptures we find, what appear to be, a contradiction in scripture. [bless and do not curse]On one hand we find that we must not provoke our children to anger and on the other hand we are instructed not to spare the rod. [bless and do not curse]That is the rod or the belt on the soft padding God put in place for such a thing, their hinny.

I am guilty of being a proponent of corporal punishment but I am also a proponent of long, long. prison terms for those that beat their children. [bless and do not curse]If you have read this far you understand that I can generate a lot of anger and a good deal of it inside the Church. [bless and do not curse]This generation's parents, seriously, need to learn to compare the lessons being taught from the pulpit wit what God has said and to learn to ignore the government when their word is in conflict with your God's words.

 

[OzSpen]

th1bill,

Why have you interspersed '[bless and do not curse]' throughout your post? What are you trying to communicate to us?

Oz

 

[Bluelion]

It might interest you spare the rod does not mean beat your children or strike them in any way. Jesus rules with a rod, do you think Jesus is one who beats His servants? To rule with a rod or use the rod means you do not let transgression go with out punishment. It means sins are quickly addressed and punished. It speaks to disciplining your child, It does not mean beat the child. rounding a child right after he commented an offense is seen as using the rod. It speaks to not letting time go by before punishment. God uses the rod with the elders in the church. They are held to a higher standard and when they mess up discipline comes fast from The Father. This is using the rod.

People thought it meant beat your child because in those day that was discipline your child, but the passage speaks to disciplining your child and not beating them.

 

[th1bill]

It might interest you spare the rod does not mean beat your children or strike them in any way. Jesus rules with a rod, do you think Jesus is one who beats His servants? To rule with a rod or use the rod means you do not let transgression go with out punishment. It means sins are quickly addressed and punished. It speaks to disciplining your child, It does not mean beat the child. rounding a child right after he commented an offense is seen as using the rod. It speaks to not letting time go by before punishment. God uses the rod with the elders in the church. They are held to a higher standard and when they mess up discipline comes fast from The Father. This is using the rod.

People thought it meant beat your child because in those day that was discipline your child, but the passage speaks to disciplining your child and not beating them.

And I described, in the OP, the correct method of using, in my case, the belt of discipline. If you were not going off on me we might have engaged in a conversation o the subject but I'll not try to deal with your righteousness, sorry but no.

 

[th1bill]

th1bill,

Why have you interspersed '[bless and do not curse]' throughout your post? What are you trying to communicate to us?

Oz

Sorry, my friend, I answered this earlier but it appears to have gotten lost in Hyper-Space. But I did explain my message in the OP. We must read all the verses to find the truth, it does not lay on either extreme.

 

[Hammster]

It might interest you spare the rod does not mean beat your children or strike them in any way. Jesus rules with a rod, do you think Jesus is one who beats His servants? To rule with a rod or use the rod means you do not let transgression go with out punishment. It means sins are quickly addressed and punished. It speaks to disciplining your child, It does not mean beat the child. rounding a child right after he commented an offense is seen as using the rod. It speaks to not letting time go by before punishment. God uses the rod with the elders in the church. They are held to a higher standard and when they mess up discipline comes fast from The Father. This is using the rod.

People thought it meant beat your child because in those day that was discipline your child, but the passage speaks to disciplining your child and not beating them.

Why do you think that using the rod means to beat a child? Do you understand the difference between beating a child and disciplining through spanking?

 

[Bluelion]

And I described, in the OP, the correct method of using, in my case, the belt of discipline. If you were not going off on me we might have engaged in a conversation o the subject but I'll not try to deal with your righteousness, sorry but no.

wow. False judgement there buddy, I was trying to add to what you said I was not "going off on you".

Don't know what your talking about my righteousness, Jesus is righteous if I have any it is because of the Blood Jesus has shed for me.

 

[Bluelion]

Why do you think that using the rod means to beat a child? Do you understand the difference between beating a child and disciplining through spanking?

well if you whip your child with a belt that is not beating them? You could use that word sorry you don't like it.

I don't think the rod means beat or if you prefer spank your child as I said.

I think if you have to strike your child in any way you are not a very effective parent. i could not imagine Jesus using this to discipline any of His children.

We have never spanked are children or strike them in any way, it simply is not necessary. I can correct my children with just the tone of my voice, and if not time out, and if not no games or tv, never had to go beyond that. My oldest going to be 18 this year is going into the navy, He has never drank, used drugs or smoke or even been in a fight. If we never had to use the belt or spanking and he turned out just fine, I don't think any one has to. Its called being a parent and being part of your kids life.

