speaking the word over inanimate objects

[now faith]

Galatians: 4. 6. And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 7. Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. 8. Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. 9. But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Good night God Bless

 

[Kathryn Jensen]

I agree. Nothing is wrong with being prospered to help others. I received help today to get some food in my house and when they gave me extra I gave 4 cantaloupes away to some neighbors to help. The people asked how much I want for them and I said "The best thing about receiving something for free is being a good steward and giving it away for free. God says "Give freely what has been given freely. But when people preach that if you give to God He will give back and all their energy is toward giving to receive riches and supporting a prosperity gospel instead of spreading the word and the gospel of Jesus Christ and Him crucified then there is a problem, greed. I cannot argue with the word rightly divided. Though you do not, others use the word to manipulate.

It's God's nature and character to bless. It's is He who presented us with "If you do this, then i will do this." Basically, if you obey my commands, i will...or if you ask anything in my Name or other scriptures that give us confidence in prayer...or "let it be done to you according to your faith.." or "i could do no miracles because of their lack of faith...just throwin stuff out...

I do agree with you regarding those who are not seeking God (and the blessings naturally follow), but seek only His hand...ive heard some wacky stories...

 

[bloodbought09]

Love Billy Graham. Love the Swaggarts too. I have messed up way worse than Jimmy Swaggart. Of course I am called to evangelism as well but will never do as much as these guys have done. But I really like Donny Swaggart. But no one can top Jesus Christ. I don't trust Kenneth Copeland. But then who should put their trust in man?

 

[tiffc34us]

well here we are,,, bloodbought09 and me :0

 

[bloodbought09]

well here we are,,, bloodbought09 and me :0

I love you honey.

 

[Kathryn Jensen]

I was "brought up" Baptist. I have a lot to say about that, but that's another topic, altogether. LOL Because that particular church taught rules rather than relationship, I had nothing but a shallow religion to turn to when "life" became overwhelming. I walked away when I was 18. When God began to call me back in my early 30s (or when I was listening), one of the first things He had to foundationally teach me was faith. He put me under Kenneth Hagin. During Christmas they had every book he had ever published. I have cousins who work for Rhema and one is a pastor on staff there. I know what they believe. Where God was taking me was not easy due to my Baptist background (Baptism in the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues, for one) because they taught that Pentecostals were of the devil and thus so was speaking in tongues. Of course, at that age, I wasn't actually in the Word learning it for myself; I was believing was what being spoken in the pulpit.

Through the years, I have heard and READ what people believe Kenneth Hagin believes. I am astonished. I often wonder if people actually read his books in their entirety or attend his church, or heard him speak (he has passed now), or have spoken with him at length; or do they just pluck out excerpts and twist them for their agenda. YEARS ago Kenneth Copeland, when he was discovering our place with God (seated in heavenly places with Christ and authority given to us, etc, made a statement that has haunted him since "we are little gods" or something. I know what he meant and so do those who KNOW his heart and what he was discovering in Scripture. However, the heart is evil above all else and man is evil and critical and Christians are the worst with each other (in the Name of God), if you ask me. Pharisees and Sadducee, for example, are the worst (what is done in the name of God). I do realize that God has done some seemingly cruel and harsh things in His own Name so....lol

I haven't followed Copeland in years ~ anyone in particular, really. There are various ministers who go out with a specific message to grow Christians. This is not what they or their pastor preach every Sunday. I think people watch the televised messages from conferences and think that this is all they preach 24/7 or that they don't attend a church. They have a particular ministry (like growing people in faith) and that is what they focus on. The listeners are responsible for being in a fellowship that living life and doing what believers do in a fellowship (such as receive correction).

I remember one of the first things that the Holy Spirit ever spoke to me was to make sure that I read the Scriptures more than books (I love to read) so that the Holy SPirit could quicken my spirit when I read something in error. I have failed in this through the years but it has proven to be helpful. In my early years when reading many books from the Word of Faith teachers, I was reading one by Fred Price. The Spirit quickened my spirit to untruth. I tossed the book and never read or watched him again. He may have gotten on track now, but He's not for me. But everyone can't be lumped into the same mold as heretical.

