Stopping abortion

[Electric Sceptic]

Something has struck me recently about the 'pro-life' crowd. We all know they oppose abortion. They don't want it to take place. Fair enough.

But I have to believe that they're not stupid. They must realise that illegalising it will do very little or nothing to actually reduce the number of abortions that happen. After all, abortion has happened, on large scales, always, whether it was legal or not. So they must realise that illegalising it won't stop it. So while illegalising it might make them feel a little better, it won't really help in the battle they are fighting (ie., to stop/limit abortions).

So...what WOULD stop it? I would think the most obvious way to lower the number of abortions would be to increase sex education and availability of cheap contraceptives. Why are those who oppose abortion never for this option?

The only conclusion I can come to is that while they might be against abortion, that's not really the issue. What they oppose is what they see as sexual immorality, and abortion is one consequence of that.

So they don't WANT to make sex safer...because that'll just mean people are more likely to have sex. They want to keep sex 'dangerous' (ie., more likely to have adverse consequences such as disease/unwanted pregnancy) in an effort to persuade people not to have it.

Otherwise, if they really were so concerned about preventing abortions, they'd be handing out free condoms instead of picketing clinics.

And that sucks.

 

[Madcoil]

But it makes people suffer, so it's all right. That balances it out.

 

[Kroger99]

Something has struck me recently about the 'pro-life' crowd. We all know they oppose abortion. They don't want it to take place. Fair enough.

But I have to believe that they're not stupid. They must realise that illegalising it will do very little or nothing to actually reduce the number of abortions that happen. After all, abortion has happened, on large scales, always, whether it was legal or not. So they must realise that illegalising it won't stop it. So while illegalising it might make them feel a little better, it won't really help in the battle they are fighting (ie., to stop/limit abortions).

So...what WOULD stop it? I would think the most obvious way to lower the number of abortions would be to increase sex education and availability of cheap contraceptives. Why are those who oppose abortion never for this option?

The only conclusion I can come to is that while they might be against abortion, that's not really the issue. What they oppose is what they see as sexual immorality, and abortion is one consequence of that.

So they don't WANT to make sex safer...because that'll just mean people are more likely to have sex. They want to keep sex 'dangerous' (ie., more likely to have adverse consequences such as disease/unwanted pregnancy) in an effort to persuade people not to have it.

Otherwise, if they really were so concerned about preventing abortions, they'd be handing out free condoms instead of picketing clinics.

And that sucks.

While we are at it....We can have everyone start growing there own pot so that we know that our children are only getting clean dope. Don't forget about the tobaco plants so that we know that our childrens are not getting all those extra chems in there cigarettes.

Oh.....and which brand of beer would you recommend for my teenage daughter?

 

[StromRider]

While we are at it....We can have everyone start growing there own pot so that we know that our children are only getting clean dope.

I don't think we need to go that far, for once marijuana is legalized then the chances of someone getting bad pot will go down because everyone will know who is selling the good stuff and the bad.

Don't forget about the tobaco plants so that we know that our childrens are not getting all those extra chems in there cigarettes.

If someone choses to smoke a legal product with it's contents on the label I don't think they have a need to grow their own. I can't imagine tobacco leaf straight from the plant would be that healthy or tasty.

Oh.....and which brand of beer would you recommend for my teenage daughter?

Considering the 21 year old drinking age in the US is one of the stupidest rules in a civilived country, and it should be 18 - I would recommend something like a Coors/Bud/Miller light as a training beer. They aren't good for anything else

 

[Kroger99]

I don't think we need to go that far, for once marijuana is legalized then the chances of someone getting bad pot will go down because everyone will know who is selling the good stuff and the bad.

If someone choses to smoke a legal product with it's contents on the label I don't think they have a need to grow their own. I can't imagine tobacco leaf straight from the plant would be that healthy or tasty.

Considering the 21 year old drinking age in the US is one of the stupidest rules in a civilived country, and it should be 18 - I would recommend something like a Coors/Bud/Miller light as a training beer. They aren't good for anything else

That is Awesome! Thanks so much
While we are on the subject..... Beings that I'm new at all this Libaral Peace loving kick....Is there any suggestions on a brand of Crack Pipe that I can get for my teenage daughter? Or say....any reliable dealers that I can get her only the finest. I figure that I must educate her as the safe way to deal with this beings that she will most likely do it on her own....right?

