Struggling with faith

[LJCTAM]

Hello all. I am new here. I am not Eastern Orthodox ~keep reading though. I don't have a church nor go to any anymore. The many arguments, problems, and general lack of love in churches completely broke my heart because I read the bible before I even went to a church and believed that is the way it would be. Bitterness grew increasingly and I became bitter even hateful towards Christians. This is my day of adversity and only one stood with me.

I only read now and pray. I really struggle being alone and need the Lord so badly.

I am an odd person, with differing interests, and have my issues as well. I like calligraphy and practice Vyaz, Old Slavonic (the icon style of writing), Romanian and similar. It is amazing art and even though I am not Orthodox, these are things I like to do.

A while ago I came across some Byzantine/Greek and Russian Orthodox singing: Kabarnos Panos, the Kiev Choir, and more. This stuff is AMAZING and on occasion will play Kabarnos Panos all day.

So here is why I posted. On one Greek Orthodox church site I ran into a quote saying that "the deification of man" was his purpose in life. Is this what Eastern Orthodox believes? This is what stopped me from going any further into studying it. Much love.

Comments appreciated,
God bless

 

[RKO]

Hello all. I am new here. I am not Eastern Orthodox ~keep reading though. I don't have a church nor go to any anymore. The many arguments, problems, and general lack of love in churches completely broke my heart because I read the bible before I even went to a church and believed that is the way it would be. Bitterness grew increasingly and I became bitter even hateful towards Christians. This is my day of adversity and only one stood with me.

I only read now and pray. I really struggle being alone and need the Lord so badly.

I am an odd person, with differing interests, and have my issues as well. I like calligraphy and practice Vyaz, Old Slavonic (the icon style of writing), Romanian and similar. It is amazing art and even though I am not Orthodox, these are things I like to do.

A while ago I came across some Byzantine/Greek and Russian Orthodox singing: Kabarnos Panos, the Kiev Choir, and more. This stuff is AMAZING and on occasion will play Kabarnos Panos all day.

So here is why I posted. On one Greek Orthodox church site I ran into a quote saying that "the deification of man" was his purpose in life. Is this what Eastern Orthodox believes? This is what stopped me from going any further into studying it. Much love.

Comments appreciated,
God bless

I am not orthodox, so I cannot answer your question. I simply posted to thank you for the heads up about Kabarnos Panos. I'm listening now, Gorgeous!

 

[Dorothea]

Hello all. I am new here. I am not Eastern Orthodox ~keep reading though. I don't have a church nor go to any anymore. The many arguments, problems, and general lack of love in churches completely broke my heart because I read the bible before I even went to a church and believed that is the way it would be. Bitterness grew increasingly and I became bitter even hateful towards Christians. This is my day of adversity and only one stood with me.

I only read now and pray. I really struggle being alone and need the Lord so badly.

I am an odd person, with differing interests, and have my issues as well. I like calligraphy and practice Vyaz, Old Slavonic (the icon style of writing), Romanian and similar. It is amazing art and even though I am not Orthodox, these are things I like to do.

A while ago I came across some Byzantine/Greek and Russian Orthodox singing: Kabarnos Panos, the Kiev Choir, and more. This stuff is AMAZING and on occasion will play Kabarnos Panos all day.

So here is why I posted. On one Greek Orthodox church site I ran into a quote saying that "the deification of man" was his purpose in life. Is this what Eastern Orthodox believes? This is what stopped me from going any further into studying it. Much love.

Comments appreciated,
God bless

Welcome, LJCTAM. It's nice to have you here with us. I'm sorry you've gone through such experiences. I am not, however, surprised, as we all fall short and are all sinners and struggle daily. Without God, we can do nothing, of course.

I haven't heard of Kabarnos Panos' chanting/music. I'll need to check it out as well.

Yes, to your question. The Orthodox do believe in the deification of man is why we are here...it's to become one with God through His transforming our lives through synergy - cooperation from us with Him through our free will of wanting to serve Him and grow closer to Him. That's my understanding. I know others here to could explain it ten times better than me.

 

[RKO]

Dorothea, I wonder if the OP is looking at the word "deification" in a way that is not intended in Orthodoxy. I don't know if this is accurate, but he may see the word 'deification" as man becoming "like God," which many do not think is a good thing. Sort of like the fall of Lucifer, when he thought he was "like God."
Obviously, it means reaching a "oneness" with God, rather than becoming Godlike.
And i could be completely wrong about all of this.

