Struggling to forgive

[BriannaR]

I am sorry it is very hurtful. But like I said forgiveness is different than trust. I have some friends that I have distanced myself from. I love them and forgive them but I don't let them in my inner circle of influence either. That is different than marriage I know. But some of it carries over. We all have issues. And your issue is you feel God ripped you off ultimately. That He allowed some one to get away with lying in order to get married. But we do that every day with God. We get saved totally out of selfishness and for the purpose of getting out of hell. Ultimately in time we do love the Lord. So He gives us grace during that transition from doing christianity for selfishness and doing it to be close to Jesus. So you are not the only one who has been lied to in order to be married. We did that as a church to God. I think this is why we are asked to forgive as He has forgiven us.

That is an interesting perspective createdtoworship, and may be the reason for many, but certainly not all. Personally I didn’t even know about the hell part when I accepted Christ. I just knew that for some unknown reason God loved me even though I was disgusting, and I wanted to be close to Him. But, going with your idea, God offers to get us “out of hell” if we come to Him. He knows what He is getting when we come to Him. God isn’t blindsided. He knows our hearts, He knows why we are coming to Him and how far we have to go. We are supposed to marry wisely, but how can we do that when one deceives the other. I went into a Christian marriage, believing in my spouse’s complete honesty. I worked so he could go to Seminary to be a pastor! Thank God that never happened. At least he didn’t disillusion anyone outside our family. At any rate, I am not saying I am not a sinner still, I certainly am. But, I would rather die than deceive anyone about anything. My childhood abusers all lied in the beginning, all tricked me into believing they cared, only to have them take what they wanted from me, once I was trapped. This is what I feel like my husband did to me. He knew this pattern. He knew how important this was to me and rather than be honest and ask me to consider pursuing the relationship despite the porn use, he deceived me to get what he wanted, and he trapped me, because I had no way to escape marriage as a Biblical Christian.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Hi. I’m new, but looking for some help. My husband and I have been married for 30 years. I experienced a lot of abuse as a child and became active in speaking out against abuse early in college years, before meeting my husband. I would give speeches and write about the dangers of pornography. He even helped edit my speeches at times. We were both Christians and friends for a year or so before dating. When it seemed like we might be heading towards marriage we sat down to discuss our pasts. It was very important to me that we share everything so there were no surprises and we could avoid hurting each other or wasting time. I specifically brought up topics about porn and sex. He told me that his brother had shown him porn once, but that was the extent of his exposure to porn. This topic also came up during premarital counseling and again he assured me the one time was as far as it went.

Fast forward to 14 years into marriage. He feels convicted during a sermon and repents of his porn usage, confessing to the pastor, who then made him confess to me. I was freaked out and fearful of him and we had to work through a lot before moving forward. I forgave him and all seemed good.

Fast forward another 14 years (2 years ago now), and he confesses that he never really stopped back then, but has finally stopped now. This was already a difficult time in our marriage because every week or so he was confessing some old sin he committed against me that I was unaware he had done. This continued for about a year, each confession followed by a longer time period before the next. Well, he left the biggest lie for his last confession. He confessed that he purposely lied to me about his porn usage before marriage, that he had actually used porn all through high school and college. When I asked him why he would do this, he said he knew I wouldn’t marry him if I knew the truth.
He is in an accountability program and meets in a group once a week, so he says he is “clean”. I can finally forgive the porn usage, but I can’t get past the fact that he lied so I would marry him. I feel like he stole my life from me. I wouldn’t have married him if I knew and many of the difficulties in our marriage and possibly, even those with our children, might never have happened. He was a Christian and everyone from coleaders in campus ministry with him to pastors all thought he was a godly man. I didn’t rush into marriage. I did my “due diligence”, but I didn’t expect my friend to lie to me at all, let alone about such an important topic. I don’t know how to get past this. It’s not like this is fixable. He can’t give me the last thirty years back. He says he’s sorry, but I still don’t know how to forgive this or trust him again. Any advice welcome. Oh, but he doesn’t want to go to ongoing counseling, since he is doing so well with his issues. Help!!!

Sorry that your husband was dishonest with you.
A marriage is in serious trouble without honesty.