 

[Hammster]

well if you whip your child with a belt that is not beating them? You could use that word sorry you don't like it.

I don't think the rod means beat or if you prefer spank your child as I said.

I think if you have to strike your child in any way you are not a very effective parent. i could not imagine Jesus using this to discipline any of His children.

We have never spanked are children or strike them in any way, it simply is not necessary. I can correct my children with just the tone of my voice, and if not time out, and if not no games or tv, never had to go beyond that. My oldest going to be 18 this year is going into the navy, He has never drank, used drugs or smoke or even been in a fight. If we never had to use the belt or spanking and he turned out just fine, I don't think any one has to. Its called being a parent and being part of your kids life.

Never had to? That's different.

 

[Bluelion]

Never had to? That's different.

what are you talking about?

 

[Hammster]

what are you talking about?

If you never had to spank a child, that's different than having to and just not doing it.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

ever since , well, ever, spanking is often necessary, and children often know it and feel unloved if their own parents never spank them - they honestly and truthfully realize that their own parents don't love them much, don't love them enough to correct them as needed. (and they may act out a lot trying to get their own parents to spank them, or trying to get someone to care).

if you were spankied too hard, or in anger instead of in disciplined controlled love, you may have a bad impression of what spanking is and what it is supposed to be .

the best evidence, besides spoiled kids who were not spanked, is that the world says to not spank. that and the results of the world's ways of upbringing, and the results of fake christians upbringing,

well, the plain and simple word of god is much better, of course, but there are very few who get it. "there is a famine everywhere of the "hearing" of the word of god". everyone is doing what they want to do instead of what god says to do.

 

[Bluelion]

ever since , well, ever, spanking is often necessary, and children often know it and feel unloved if their own parents never spank them - they honestly and truthfully realize that their own parents don't love them much, don't love them enough to correct them as needed. (and they may act out a lot trying to get their own parents to spank them, or trying to get someone to care).

if you were spankied too hard, or in anger instead of in disciplined controlled love, you may have a bad impression of what spanking is and what it is supposed to be .

the best evidence, besides spoiled kids who were not spanked, is that the world says to not spank. that and the results of the world's ways of upbringing, and the results of fake christians upbringing,

well, the plain and simple word of god is much better, of course, but there are very few who get it. "there is a famine everywhere of the "hearing" of the word of god". everyone is doing what they want to do instead of what god says to do.

and yet i could never see Jesus taking a child over his knee and spanking him.

[Staff Edit]

 

[th1bill]

Okay BL, I checked to make sure I'm right and I am, you're not an elder so I'm correct in placing you in the youngster class although by the time I had my first son, at Twenty-eight, I had matured a good bit more than you have in this area. I never used a rod, a belt nor a switch on my children, I considered them to be Little People but I was smart enough, still not converted to Christianity, to know that the foolish (yep, you tried to slam me with thye brick approach so I'm being blunt) ideas presented by youth are never to be considered with more than a grain of salt.

There is no pat rule for raising children, that is why we are taught by the Word to study them and to raise them the way or God as bent them. My youngest got the most spankings of all and he got one that I regretted until his mid-twenties, he bolted away from me as we were going to movie, right in front of a car. I whipped his posterior with the palm of my hand and we both sat on the curb crying.

One of my little people was punished with the rod of removing all books and library privileges. One by no movies for a month and she was dead. My youngest, all I had to do was to speak his name ad he was crushed. The oldest son, you could beat him il the cows came home and he would ask his mom i8f she had her mad out yet, and grounding from all outside would just kill him. The rod of punishment has many forms and at this point, you are the only aggressor here.

Believe me, with three tours of Combat Close Support from a Huey in Vietnam, I know aggressors and you entered this discussion with you sword drawn, ready for war. Repent maybe?

May God less yo with His wisdom and get you out of His way.

 

[Bluelion]

Okay BL, I checked to make sure I'm right and I am, you're not an elder so I'm correct in placing you in the youngster class although by the time I had my first son, at Twenty-eight, I had matured a good bit more than you have in this area. I never used a rod, a belt nor a switch on my children, I considered them to be Little People but I was smart enough, still not converted to Christianity, to know that the foolish (yep, you tried to slam me with thye brick approach so I'm being blunt) ideas presented by youth are never to be considered with more than a grain of salt.