 

[Spinrad]

Not addressing the actual topic is fun.

 

[StromRider]

The only conclusion I can come to is that while they might be against abortion, that's not really the issue. What they oppose is what they see as sexual immorality, and abortion is one consequence of that.

So they don't WANT to make sex safer...because that'll just mean people are more likely to have sex. They want to keep sex 'dangerous' (ie., more likely to have adverse consequences such as disease/unwanted pregnancy) in an effort to persuade people not to have it.

Otherwise, if they really were so concerned about preventing abortions, they'd be handing out free condoms instead of picketing clinics.

And that sucks.

Excellent points!! I never cease to be amazed by the fact that those who demand abortion be stopped are usually (not always) the same ones who are against proper sex education and easy access to birth control. And the really conservative ones among them will be the first to condemn the single mom even after preventing the education/birth control/abortion that would have prevented her from becoming a single mom. And don't go asking for no welfare you bum!!!! It's your fault!!!

The day abortion is made illegal is the day those who can affored it will go to their private doctors and pay for a proper procedure while those who can't afford it will return to getting maimed and killed by back alley butchers. This is such an obvious fact of history people must have to try really hard to ignore it. Or else they just don't care.

 

[StromRider]

That is Awesome! Thanks so much
While we are on the subject..... Beings that I'm new at all this Libaral Peace loving kick....Is there any suggestions on a brand of Crack Pipe that I can get for my teenage daughter? Or say....any reliable dealers that I can get her only the finest. I figure that I must educate her as the safe way to deal with this beings that she will most likely do it on her own....right?

I don't recall advocating the use of crack anywhere in my post. Can you point out to me where I did?

And by the way the word is 'Liberal', not 'Libaral.' Or is the word so horrible to you that you just can't bear to type it out correctly?

 

[Kroger99]

I don't recall advocating the use of crack anywhere in my post. Can you point out to me where I did?

And by the way the word is 'Liberal', not 'Libaral.' Or is the word so horrible to you that you just can't bear to type it out correctly?

Lol

Nah….I just think that your ideal is absurd and I thought I would have some fun by sounding absurd myself, but I bet that you already knew that. Your nit-picking my spelling errors is just proof that I was successful at my evil ploy.

However, I see teaching kids how to have sex just as absurd as some of the things that I jokingly suggested. I would prefer that we teach them about not having sex until they are married and remind them that killing babies is not cool.

 

[Spinrad]

Absurd...like devoting your life to mythological beings?

 

[Scally Cap]

That is Awesome! Thanks so much
While we are on the subject..... Beings that I'm new at all this Libaral Peace loving kick....Is there any suggestions on a brand of Crack Pipe that I can get for my teenage daughter? Or say....any reliable dealers that I can get her only the finest. I figure that I must educate her as the safe way to deal with this beings that she will most likely do it on her own....right?

Your daughter will likely have sex some day. She may some day choose to drink alcoholic beverages. In fact, both of those behaviors are likely to occur in conjunction with her wedding day. Sex and alcohol consumption can't be equated to smoking crack because, unlike sex and drinking, crack smoking isn't a behavior that magically becomes legal and acceptable once a person attains an arbitrary minimum age. Given the likelihood that your daughter will one day engage in those behaviors, it's important that she be educated about them--not only about how she will be affected, but how the people around her will be affected as well. And a major component of that education needs to be about proper decision-making and the power of choice. Teaching about contraception and moderation in drinking does not compel either sexual promiscuity or binge drinking, and in fact should discourage both.

When a kid turns 16 she's legally allowed to drive, but we don't turn her loose with a car and a warning not to wreck it. We require classroom learning and practical training in order to reduce the risks to both the young driver and everyone else on the road. Don't like abortion? Promote a realistic and comprehensive sex-ed curriculum. Don't like teenagers drinking themselves into a stupor? Adopt the European model of introducing wine and easy beers with supervised family meals when they're young teens. Good sex within a marriage strengthens it. Good wine in moderation promotes individual health. Can't make the same arguments for crack, so, sorry, your analogy doesn't stretch that far.