It's amazing how many these days that say porn hurts no one. We know that's not true.

Your husband needs to stay in Christian porn Recovery groups. How long? Maybe forever.

I know -- it's a hot mess.

M-Bob

 

[Brianlear]

Honestly, you seem to believe this problem is mine and not his. Everyone does porn, just get over it. I made him feel so scared of rejection that he had no choice but to lie to me. He loved Me sooo much that he had to lie to me to marry me. I mean isn’t that true love, that he’s willing to lie to get me. And, it’s my fault that he felt he couldn’t be honest with me. Got it. I’ll go repent and lash myself now.

Well, you took my post about 10x more personally than I intended
Sorry if you took the meaning to be that this is "all your fault". Not at all, we are each equal contributors to the problems in a relationship. If he is continuing to use porn despite serious consequences in his life, then he has a real problem and the only way for him to change is to re-set his eyes on God and how he wants us to live. But a lot of people already said that, I didn't feel the need to repeat it. What I did feel called to do was hold up a mirror and ask some tough questions, which is what I did. It wasn't meant personally at all. I know you have a history of abuse, and I believe that history is causing you to have an extremely acute response to all of this. I believe you may be projecting your anger and fear onto your husband, causing him to retract and hide from you instead of being honest. I'm trying to get you to see that, and in doing so you are even lashing out against me, out of anger and fear. God wants to take that fear from you and end it. I believe this issue COULD be far more about your own history of abuse, your own fears, and anger, than anything to do with your husband, which, yes he has a problem, but the way you talk its as if the entire balance of the world and your marriage hang on this one question of "did he" use porn when he told you he didn't. You are on here crying out for help about "how to get over this". Multiple people have steered the conversation in the direction of forgiveness, which is exactly where it needs to go. But before you can heal the relationship with your husband, is it possible that you need to give over to God what happened to you as a child?

Here it is right here..

My childhood abusers all lied in the beginning, all tricked me into believing they cared, only to have them take what they wanted from me, once I was trapped. This is what I feel like my husband did to me.

I think you may be blaming your husband for the sins of your childhood abusers, and I think he knows it, and thats why he hides from you. The emotions are so intense that he can't handle exposing himself to you.

I pray regularly for forgiveness and to be able to forgive. I know all the theology about forgiving when the person asks, and, that if we don’t forgive others Christ won’t forgive us.

You're telling us that you KNOW you need to forgive, you pray about it regularly, you "know all the theology". But have you actually done any forgiving yet?

I don't mean any of this to "justify" his actions at all. At ALL. So please don't interpret it that way. What I'm saying is that its not our job to justify in the first place. It's not our place to judge. Jesus instructed us to forgive and he was very, very specific and emphatic about this. So much so that he said, if we don't forgive those around us for their sins, our OWN sins will not be forgiven.

It seems to me that you are on here looking for people to tell you anything EXCEPT what you really need to do, which is go to your husband and forgive him. And I suspect that if you did do that, you would be freeing your own heart and his to walk closer to God. Sorry if this is tough to hear but I think you need to hear it, because honestly it doesn't even seem like forgiving him is on your radar. And I say all this, with the utmost love and respect to you and your husband. I want you guys to make it through this, and grow together.

 

[BriannaR]

First of all, I am not responding to you out of fear Yes, I am responding to you in anger, because you are continually trying to twist this and say I either helped create this situation (I know you have a history of abuse, and I believe that history is causing you to have an extremely acute response to all of this. I believe you may be projecting your anger and fear onto your husband, causing him to retract and hide from you instead of being honest) or you are minimizing the situation (see above quote as well as your description of how your wife handled this and suggesting I do likewise). You seem to think I should not be reacting so seriously about either the lie or the porn. I think you do not take it seriously enough. In Matthew 5:28 Jesus says “but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” And, if having a commandment against adultery is not serious enough for you just read 2 Peter chapter 2. And, you can repeat this with lying (bearing false witness). God seems to take both VERY seriously. Why should I take it less seriously than God? Just because it is a common sin? I do not think that matters. We have become too tolerant of sin. We no longer fear “falling into the hands of an angry God”. (Jonathan Edwards) We should be terrified of sinning. We should be terrified of taking sin too lightly, becoming to comfortable with our sin, and hardening our hearts. We should never think “well everyone sins like this, I’ll repent and I know my wife will forgive me, so what’s the big deal?” The big deal is he sinned against me in the way only a husband can. Not only did he break his marriage vows, but he went into a vow, which he took before God and the church, under false pretenses. Oh, yeah, God takes vows pretty seriously, too.