I admit, though I believe that "the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous," I am unsure how I feel about Creflo Dollar feeling he needs a 65 million dollar plane paid for my contributions. LOL Do I think God has a problem with him having a 65 million dollar plane? No. But, WOW, what we could do with 65 million. This is where my double standard steps in. I don't know how I feel just yet. lol If people send money in designated for the purchase of the plane, then fine. I don't know.

Either way, I do know where you are coming from. Man has always gotten out of balance. It's the nature of the beast. But, we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. We glean the truths and throw the rest away. "I wish above all else that you would prosper and be in health, even as your soul prospers." Peace, Shalom: wholeness spiritually, mentally and emotionally, financially, and physically. It's God's way.

You are called to evangelize so get on it...LOL

 

[hhodgson]

I have been on here for about a week again. I regret stepping foot in this part of the forum. You want to message me one on one and we can talk. I am not going back and forth with you in this op I care nothing about. What I mean to say is that, I am born-again and know the power of God but it is very important to be in the word and not be watching a bunch of charlatans and fakes.

First of all... Welcome. But I MUST remind you that this is the Word of Faith forum. You are in violation of forum rules and are NOT allowed to debate here unless you are a member of this forum. You are also in violation of speaking against our WOF beliefs AND ... in violation of speaking against some of our teachers who are just like you and me... Far from perfect.

You quote here... "I regret stepping foot in this part of the forum." I will also remind you that the same door you opened "swings" both ways. If you continue this bad hair day approach to our home... YOU will be reported to the moderators (if not already). If you want to fellowship with us then ALL it would take for you is to repent (change your mind) in what you are doing. Time is too short to be playing games... and get serious as we are seeing that day approaching. Please think about this and back away if this continues...

The Forum Watchman...​

​

 

[hhodgson]

It would be better than pulling money out of a fish's mouth...lol

Especially this fish...

Welcome to the WOF forum...​

​

 

[bloodbought09]

First of all... Welcome. But I MUST remind you that this is the Word of Faith forum. You are in violation of forum rules and are NOT allowed to debate here unless you are a member of this forum. You are also in violation of speaking against our WOF beliefs AND ... in violation of speaking against some of our teachers who are just like you and me... Far from perfect.

You quote here... "I regret stepping foot in this part of the forum." I will also remind you that the same door you opened "swings" both ways. If you continue this bad hair day approach to our home... YOU will be reported to the moderators (if not already). If you want to fellowship with us then ALL it would take for you is to repent (change your mind) in what you are doing. Time is too short to be playing games... and get serious as we are seeing that day approaching. Please think about this and back away if this continues...View attachment 159567

The Forum Watchman...​

View attachment 159568​

Repent is not changing your mind. It is a full 180 in the opposite direction. I do not repent for speaking truth. I am off to check on some other stuff.

 

[hhodgson]

Repent is not changing your mind. It is a full 180 in the opposite direction. I do not repent for speaking truth. I am off to check on some other stuff.

Your close to the definition bloodbought09... But, not quite! You can turn around 180 all you want. You can even do a 360 as many times as you want, the only thing that may be accomplished is getting dizzy. Doesn't change your thinking. The MIND is the battlefield. True repentance IS changing your mind, stop what your (doing and saying)... and turn to Jesus. You can do that standing still without turning around at all. You acknowledge to Him that you done wrong and thank Him that He has ALREADY forgiven you by the finished work of Christ. You don't need to turn around. Stay here and fellowship with us.

You... And your lady friend (tiffc34us) are more than welcome to stick around and get to know us if you desire. We may be a little weird and peculiar but we are His chosen generation as royal priesthood (1 Peter 2:9).