 

[Kroger99]

Your daughter will likely have sex some day. She may some day choose to drink alcoholic beverages. In fact, both of those behaviors are likely to occur in conjunction with her wedding day. Sex and alcohol consumption can't be equated to smoking crack because, unlike sex and drinking, crack smoking isn't a behavior that magically becomes legal and acceptable once a person attains an arbitrary minimum age. Given the likelihood that your daughter will one day engage in those behaviors, it's important that she be educated about them--not only about how she will be affected, but how the people around her will be affected as well. And a major component of that education needs to be about proper decision-making and the power of choice. Teaching about contraception and moderation in drinking does not compel either sexual promiscuity or binge drinking, and in fact should discourage both.

When a kid turns 16 she's legally allowed to drive, but we don't turn her loose with a car and a warning not to wreck it. We require classroom learning and practical training in order to reduce the risks to both the young driver and everyone else on the road. Don't like abortion? Promote a realistic and comprehensive sex-ed curriculum. Don't like teenagers drinking themselves into a stupor? Adopt the European model of introducing wine and easy beers with supervised family meals when they're young teens. Good sex within a marriage strengthens it. Good wine in moderation promotes individual health. Can't make the same arguments for crack, so, sorry, your analogy doesn't stretch that far.

LOL......This is too much! Thanks! I needed that this morning....LOL

 

[Kroger99]

Absurd...like devoting your life to mythological beings?

Sorry...You must have me confused with someone else.

 

[TeddyKGB]

While we are at it....We can have everyone start growing there own pot so that we know that our children are only getting clean dope. Don't forget about the tobaco plants so that we know that our childrens are not getting all those extra chems in there cigarettes.

Oh.....and which brand of beer would you recommend for my teenage daughter?

Bad analogy. Smoking and drinking have no obvious underlying biological imperatives.

It seems pretty silly to think we can substantially alter the very behavior that our species depends upon for continuation.

 

[Spinrad]

Sorry...You must have me confused with someone else.

A Christian. My mistake. It was the cross and the attitude that threw me.

 

[jayem]

Responsible sexual behavior is indeed the best way to reduce abortions. I tend to agree that abstinence (or at least, avoiding intercourse) is the best method for young people and those not in a mature, committed relationship. But everyone should know about the benefits and risks of all birth control methods, and they should be used conscientiously by both men and women. (Effective birth control technology for men--other than condoms and vasectomy--sorely needs development.) Most western European contries have non-restrictive abortion laws, yet they also have 1/3 to 1/2 of the rate of abortion in the US. Why can't we have the same?

 

[StromRider]

Most western European contries have non-restrictive abortion laws, yet they also have 1/3 to 1/2 of the rate of abortion in the US. Why can't we have the same?

You know the answer to that as well as I do. Because the religious zealots, in their need to paint sex as something horrible - until the day you marry!!! - won't let people talk about sex education and birth control.

Oh, and I guess that because homosexuals will never be allowed to marry in the christian utopia they can never have sex. Sucks to be them.....

 

[StromRider]

LOL......This is too much! Thanks! I needed that this morning....LOL

Why does something totally logical and practical make you laugh so much?

 

[chipmunk]

I think some people confuse sex education with handing children a copy of sexual techniques/positions. However, it's more about safety issues and ways to prevent pregnancy. It is in my mind criminal not to equip them with knowledge about condoms, diaphragms, birth control pills, STDS, effects of multiple partners, what birth entails, the effects of pregnancy on teenagers, and YES they teach abstinence as the best way for avoiding all complications, etc. Not all parents are cut out for teaching their kids these things and it is the child in the end that will suffer. Some children are in going to disregard all the good advice about abstinence until marriage and these children need to know how to protect themselves, or at least be equipped with the knowledge to know how. Besides, when they're curious its best to learn things in a structured environment than behind the school from other kids.

 

[Archivist]

However, I see teaching kids how to have sex just as absurd as some of the things that I jokingly suggested. I would prefer that we teach them about not having sex until they are married and remind them that killing babies is not cool.

I believe that studies have shown that teaching abstinence doesn't work.