One of my problems with your responses is your whole “I don’t see anywhere you have...” I cannot know each and every thing you want to hear by telepathy. Just because something isn’t written, doesn’t mean it hasn’t been done.

Yes, I have forgiven many people. We, (my husband and I) had worked with counselors, pastors, prayer and lots of discussion to deal with my childhood abuse issues. By the time his issue was first confessed, things had been settled for 3-4 years. I no longer had any PTSD problems, no anger/bitterness, etc.

I do not know why you assume my husband hides from me. He doesn’t. You brought up the tv thing earlier. I do not prevent from watching tv, he just doesn’t care for tv and would rather read. I am not some kind of jailer, punishing my husband. I do not blame him for my childhood abuse, nor have I ever done so. Yes, this particular behavior mirrors my childhood abuse, which again is part of why him doing this bothers me so much. He chose to repeat a pattern that my abusers used, even though he knew about the pattern. Think about it like this: What if I had a weak knee and he violently kicked my knee out. Wouldn’t that bother me emotionally as well as physically? He chose to hit me in a vulnerable area of my life. What kind of Christlike love does that?

As a Christian I have no choice but to remain married, especially as an older woman, who sacrificed my career to stay home and raise children, etc. If I could turn back time, I would. I would gladly change the last 30 years and remain unmarried, but I cannot do that. So I am trying to forgive and trust him again. I have succeeded in forgiving him for the porn, the vast majority of his lies, and the things he did that damaged our children and destroyed our family. This pre-marital lie is the only remaining issue with which I am still struggling. I am trying to forgive him. I am trying to determine how to break down my walls. It is just difficult and I was looking for support.

Perhaps I’ve answered your questions. Perhaps not. I have the feeling you will never be satisfied until I say that I contributed to his choices to sin and I will not say that. If I “caused” him to sin then he isn’t responsible. My understanding of Scripture is that we are each accountable for our own sins before God.

 

[Brianlear]

Thanks for sticking with this! I'm just here to help you see things from a different angle. And I think its obvious that there is way more history here than we can know in an online form. You've alluded to things other than the porn that damaged your family and children, and I can only guess at what those things are. I do hope you find the solution you are looking for.

 

[ripple the car]

Sometimes it helps if you see your husband as a child.
God gives you strength.

That is excellent advice. And very beautiful and kind advice, too.

Every human being struggles with sin. I am glad he is going to confession, and taking this seriously. When feelings of betrayal or sadness or anger well up, pray for him. Just do that. It's a simple tactic, but it helps.

Your sorrow is understandable, but if you let the angry, pained feelings crash around in your head for long, they can block out compassion, mercy, and forgiveness. Work through those thoughts. Pray for him. That would be my advice. And try to see him as a little boy who needs you help, love, and prayers. That would likely help, too.

 

[createdtoworship]

That is an interesting perspective createdtoworship, and may be the reason for many, but certainly not all. Personally I didn’t even know about the hell part when I accepted Christ. I just knew that for some unknown reason God loved me even though I was disgusting, and I wanted to be close to Him. But, going with your idea, God offers to get us “out of hell” if we come to Him. He knows what He is getting when we come to Him. God isn’t blindsided. He knows our hearts, He knows why we are coming to Him and how far we have to go. We are supposed to marry wisely, but how can we do that when one deceives the other. I went into a Christian marriage, believing in my spouse’s complete honesty. I worked so he could go to Seminary to be a pastor! Thank God that never happened. At least he didn’t disillusion anyone outside our family. At any rate, I am not saying I am not a sinner still, I certainly am. But, I would rather die than deceive anyone about anything. My childhood abusers all lied in the beginning, all tricked me into believing they cared, only to have them take what they wanted from me, once I was trapped. This is what I feel like my husband did to me. He knew this pattern. He knew how important this was to me and rather than be honest and ask me to consider pursuing the relationship despite the porn use, he deceived me to get what he wanted, and he trapped me, because I had no way to escape marriage as a Biblical Christian.