Peace...​

​

 

[hhodgson]

Kathryn Jensen said:

I admit, though I believe that "the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous," I am unsure how I feel about Creflo Dollar feeling he needs a 65 million dollar plane paid for my contributions. LOL Do I think God has a problem with him having a 65 million dollar plane? No. But, WOW, what we could do with 65 million. This is where my double standard steps in. I don't know how I feel just yet. lol If people send money in designated for the purchase of the plane, then fine. I don't know.

Either way, I do know where you are coming from. Man has always gotten out of balance. It's the nature of the beast. But, we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. We glean the truths and throw the rest away. "I wish above all else that you would prosper and be in health, even as your soul prospers." Peace, Shalom: wholeness spiritually, mentally and emotionally, financially, and physically. It's God's way.

Good overall post...

As far as Creflo "needing" or "wanting" THIS particular jet it remains to be seen what actually takes place. We seen an article recently where the church board approved this purchase. We'll wait and see how that turns out to see (if the article is even true). I pray that he has determined in his HEART to put God first even before his own self. If that's his pure motive than God's BLESSING will not only come upon him... but will overtake him (Deut. 28:10).

You are right though that MAN has always gotten out of balance... whether they are rich or poor. The out of balance affects both whether it's prosperity mentality or having a poverty mentality.

Kenneth E. Hagins book... "The Midas Touch" explains in detail of a balanced scriptural approach to prosperity. Hagin said that he observed many teachings and practices that have both helped and hindered the Body of Christ. In virtually every biblical subject, there is a main road of truth with a ditch of error on either side of the road. Some are having great difficulty staying in the middle of the road when it comes to prosperity. I think we've all been there one time or another in some areas of our faith. And we've all probably veered off one side or the other in our thinking.

God is NOT against wealth and prosperity and he wants us all to prosper financially. But He is against people being covetous or having wrong motives. I would recommend Hagin's book to everyone to learn about a scriptural balanced approach to being prosperous. The book can be purchased on Amazon, or... one may be able to download a pdf version from the net.

Be Blessed to be a BLessing...​

​

 

[bloodbought09]

I would have to agree. The road is narrow that leads to life and not many find it. Wide is the gate that leads to destruction. Creflo could get a flight to whatever country he would like and take provisions to minister to the people. Of course a missions journey gets one out of their comfort zone. A 65 million dollar jet is too luxurious. Jimmy Swaggart and his crew raise 4 million a month to do what they do but I just do not get the air of poor stewardship. People have the gospel preached to them and many are baptized in the Holy Spirit. I also like watching a guy named Bill Keller out of Florida on my tv. He tells it the way it is with people who call in. Sometimes people who just want to heckle him. He always prays for people to be healed and he sees many praise reports when people come to praise Jesus for the miracles that occur.

Kenneth Hagin jr, Kenneth Copeland, and even that Roberts guy got into that holy laughter phenomenon. I just will not follow anyone who strays off course. Just focus on my own walk.

Thanks for the welcoming committee. I may stay for some time. We are a peculiar people, I agree. I bow my knee to Jesus Christ and the Word. I am saved and I am baptized in the Holy Spirit. I really do not identify myself with Pentecostal, Word of Faith, Charismatic, or any of these denominations. If I am indeed a part of the body of Christ I ought to be able to walk into any congregation and feel at place. I am just not gonna engage myself to any funny business. God does want to see us prosper but I am sure He does not want to bless us if we are going to be a bunch of spoiled brats. He blesses so that we may be a blessing to others.

We can speak to mountains and a tree with mustard seed faith and they will move. I do have to agree that our motives must be right. If there is no money in our wallet, then ask, seek, and knock. Ask God for prosperity, position yourself to find it, and keep knocking. But asking, seeking , and knocking does not necessarily pertain to prosperity. God sometimes even brings people who do not know Him into our lives to bless us. He can use anyone to bless His children, even if they do not even know they are doing it.