 

[Dorothea]

Dorothea, I wonder if the OP is looking at the word "deification" in a way that is not intended in Orthodoxy. I don't know if this is accurate, but he may see the word 'deification" as man becoming "like God," which many do not think is a good thing. Sort of like the fall of Lucifer, when he thought he was "like God."
Obviously, it means reaching a "oneness" with God, rather than becoming Godlike.
And i could be completely wrong about all of this.

Most people who stumble over the use of deification think that means the person actually becomes God, not like Him.

 

[RKO]

Ah, ok. Thank you! Hope you are having a spectacular day, Dorothea, BTW.

 

[nutroll]

It is important to understand that there are important safeguards within Orthodoxy that make "the deification of man" something very different from similar sounding concepts in other religious groups. We believe that God is completely unknowable in His essence but wants to be known and is known in His energies. When we speak of deification we are speaking of sharing in God's energies, not becoming what God is in His essence. St. Peter speaks of becoming "partakers of His divine nature" in 2 Peter 1:4. The energies or the grace of God are not created things that God gives to us, they are part of who He is and He allows and even encourages us to participate in them. But we do not become gods of our own planet like the Mormons teach or anything like that. We do not usurp anything of what God is. God is still God and we are still humans.

 

[ArmyMatt]

welcome to TAW!

yeah, we are to become like God, and since He is eternal and infinite, we can never actually become exactly like Him. the Fathers use the image of metal in a fire. when you put metal in a fire it gains the properties of the fire (becomes hot, gives light, becomes orange and red, etc), but never actually becomes fire itself. remove the metal and it returns to it's cold, dark state. make sense?

 

[buzuxi02]

Hello LJCTAM.

People will be people, with all of our excesses and extremes. Our surroundings and environment many times will influence how we act in church, its a reflection of broader society. I remember once reading how a Russian christian missed communism and persecution. The reason was even though he was now free to worship and many were joining the Church, he longed for the fervor found in the catacomb church, where the smaller more pious persecuted community defied all the naysayers to gather together; in contrast to the laxity of faith people have when they are free and faith is 'easy'.


Deification also known as Theosis and sometimes refered to as the divinization of man has been part of christianity since its inception. Its not well known in the west because it was espoused moreso by the greek Fathers and not as much by the latin Fathers. Nutroll and Armymatt have given good explanations. Scripturally there are verses which describe what this is:

2 Peter 1:3-4
New King James Version (NKJV)
3 as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, 4 by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.


2 Corinthians 3:18
New King James Version (NKJV)
18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.

2Corinthians 8:9
New King James Version (NKJV)
9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Christ also quotes the Psalms when He tells the Jews that they are called to be "gods, sons of the Most High."

 

[LJCTAM]

Hey buzuxi, (is that like mpudzuki?)

Thanks for that. I understand some Koine; been teaching myself for a few years. ThKS!

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

He has said how to pronounce it before, but I always forget!!! LOL! One day I pronounce it "boo-zoo-shee" then another day "buzz-uh-ksee" then "buzzushee" heck I don't know. I wish the dude would just call himself Hank! LOL

Hey buzuxi, (is that like mpudzuki?)

Thanks for that. I understand some Koine; been teaching myself for a few years. ThKS!

 

[Dorothea]

He has said how to pronounce it before, but I always forget!!! LOL! One day I pronounce it "boo-zoo-shee" then another day "buzz-uh-ksee" then "buzzushee" heck I don't know. I wish the dude would just call himself Hank! LOL

I always thought his username was the spelling of the Greek guitar-like instrument. Don't know, but sounds like it. bu-zoo-kee.

 

[LJCTAM]

@Dorothea, that's what I think it is. A few years ago I wanted one so bad. The name is so similar.

GBU

 

[Dorothea]

@Dorothea, that's what I think it is. A few years ago I wanted one so bad. The name is so similar.

GBU

 

[buzuxi02]

Yup thats it

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I think bazooka would be better....more take-charge and tough!

 

[LJCTAM]

Lol!

 

[MariaRegina]

I always thought his username was the spelling of the Greek guitar-like instrument. Don't know, but sounds like it. bu-zoo-kee.

Yes, I thought that too.

If we were having a Greek Festival, I would head out there right now.
I love Greek dancing as it is like a prayer as I fly through the air.

 

[Dorothea]

Yes, I thought that too.

If we were having a Greek Festival, I would head out there right now.
I love Greek dancing as it is like a prayer as I fly through the air.

buzuxi, I think your username is awesome.