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True. But special pleading for your chosen deity cuts even less mustard. The argument from Danny appears to be "God has a different moral barometer to humans." There is no evidence for that and no reason to believe it other than convenience.
But "godidit", no longer a satisfactory explanation for lightning, suddenly is a satisfactory explanation for morality again?
Because it is biblical - for example Romans chapter 2 where Paul writes about having the law being written in to peoples hearts, and that some people naturally obey this...
And God is still a perfectly valid for explaining lightning by the way..
...
The evidence would have to be via 2 control groups - one living in this universe and one living in a godless universe - and conduct an experiment thus...
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then He is not omnipotent.
Is He able, but not willing? Then He is malevolent.
Is He both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is He neither able nor willing? Then why call Him God?
Epicurus (c. 341 - c. 270 BC)
Yes - this is a good example of the sound reasoning and rationality that atheism is famous for.
Based on this evidence, Atheism is the equivalent of getting annoyed with kids that still believe in Father Christmas...
You believe God made everything. You also believe God gave you your moral code. So, unless God pulled a fast one and for some inexplicable reason gave us a different morality to his own, do you not see that it is absurd to ask "who are you to judge God according to your own (God given) moral barometer"? This is where the special pleading comes in - either God shares the same moral code, in which case it is perfectly acceptable to judge God by that code, or God has a different moral code so we cannot judge Him. The latter makes no sense other than being a convenient way to explain away the inexplicable.The idea of a moral compass by the way makes virtually no sense in a godless universe.
Obviously there is no evidence for this. Both Danny and myself believe that God is what our moral compass points to (or not), and we also believe that the god of the bible exists in this universe - so this explains how we see things.
Recent clip of Stephen Fry's reaction when asked what he would say if he met God (assumed Judeo Christian variant..)
Anyone seen it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-suvkwNYSQo
You believe God made everything. You also believe God gave you your moral code. So, unless God pulled a fast one and for some inexplicable reason gave us a different morality to his own, do you not see that it is absurd to ask "who are you to judge God according to your own (God given) moral barometer"? This is where the special pleading comes in - either God shares the same moral code, in which case it is perfectly acceptable to judge God by that code, or God has a different moral code so we cannot judge Him. The latter makes no sense other than being a convenient way to explain away the inexplicable.
I haven't seen the argument "lightening, therefore God exists" lately.
That's off the point.So you don't believe that God is omnipotent then?
There are numerous examples in YOUR bible that show that God can control natural phenomena such as the weather....
It's a bit hard to see, however, how exactly human behaviour could cause, say, the Boxing Day Tsunami.Maybe at the end of the day is it actually humans who cause cancer by the way we eat, Earth, technology. It's it our freewill be well free and not be robots for god. Maybe a part of this is what we do does have cause and affect....
And I don't get then how God can stop that ?
I don't think God wants too see anyone suffer.... And since Stephen doesn't know God then he doesn't understand this...
It's a bit hard to see, however, how exactly human behaviour could cause, say, the Boxing Day Tsunami.
You believe God made everything. You also believe God gave you your moral code. So, unless God pulled a fast one and for some inexplicable reason gave us a different morality to his own, do you not see that it is absurd to ask "who are you to judge God according to your own (God given) moral barometer"? This is where the special pleading comes in - either God shares the same moral code, in which case it is perfectly acceptable to judge God by that code, or God has a different moral code so we cannot judge Him. The latter makes no sense other than being a convenient way to explain away the inexplicable.
Global warming, the amount abuse on the sea by new types of fishes since 150 million different fish spieces are caught in the 75 mile line at every catch are they doing some damage ? .......
Am not saying that is the actually cause...
But something must have caused it or are you saying God caused it ?
A movement in the tectonic plate. Same as an earthquake.
Earthquakes, volcanos, tsunamis,... are inherent to the way the planet is constructed. They've been going on for far far longer than we have existed.
That's what techtonic plates do. They don't slide smoothly over each other; the pressure to move builds up until something shifts in a jerk.I know that but what is making the movement to be so strong that it is causing it, something it..
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