There is no pat rule for raising children, that is why we are taught by the Word to study them and to raise them the way or God as bent them. My youngest got the most spankings of all and he got one that I regretted until his mid-twenties, he bolted away from me as we were going to movie, right in front of a car. I whipped his posterior with the palm of my hand and we both sat on the curb crying.

One of my little people was punished with the rod of removing all books and library privileges. One by no movies for a month and she was dead. My youngest, all I had to do was to speak his name ad he was crushed. The oldest son, you could beat him il the cows came home and he would ask his mom i8f she had her mad out yet, and grounding from all outside would just kill him. The rod of punishment has many forms and at this point, you are the only aggressor here.

Believe me, with three tours of Combat Close Support from a Huey in Vietnam, I know aggressors and you entered this discussion with you sword drawn, ready for war. Repent maybe?

May God less yo with His wisdom and get you out of His way.

thats funny because my first post was out of love, and it might suprise you I have not been mad at all. I fell to see how explaining what is meant by the rod as being an aggressor.

Fact is you have insulted me twice and then claim I am being aggression, why don't you quote me where I was being an aggressor?

Fact is sense your first response to me you have been falsely judging me, and don't try to belittle me by calling me youngster.

I think you must be a standingtall fan and are trying to make something out of nothing.

Certainly feels like I am being persecuted here i can not even type a friendly post with out being attack. Oh well must be doing something right to be counted among the worthy to be persecuted.

Fact is you have misjudged me from the start.

i think i will leave because you have some sort of issue with me, sorry we could not fellow ship.

I will pray for you

but if you don't see how striking your children caused problems then you are just blind to it because i see it just in your story.

one more thing if you are a child of God and you make war with a child of God who do you go to war against. Why would i make war with my brothers and sisters?

 

[OzSpen]

Sorry, my friend, I answered this earlier but it appears to have gotten lost in Hyper-Space. But I did explain my message in the OP. We must read all the verses to find the truth, it does not lay on either extreme.

You didn't answer it in your OP so I still have no idea what you meant by interspersing [bless and do not curse].

I would appreciate it if you would please explain it - briefly.

Thanks, Oz

 

[th1bill]

Oz,
I did in the post you quoted, the last sentence of that post is a one line summary.

 

[Bluelion]

You, of course are correct. If I thought differently I would have laid into him as soon as I read his first sentence instead of backing off until I was sure that I could type without vigorous anger in my response. And yes, Jesus left us with the Kingdom right here on the Earth that we might build on it but so many have not opened their eyes to look at it. So many, such as BL has done here, do not seek the leading of the Holy Spirit before trying to do the work of the LORD.

God bless my brother.

You made a mistake with that judgement. I feel God angry about as am I, you will answer for it. You just don't go around bashing children of God. You forget my God is the same God that destroyed Sodom.

ANd Jesus said what you do to the least of my brothers he does it to Me. You have been behaving this way toward the King, He is right here with me taking your false judgement. Tell me what do you think the master will do when comes back to find his servant beating the others, Jesus spoke of this, He said he would give him a beating and strip him of all he has. Those who abuse even a little what little they have will be taken, and those who are trust worthy and good servants even more will be added to the abundance they have.

You need to repent and make amends with me.

 

[th1bill]

Let me show you just how off your judgement are, my avatar is not a knight at all. It is the complete Armor Of God

Okay, you have suckered me into one more post to you.

Each of us can, in hind sight, play what we have said in any light but writting does not run that way. Sentence Structure has always and will always indicate tone, mood and attitude. Your reply dripped with acid from the first sentence and if it were not aimed at me, then who? (Rhetorical question!) And I am just as my avatar because that is me, period. The Armor of God is not the armor of a warrior. That is just as pretentious as me posting a pic of me in my battle gear from the sixties. Both are the gear of battle and when we join the Army of our LORD He is our gear, read the passage again, it is all spiritual and on top of that we are warned not to do what you just told you are doing, in a manor. Any replica or picture of anything in Heaven is forbidden.

The image you have presented here is, at the very best, of the mistaken monsters of the Crusades that to this day is hated around the world. Get away from the US for a few years and you will be amazed how much the Christian US (their thoughts) is hated because of what the Christians from Europe attacked.

Now, you are still stuck in that silly, dumb, state of legalism, please, stop that and show the love of Christ. God's Wrath is tempered with love and long suffering.

 

[standingtall]

Why do some Christians insist upon calling God's judgement down on folks (i.e."God will get you for this) when they themselves are guilty of the same arrogance, mean spirit, and judgmental attitude they are accusing others of?