 

[jerry kelso]

Kathryn Jensen said:

I admit, though I believe that "the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous," I am unsure how I feel about Creflo Dollar feeling he needs a 65 million dollar plane paid for my contributions. LOL Do I think God has a problem with him having a 65 million dollar plane? No. But, WOW, what we could do with 65 million. This is where my double standard steps in. I don't know how I feel just yet. lol If people send money in designated for the purchase of the plane, then fine. I don't know.

Either way, I do know where you are coming from. Man has always gotten out of balance. It's the nature of the beast. But, we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. We glean the truths and throw the rest away. "I wish above all else that you would prosper and be in health, even as your soul prospers." Peace, Shalom: wholeness spiritually, mentally and emotionally, financially, and physically. It's God's way.

Good overall post...

As far as Creflo "needing" or "wanting" THIS particular jet it remains to be seen what actually takes place. We seen an article recently where the church board approved this purchase. We'll wait and see how that turns out to see (if the article is even true). I pray that he has determined in his HEART to put God first even before his own self. If that's his pure motive than God's BLESSING will not only come upon him... but will overtake him (Deut. 28:10).

You are right though that MAN has always gotten out of balance... whether they are rich or poor. The out of balance affects both whether it's prosperity mentality or having a poverty mentality.

Kenneth E. Hagins book... "The Midas Touch" explains in detail of a balanced scriptural approach to prosperity. Hagin said that he observed many teachings and practices that have both helped and hindered the Body of Christ. In virtually every biblical subject, there is a main road of truth with a ditch of error on either side of the road. Some are having great difficulty staying in the middle of the road when it comes to prosperity. I think we've all been there one time or another in some areas of our faith. And we've all probably veered off one side or the other in our thinking.

God is NOT against wealth and prosperity and he wants us all to prosper financially. But He is against people being covetous or having wrong motives. I would recommend Hagin's book to everyone to learn about a scriptural balanced approach to being prosperous. The book can be purchased on Amazon, or... one may be able to download a pdf version from the net.

Be Blessed to be a BLessing...View attachment 159621​

View attachment 159622​

hhodgson,
1. It is true that God is not against wealth for he blessed many people such as Abraham and Job who were very wealthy. Their wealth came because of not trying to get from God but being faithful in their service by faith and trusting and living and being true to God.

2. The old testament of sowing and reaping was agricultural in which one seed would produce within itself one plant. There was also sowing spiritually as well and it was connected to the blessing and cursing system. They had to do something to attain something.

3. In Jesus day it changed to sowing the message of the kingdom and what was reaped was the result of the message. The 30, 60, 90, and 100 fold was all about the sowing the message of the kingdom of heaven which was the earthly kingdom the jews were promised through the Abrahamic and Davidic covenants. The reaping was the result of that message.

4. In the early church one can see the message sown and the result of the message which is not the kingdom of heaven message and not about doing something to attain something. It is all about what Christ did according to the cross and his resurrection message.

5. Paul had the Corinthians to sow bountifully so they could help the poor saints in Jerusalem not for the things of the church. Paul personally did not receive tithes for his salary. He did not choose any money for his labor even though he could have for the labor is worthy of his hire.

6. I really see no scripture that actually sows money to reap money. Paul did sow the message and reaped carnal things in some instances.

7. Abraham gave a tithe and it was not mandatory. God loves a cheerful giver and really if we give out of love we will give more than the tithe. At the same time I understand about supporting the church. Many in the past used tithing as a doctrine of fear by using Malachi. The context of Malachi was the priests corrupting the temple and Israel robbing God of the tithe that was mandatory according to their covenant.

8. Paul said in Romans 8 that God gave his son freely so that he may give us all things freely.
Stewardship is a factor in giving because of what Christ did and not what we do. The difference could be in legalistic or free in love; which results in wrong or right motive.

9. My dad preached Kenneth Hagin and Kenneth Copeland and I would not necessarily indict them of not being a christian for I believed they are saved. Both of them are mostly accused of following E.W. Kenyon's basic principles which were supposedly metaphysical teachings.