Thank for your transparency, it is hard to go online and confess our faults to one another, but it is healthy and hopefully you can find resources to minister to your particular situation. Sometimes life blind sides you. It's those serious cry sessions with the savior that defines your life. It's not the mountain tops. For me, when I got married I brought to may marriage all the baggage of my previous life, some of it from even before I was saved, pornography was part of that baggage. My wife was hurt by it yes, but I did tell her that I have never kept anything from her except the pornography problem. I think that is fairly common too. See addiction is something that is not really in our ability to become free from without specialized knowledge, accountablity, or other resource. For me it was fasting and praying, that seemed to get me over the addiction boundary. But the first thing I did was learned about my addiction. I bought the book pure desire by ted roberts and I read that book every year for five years, the first few years I read it a few times each year. It was helpful for me. That book is good for the wives as well. It deals with how pornography affects both the husband and the wife. But what I wanted to tell you is most likely He is honest with you. Pornography is particularly evil in how it works and men are very very ashamed of it, and very informed as to the fact it is a sin. So if he confessed it, he would have to be at a point where he was already getting victory over it. No need in hurting the wife over said infidelity to fantasy of porn if it was just going to come back the next week when struggling again. So he waited until he grasped his addiction. But for you, you need to realize that was the only thing he was holding back from you. It's not usual that a man will hold information from a wife, they are typically really transparent with everything. But like I said porn is different because we know it hurts them to talk about it. Because it involves infidelity. But at this point, now that you can truly trust him. I am not saying to fully open your heart, as there was some damage done by his lies. But realize that that was a unique situation. He was literally helpless and hoplessly addicted, and he didn't want to lose you too. I am not saying that he will always have victory, he may relapse. I was keeping two guys accountable on here, and as far as I know they both relapsed, and stopped talking to me. But what He needs is to feel like he can talk to you about his problem. That you won't guilt shame him over his addiction, that He needs Jesus. It's no different than a woman having a love addiction to romance novels, that talk about seduction and sex and all that stuff. That is women porn. That is infidelity as well, just in an different way. So both women and men have their own vices they must overcome. He needs to know from you, that He is doing a good job. That you are proud of him and love him and that you will stick by him if he messes up but that you will be there to help him turn it off if you need to be. Wives don't really serve as an accountability partner, but pray for his accountability chain, that is where the rubber hits the road, if he falls again, most likely he will stop accountablity. So that is a way you can test if he is still victorious over it, "are you still in contact with your accountability team?" If not, then ask why? And if it is a legit reason, then you need to find another accountability for him. I always offer people on CF that they can message me and I will try to keep them accountable for purity reasons, I don't get hit up very often. But I have done it twice. And one guy from church I keep accountable, and he for me.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

You've alluded to things other than the porn that damaged your family and children, and I can only guess at what those things are. I do hope you find the solution you are looking for.

That may be and actually may be
for most of us
born into this sinful world.

I still see porn as a number one hurdle.
I've seen it destroy many a man and family.
Proven in most cases
to be very hard to overcome.

Most overcomers
even with years of recovery
still fight a lifelong battle.

As we know it even has a stronghold in the church.

M-Bob

 

[iLove]

Hi. I’m new, but looking for some help. My husband and I have been married for 30 years. I experienced a lot of abuse as a child and became active in speaking out against abuse early in college years, before meeting my husband. I would give speeches and write about the dangers of pornography. He even helped edit my speeches at times. We were both Christians and friends for a year or so before dating. When it seemed like we might be heading towards marriage we sat down to discuss our pasts. It was very important to me that we share everything so there were no surprises and we could avoid hurting each other or wasting time. I specifically brought up topics about porn and sex. He told me that his brother had shown him porn once, but that was the extent of his exposure to porn. This topic also came up during premarital counseling and again he assured me the one time was as far as it went.