10. I think they may have not been perfect in many things but I do believe they learned many things and have been successful because of faith and a real relationship with God. Another words some things might have been construed by some who may have got lost in principles and forgot about relationship and stewardship. I would agree that there are those who God can trust with handling of money and it does take money to do things and we do know our source is God and the object is faith in what he did on the cross. Normally, if people are teaching you what to do legalistically is what results. It is through the message of the cross and the resurrected Lord that we have provision. Thinking out loud. Jerry kelso

 

[hhodgson]

Kenneth Hagin jr, Kenneth Copeland, and even that Roberts guy got into that holy laughter phenomenon. I just will not follow anyone who strays off course. Just focus on my own walk.

Thanks for the welcoming committee. I may stay for some time. We are a peculiar people, I agree. I bow my knee to Jesus Christ and the Word. I am saved and I am baptized in the Holy Spirit. I really do not identify myself with Pentecostal, Word of Faith, Charismatic, or any of these denominations. If I am indeed a part of the body of Christ I ought to be able to walk into any congregation and feel at place. I am just not gonna engage myself to any funny business. God does want to see us prosper but I am sure He does not want to bless us if we are going to be a bunch of spoiled brats. He blesses so that we may be a blessing to others.

As far as the laughter phenomenon Kenneth E Hagin Sr. experienced it also. And as far as "not following" anyone who strays off course... that only leaves us with just one who has never strayed. Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

We have heard this more times than we can count." Chew the meat and spit out the bones." or "Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater." If we ONLY listen to perfect preaching/teaching we listen to NOTHING at all, for none is. These phrases (by themselves) are not scriptural and many don't like them at all so they won't listen to anyone. Either way, there can be a lot of truth with a little error and/or a lot of error with a little truth.

Scripture teaches that we are to "examine everything carefully; hold fast to what is good" (1 Thess 5:21).

So it comes down to what WE choose to believe in what we (think)... is truth. We need to watch and know them by their fruits from any and all teachers/speakers/preachers of the Word. We also need to continually renew our minds with the Word (Romans 12:2). What's sad is some Christians will use these same phrases to justify "parts" of the law. In that, there is NO justification in any part of the law. The law is not of faith. To some teachings one would have to dive in a dumpster to get a nugget of truth.

Someone said, "Keep the good part of the teaching, throw out the bad. However, someone could chew on a bone by mistake and break a tooth. Worse yet, someone could accidentally swallow a small bone and choke. Wouldn’t it be best to remove the meat from the bone before putting it into your mouth?"

That's something different to think about.​

​

 

[bloodbought09]

How about listening to a preacher who has prepared the meat and left out the bones? I agree to search things out and hold to what is good. A good helping of the Word of God by opening my bible is sufficient. As for the baby and the bath water, what do we need this for if we are washed with the pure water of the Word? Not diving into a dumpster for a little nugget of truth. The best nuggets come from reading the Word and the Holy Spirit teaching us and reminding us of what we have read and learned.

 

[bloodbought09]

Holy laughter, drunk in the spirit, and slain in the spirit is not for me.

 

[now faith]

I find it amusing when someone decides how much is too much.

As if stewardship is conditional upon their sense of value.

We should check with our esteemed posters here before we allow God to bless us.

Over and over this old false statement about Kenyon!!
No he was not part of the mystical movement.

Kenyon started as a Methodist Preacher,then became a Freewill Baptist Pastor.
His positive confession doctrine had its roots in the Holiness movement.


Essek William Kenyon (1867 – 1948) was an evangelist, pastor, president of a Bible Institute, author, songwriter, and poet. He is best known for the numerous books that he authored that are still in great demand today. Kenyon’s writings dramatically unfold the glorious truths of the revelation given to the apostle Paul in simple, concise language. He wrote for the spirit man, addressing the heart more than the head.

Understanding the Father-heart of God, who we are in Christ, and the authority and privileges of the believer were central to Kenyon’s message.

In his writings, Kenyon calls the believer up and out of the mire of traditional unbelief into the deep, rich treasures of our redemption in Christ. Many lives have been transformed reading his simple, yet profound books. To read more go to Kenyon’s Gospel Publishing Society

Source: Hope Faith Prayer web page.

 

[now faith]

Holy laughter, drunk in the spirit, and slain in the spirit is not for me.

That's good

Romans: 14. 22. Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth. 23. And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin. - Bible Offline

 

[now faith]

How about listening to a preacher who has prepared the meat and left out the bones? I agree to search things out and hold to what is good. A good helping of the Word of God by opening my bible is sufficient. As for the baby and the bath water, what do we need this for if we are washed with the pure water of the Word? Not diving into a dumpster for a little nugget of truth. The best nuggets come from reading the Word and the Holy Spirit teaching us and reminding us of what we have read and learned.

What is the point of these post?
Are you teaching us the true Gospel?
You need to get in line and wait your turn just like the others ahead of you.

 

[now faith]

hhodgson,
1. It is true that God is not against wealth for he blessed many people such as Abraham and Job who were very wealthy. Their wealth came because of not trying to get from God but being faithful in their service by faith and trusting and living and being true to God.

2. The old testament of sowing and reaping was agricultural in which one seed would produce within itself one plant. There was also sowing spiritually as well and it was connected to the blessing and cursing system. They had to do something to attain something.

3. In Jesus day it changed to sowing the message of the kingdom and what was reaped was the result of the message. The 30, 60, 90, and 100 fold was all about the sowing the message of the kingdom of heaven which was the earthly kingdom the jews were promised through the Abrahamic and Davidic covenants. The reaping was the result of that message.

4. In the early church one can see the message sown and the result of the message which is not the kingdom of heaven message and not about doing something to attain something. It is all about what Christ did according to the cross and his resurrection message.

5. Paul had the Corinthians to sow bountifully so they could help the poor saints in Jerusalem not for the things of the church. Paul personally did not receive tithes for his salary. He did not choose any money for his labor even though he could have for the labor is worthy of his hire.

6. I really see no scripture that actually sows money to reap money. Paul did sow the message and reaped carnal things in some instances.

7. Abraham gave a tithe and it was not mandatory. God loves a cheerful giver and really if we give out of love we will give more than the tithe. At the same time I understand about supporting the church. Many in the past used tithing as a doctrine of fear by using Malachi. The context of Malachi was the priests corrupting the temple and Israel robbing God of the tithe that was mandatory according to their covenant.

8. Paul said in Romans 8 that God gave his son freely so that he may give us all things freely.
Stewardship is a factor in giving because of what Christ did and not what we do. The difference could be in legalistic or free in love; which results in wrong or right motive.

9. My dad preached Kenneth Hagin and Kenneth Copeland and I would not necessarily indict them of not being a christian for I believed they are saved. Both of them are mostly accused of following E.W. Kenyon's basic principles which were supposedly metaphysical teachings.

10. I think they may have not been perfect in many things but I do believe they learned many things and have been successful because of faith and a real relationship with God. Another words some things might have been construed by some who may have got lost in principles and forgot about relationship and stewardship. I would agree that there are those who God can trust with handling of money and it does take money to do things and we do know our source is God and the object is faith in what he did on the cross. Normally, if people are teaching you what to do legalistically is what results. It is through the message of the cross and the resurrected Lord that we have provision. Thinking out loud. Jerry kelso

The Old Testament had a monetary system based primarily on agriculture.

The 30 60 100 fold blessing is the Word of God.
When we abide in the Word and confess the Word in prayer,we receive all the promises in God's Word,Spirtual,Physical,Financial according to the power in us some 30 60 100 fold.

Christ message was eternal life.

Paul received from the Churches he ministered to.

If you give in secret God will reward you openly.

Malachi is just as relevant today as it was then.

Stewardship applies to how we handle God's money as in tithing.

Jerry we welcome you and hope to give you a better understanding of how we apply Kingdom principles.
There is much more Bible verse that needs to be posted for your answers.