Fast forward to 14 years into marriage. He feels convicted during a sermon and repents of his porn usage, confessing to the pastor, who then made him confess to me. I was freaked out and fearful of him and we had to work through a lot before moving forward. I forgave him and all seemed good.

Fast forward another 14 years (2 years ago now), and he confesses that he never really stopped back then, but has finally stopped now. This was already a difficult time in our marriage because every week or so he was confessing some old sin he committed against me that I was unaware he had done. This continued for about a year, each confession followed by a longer time period before the next. Well, he left the biggest lie for his last confession. He confessed that he purposely lied to me about his porn usage before marriage, that he had actually used porn all through high school and college. When I asked him why he would do this, he said he knew I wouldn’t marry him if I knew the truth.
He is in an accountability program and meets in a group once a week, so he says he is “clean”. I can finally forgive the porn usage, but I can’t get past the fact that he lied so I would marry him. I feel like he stole my life from me. I wouldn’t have married him if I knew and many of the difficulties in our marriage and possibly, even those with our children, might never have happened. He was a Christian and everyone from coleaders in campus ministry with him to pastors all thought he was a godly man. I didn’t rush into marriage. I did my “due diligence”, but I didn’t expect my friend to lie to me at all, let alone about such an important topic. I don’t know how to get past this. It’s not like this is fixable. He can’t give me the last thirty years back. He says he’s sorry, but I still don’t know how to forgive this or trust him again. Any advice welcome. Oh, but he doesn’t want to go to ongoing counseling, since he is doing so well with his issues. Help!!!

It is the life of Christ that is manifested through the power of the Holy Spirit that loves and forgives and does everything else that is needed through us by our Faith placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Finished Work at Calvary Cross (The Blood of Jesus) where the victory was won. Romans 8:2

Unless the Believers Faith is placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Finished Work at Calvary Cross (The Blood of Jesus) where the victory was won, the works of the flesh will manifest (the sin nature) - Galatians 5:19-21. The Believer must enter into sanctification or else the Law of sin and death will reign and rule in everything you do.

Righteousness cannot come by the law, by our own efforts, our own abilities, or by anything that man devise. It can only come by and through what Christ did for us at the Cross and our faith in that finished work, which then guarantees the help of the Holy Spirit. Romans 8:2, Galatians 2:20-21

 

[iLove]

The Believers Full Armor is being in Christ (Rom, 6:3-5). The Believer can only abide in Christ by Faith placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and the Finished Work at Calvary Cross. No other enticing religious disciplines that appeals to the flesh is needed. Concerning this Revelation 12:11 says:

“11 And they overcame him by the Blood of the Lamb (the power to overcome and overwhelm the Kingdom of Satan is found exclusively in the Blood of the Sacrifice of the Son of God, and our Faith in that Finished Work [Rom. 6:3-5, 11, 14]), and by the word of their testimony (the “testimony” must pertain to the fact that the Object of our Faith is the Cross, and exclusively the Cross, which then gives the Holy Spirit latitude to work within our lives); and they loved not their lives unto the death. (This refers to the fact that the Believer must not change his testimony regarding the Cross to something else, even if it means death.)” JSM

As I have stated over and over again, it is the Cross, the Cross! When we speak of the Cross for the solution and answer for all things, we are speaking about "The Blood of Jesus!"

Praise God, Praise God!!!!!! Glory to the Lamb of God!!!!!!!

 

[magiani]

What is difficult I guess is accepting your past life as past. When we hurt we think of many ways how it could have been otherwise. I heard Oprah saying that it was aha moment for her when someone said" you are free of your past when you accept you cant change it 'couse it is your past". It's true that if you had not married your husband 30 years ago, maybe your life would be better(or worse). Eighter way different,but it can not be changed. Your husband did wrong to you but only God may judge. If you do it yourself you are at risk to commit many sins. Probabbly you know all this as you went through many healing sessions. What helps me to heal currently is a prayer. The Jesus prayer. It is simple, but very powerful. " Lord Jesus Christ, be murciful to me" If I repeat it and really concentrate on the meaning of the words it helps me. I hope you can move on soon. Pray for you!